Tennis Forum banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
OK, this is just my observation, but it's based on what I learned at my coaching course:

There was a whole session devoted to adapting the player as their physiology changes. During things like growth spurts, the plates within the critical joints (knees, elbows, etc...) do not grow at the same rate. The direction was that we must adjust the game and the fitness regimen of the player to cope with this and develop them differently until the plates catch up. This also causes them to slow a little, it changes their center of gravity, stresses their body as more torque is applied to joints that are struggling to catch up, they lose coordination as the joints try to adapt to working differently, and generally get a little klutzy.

If Dani has indeed grown some, with all these complications, it could possibly account for what others see as diminished performance, and also her weight loss. The good news is that the plates generally catch up within 6 months or so, so we can start pushing players soon after that.

Thought everyone might like this information...

..Joe
 
  • Like
Reactions: gorecki

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,001 Posts
Wow, really interesting Joe, thanks a lot :wavey:

So we only have to wait two or three more months and Dani will be back at her old level of performance? :bounce: :bounce: ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,603 Posts
Thanks for that Joe - I think we now understand that this is only a temporary blip in Dani's performance at the moment and that, given time, things will sort themselves out and we'll be seeing the Dani we saw last year, maybe in time for Wimbly. Although I do think that the process might be accelerated a little with some extra professional advice aside from that from Nigel, and that it wouldn't be such a bad idea if she employed a fitness expert and maybe a nutritionist. Asking Nigel to be a Jack of all trades (and possibly master of none) might be a bridge too far for him, so extra help and advice would go a long way IMHO.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
You're welcome, but I want you to remember that I'm not there, so I could just be blowing smoke about all this. It just seemed that a corollary exists, which is why I brought it up.

As to Nigel handling all this, well, that's what he's there for. If I was trained in this, then I gotta believe that Nigel was also, and with more intensity, because he's dealing with tournament-level players.

..Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,603 Posts
joegerardi said:
As to Nigel handling all this, well, that's what he's there for. If I was trained in this, then I gotta believe that Nigel was also, and with more intensity, because he's dealing with tournament-level players.

..Joe
I just wonder if he thinks getting in extra help would dent his pride (and maybe his reputation), but in reality, that is really what is needed. H emight be a decent tennis coach, but is he also an expert in fitness and nutrition? I'm not sure.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
GrahamD said:
H emight be a decent tennis coach, but is he also an expert in fitness and nutrition? I'm not sure.
Well, I can speak to the fitness side of it...
There are several tennis specific excersizes that the students at Van Der Meer's were working on. One great one was throwing different weight medicine balls to each other, catching them to one side of the body with both hands, letting it move the arms and shoulders back, and then throwing it back. It imitated tennis strokes amazingly well, and brought the students' arm strength up. They were very careful there to balance the aerobic and anaerobic training.

We dealt with a gazillion weight-training and strenghtening drills that were geared specifically to tennis. Trying to avoid building up certain muscles that actually hinder the tennis player. Neck muscles is one case, but that's kind of strange area, because we DO want to build up the shoulders...

Anyway, though, I'm willing to give Nigel more time here before I start sending Dani my resume. :D :p :D :p :D

..Joe

PS: The concensus there is that the all-court game - Dani's specialty - is going to go away, along with the serve-and-volley. The game has just become to fast and powerful for that style to continue.
 

·
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Joined
·
20,453 Posts
i did not understand what you wrote.. but i think you meant that during a 'growth spurt' some of your other body parts dont catch up until the later stages so thats why Daniela might be playing 'not so good' lately.

i think we could wait until the fall and winter to see Daniela's power realli acting up!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
beauty_is_pink said:
i did not understand what you wrote.. but i think you meant that during a 'growth spurt' some of your other body parts dont catch up until the later stages so thats why Daniela might be playing 'not so good' lately.

i think we could wait until the fall and winter to see Daniela's power realli acting up!
Maria:
Basically, you have it. I was specifically referring to the tennis-critical joints (elbows, knees) and the things inside them like cartilage that take a while to catch up. As a person grows, their center of gravity changes, and as women physiologically have a lower center of gravity to begin with, any changes screws up one's balance. Remaining centered over the body whilst playing tennis is incredibly important for proper stroke mechanics, recovery, etc., so this could all speak to the changes in Dani's game now.

Again, I'm not stating that this is a fact, it's just something I learned that I wanted to share with all of you as a possible response to all the nay-sayers out there claiming that Dani is losing her competitive edge.

