Mary did however deliver the commetators line of the tournament.

Safina challenged a ball she thought Serena hit wide, and Mary said. " She's got bigger challenges than that!. :lol:

 

Everytime Mary tried to bad mouth Serena for doing it her way, Chris put that ass in check.

Thank you Chris, it seems like only he and John Mac, are willing to do this.

John Mac is the biggest hater of em all, I will never forget the fact that he condoned Justines cheating at the French Open and basically said that you have to do whatever it takes to beat Serena. And MARY CARILLO stepped up and challenged him on that one.

 

What exactly did Mary Carillo say that badmouthed Serena? What I heard her say was that she wished ALL the women would show as much dedication to the sport as the men do, so that she could see the women play major finals that are as competitive as Nadal-Federer. If you heard something else, please enlighten me.

 

It was fine the first 5 times she said it. Then she said it another 5 or 6 times during play and after and during the awards presentation and then after in the post commentary. She went beyond harping and basically saying the same thing over and over until when she stopped talking about Serena only, all our eyes and ears were blearied by it and everything just seemed like it was all about Serena.

And, I think it is bad mouthing the women to say that they don't have as much dedication to the sport as the men. When someone comes along that has as much talent as Serena and Vee, then maybe there will some competition. Until they, they can only play what is on the other side of the net. And please as error ladened as the mens final was, it was not anything outstanding. It merely went five sets, like Venus and Lindsay's went to 3 sets in 2005 Wimbledon. It was an exciting match, but it wasn't a clean match. At least not by the golden boy, aka head case Federer. I don't think I've ever seen Federer play so badly. At least the women don't cry like big babies when they lose, at least not so much so that they can't even compose themselves to say thank you. :shrug:

 

I heard Chris Fowler telling her they dont want to do it her way but THEIR OWN way.
She kept insisting that it wasnt too much for HER to ask to see more finals where Serena, and by extension Venus competes like this all the time.
She cant want all she wants, but she isnt swinging any rackets last time i checked.

 

Care to quote him?

 

Loved it. :lol:

 

The only fair commentators are Mary Jo, Zina Garrison and to some extent the reformed John Mcenroe.

Mary Carillo, Chris Fowler, Martina N., Tracy Austin, and Pam Shriver are the worst offenders. They are overly negative when it comes to the sisters and have a personal bias against them. It's nauseating to hear their commentary, often times I turn the volume down when Serena is playing to not hear the negativity.

Patrick McEnroe, Bill McAtee, and Cliff Drysdale are lightweight meaning they aren't as bad. At least they can give credit where it's due but that's because they're older men. On the other hand, Chirs Fowler acts like a straight up woman while Carillo wants to be a man.

 

Mary Carillo, Chris Fowler, Martina N., Tracy Austin, and Pam Shriver are the worst offenders. They are overly negative when it comes to the sisters and have a personal bias against them. It's nauseating to hear their commentary, often times I turn the volume down when Serena is playing to not hear the negativity.

Patrick McEnroe, Bill McAtee, and Cliff Drysdale are lightweight meaning they aren't as bad..

Pmac isn't a saint, I remember one time after Serena or Venus (can't remember) lost a match he said the reason why was because all of the players were just as strong as them so they couldn't overpower players and it was all about tennis and they couldn't win with their tennis skills. Although the last couple years it seems as if he now realizes how important V&S are to American tennis and has backed off them.

Pam Shriver isn't as bad as the others she's mentioned with. I think Pam is just a messy individual who gossips about everyone, she's not impartial to the sisters IMO.

 

I liked what Chris Fowler did, too, but it seemed staged, in my opinion. They had to do something to liven up the 59 minute thrashing.

 

It's no secret I'm no fan of Mary Carillo and yet here we go again, I have to defend her.

Bad mouthed Serena? What freaking match were you watching. Mary was having such a lovefest about Serena that it was making nauseated.

If you consider Mary wanting to literally be in Serena's space bad mouthing than you need to start watching figure skating.........

 

I think Mary Jo and Pam are the good commentators. They call the match. Not all this nonsense that Mary Carillo dredges up in the middle of play. I've said it before and I'll say it until it changes, why can't the women have the same type of play commentary the men get? We get their life story and the ball boy's life story during women's play. Even Chris Fowler is better at calling the matches than Mary Carillo. She is the worst. Not because of the stupid stuff she says about the WS, but the stupid stuff she says period.

