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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
When we say players 'offensive' or 'defensive', should we look at how they play against the top players, or how they play against everyone else? Is Kim Clijsters the defensive player five feet behind the baslein playing Venus? Or is she the net-rushing opportunist we see when she plays Clarisa Fernandez?

Is the real Llndsay the one who's punishing groundstrokes produce weak returns, which Lindsay puts away for volley winners? (Efficient all courter) Or is the real Lindsay the one who can't catch up to Serena's own bullet groundies? (Pure baseliner)

Have at it, then.:)
 

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It´s the way you play all the time. In fact it´s the way you play the TOP players, that define who you´re.Lindsay at least tries to be agressive against Serena, but Serena is more agressive than her and thus doesn´t give Lindsay the chance to be agressive.

Serena is agressive regardless of whom she´s playing. But Kim doesn´t even try to be agressive against Serena, Venus or Justine...ball in the middle, pray for the error...
 

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How offensive you are can be based laregly on how you play against the majority, but to succeed at the top, you have to be capable of being aggressive against the Top 10.

Kim is aggressive only where she plays opponents who cannot match her speed/defense/power or other factor.

Put a fast moving, hard-hitting girl with good defensive skills (Serena, Venus, Justine, Jen, Mauresmo, Elena D) against her, and you will see the problems that Kim faces. Add to the fact that she raraely flattens her shots out adds to her reduced winner count.

Lindsay is aggressive, and yes at times she is left reeling from Serena's power, but on the same note, she is able to attack Serena too, on serve and off the ground. Lindsay uses this tactic against every player in the Top 10.

So the real aggressive player is one who consistently employs that game plan against any opponent.
 

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because i agree with Sonic. Venus i sa very aggressive player unless she is playing someone like davenport or serena or even Lucic. She gets enough balls back so that they can make some errors. She is still aggressive but she relies more on her aggressive defense as well.
 

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Actually I heard Serena in an interview before the US Open semis last year vs Davenport and she says she likes playing Lindsay because they have the same type of game.

For me both Serena and Lindsay are offensive players, the reason Serena is winning more often is that she is a better defensive player than Lindsay and a far better mover. Lindsay should play her best to beat Serena because she has little defense with their type of game. But I would say Lindsay is the best offensive player I have ever seen if her grounstrokes are on. No defense can match that.
 

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QUEENLINDSAY said:
Actually I heard Serena in an interview before the US Open semis last year vs Davenport and she says she likes playing Lindsay because they have the same type of game.

For me both Serena and Lindsay are offensive players, the reason Serena is winning more often is that she is a better defensive player than Lindsay and a far better mover. Lindsay should play her best to beat Serena because she has little defense with their type of game. But I would say Lindsay is the best offensive player I have ever seen if her grounstrokes are on. No defense can match that.
Don´t think so....the Lindsay-Serena match-up is a bad one for Lindsay and it will take her best and Serena playing well below par for Lindsay to win...and maybe not even then.

It´s bad for Lindsay because she doesn´t have any advantage over Serena. Lindsay has a good serve?! Serena has a better one. Lindsay great return?! Serena´s as good. Lindsay great on offense?! Serena´s as good if not better. And the huge gap: Serena can give AND take....Lindsay can only give and not take and Serena likes a giving of her own...so that means bye bye Lindsay.
 

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bandabou said:
Don´t think so....the Lindsay-Serena match-up is a bad one for Lindsay and it will take her best and Serena playing well below par for Lindsay to win...and maybe not even then.

It´s bad for Lindsay because she doesn´t have any advantage over Serena. Lindsay has a good serve?! Serena has a better one. Lindsay great return?! Serena´s as good. Lindsay great on offense?! Serena´s as good if not better. And the huge gap: Serena can give AND take....Lindsay can only give and not take and Serena likes a giving of her own...so that means bye bye Lindsay.
Did'nt you see US Open quarters 2000- Lindsay won 2 easy sets
US Open quarters 2001- Serena in a very close match
US Open semis 2002- Serena won after Lindsay gave up the second set.

I dont wanna debate again on whos better and who has better this and that because I know this will again be a never ending thread. I just wanna point out that for Lindsay to come close as this to Serena, Man!!!! This girl has a very superb Ofensive game when she is ON. Lindsay does'nt even run for balls and she can still score. I just hate this idea of saying Lindsay does'nt stand any chance at all. Maybe Serena has the edge because of her athletism but not because she is better.

