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Discussion Starter #21
The angry islamists:


Supporters of a Pakistani religious group chant slogans while blocking a main road at a protest after the court decision in Karachi on October 31.

In 2011, two government officials -- a Pakistani governor and a minister of minorities -- were assassinated for having spoken out in support of Bibi.

Insulting Islam is punishable by death in Pakistan, and the mere rumor of blasphemy can lead to lynchings by mobs....

Christians make up only about 2 percent of Pakistan's population and are sometimes discriminated against.

Approximately 40 people are believed to be on death row or serving a life sentence in Pakistan for blasphemy, according to a 2018 report by the United States Commission on International Religious Freedom.
 

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This's been going on for 700+ years. If they are not aware by now, they will never be. Shaming them is the only route. They behave like animals.
They also have been practicing incest for a very long time which Islam supports (cousin marriages) for many generations. Altogether it perpetuates the system / cycle of oppression, fanaticism and mental illness (it increases the risk). Also no wonder why Pakistani community makes up 33% of genetic anomalies / illnesses found among newly born in UK despite only accounting for 5% of the children.
 

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The story is not over yet. Multiple countries have offered Asia Bibi asylum but they won't let her go.

Pakistan works to stop Asia Bibi leaving after blasphemy protests

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/nov/02/outrage-as-pakistani-government-vows-to-stop-asia-bibi-leaving

Administration accused of signing Bibi’s ‘death warrant’ in deal with hardliners

Pakistan’s government has been accused of signing the “death warrant” of Asia Bibi after it said it would begin the process of preventing her leaving the country.

Bibi, a Christian farm labourer, was acquitted of blasphemy on Wednesday. She had spent eight years on death row after she drank from the same cup as a Muslim, prompting false allegations that she insulted the prophet Muhammad.

Bibi’s lawyer, Saif-ul-Mulook, has reportedly since fled the country amid fears for his life, telling AFP: “I need to stay alive as I still have to fight the legal battle for Asia Bibi.”

The ruling Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) administration signed an agreement with the anti-blasphemy group Tehreek-e-Labbaik Pakistan (TLP) on Friday night, giving in to many of its demands in the face of massive, countrywide protests calling for Bibi to be put to death.

In a document signed by the PTI’s religious affairs minister and the TLP’s second-in-command, Pir Afzal Qadri, the government promised not to oppose a court petition to reverse Bibi’s release. It also pledged to work in the meantime to put her name on the exit control list (ECL) which would prevent her leaving the country.


“Placing Asia Bibi on the ECL is like signing her death warrant,” said Wilson Chowdhry of the British Pakistani Christian Association. Bibi, a mother of five, remains in the same prison where last month two men tried to kill her, although she has been shifted out of her windowless cell.

The agreement was a “historic capitulation”, tweeted analyst Mosharraf Zaidi. On Wednesday night, the prime minister and leader of the PTI, Imran Khan, defended the verdict acquitting Bibi and suggested the government would clamp down on protesters it termed “enemies of the state”.

The TLP has agreed to call off its protests, which saw thousands of Islamists blockade the country’s major motorways, burning cars and lorries and chanting that they were ready to die to protect the honour of the prophet.

Meanwhile, the government has promised to free any TLP workers arrested during the three-day protest. The group has only apologised for the damage it caused, the cost of which one government official estimated at $1.2bn (£900m).

Afzal Qadri told the Guardian “the government has almost accepted our maximum demands” and that if it backtracked “we can come [out on the streets] again”.

Islamists poured on to the streets after Friday prayers in a show of force that briefly unified extremist groups from the majority Barelvi sect, which the TLP springs from, and the more traditionally hardline Deobandis. Terrorist-linked outfits including Ahle Sunnat Wal Jamaat held rallies in Islamabad, alleging that the EU had pressurised the government into releasing Bibi.

While the protests were ongoing, unknown assailants stabbed Sami ul Haq – the leader of the Haqqania madrasa known as the “father of the Taliban” – to death in his own home.

The spokesperson for Pakistan’s army, Maj Gen Asif Ghafoor, said that the military’s chief condemned the assassination and expressed “grief and condolences” for the ul Haq family. Earlier in the day, Ghafoor released a statement about the protests which avoided criticising the TLP, despite its leaders calling for soldiers to mutiny.
 

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And the 3 Supreme Court judges that freed her today are in hiding. There was a mob going after them. It won't take long before they are assassinated too.
Last thing I heard is that she and her family where taken abroad. There is no way they can live in that country.
I'm sure they'd be honoured to know which type of Muslim you would classify them as, Serve2Win! Courageous- or cowards? Or, do they somehow challenge your criteria?! Oh, please do let us know! As I'm sure you're aware, the international community holds the views of Americans such as yourself in high regard. You are such an educated, cultured, and altogether well-rounded people. I must say, your leader is an accurate reflection of his people!
 

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The story is not over yet. Multiple countries have offered Asia Bibi asylum but they won't let her go.

