Was not doing that closed stance, longer hold and more rotation against babs, was more open stance all match unfortunately. Oviously just to get through that match with her back hindrance

And before the haters chime in with loopy topspin or deluded Alacarz comparison, no this technique helps with more body ration and racket lag for a bit more power for any player, of which emma had none of these against babs

 

In some ways though it also kind of feels like Emma is pushing through whatever to finally be able to say she has had a full season. That’s a monkey (one of many) that she is trying to get off her back.

Also from a general tennis standpoint. From where she started the year to where she has reached (and all the crap in between) wouldn’t this be considered a very successful tennis year?

 

Also from a general tennis standpoint. From where she started the year to where she has reached (and all the crap in between) wouldn’t this be considered a very successful tennis year?

I think some people on here, myself included, can get a little too emotionally caught up in the immediate short-term disappointment whenever she has a bad result, and allow that to muddy the waters a little when trying to look at the bigger picture.

If you zoom out and take a season-long look at her 2025 so far, it's actually been pretty good :

• She's played 46 singles matches, going 27-18 (59%) and 6 doubles, going 3-3. Not as strong as WL% as last year, but she's also consistently facing a higher quality of opposition in 2025 (77 vs 53)
• By rank, she started her season ranked just outside the top 60, and is now just outside the top 30 with zero points now to defend and everything to gain for the next 5-6 weeks. Barring an absolute shocker in her next 3/4 tournaments, she'll almost definitely finish the season inside the top 30, provided she can accumulate another 150-200 points. If she can somehow accumulate around 300-350 more, she'll guarantee herself a top 25 finish.

Ideally, I would have liked her to have won a title somewhere to get that monkey off her back, and to have defeated a couple more top 10 players along the way.

Her trajectory is still going up, but because she hasn't gotten a big result anywhere, it's a slow and steady one.

 

2025 has definitely been a successful year for Emma no matter how people want to dress it up. Playing a full Asian swing would crown it. Emma ending 2025 with 22 or 23 tournaments and 50+ matches while being completely injury free is a massive success compared to her last 3 seasons. It will be something to build a lot upon.

 

Speaking for myself, I don't 'hate' you bringing this up again and again at greater and greater length, I am merely irritated by it, given that it is speculation based on observations from a great remove. A simple investigation of chiropractic indicates that they do in fact treat causes of back pain other than slipped ribs. Sure, that may well be the cause, and if so, you can take a bow; but until that conclusion is confirmed, can you just give it a rest? Ed. Or perhaps post them on that thread about health issues?

 

Why is this any worse than people bringing up again and again why hasn’t she gotten a S&C or physiotherapist on board already? Or why does she suddenly get passive mid match? Or why doesn’t she say come on and pump herself up more during the matches? Or why doesn’t she get a new coach? I don’t think I bring up the back issue any more than those other matters/explanations for her performance. If we’re just talking about frequency or total occurrence. I didn’t even think of this possibility until a week or two ago. And I have merely added my perspective when I think Emma is being unfairly crtiticized for not trying hard enough, or making the right staffing decisions, or whatever, when I think a better explanation is right under our nose. How is my thought any more speculative than any of these other assertions or complaints? Do we know for sure saying come on more will help her? Do we know for sure she is suddenly getting passive for no good reason whatsoever? Do we know for sure she isn’t trying to find the right people to add to her team? Come on, all comments we make are all subjective speculations to some extent. Why should my comments alone be held up to higher standards? I’m not saying all this because I’m mad. I’m just pointing out the inconsistency.

Why should it be relegated to a health thread when it’s a way to explain why her tennis performance suddenly dips in certain matches? I don’t care about her health for her health’s sake. I care about her health for her tennis’ sake.

if you find my comments irritating then please, just put me on your ignore list. Seriously. I’m not mad about this. I don’t take it personally. But I do want to be able to post my opinion freely just like everyone else. And I understand why it bothers some people. I really do. It’s far easier to blame some easier to fix problem, to believe with simply a change in mindset, or the hiring of the right people, all Emma’s problems could be solved!

But I just can’t stand poor Emma gets criticism that she doesn’t deserve. I want to believe that I can defend her at least on her own forum!

 

I think we all accept that there is something wrong, and you have made your case as to what you think that something is, but what is the point of bringing it up again and again?!

 

What is the point of anyone bringing up the same point over and over again - that she’s being passive for no reason, that she still hasn’t gotten a S&C coach or physiotherapist yet, and the most specious of all, that she or her family are too tight fisted to pay for professionals

Is there a rule against repeating the same arguments? If you think there is one and want to enforce it, then please, I’d love it if you reply to all those repeated comments every time and ask them why they’re bringing it up again.

if not, then I think you’ve already answered your own question - why I feel compelled to repeat myself every time I see one of those comments repeat themselves.