I bet you think otherwise and that made us fans of two different players.
 

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QUEENLINDSAY said:
Did'nt you see US Open quarters 2000- Lindsay won 2 easy sets
US Open quarters 2001- Serena in a very close match
US Open semis 2002- Serena won after Lindsay gave up the second set.

I dont wanna debate again on whos better and who has better this and that because I know this will again be a never ending thread. I just wanna point out that for Lindsay to come close as this to Serena, Man!!!! This girl has a very superb Ofensive game when she is ON. Lindsay does'nt even run for balls and she can still score. I just hate this idea of saying Lindsay does'nt stand any chance at all. Maybe Serena has the edge because of her athletism but not because she is better.

I bet you think otherwise and that made us fans of two different players.
It´s not a debate about who´s better and stuff. Lindsay´s good, very offensive, but you said that Lindsay´s best offense beats Serena´s best offense....that to me isn´t true. Serena´s besft offense is the best offense I´ve ever seen.

Of course Lindsay will have close matches against Serena, it ain´t like she´s a qualifier or something.

Still look at the h2h and Serena has more crushing defeats whereas Lindsay only has one crushing defeats( in fact she has only 2!! victories against Serena and that tells the whole story...not even during her heydays she couldn´t handle Serena). I´m talking about 6-1 6-2 ´01 IW and some other matches where Serena was totally blowing Lindsay away.
 

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When you're not allowed to play the game you want to play, yeah you have to change it up and maybe play defense, but eventually, to come out on top, you have to play aggressive tennis in today's times.

Being forced to play differently from your usual game because of your opponent is very different to how you actually approach each match and the game plan you intend to use.

Lindsay always comes out to be the aggressor, sure she may have to play defense, but her primary aim is to attack.

Kim OTOH can rally well, move well, etc. but doesn't usually go for the big shot/winner. More often she will get shots back with some nice depth/pace, but ultimately, the more aggressive power player will take advantage.

Kim only plays like an aggressive player when she faces lower class opposition. She moves the ball so well around the court, aiming to draw errors rather than forcing the issue with her shots.

In relation to the argument about Lindsay/Serena, when Serena wasn't as consistent, there were times when Lindsay and Serena were very even in their matches. Now with her new found consistency and superior movement, it is beginning to make life difficult for Lindsay. However, when ON Lindsay's game is lethal.

Note the 6-2 set off Venus at Wimby this year. Awesome stuff from Lindsay, but it seems like that form cannot be sustained for 1+ sets. Secondly, I genuinely believe Lindsay isn't playing as well as she still can. If she regains that focus again, especially to make a big run at a Slam, I think we can see Lindsay back on form again, the one that has the potential to defeat any player.
 

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DEETHELICK said:
When you're not allowed to play the game you want to play, yeah you have to change it up and maybe play defense, but eventually, to come out on top, you have to play aggressive tennis in today's times.

Being forced to play differently from your usual game because of your opponent is very different to how you actually approach each match and the game plan you intend to use.

Lindsay always comes out to be the aggressor, sure she may have to play defense, but her primary aim is to attack.

Kim OTOH can rally well, move well, etc. but doesn't usually go for the big shot/winner. More often she will get shots back with some nice depth/pace, but ultimately, the more aggressive power player will take advantage.

Kim only plays like an aggressive player when she faces lower class opposition. She moves the ball so well around the court, aiming to draw errors rather than forcing the issue with her shots.

In relation to the argument about Lindsay/Serena, when Serena wasn't as consistent, there were times when Lindsay and Serena were very even in their matches. Now with her new found consistency and superior movement, it is beginning to make life difficult for Lindsay. However, when ON Lindsay's game is lethal.

Note the 6-2 set off Venus at Wimby this year. Awesome stuff from Lindsay, but it seems like that form cannot be sustained for 1+ sets. Secondly, I genuinely believe Lindsay isn't playing as well as she still can. If she regains that focus again, especially to make a big run at a Slam, I think we can see Lindsay back on form again, the one that has the potential to defeat any player.

Yeah, Lindsay when´s on she can be deadly...but the thing´s when she meets Serena or another elite player it´s usually in semi´s and stuff...so the other player will be motivated to do well too and it seems like Lindsay can only hold her "on"form for a set...

Lindsay is the perfect opponent for Serena: Hits hard, gives Serena a rythm but doesn´t run much balls down...perfect.
 
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