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I think she is, because she refused to change. I mean like in physical conditioning. She didn't change with the game or become stronger to be able to compete better.
 

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Henin-Hardenne is a smaller player. Looking at her success, it's hard NOT to wonder if Martina could have changed. If only she hadn't had such disdain for power tennis. Even the Williams sisters can't win hitting hard all the time, but all the successful players these days can hit it hard SOME of the time.

I don't believe Martina was physically incapable.
 

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She did improve physically and become a lot fitter...it just didn't improve her game...Justine is smaller but plays more aggressively.
 

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jbone_0307 said:
I think she is, because she refused to change. I mean like in physical conditioning. She didn't change with the game or become stronger to be able to compete better.


Tennis isn't now nor has ever been EVERYTHING in Martina's life, she has other things going on besides tennis. She actually happens to have a ~life~.
 

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antonella said:
Tennis isn't now nor has ever been EVERYTHING in Martina's life, she has other things going on besides tennis. She actually happens to have a ~life~.
What's your point? :confused: Are you saying Martina would still have retired, even if she was still winning, cos she prefers riding horses and going to school?
 

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Willow said:
She did improve physically and become a lot fitter...it just didn't improve her game...Justine is smaller but plays more aggressively.
Not only that, but even with justine's small size, she's still far more athletic than my poor marty.

I don't like when they compare marty with justine. they might both be small, but there's no way that marty could do the stuff justine does cos she's not as strong as justine. and working out wouldn't help. justine is just blessed with that strong athletic body.
 

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antonella said:
Tennis isn't now nor has ever been EVERYTHING in Martina's life, she has other things going on besides tennis. She actually happens to have a ~life~.

That makes no sense because she critcized the william sisters on doing other things other than tennis, so why would she contradict herself??? Tennis was 98.9% of Martinas life or else she wouldn't have been on the court winning GS :rolleyes:
 

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Willow said:
What's your point? :confused: Are you saying Martina would still have retired, even if she was still winning, cos she prefers riding horses and going to school?


Did or rather does Martina prefer horse-riding to tennis?? who knows, but I think the evidence tends to suggest the former rather than the latter. Some of you may recall Melanie stating back in 1996 Martina was 'unsure' as whether to concentrate on tennis or on equestrian sports. It was only in her breahthrough year of 1996 that she decided to concentrate on tennis instead. But did she do it with all her heart?? HELL NO!! if tennis was her whole life she would have bulked up and hired a coach. She was never into it ALL THE WAY. From the looks of it, I saw nothing but boredom in her eyes in the latter part of her career, she had 'been-there and done-that' to death and wanted some other venue. After all, she won $18 million in prize money, a garage full of Porsches, no pressure and a boyfriend. In case many of you don't know, it takes a lot of money to compete professionally on the equestrian circuit, she finally had access to the resources and is doing what is making her happy. :) :D :) :D
 

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It almost always makes me chuckle when someone mentions the fact that Martina was small.

I am 5'7, same size as Martina and that is not exactly pint size. Compared to the likes of Davenport of Venus who are over 6' she might be, but her size was not the problem. Her problem was she stuck to the game that brought her success even when her peers had caught up with her!
 

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antonella said:
Tennis isn't now nor has ever been EVERYTHING in Martina's life, she has other things going on besides tennis. She actually happens to have a ~life~.

This confirms that you "know absolutely phucking nothing" of the Hingis psyche...!!! Martina was more dedicated to tennis and the tennis professional lifestyle than the Williamses, having forgone formal education for the rigors of life on the tennis circuit. She absolutely walked, talked and ate tennis up until she was injured. She was also prominent on the Juniors Circuit as well. Yes, she had a life, and it's name was competitive tennis...!!!
 

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I thought she was the victim of a foot injury. :S
 

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jbone_0307 said:
I think she is, because she refused to change. I mean like in physical conditioning. She didn't change with the game or become stronger to be able to compete better.
Martina was super fit at the start of 2002 in Oz.
 

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martina played about 20 touraments a year of course tennis was her whole life. the only time her lover was more important was in wimbledon 99 :eek:
 

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You're right in that stubborness was the key, but not as you think.

The stubborness was to keep playing a defensive game instead of an aggressive game, despite the power of the others' aggressive shots. She had all the power and technique she needed, but she didn't use it the way she had to to win, namely to try to win instead of try not to lose.