There are lazy journalists who happily cite fan criticism to pile more onto Emma when things go wrong, like losing in USO R1 last year. Plenty of people here accused her of not wanting to play more warm up matches “for no reason”. But we now know she had injuries beforehand and couldn’t play. So while I’m happy to laugh and joke along about lots of things, I absolutely will defend Emma every time when I think people are piling unfair criticism onto Emma any time. I hope I have made my reasoning clear enough. I’ve tried to explain many different ways already what the point is. if you or other still don’t get it, I don’t how to explain it any other way. I’ll just repeat that feel free to ignore me.

 

Emma before USO 21 final, they interviewed her old coaches at Partk Langley, and they said emma has to win instraight sets and if it goes to 3 then its over. They probably know something and that was long time ago. But it could be that she was just new and not done enough hours for long setters.

Anyway, fingers crossed things get better for emma, on to Beijing.

 

I am not (nobody can be) sure if @tennismomfan hypothesis is true. But I agree with @tennismomfan on two points: 1) whatever back problem Emma has is not uncurable, 2) finding the right person to cure it is not easy.

More than 12 year ago I started to have problem with my upper back. I tried multiple physios, some of them trained chiropractors , acupuncturists, osteopaths. Despite all those efforts my back went steadily worse. 5 years ago it got so bad that I lost feeling in 50% of my left arm, had diminished power in both arms and was living in constant pain all because nerve compression. Doctors said it is an irreversible degenerative process and proved through MRIs and CTs that reduced inter-vertebral space is compressing the nerves. I was therefore shortlisted (bypassed a 3 year waiting list) and scheduled for emergency spinal fusion surgery. 3 weeks before surgery I meet this osteopath (similar to a chiropractor but with a different more approach) that fixed my chronic pain in 2 sessions so I took the risk and canceled my surgery. That was a big deal because I am no longer be eligible to be shortlisted for such surgery, and if I ever needed I will have to wait 3-4 years in line. But I made the right decision. Few months later I regained most of feeling and power in my arms. 5 years later I manage my back every day with the exercises prescribed by the osteopath and visit the guy 2-3 times a year. I can live a normal life, ski and play tennis which would not have been possible after the scheduled triple spinal fusion. I had recently an MRI for something else, and they pointed out that I have severe nerve compression and that I should urgently schedule a meeting with a neurosurgeon for assessment. I smiled and thought I must be one of the luckiest man alive. But I am not a unique case, I know a lot of people that went through similar experiences.

 

I am not (nobody can be) sure if @tennismomfan hypothesis is true. But I agree with @tennismomfan on two points: 1) whatever back problem Emma has is not uncurable, 2) finding the right person to cure it is not easy.

More than 12 year ago I started to have problem with my upper back. I tried multiple physios, some of them trained chiropractors , acupuncturists, osteopaths. Despite all those efforts my back went steadily worse. 5 years ago it got so bad that I lost feeling in 50% of my left arm, had diminished power in both arms and was living in constant pain all because nerve compression. Doctors said it is an irreversible degenerative process and proved through MRIs and CTs that reduced inter-vertebral space is compressing the nerves. I was therefore shortlisted (bypassed a 3 year waiting list) and scheduled for emergency spinal fusion surgery. 3 weeks before surgery I meet this osteopath (similar to a chiropractor but with a different more approach) that fixed my chronic pain in 2 sessions so I took the risk and canceled my surgery. That was a big deal because I am no longer be eligible to be shortlisted for such surgery, and if I ever needed I will have to wait 3-4 years in line. But I made the right decision. Few months later I regained most of feeling and power in my arms. 5 years later I manage my back every day with the exercises prescribed by the osteopath and visit the guy 2-3 times a year. I can live a normal life, ski and play tennis which would not have been possible after the scheduled triple spinal fusion. I had recently an MRI for something else, and they pointed out that I have severe nerve compression and that I should urgently schedule a meeting with a neurosurgeon for assessment. I smiled and thought I must be one of the luckiest man alive. But I am not a unique case, I know a lot of people that went through similar experiences.

Emma's back problem can be incurable. She's had those problems even in her junior and ITF days. This goes back at least 7 or 8 years then so if the Raducanu camp knew there was a long-term solution for that do you think they would pass it up for several years to make Emma suffer more?

 

Always going to think what could have happened if Yutaka could have stuck around. (I know personal reasons)

Thinking back to AO watching those training session between them and how Emma isn’t getting any of that any more

what could have been ….

 

She hasn’t gotten any injury. Her back problems are not injuries caused by playing or fatigue. They could happen anyway as an example the spasm she suffered in December 2024 happened when she was bending down to tie her shoes. I am sure that if she knew there was a solution that would dissolve them for good she would apply it but it looks like there isn’t any.