Pakistan works to stop Asia Bibi leaving after blasphemy protests

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/nov/02/outrage-as-pakistani-government-vows-to-stop-asia-bibi-leaving
That's really awful. I hear her lawyer has fled the country for his life. Really need to get her out the country but they won't let her go. But need to just get her out somehow. Terrible place to be. Terrible religion as practised by this mob in this day and age.
 

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There is one and easy way to fix this.
International Cricket Council should raise their voice for very basic human rights and make them choose between their fanatic belief and their cricket. I am fairly certain they'll choose cricket.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
I'm sure they'd be honoured to know which type of Muslim you would classify them as, Serve2Win! Courageous- or cowards? Or, do they somehow challenge your criteria?! Oh, please do let us know! As I'm sure you're aware, the international community holds the views of Americans such as yourself in high regard. You are such an educated, cultured, and altogether well-rounded people. I must say, your leader is an accurate reflection of his people!
oh yeah. there are lots of them at this forum. Where are the members defending her here? They are all cowards. you included. You are quietly rooting for these woman to be put to death. You are a proud soldier of your prophet.

And by the way, Trump didn't win the popular vote. That speaks volume.
 

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There is one and easy way to fix this.
International Cricket Council should raise their voice for very basic human rights and make them choose between their fanatic belief and their cricket. I am fairly certain they'll choose cricket.
I fear the truly fanatical are not too keen on sports either. At least I remember even playing some street football wasn't allowed in the IS occupied territories.



But we all know this whole thing isn't even about religion. Maybe for those bearded simpletons but for their leaders of the TLP this is just a way to power. In the end that's all these religious leaders want, power.
 

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Discussion Starter #29 (Edited)
I fear the truly fanatical are not too keen on sports either. At least I remember even playing some street football wasn't allowed in the IS occupied territories.
But we all know this whole thing isn't even about religion. Maybe for those bearded simpletons but for their leaders of the TLP this is just a way to power. In the end that's all these religious leaders want, power.
I doubt it. I don't think those bearded animals care about power. They are executing their religious duty. "Anyone that disrespect their prophet must be put to death" as their demoniac book (nothing Holy about it) says. That's all they care about.
The rest means nothing to them. The courageous ones will execute the order. The cowards ones will sit in silently and applaud inside.
 

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This's been going on for 700+ years. If they are not aware by now, they will never be. Shaming them is the only route. They behave like animals.
I was referring to Western leftists.

oh yeah. there are lots of them at this forum. Where are the members defending her here? They are all cowards. you included. You are quietly rooting for these woman to be put to death. You are a proud soldier of your prophet.

And by the way, Trump didn't win the popular vote. That speaks volume.
Very few in the West (people who use this forum) are rooting for these women to be put to death. You are sick for making such paranoid assumptions.
 
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I doubt it. I don't think those bearded animals care about power. They are executing their religious duty. "Anyone that disrespect their prophet must be put to death" as their demoniac book (nothing Holy about it) say. That's all they care about.
The rest means nothing to them. The courageous one will execute the order. The cowards one will sit in silent and applaud inside.
I fear the truly fanatical are not too keen on sports either. At least I remember even playing some street football wasn't allowed in the IS occupied territories.



But we all know this whole thing isn't even about religion. Maybe for those bearded simpletons but for their leaders of the TLP this is just a way to power. In the end that's all these religious leaders want, power.
I think it's about power and salvation, which all has to do with indoctrination. You see less extreme forms of such indoctrination all over the world. Also, there are many things that can help counter effects of such indoctrination such as the cultivation of certain values and non-corrupt legal systems.
 

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Discussion Starter #32 (Edited)
I was referring to Western leftists.
Very few in the West (people who use this forum) are rooting for these women to be put to death. You are sick for making such paranoid assumptions.
They are not defending her. All you have to do is read this topic. Where are they? They all believe that whoever makes fun of their prophet must die. Every muslim believe that. Just tell me I am lying, would you? They sit quietly, thinking "yes, that woman must get what she deserves. She must die".

I had a muslim friend at work. He is from Indonesia. I used to joke with him asking if he would kill me if I say not so nice things about his prophet. He laughed and responded, "I would not do it, but someone else will because it's the duty of every muslim".
When I asked why he wouldn't do it, his response was that he doesn't want to go to jail... That's where I got the idea about the "courageous ones vs the cowards ones".

Of course I was not openly calling him coward. We were good friends, having breakfast together every morning downstairs at the cafeteria.
 

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They are not defending her. All you have to do is read this topic. Where are they? They all believe that whoever makes fun of their prophet must die. Every muslim believe that. Just tell me I am lying, would you? They sit quietly, thinking "yes, that woman must get what she deserves. She must die".

I had a muslim friend at work. He is from Indonesia. I used to joke with him asking if he would kill me if I say not so nice things about his prophet. He laughed and responded, "I would not do it, but someone else will because it's the duty of every muslim".
When I asked why he wouldn't do it, his response was that he doesn't want to go to jail... That's where I got the idea about the "courageous ones vs the cowards ones".