Of course, the wear and tear of playing too much also played a part, it's not _that_ fun to train to be in top shape when it hurts all the time. It was obvious the last two years that she wasn't enjoying the tennis very much, the smile that was her charm was seen less and less often.

If I had the money so I didn't need to keep my boring and dangerous job, I'd do something else too...
 

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Martina is not a victim at all, to say so would be ridiculous. Her injuries have caused a long layoff and she has decided to do other things with her life. As she says herself she has had wonderful experiences and is a multi-millionaire and nobody should feel sorry for her. I don't although I was v v bummed when she quit, but you gotta remember she is getting on with her life, and so should you!
 

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Stubborn, Its an opinion of perception. People who don't like Martina would call it lazyniess, couldn't compete with the "elite" and Pro Martina Fans would call it on injury.

However if you put away the mud slinging and perceptions and actually look at it directly, Stubborness was something that was involved with Martinas Game, and it was obvious and if you continue to deny the problem she had then your just being ludicrous.

You could argue the notacble weaknesses of Martinas Game and justify that by your own answer. However a good example of Martina and Stuborness was her Serve.

One thing that was apparent was that she did endeavour to modify her game to compete with the elite such as Venus, Serena, Lindsay, etc, I don't know what her training regeme was, but she did start going to the gym more, pumping more iron, extended weight training with increasing Cardiovascular, She did explain this at a Press Conference to Blick when she just won at Tokyo (early 2002) and many commentators such as Austin, Shriver, McEnroe even had knowledge that she was trying to level her game. We don't know if it served purpose though, maybe not in our view, but we never did get a clear perception of her own assumptions and if it did actually worked for her.

Her serve has always been her biggest dissapointment in Martinas Game, and that is evident. Even Patty Fendick who I think was ranked 43rd ikn Zurich commented on her Serve.

Thats just one part of Martina I really don't understand was that her serve. predrominatly during the part of 1998 and 1999 it was clear that her placement alone (1st serve) and her dismal second serve was not going to hold up against the elite, it was just had virtually no place, and sluggish that it was able to be returned with a large amount of pace and variety, even particulary from non-power players.

She was offered a service coach at the Lipton Champs (The name might of changed) in 1999, she turned it down, and did quote by somewhat that her placement had enough variety to compensate for the lack of pace, and even though she was still dominating most of the WTA, her serve was becoming more weaker looking and hardly intimidating.

There was an abundance of service coaches out there, She was offered them at Saddle Brook, The Swiss Tennis Federation was actually at one point in 2000 was actually going to fund her one. And she refused it. This was stubborness in action, its apparent and obvious, it also was naive, yes yes we all know that her game itself was amazing and that she was up with the best, but particulary the serve was something that did let her down against the top players, something that could of probably not been changed into a bazuka, or a Serena Serve, but could of been alot more intimidating, and have built up a little more pace, you know..more respectful.

She had the chances as I have stated to improve her serve in someway, but declined an abundance of offers, some with blatant naivity, being over-zealous thinking that a serve wasn't that important to her improvment of her game (Of course we very well know that a serve starts the point in the game)

Even though her game did keep her up their, a improved serve would of given her a better chance to dictate the point right from the start, or atleast have a chance to control the ball more in her favour, I really must admit that if she had a more convalescent serve alot of Head to Heads and games that she lost would of gone in her favour.
 
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I think she was stubborn in that she didn't work on her serve.

However, I have to agree that she wasn't into tennis as much as Melanie was. She wasn't interested in practicing and was not nearly as driven as Melanie. Melanie was a perfectionist and a workhorse. Martina had her natural gifts.

If tennis was Martina's life, she wouldn't continue to ride horses, even after she got thrown off one which cost her the Grand Slam in 1997.
 

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hingis-seles said:
I think she was stubborn in that she didn't work on her serve.

However, I have to agree that she wasn't into tennis as much as Melanie was. She wasn't interested in practicing and was not nearly as driven as Melanie. Melanie was a perfectionist and a workhorse. Martina had her natural gifts.

If tennis was Martina's life, she wouldn't continue to ride horses, even after she got thrown off one which cost her the Grand Slam in 1997.
One can say that it did cost her the grandslam, I think from the Horse Accident to the RG Title was 8 weeks I believe, She commited her self knowing she was fit and got to the final, which she lost to Iva Majoli in 3 Sets, and that she had previoulsy lost to Iva before that I think. If you find her Interview she doesn't blame her loss on the Horse Accident she had.
 
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