 

Having Yutaka around was doing more for Emma body then having nobody doing nothing.

 

Do you know what she is doing to keep her body in a good shape? She had a back spasm 3 weeks after starting to work with Yutaka. No real guarantee that she wouldn't be having those spasms if Yutaka was there. If she pushes through a lot she increases the risk of having them. We can't know if she skipped BJK Cup qualifiers and Rouen back in April because she actually was feeling her back because of a hectic first 3 months she even said they were very taxing physically.

 

anyway since she'll mostly spend a month in China, maybe she can reach out some high profile acupuncturists and probably hire one along with her touring Chinese swing.

 

Having a physio and s&c coaches will give her the best possible chance of her back being in the best condition, nobody is saying it’s going to fix it but without them she is most likely making everything worse and not going to be able to progress.

 

Yep, and it’s also not only about her back.

 

Maybe she is relying on tournament physios. How do you see that she hasn't progressed this season? Her back spasms seem to be very random and unpredictable so she can't know when they'll happen and no physio can control that. If she could know when they'll happen she could work to prevent them from happening that doesn't seem to be the case with her. It is just similar to what tennismomfan told us about themselves.

 

Just let her and us get through this season unscathed…..the first of her now 4+ year career. It’s a goal Emma set early on and I think along with potential seeding for AO this is her ONLY actual goal. Just a little more Emma. Just a little more

 

She will get through it.

 

I thought you said her condition was permanent?

 

Not sure how it’s even remotely controversial to say that it’s suboptimal to be relying on tournament physio’s, who have a finite amount of time they can work with Emma, vs hiring a full-time physio who’s sole responsibility would be Emma. The fact she has a genetic back condition makes it more, not less imperative as it clearly needs managing.

 

It is not at all controversial.. if she can find the right person ..and it is what Petch said recently ..so am sure he would have told her as well.

It is just trying to understand the reasons why she might be cautious ..if her trust in her previous full time physio was broken and she was surprised and let down. She may feel she gets more independent advice from someone not under her full time employment (who can get influenced by an agent ..Chris at the time) ...although she has a better agent team in Jill and Thomas now I would say. So she might take longer to find that right person ..rather than jump at first option.

 

Emma was right to fire her whole team in 2023. In hindsight, if she had the surgeries in autumn of 2022 she would had been back for RG 2023 or at least Wimbledon 2023. But without hindsight, the decision to keep pushing after IW, when it was obvious even for us that the wrist pain fully returned, was so bad. If you only consider the ranking blunder, it was so idiotic to go to Miami, Stuttgart and Madrid, and lose those protected ranking points. I am 100% sure that, if Emma had those PR points she would had attended more tournaments last year.

 

Yes. But we still don't know for sure whose fault that is, in spite of what Emma's interpretation is. And maybe her story is the whole truth. I work in a very litigious profession- when things go wrong, fingers get pointed at everyone. And often there is blame to go around. I'd be shocked if Emma said 'i need to stop and have surgery' and everyone told her to just suck it up. Which is what she implied. If that is the whole truth then i agree she was let down by them in a big way.

In any event, she couldn't afford to keep Seb on while going through months of rehab, and decided that things didn't work out with Will and made that change. Will is now with Hannah and was with GB at BJKC. And i have wondered if there also is some discomfort there in that for Emma, if maybe there are some personal issues that might have made the decision to stay with Roig for the two weeks easier to make.

 

Federer on hiding his injuries (recent Served podcast).

I've been wondering whether it was better for Emma to keep schtum or to reveal. In Emma’s case, I think she’ll catch flak either way. So I’m kind of with Federer on this. If you’re playing, don’t give your opponents any more information. She’ll be dragged anyway whether she reveals or keeps it on the DL. Frustrating for us fans, but no upside in revealing on-going health issues me thinks

 

I’ve seen enough. If Roig doesn’t stay on, Emma should hire Agassi. And who knows, you might be getting 2 for the price of 1, with casual input from Steffi over dinner.

Srsly, I think Andre would make a good coach for most players – expertly analytical, understands the mental and emotional struggles and has won all the majors without natural athletic advantages. Plus he’s such a cheerleader

 

And as much as anyone in tennis past or present, he knows the pitfalls and demands of being over-marketed. Emma's probably peaked in this department, but still think she could benefit from Andre's wisdom.

 

Plus even Poupel isn’t a miracle worker and cannot fully prevent her back from flaring up in a match - he can only help her between matches. If I recall correctly, her whole team including Poupel looked on grimly during her match against Rybakina, in which she had trouble both with her serve and her BH (her serve stats were noticeably worse than first two rounds, and I think @julesjules noted that she kept on dumping her BH into the net).