 

I agree, Mary rarely talks about the match itself and rambles on like a penniless drunk. I guess it's hard for her to call plays when she doesn't really know anything about the game. Hence her wack singles career

 

Mary said nothing wrong. She has an opinion that is very valid. And Chris stated another that is also valid. I happen to agree wit both lol. I wud love Venus n i guess Serena to put 100% into tennis like Nadal Federer, no companies clothing lines n other distractions but at the same time i understand the sisters. Being raised to know tennis isnt everything in life like Venus said "I like to focus on being a good person" etc and after uve basically won everything tennis cud get to be a drag particularly wen ur sister has been murdered tons of injuries and being ridiculed by the media for winning then losing. But that time has passed and there definitely more focused these days tho not 100%.
Is really to much to ask wen u have talent such as the sisters do to be completely dedicated??? The men do it why not the WS....ANSWER: different strokes for different folks :shrug:

 

Let me ask you a serious question? Do you actually believe Mary's intentions when she was the main commentator leading the charge that the sisters domination of the sport was boring? From 2000-2003, all of the American commentators were seeking this great white hope to take the sisters down. It didn't matter if they were from another country or some low ranked player with no future prospect. I remember that period where their domination was seen as "bad for women's tennis".

I've stated many times that I don't have a problem with constructive criticism but Mary Carillo has repeatedly crossed the lines of decency. After the final she kept repeating the same mess over and over as if we didn't hear her the last 15 times. It proved to me that she wasn't necessarily worried about the state of women's tennis, just Serena winning another AO that Mary felt she didn't deserve.

Women's tennis will NEVER be played on the same level as men's tennis. The same type of lopsided finals were played when Mary was on tour and it hasn't changed that much even when the top players were all healthy.

In my opinion, Mary is jealous of Serena. It has to hurt that she worked so hard during her tennis career and couldn't win a slam while Serena is so talented that she can bring her B game and still win. But Mary can't admit her bitterness so instead she indirectly makes all these observations about Serena's game like she's concerned. Anybody with a bit of sense can clearly see she's a hater. After watching the final via DVR, my cousin asked me, "What problem does that woman have with Serena?" and he doesn't even follow tennis.:lol:

 

I like the part where she was telling her Navratilova story and Chris started laughing. She thought he was laughing at her story and he said no, he was laughing at the look on Dinara's face when she decided to challenge. Newsflash Mary, there is a tennis match going on. Your story is not a part of the marquee.

 

She never shuts up during the match. You'd think she was the best player that ever held a racket. She's one annoying person. She wasn't that bad this time but there have been times that I've had to use the mute in between points just not to here her nonsense.

 

Mary Carillo did play tennis but her record is abysmal.

 

why should they just concentrate on tennis? there is absolutely no reason for that, because they're still able to win big titles. they're not one of the younger players anymore so it's just clever to do something outside the sport, because they won't be on court forever.
i think some people just have to find something to criticise about players and it's the same for about 4 years now. it's just getting more ridiculous every year, because the sisters keep winning titles and still people like carillo feel like they have to bash them with the same old arguments time and time again.

 

 

As noble as people are trying to make this guy out to be, the William sisters dont need to be 'rescued' or 'shielded' from criticsm. I can bet on all my gods ( Phoebe Buffay reference there:lol: ), that they both wouldnt give a crap if Mary went face to face to them and told them they were absolutely shit tennis players.

Criticsm flies off in the wind if you can ignore it. Retaliation on the other hand is a far more draining experience.

 

As noble as people are trying to make this guy out to be, the William sisters dont need to be 'rescued' or 'shielded' from criticsm. I can bet on all my gods ( Phoebe Buffay reference there:lol: ), that they both wouldnt give a crap if Mary went face to face to them and told them they were absolutely shit tennis players.

Criticsm flies off in the wind if you can ignore it. Retaliation on the other hand is a far more draining experience.

I think you know very well they get plenty of criticisms. That is not the point here.
And I do not think anybody on this board is insinuating any retaliation toward Mary.

