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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
 

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Yeah but its a Masters Series. Mind you though the turn out for the day session has been dissapoining.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
I'm telling you, they need to ring up Jack Kramer and ask him to help with the promotion of the women's event in Los Angeles! :lol:

Billie Jean King can make the call :lol:
 

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I have a theory, I don't know how accurate it is but ok her goes. In large cities like LA, NY etc. it can take 2 hours to get somewhere that's only 10 miles away so maybe while Carson may be close geographically, maybe timewise the ppl that attended the event at Manhattan Beach Country Club think it's too far.
 

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LOL..um the women's event in Toronto will have the same success if not more...the attendance last year for the WTA event in Montreal was over 160,000...IMO the lousy attendance at that one event in California has more to do with the incompatence of the organizers.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
oh yeah, use one match as a comparison :eek:
 

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I'm sure if Monica, Anna, Jen and the Williams sisters were playing, the seat would be filled. Lindsay is the only top American and she isn't as popular as the others, though I love to watch her play.
 

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selesfan1 said:
I have a theory, I don't know how accurate it is but ok her goes. In large cities like LA, NY etc. it can take 2 hours to get somewhere that's only 10 miles away so maybe while Carson may be close geographically, maybe timewise the ppl that attended the event at Manhattan Beach Country Club think it's too far.

So true! As an Angelino, Carson is not easy nor a glamorous place to reach...its a mini-trek on a packed 405 FWY. No traffic you can get there in 20 minutes...with traffic... :fiery:
 

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The answer is - competetiveness. Clijsters-Loit. #2 vs #50. Chance of upset = 0. Predictability = 100%.
Hewitt-Mirnyi, #5 vs #32. Chance of upset is at least 25-30%. Loit came to lose. Mirnyi came to win. All the difference in the world.
 

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I can only say, this event is now brought to you by the same marketing geniuses who gave you last November's Staples Center disaster.

After years of operating a very successful touranment at Manhattan Beach, they've moved the tournament to a remote location and not told the general public about it.

Yes, the fact that few stars are playing is one factor, but failing to advertise a brand new event is quite another.

This has fiasco written all over it.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?

I dunno, i think this is like once in a lifetime thing for canadians because this is like the only tournament they have in canada so people take advantage of it. But people in Los Angeles have agendas and are too busy to come see a tennis match. That why the Tour Finals was half empty. I mean even my city (shreveport) would have had better turnout days. I just dont think tournaments (tennis) are made for L.A. San Diego does good with the Acura.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The Agassi/Larose match was packed today, too.
 

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jenglisbe said:
The Agassi/Larose match was packed today, too.
The popularity of the men's tour pales in comparison to the women.
Hence, the supporters of the men's tour take what they can gat when they get it. It's so nice to see them so happy! ;)
 

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jenglisbe said:
The Agassi/Larose match was packed today, too.
That's a really bad example. Agassi is the biggest pull in men's tennis and Larose is a Canadian who has had the biggest week of his career this week. Of course the stadium is going to be packed out for that.

On the other hand, Rainer Schuettler was playing Jiri Novak on Court 1 at the same time and there was barely a crowd ;)

It's not fair to put a Tier II up against a TMS, either. TMSes are going to get huge crowds no matter where they are because all the top players are required to be there.

But overall, I agree with TonyP (once again ;)) that LA's attendance probably has more to do with advertising than star power.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
I just don't think people fans and players alike were prepared for the move from Manhatten Beach to Carson. But I have to agree that the absense of the sisters and Capriati could be the problem too.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
No. Tennis has basically two revenue streams. Ticket sales and TV rights. Men sell more tickets. But (at least in the USA) women get better TV ratings.

If you measure it by TV, its proof that more people want to watch the women.
 

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jenglisbe said:
ESPN is showing the Hewitt/Mirnyi match from last night, and they were saying people were hanging from things to try and see the match. In L.A., though, press reports have said only 400 people were at the Clijsters/Loit match (and less at other matches). This is where the argument that women don't bring in as much money to tennis comes in, no?
I was there and the stadium was like 1/4 empty for the Hewitt match. The people hanging from things to try to see the match were those outside the stadium who didn't pay.
 

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I agree with the point that has been made in this thread; the bulk of the blame lies with the tournament itself. It was moved and not promoted. In essence, it became a new tournament. And if you hold a "new" tournament without telling anyone, no one will come.

A further example comes from a couple of weeks ago. The Stanford final had a full house, despite no Americans. The Indianapolis final did not have a full house, despite the presence of Roddick. Stanford had been established in its position for a couple of years, while Indianapolis was just moved. (And Indy hadn't been drawing full crowds even in its former spot.)

Thus, you can't take any one week as a referendum on a player's (or tour's) drawing power. Last week in San Diego, the women drew great. Establshed tourney. A few years back, when NBC was televising the San Diego final, they, naturally, wanted it on tape. So the final had to be played at 10 AM. And it featured Kimiko Date vs Arantxa, who were not considered big drawing cards. (Arantxa was continually underestimated in this capacity by American networks.) Yet the stadium was packed.

So, the primary factors seem to be with the tournament. If it's in an established location (both geographically and on the calendar), and it's properly promoted, it will usually do well.

And as a general attendance rule, when men and women play at the same venues, in North America (patricularly the US, home of Title IX and more liberated attitudes about women in sports), the women draw better, whereas in Europe (with more chauvanistic attitudes about sports), the men will draw better. In both places, women draw better TV numbers.

You could draw some conclusion by examining the makeup of the two spectator constituencies. The live attendees tend to be more affluent, and more conservative. Whereas the TV viewers are a more broad cross-section of the public, including the working class. The women do better amongst the populace as a whole than amongst the economic elite.
 
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