..Joe
 

·
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Joined
·
20,453 Posts
joegerardi said:
Maria:
Basically, you have it. I was specifically referring to the tennis-critical joints (elbows, knees) and the things inside them like cartilage that take a while to catch up. As a person grows, their center of gravity changes, and as women physiologically have a lower center of gravity to begin with, any changes screws up one's balance. Remaining centered over the body whilst playing tennis is incredibly important for proper stroke mechanics, recovery, etc., so this could all speak to the changes in Dani's game now.

Again, I'm not stating that this is a fact, it's just something I learned that I wanted to share with all of you as a possible response to all the nay-sayers out there claiming that Dani is losing her competitive edge.

..Joe

ah Thanks Joe! it makes perfect sense to me! and that may be it for Daniela!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32,932 Posts
Thanks for the info Joe - definitely sound like what Daniela might be going through lately.

Hopefully this *catching up* process will be complete b4 Wimbledon!!! :bounce:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
829 Posts
joegerardi said:
PS: The concensus there is that the all-court game - Dani's specialty - is going to go away, along with the serve-and-volley. The game has just become to fast and powerful for that style to continue.
I'm no expert, but it seems that the ones who are reeling it in these days are all-courters like Henin who like to mix it up and not just rely purely on power. Baseliners like Dokic are basically losing. Maybe its just in the clay season. I really wouldn't consider Dani an all courter. Yes she approaches the net every now and then but she's still basically a baseliner. I really still believe that the all-court approach is more dynamic and that it is still applicable. I believe that if Dani can become a truly efficient all-courter then she would rack up more wins.

That... and I still think serve-and-volley is a damn exciting style to watch.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Tarsius said:
I'm no expert, but it seems that the ones who are reeling it in these days are all-courters like Henin who like to mix it up and not just rely purely on power. Baseliners like Dokic are basically losing. Maybe its just in the clay season. I really wouldn't consider Dani an all courter. Yes she approaches the net every now and then but she's still basically a baseliner. I really still believe that the all-court approach is more dynamic and that it is still applicable. I believe that if Dani can become a truly efficient all-courter then she would rack up more wins.

That... and I still think serve-and-volley is a damn exciting style to watch.
Actually, it's only been the last year or so that Dani has been more of a baseliner. Before that, she was all-court, all the way. I wish she would go back to it, it served her very well.

S&V is the most exhilarating to watch, but sadly, it's dying out. Sampras wasn't really an S&V'er. He was a true all-courter who could S&V because of his outstanding serve. Patrick Rafter was probably the last true S&V'er out there, and before him it was Stefan Edberg. Granted, a few of the clay specialists do it, but without much success.

..Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
829 Posts
I really do think that being an all-courter will be advantageous to Daniela (assuming she can practice it at a very efficient level). This is purely opinionated and by no means an expert opinion at that, but I think that all-courters have the advantage of a more diverse game. Baseliners rely on power and are very predictable. The trend these days is on overpowering the opponent, but still I believe that diversity is the way to curb that trend. Daniela has a strong baseline game. Actually, she has very excellent fundamentals, its all a matter of stringing them together into something she can consistently execute and use. And I believe an all-court approach is a really good way to use her skills. I think Nigel Sears has also been working on her net game... also maybe why she always plays doubles.

Hey Joe, I read a pretty good analysis of Daniela's game on the GM board which says that she really needs a better attitude when it comes to sticking to tactics within the game or in improvising against tricky opponents. I tend to believe that since I haven't seen her lately on TV and the writer of the comment did. According to that post she seems to be really easily frustrated with herself and her strategy whenever it gets foiled and it becomes her ultimate demise in her matches. What do you think of this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32,932 Posts
Tarsius said:
I really do think that being an all-courter will be advantageous to Daniela (assuming she can practice it at a very efficient level). This is purely opinionated and by no means an expert opinion at that, but I think that all-courters have the advantage of a more diverse game. Baseliners rely on power and are very predictable. The trend these days is on overpowering the opponent, but still I believe that diversity is the way to curb that trend. Daniela has a strong baseline game. Actually, she has very excellent fundamentals, its all a matter of stringing them together into something she can consistently execute and use. And I believe an all-court approach is a really good way to use her skills. I think Nigel Sears has also been working on her net game... also maybe why she always plays doubles.

Hey Joe, I read a pretty good analysis of Daniela's game on the GM board which says that she really needs a better attitude when it comes to sticking to tactics within the game or in improvising against tricky opponents. I tend to believe that since I haven't seen her lately on TV and the writer of the comment did. According to that post she seems to be really easily frustrated with herself and her strategy whenever it gets foiled and it becomes her ultimate demise in her matches. What do you think of this?
have to agree on Daniela using her all-court capabilities once again - allows her to change strategies should a particular one's not working at that time.