Having said that, Mary often makes very deorgatory remarks about Venus and Serena.
But Mary's strong personality, coupled with an accomodating personality of her co-hosts, have often left those offensive remarks unanswered.

For example, when there were rumors of match fixing by Richard Williams, she gave credence to the sentiment by
questioning Serena's "sudden drop in" her level of play , and claiming that is why people think their matches are fixed.

Mary may like the WS, but she sure has a strange way of showing it.
Compare this to her comments about other players she likes. It is night and day.

I think that is the backdrop of the posts you are reading

 

Why do people hate on commentators so much? I thought it was their job to give their opinions on air. I feel like everytime a commentator says something negative about someone's fave, they think that commentator suck, or that they are racist, or that they are douches, etc. Give it a rest people. Your favorite players are NOT PERFECT. Fans like to hear both compliments AND critiques, and your favorite is not too good to be above criticism.

 

it's not a problem hearing constructive criticism...:shrug: i hear it all the time when i watch my ESPN and listen to jimmy arias...the problem with mary is that she spends a WHOLE match criticising...and especially in this match she spent the WHOLE match repeating one thing over and over and over....while chris was trying to commentate on the match, she kept repeating one thing for the match and the presentation...:shrug: also her "constructive criticism" only seems to come out when the sisters play :shrug:

 

I don't think Mary hates Serena at all. Quite the opposite. Mary's problem is that she is like a bad tennis parent. She wants to live vicariously through Serena since her own tennis career stunk and keeps thinking to herself what kind of career she would have had with such gifts and if she devoted herself to tennis 100%. Since that's physically impossible, the next best thing she can do to live out her dream is to see Serena do it. When Serena doesn't do it like Mary wants, she goes back to "if I only had what you had I've had been so great" mode which a lot of Williams fans confuse with being a hater or racist.

 

I agree. She's obnoxious and desperately needs to get a life of her own, but she's not necessarily a hater. Chris Fowler on the other hand is a bit douchie but he can say some hilarious things sometimes.

 

Chris Fowler is so damn annoying though. OMG.

 

I wish Mary Carillo would dedicate herself to the sport enough to know up and coming players. Perhaps she should attend a Challenger event or five so she can know who some of the qualifiers are.

 

Fowler totally misunderstood the context. Tempest. Teapot.

 

He didn't misunderstand when she said, 'I'm glad Serena is making the effort and caring about tennis again'. Chris responded, "I don't think she ever stopped caring about tennis, Mary". And, that shut her up, at least for a game. :lol: That was classic and I loved that he said that.

 

Everytime Mary tried to bad mouth Serena for doing it her way, Chris put that ass in check.

Thank you Chris, it seems like only he and John Mac, are willing to do this.

I listened to that conversation, and Chris did not back down as Mary ketpt pushing the same point.
At one point he even said, "that is not true".

Usually other colleagues would back down or laugh it off to defuse the tension.
Not Chris. It seems like, having heard Mary make this point over and over again, it probably bothered him, but never had a good oppurtunity to answer. This was a golden opportunity and he was ready and responded forcefully.

 

I thought Mary said she loved Serena and wants to see her in more finals..... damn, all these Williams fans are blind x 1 million

 

It's hard to avoid seeing subtext in Mary's comments because she's done this more than once. I think like Martina Navratilova, Mary Carillo resents Serena (and Venus) for pretty much doing things their way since they turned pro AND succeeding. Going back several years, Mary's criticism of them has reeked of "how dare you buck the system". Richard's method of easing his daughters onto the tour may not work for all but no one is stopping parents and coaches from trying it. People just don't see that and are quick to label the family as non-conformists.

 

Carillo conducted herself with the same lack of class that everyone loves to stone Serena for lacking - only worse since she gets to do it every day, she couldn't just shut the f*ck up for 5 minutes and let us enjoy a historical moment.

Right on!

 

I think Mary Carillo is a fine analyst, but this thing with Serena needs to be put to rest. She needs to take Chris Fowlers advice and accept that the way the Williams run there careers, works for them, and keeps them healthy and winning majors long past the age when other champions are retired. All the other tennis analysts, by and large (Navy, Shriver, Fernandez, etc.) have bent to the facts as borne out over time. Only Carillo seems to be holding out for HER WAY, as being the only good way. Its past annoying...its a litle sad.