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if you can moonball with spin, you can get far on clay.
You have no idea the pace, weight and depth (plus the bounce) these “moonballs” by Nadal have. He is one of a kind and requires a lot of skill to hit these shots consistently. Calling this shot “moonball” shows you have no idea about tennis.


I’ll just ignore (and delete from the quote) the rest of your messy post.
 

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Its not more popular because it doesnt work as a regular strategy. Its more like a reset when a player needs a breather, or wants to get a different type of return
 

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You have no idea the pace, weight and depth (plus the bounce) these “moonballs” by Nadal have. He is one of a kind and requires a lot of skill to hit these shots consistently. Calling this shot “moonball” shows you have no idea about tennis.


I’ll just ignore (and delete from the quote) the rest of your messy post.
he's a woz stan, and since when rooting for the archpusher does require knowledge in tennis to begin with? :lol:

and yes, can't agree more about nadal. his FH reaches spin rates at 4500 rpm and above, and he's still able to hit I/O-winners with 2 to 3 feet net clearance at 90 to 100 mph.
some folks should just shup when they got absolutely no clue what they're talking about. :facepalm:
 

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The current moonball queen is Kenin. I think she is the only top 100 player that uses lot of times in all her matches this kind of shots
 

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Another classic moonball epic fest was Cohen-Majeric in US Open qualies. There was a video in YT I think
I think I’ve found it. It’s worth checking. Enjoy it :drool:

I bet a TF poster uploaded this mess :lol:

And to think Julia Cohen was a top 100 player and WTA finalist.
 

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I think a lot of people still use moonballs or at least defensive lobs while on the defense

but a) when you are on the run it isn't very easy to control and place a moonball
b) players train to turn defense into offense, which if executed effectively, is much more threatening to the opponent than just random moonballing
 

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Why? Because there are a lot of easier ways to win a tennis match. Did you see that 140 shot rally that was linked? To win like that, you have to have some great wheels, terrific hands and and the mentality to be willing to grind it out every single point, every single day. So essentially, Errani, Sanchez Vicario and from way back, Andrea Jaeger.

Also hitting a lob without spin is awful, and hitting a GOOD lob with topspin consistently is very difficult to do. Did you see how many of those shots were landing at the serviceline during that 140 shot rally? There's a reason that match was on the satellite tour. If you moonball a great player, your lobs better be deep and doing that over and over is again is tough. The Woz/Kerber point was all about mocking/mental games than any sort of testament to their skills as players, they were effing with each other.
 

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To be fair to the moon ballers that I sometimes criticize, I have to admit that I do lots of moonballing when I play. However I'm a terrible tennis player, even for club levels, so at least I acknowledge it.
 

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I wonder how many pts you wish to be played like this? The Kerber and Woz case was an extreme example, I think they were mocking each other in some ways (see slice-slice rallies) :SNE: and that type of rally can never keep up over time as both players will become bored of it themselves.
Kerber-Woz was not really moonballs but a lot of high balls.

If I remember correctly (and I probably don't) this was at a deadlock two hours into a gruelling match with a lot of running, lots of long points... so something you resort to out of desperation when nothing else works, not the strategy you start out with.
 

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To be fair to the moon ballers that I sometimes criticize, I have to admit that I do lots of moonballing when I play. However I'm a terrible tennis player, even for club levels, so at least I acknowledge it.
Ironically, as a fan I dislike BBBs, but as a player I pretty much am one - because I'm not good enough to sustain super-long rallies. And I can't execute touch shots at all. It's so much easier and requires less skill (and way less mental strength) to just hit harder.
 

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Kerber-Woz was not really moonballs but a lot of high balls.

If I remember correctly (and I probably don't) this was at a deadlock two hours into a gruelling match with a lot of running, lots of long points... so something you resort to out of desperation when nothing else works, not the strategy you start out with.
Yes, it was deep in the third set - and I feel that when we see full-on moonball rallies (as opposed to just one stroke to switch things up) it's when players are frazzled, stressed, maybe their usual tactics aren't working. It's a close cousin of the desperation dropshot when you can't work out any other way to end the point.

The premise of this thread is weird to me because we do see a lot of players employ moonballs when they have to. And there's no reason for it to be any MORE popular because 1) every player has shots they hit better than the moonball and will try to execute those first, b) it's only effective as a surprise tactic in the top 100 because if it's expected it'll be punished.
 

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To be fair to the moon ballers that I sometimes criticize, I have to admit that I do lots of moonballing when I play. However I'm a terrible tennis player, even for club levels, so at least I acknowledge it.
Ironically, as a fan I dislike BBBs, but as a player I pretty much am one - because I'm not good enough to sustain super-long rallies. And I can't execute touch shots at all. It's so much easier and requires less skill (and way less mental strength) to just hit harder.
That's interesting. If the guy I'm playing is inconsistent for me it's way easier to try to push the ball back in a way that I either put him in uncomfortable positions.

I love going to the net when possible though, and even improved recently on that.
 

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Yes, it was deep in the third set - and I feel that when we see full-on moonball rallies (as opposed to just one stroke to switch things up) it's when players are frazzled, stressed, maybe their usual tactics aren't working. It's a close cousin of the desperation dropshot when you can't work out any other way to end the point.
Yes, a desperation dropshot is a good analogy. This was not Plan A for either of them.


The premise of this thread is weird to me because we do see a lot of players employ moonballs when they have to. And there's no reason for it to be any MORE popular because 1) every player has shots they hit better than the moonball and will try to execute those first, b) it's only effective as a surprise tactic in the top 100 because if it's expected it'll be punished.
This, 100%.
 

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Most players are killing these balls with shots from above the shoulder and get a winner or a decisive advantage. It's useful to get back in position and at least have a chance instead of returning in range for a volley that means the point ends. It makes sense as a last resort in defense but for regular play... not a chance
 

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Most players are killing these balls with shots from above the shoulder and get a winner or a decisive advantage. It's useful to get back in position and at least have a chance instead of returning in range for a volley that means the point ends. It makes sense as a last resort in defense but for regular play... not a chance
I don't think it really is the case with 80% of WTA players. Some of them give back poor, short responses especially hitting BH off the moonball if it's not moonball attempt too.
 

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I don't think it really is the case with 80% of WTA players. Some of them give back poor, short responses especially hitting BH off the moonball if it's not moonball attempt too.
Sure I guess some players might have a hard time dealing with this but I don't think there are too many

Another answer might be this: most players that make it to the top are good enough to play real tennis and win matches using normal shot making so choosing this strategy (let's call it that) makes no sense for them. This is why we don't see this being played, because players having the audacity to do this loose against better players that make it to the top instead
 
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