Tennis Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.
61 - 80 of 82 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,383 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,383 Posts
There are two issues here, one major, one minor.

1) The major issue. The ATP and WTA tour are international competition and they are open. That is where the term "Open Era" comes from. Being open means everybody can play. Being an international competition and open means visa application is an issue. Different countries have different visa requirements and the job of ATP and WTA is to ensure visa applications are successful for all players. That is where the selection of location comes in. ATP and WTA has to ensure the locations they hold their tournaments will issue visas for all players. If not, ATP and WTA have no choice but to change location to where this is true. For example, if Roland Garros is held in France, ATP and WTA have to ensure France will issue visas for all players. Otherwise, Roland Garros will be held somewhere else where visas can be issued for all players. The same is true for Wimbledon. The same is true for US Open. The problem with Australian Open is ATP and WTA did not do that. Australia does not issue visas for all players. ATP and WTA should tell Australia that if it does not issue visas for all players, ATP and WTA will move to somewhere else.

2) The minor issue. Clerical errors happen all the time on visa application. Correct it and the visa is issued. No big deal.
Who told you that breaking tradition is that simple? The slams are very old tournaments, some being played for more than a century. And it's just not simple a clerical error. Djokocic is responsible for what people under him does for him.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HangTennis

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,147 Posts
Stopped reading after the whole agent paragraph, no matter who is filling in documents if it’s your name on them, they’re your responsibility. There seems to be some idea some people are “too big” to be responsible for their own arrangements
the whole post is ignorant-
1-she like novak and others need to realize tennis australia lied to them. they gave them info that they knew was wrong. the australian government made it clear non-vaxxed couldn't enter.
2- her drug cheat ass lied about a pregnancy to justify her doping
3-she tried to compare tues to doping like herself

she is a whole clown
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,206 Posts
I appreciate that she shared her thoughts on the matter, but the context she provides does little to make one empathize with Djokovic. The fact that some players have TUEs to use corticosteroids, anti-inflammatories and painkillers is already well-known within tennis circles and irrelevant to the global pandemic.

I agree with her sentiment that political processes are hypocritical. But to allow Djokovic, a public figure, entry into the country without following the same rules everyone else must follow, would be the very definition of hypocrisy. And as a public figure, he basically made a mockery of the Australian government. Voracova's case was, I believe, to demonstrate that immigration law should be applied consistently, not just to make examples of big names like Djokovic.

Her reference to the easy-breezy pre-pandemic handling of tennis player visa applications only highlights how much things have changed in the world for everyone, and how traveling requires extra careful planning now.

Side note: her equating walking through airport security with a banana in hand, to lying on a visa application form is nonsensical. One requires some degree of investigation to discover/prove, the other doesn't.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,261 Posts
What kind of dumbassery is copy pasting so much machine / auto text and posting it verbatim?

And this despite manually going through every sentence only to make bold selections (but seemingly not edit one word of the robot mistranslations? :lol2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,123 Posts
Yeah, well those illusions have just killed nearly 6 million people in less than two years. That's faster than the Nazis.

Also: The argument "this has never happened before" is not very strong when compared against a globe-engulfing pandemic that is currently raging out of control. The players are lucky they get to travel, cross borders, and play at all.

In times of crisis, freedoms are temporarily suspended. This happens in war, it happens in natural disasters, and we're going to have to live with it for awhile.
True, but average age of COVID death in UK is 83. Eighty Three. Yes I am vaxxed and not an anti vaxxer at all.

But I believe in personal choice and freedom. A fair way to balance vaccination is anyone getting hospital treatment for COVID should be charged at a high rate, or take vaccine, or your choice. That is fair and correct,

Injections should never be manditory especially for a virus that kills people who are old, obese or have immune irregularities..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,886 Posts
But I believe in personal choice and freedom.
That's fine. But the virus doesn't, and if you give people the choice to opt out of defeating it completely, then it will simply persist, and use them as incubators to mutate into tougher strains that will infect the vaccinated again.