Of course I was not openly calling him coward. We were good friends, having breakfast together every morning downstairs at the cafeteria.
I think you've taken this claim too far. There are two points you've made: The first is about all Muslims think that Asia Bibi should be punished and must die. The second the lack of people in this forum condemning this.

If we talk about Muslims: There's a group (not so many in the Western democracies) that would actively perform terrible acts of murder. They quote the Koran when they perpetrate these acts. Then there's more that support these acts of terror or what has happened to Asia but wouldn't do it themselves. Then there's a large number who don't support it but are fearful of speaking up.

And then there's a number who don't support it and do condemn it. How they reconcile this with the Koran I don't know but they do. Much as I dislike Sadiq Khan - he has condemned violence committed in the name of Islam. We have Muslims who are MPs in the UK including the home secretary Sajid Javid. And they have condemned violence in the name of Islam.

I don't think you have provided any evidence (apart from your friend anecdote) that all Muslims or even a majority of Muslims in Western Democracies really think "yes, that woman must get what she deserves. She must die" (I've put in bold in your post).

Now for this lack of posters in this thread not condemning this terrible thing in Pakistan. Firstly this is a Tennis Forum and only a tiny handful of posters are posting on Politics down here.. The "US Politics thread" is the only political thread that is very active. That's because a very small number of posters (maybe half a dozen) are posting there every day. So we have half a dozen posters haven't noticed this thread or are not concerned enough to post here and are busy with mainly "Left is Good, Right is Bad" posts in the "US Politics thread". I don't see how you can generalise from such a small number of people. Or even conclude they are actively thinking "yes, that woman must get what she deserves. She must die".
 

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Discussion Starter #34 (Edited)
Then there's a large number who don't support it but are fearful of speaking up.
fearful for what? fear of what?
And then there's a number who don't support it and do condemn it. How they reconcile this with the Koran I don't know but they do
How do you know they do?
Firstly this is a Tennis Forum and only a tiny handful of posters are posting on Politics down here..
You mean you can't find on this forum 3 muslims to say openly the woman did nothing wrong and shouldn't be killed?
 

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fearful for what? fear of what?
How do you know they do?
You mean you can't find on this forum 3 muslims to say openly the woman did nothing wrong and shouldn't be killed?
If you cannot understand or pretending to not understand that not speaking out against something doesn't mean that you approve of it and don't think it's wrong then that just shows that you have an agenda of your own. Fear can take many forms from fear of violence to fear of simply creating acrimony and arguments amongst friends and family.

You are now claiming that every Muslim who doesn't come out and condemn what is happening supports it. :rolleyes: That's absolute nonsense and it says a lot of your real motive for starting this thread.

I also cited Salmaan Taseer who lost his life trying to secure Asia Bidi's freedom. Let's just compare him to you. You in the safety of your country say all Muslims are cowards for not speaking up. It's you who are the coward not him.

You completely dodged answering the point that no-one ever posts in political threads in Non Tennis apart from half a dozen or so people most with an agenda. So find me 3 Muslims out or the people who post down here all the time who are Muslims first before asking me to find 3 Muslims posting a particular view in this particular thread.

In summary - you obviously don't have any concern for Asia Bidi. Just using her plight to peddle your agenda that all Muslims support the dreadful thing that has happened to her.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
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In summary - you obviously don't have any concern for Asia Bidi. Just using her plight to peddle your agenda that all Muslims support the dreadful thing that has happened to her.
I am still looking for a single post from you, where you said this woman did nothing wrong.
Can you please quote yourself?
 

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I am still looking for a single post from you, where you said this woman did nothing wrong.
Can you please quote yourself?
She did nothing wrong. And even if I didn't say so specifically those exact words every one of my posts has expressed that sentiment and the relief that she's out the country and the terrible things those people did to her.

But of course your real agenda is that all Muslims actively kill or support those that kill and treat Asia like she did. You are not interested in her but your own agenda an all Muslims. There are some Muslims in those two categories but many many Muslims in the two categories of not supporting what happened but not actually speaking out and of those that have spoken out. And I've given an example of a Muslim who lost his life trying to help and free Asia Bibi.

Not one of your posts has recognised that. Not a single post. But you don't care about that because it doesn't fit your agenda.
 

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Discussion Starter #40
She did nothing wrong. And even if I didn't say so specifically those exact words every one of my posts has expressed that sentiment and the relief that she's out the country and the terrible things those people did to her..
Finally. Thank you. At least I got you to put that in writing. No other muslim on this forum will write that. It's too painful for them to say anything like that.
... There are some Muslims in those two categories but many many Muslims in the two categories of not supporting what happened but not actually speaking out and of those that have spoken out..
And that's the problem.
Not one of your posts has recognised that.
.. and I won't.. One tree doesn't a forest make.
 
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