With Eastbourne/Wimbledon around the corner, it'll be advantageous to pick up on her all court/net game.

and not just for the grass season but utilise her all-court skills for all surfaces.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32,932 Posts
saw a couple of doubles matches Daniela played with ASV last year

she was pretty confident at the net/all court.
perhaps it will be good if she had a doubles partner with a bit more experience.

Unfortunately Navratilova seems to have a fixed partnership with Kuznetsova this year, while veterans who were good doubles players [Zvereva/Novotna/Sukova] aren't playing...

Perhaps a partnership with Husarova [who has a good doubles game] will encourage Daniela to be more inventive and be opportunistic and come to the net a bit more in singles.


wouldn't it be fun if Nigel and Daniela actually come in to read The Cocktail Party forum? :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Tarsius said:
Hey Joe, I read a pretty good analysis of Daniela's game on the GM board which says that she really needs a better attitude when it comes to sticking to tactics within the game or in improvising against tricky opponents. I tend to believe that since I haven't seen her lately on TV and the writer of the comment did. According to that post she seems to be really easily frustrated with herself and her strategy whenever it gets foiled and it becomes her ultimate demise in her matches. What do you think of this?
Well, I wouldn't necessarily agree with that statement. Look at what it says: "...she really needs a better attitude when it comes to sticking to tactics within the game or in improvising against tricky opponents."

Stick with her tactics or improvise... Which is it? It can't be both, because they contradict each other. IMHO, she should use what has worked for her in the past. When she first hit the scene, there were a lot of positive comments on her serve, yet we have seen her struggle through service games lately. (Sometimes.) I think she's going for too much on her serves. Get 'em in, and play the point. Let her game speak for itself, rather than trying to adapt.

The biggest flaw I see in her game strategy is that she tends to adapt her tactics to the player she's facing. If she's facing a baseliner, she tries to baseline against them. If she has an all-courter, then she goes for the same. I would like to see her take one tactic, and STICK with it. Develop that, and then use it consistently. Don't change strategy because of the opponent has a different style. Does Sampras become a baseliner when facing Agassi? No. He sticks with his all-court game, and it seems to have worked for him... :D Find one style, and develop that into a weapon. That's what I'd like.

..Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32,932 Posts
joegerardi said:
The biggest flaw I see in her game strategy is that she tends to adapt her tactics to the player she's facing. If she's facing a baseliner, she tries to baseline against them.
:confused: i wouldn't call that adapting...

it'll be better to play the game her opponent is most uncomfortable with :devil:

but yeah - work on what her strengths are
and continue to rectify her weaknesses
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,057 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
gorecki said:
:confused: i wouldn't call that adapting...

it'll be better to play the game her opponent is most uncomfortable with :devil:

but yeah - work on what her strengths are
and continue to rectify her weaknesses
The reason I wrote that is again, when she first came up to the pros, she was all-courting, all the time, and she was winning well. It has only been the last year or so that when she faces a baseliner, she tends to camp out at the baseline and bang it out with them. That was a major tactical change in her game. And your statement "it'll be better to play the game her opponent is most uncomfortable with" is partially correct. If she's facing a baseliner, they like to play other baseliners. They feed of each other's power. But if that is not her strength, (and I don't believe it is) then she's playing to her opponent's strengths.

However, on the other hand, suppose she faces an opponent that can't play well against an S&V'er. Dani is not an S&V'er, so adopting that game would be detrimental, and she'd probably lose very badly.

Today's game is such that a player has to develop their style based on what they do well, develop that into a series of tools, with pre-determined adjustments - that is, if your opponent is killing you with this, do THAT - and go forward from there. That's how to win. Look at what Juju did to Serena on clay: She destroyed her with angles, and made Serena's power game irrevelant, and she did that by sticking to HER strengths.

..Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
172 Posts
GrahamD said:
Thanks for that Joe - I think we now understand that this is only a temporary blip in Dani's performance at the moment and that, given time, things will sort themselves out and we'll be seeing the Dani we saw last year, maybe in time for Wimbly. Although I do think that the process might be accelerated a little with some extra professional advice aside from that from Nigel, and that it wouldn't be such a bad idea if she employed a fitness expert and maybe a nutritionist. Asking Nigel to be a Jack of all trades (and possibly master of none) might be a bridge too far for him, so extra help and advice would go a long way IMHO.
She's got a nutritionist now - according to today's Sun anyway :) You seen that disgraceful article? Headline says: "Anorexia? I'm more worried about Anna Kournikova" which is tasteless enough, but the article doesn't quote Daniela saying a word about Anna - and why would she say a word about Annaa anyways :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
172 Posts
If you didn't see it - there's nothing new in it, no quotes we haven't heard before, just a re-hash of Nigel's comments from the past few weeks, and no new pics
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top