This is something the anti-vaxxers fail to understand: Getting the vaccine is not a personal choice, it is a GROUP choice. It's not about you, it's about US. It is not an I thing -- it is a WE thing. There must be 100% buy-in from everyone, completely, across the board, or the virus will never go away.

We could have stopped this thing dead in its tracks a year ago, before Delta, if we had total and absolute compliance from everyone. But because some idiots decided their personal freedom was more important than a few mg of saline solution in their shoulder, now we have newer tougher strains and millions more dead.

And I consider every unvaccinated person complicit in the damage and death in the years to come.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,735 Posts
Rather ignorant of you.
“I’m for the truth no matter who tells it”. she’s more credible than 99%of the posters here as we may have some former pro’s on TF.
Granted I regret that post, it does happen. I understand her initial post had nothing to do with her troubles in the past with the ITF. So you are saying that a former player is more credible than 99% of the posters on TF? I admit my posting was a mistake, but the percentage you are mentioning is questionable. So, because a poster played on the WTA or ITF tours their postings are more credible than others, how so?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,749 Posts
But visas before covid are hardly comparable to visas in current times and she is completely ignoring that point. Obviously Australia has new requirements to get a visa and neither Djokovic or Voracova nor any other tennis player had been granted visas under these conditions before.
This is the single most important point that Karatantcheva is missing, or simply fails to realise. Entry to Australia NOW is available only to those who are fully vaccinated (and, I presume, to those who have an exemption issued by the Australian Border force, which is not the same as the medical exemptions touted by Tennis Australia). It didn't apply to last year's tournament, but it does NOW.
Djokovic and Voracova may have been granted visas by the state of Victoria, but the law of the country is above the states at the end of the day.
The states don't issue their own visas. That is solely the responsibility of the Federal government.
While she makes some valid points, to me it is a bit confusing, because it is all over the place and a very one-sided take.:dunno:
It's certainly interesting reading, but her lack of recent competitive play (as in, she retired several years ago) probably makes it harder for her to understand some of the restrictions which apply to certain countries - restrictions which have had to be developed on the fly as this virus attempts to take over the world.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
46,150 Posts
This is the single most important point that Karatantcheva is missing, or simply fails to realise. Entry to Australia NOW is available only to those who are fully vaccinated (and, I presume, to those who have an exemption issued by the Australian Border force, which is not the same as the medical exemptions touted by Tennis Australia). It didn't apply to last year's tournament, but it does NOW.

The states don't issue their own visas. That is solely the responsibility of the Federal government.

It's certainly interesting reading, but her lack of recent competitive play (as in, she retired several years ago) probably makes it harder for her to understand some of the restrictions which apply to certain countries - restrictions which have had to be developed on the fly as this virus attempts to take over the world.
That is the point that confuses me the whole time. I am obviously not familiar with Australian immigration law, but the most reports said that Victoria allowed him to enter on the basis of the two medical certificates attesting him to be eligible for an exemption.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
437 Posts
True, but average age of COVID death in UK is 83. Eighty Three. Yes I am vaxxed and not an anti vaxxer at all.

But I believe in personal choice and freedom. A fair way to balance vaccination is anyone getting hospital treatment for COVID should be charged at a high rate, or take vaccine, or your choice. That is fair and correct,

Injections should never be manditory especially for a virus that kills people who are old, obese or have immune irregularities..
This argument looks neat in theory but it's not quite so simple and compromises on liberty were made earlier in pandemics too. During the Spanish Flu, police even shot at people breaking quarantine or not wearing masks. This was in America, by the way, long before their so-called big government era was inaugurated. A pandemic may not quite be as threatening as war but it nevertheless does force extraordinary circumstances on a govt. I am not personally in favour of very broad and extreme vax mandates because they have a disproportionate impact on the poor (as did/do lockdowns). But I am not an expert on the matter and nor a competent authority so those vested with the powers are going to rule as they see fit in a difficult situation. Govts are kind of damned if they do and damned if they don't. You would think if the world was so overwhelmingly pro-choice that Sweden would be held up as the model of pandemic response and Bolsanaro wouldn't be regarded as irresponsible. So why is that the case? Simple: nobody wants to get covid end of the day. In a sheltered environment with a govt imposing lockdowns and vax mandates, it can be easy to pontificate about liberty but in one where the govt leaves you to fend your lives against the virus, reactions may be different.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,749 Posts
That is the point that confuses me the whole time. I am obviously not familiar with Australian immigration law, but the most reports said that Victoria allowed him to enter on the basis of the two medical certificates attesting him to be eligible for an exemption.
Once you're into the country there are no restrictions on inter-state travel, other than whatever Covid protocols/restrictions are in place (e.g. to Western Australia). Go back two years and you could land anywhere in Australia and go anywhere else inside the country. In my own case, for example, on one trip I landed in Sydney and then went to Queensland, South Australia, Victoria and Tasmania before going back home. I've also landed in Melbourne and then gone on to South Australia, as well as other trips where I've just visited one state. I haven't been to Australia since Covid hit because the travel restrictions are simply impossible to get around.

The medical exemptions requested through Tennis Australia were, as far as I understand, to allow players to participate in the Australian Open (and, by extension, the warm-up tournaments). The confusion that has arisen, whether deliberate or otherwise, is whether or not those "exemptions" qualified to be included as such under the FEDERAL entry regulations, allowing such recipients into Australia itself - which is a completely different scenario.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
She thinks that those with TUEs are more dopped than those using traditional doping. Interesting.
People would really be surprised at the number of top ranked athletes who have TUE. It's probably not nice to speculate on an athlete's health, but seeing some of these exemptions for bs excuses shows that you actually CAN 'dope' and get away with it. Especially if you are at the top of your sport. It is highly unfair.

As far as Novak, well, he tried to game the system, and lost. I am happy that Australia put their collective foot down and said "No vax? Then no Novak". He needs to play by the rules everyone is. His deportment will be justice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,606 Posts
People would really be surprised at the number of top ranked athletes who have TUE. It's probably not nice to speculate on an athlete's health, but seeing some of these exemptions for bs excuses shows that you actually CAN 'dope' and get away with it. Especially if you are at the top of your sport. It is highly unfair.

As far as Novak, well, he tried to game the system, and lost. I am happy that Australia put their collective foot down and said "No vax? Then no Novak". He needs to play by the rules everyone is. His deportment will be justice.
Agree with the top part. The later I am not so sure that the ones that make the rules play on similar terms as you and I. If they did it would be a whole other story but globally they made sure to pass laws to protect themselves before going full draconian. Also I cannot see how Australia could count this as a win. Tennis loses for sure when Caruso is sitting on top of the draw and the mens side will be a huge asterisk this year to the point that I'll watch more than 80% the women draw.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
798 Posts
People would really be surprised at the number of top ranked athletes who have TUE. It's probably not nice to speculate on an athlete's health, but seeing some of these exemptions for bs excuses shows that you actually CAN 'dope' and get away with it. Especially if you are at the top of your sport. It is highly unfair.

As far as Novak, well, he tried to game the system, and lost. I am happy that Australia put their collective foot down and said "No vax? Then no Novak". He needs to play by the rules everyone is. His deportment will be justice.
how could you game the system only 2-3 weeks before arrival. If I'm to believe what Sesil said who pretty much has an expert opinion on this case(VISA) theres no way he could game the system otherwise he wouldn't have received a visa initially.

He played by the rules and followed the law. I feel the vaccinated in this thread are directing their anger in the wrong place no wonder the immigration minister said he cancelled it due to public interest.
 
61 - 80 of 82 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top