It seems that her back can flare up on the left side, affecting her BH and serve, or it can flare up on the right side, affecting her FH, like in Seoul.

Actually you can tell which side is bothering her based on how she stretches - I went back and watched quite a few matches. If she stretches sideways to the left, then she usually has a bad serve and BH day, and if she does this twisting stretch then it affects her FH.

Of course she’s not going to disclose any such details in public, so as to give her opponents an advantage. I hope none of her opponents or team members are reading my comments here to use this against her in matches. 😰

 

Oh, I think the opponents clearly know. Especially the high ranked ones that have a team focused on looking for any weakness/advantage they can find of their opponents. They’ve been targeting her bh side for some time now. But it’s not your fault, we are just speculating, and anyone can notice it by watching her matches and knowing about her back problems.

 

I wouldn’t worry, you are postulating about Emma’s back at the US Open and Seoul. No opponent would be silly enough to use that to inform themselves before a match with Emma

 

But I do worry. This is why I won’t post any videos or screenshots of which stretches she does means which shots are affected - if this does catch on somehow it would really be bad for her competitively.

I will just mention it in her live commentary thread which shots I think would be affected each match, and those of you who think I’m merely speculating can call it “luck” every time. 😅

 

this is huge speculation, there is no real evidece she has physical issues

 

The things about the back I agree are speculation since Emma doesn’t divulge anything. But that she currently (as in today) has a physical issue is a fact since she said so to fans after her practice session. Now, whether that physical issue is the back, the ribs, her period, her legs, arms or the flu/a cold/food poisoning, nobody knows

 

Responding on this thread...

- YouTube

Thanks for posting these, I have watched some of them before, but listened to the entire series just now. There are actually 6 parts- all 6 are worth listening to. He speaks very highly of her parents. What comes across is what we know already, which is that Emma has excellent parents who have done a wonderful job raising their daughter. Emma herself credited her 'strict' parents when she won the USO. I loved that the mother said no way was Emma skipping a half hour of school in the morning to play tennis (she was age 9). 'She is not coming out of school and she is not going to school late'. Lol. Good for her, that would be ridiculous kids skipping school for sports at that age. In fact her father reduced tennis hours to have time for other things which was unusual, he said, as most parents pushed their children to do more tennis, and he has to try to convince them that after a certain number of hours it doesn't help anymore.

I addition to Harry Bushnell, there is also the podcast interviewing Alastair Filmer (Emma's coach 11-14) who Harry Bushnell says he recommended to Ian as Emma's next coach after Andrew Richardson and then Nick Cavaday - they each moved or something so were not able to coach anymore and Ian used to call Harry Bushnell for advice on coaches. I haven't listened to it since it came out but in my memory it is worth a listen, going to listen to it again now...

Alastair Filmer - Developing a US Open Champion

Podcast Episode · Control the Controllables · 09/21/2021 · 1h 18m

podcasts.apple.com

 

Responding on this thread...

Thanks for posting these, I have watched some of them before, but listened to the entire series just now. There are actually 6 parts- all 6 are worth listening to. He speaks very highly of her parents. What comes across is what we know already, which is that Emma has excellent parents who have done a wonderful job raising their daughter. Emma herself credited her 'strict' parents when she won the USO. I loved that the mother said no way was Emma skipping a half hour of school in the morning to play tennis (she was age 9). 'She is not coming out of school and she is not going to school late'. Lol. Good for her, that would be ridiculous kids skipping school for sports at that age. In fact her father reduced tennis hours to have time for other things which was unusual, he said, as most parents pushed their children to do more tennis, and he has to try to convince them that after a certain number of hours it doesn't help anymore.

I addition to Harry Bushnell, there is also the podcast interviewing Alastair Filmer (Emma's coach 11-14) who Harry Bushnell says he recommended to Ian as Emma's next coach after Andrew Richardson and then Nick Cavaday - they each moved or something so were not able to coach anymore and Ian used to call Harry Bushnell for advice on coaches. I haven't listened to it since it came out but in my memory it is worth a listen, going to listen to it again now...

Alastair Filmer - Developing a US Open Champion

Podcast Episode · Control the Controllables · 09/21/2021 · 1h 18m

podcasts.apple.com

He was always getting recommendations from coaches then. He was getting recommendations from Platenik before Platenik joined Emma. Yet you tell me he isn't involved in Emma's career

 

In this series Bushnell at some point says that Ian wanted him to train Emma every day before and after school until Renee intervened and stopped him from doing it.

 

I swear we had this discussion just a few months ago. Emma is doing what is entirely normal and typical for a child with an Asian upbringing.
A great majority of us have done the exact same thing. Given control of our finances completely over to our parents. Grown up the same way. Very strict upbringing where you basically just do what you are told and aim for the extremely high and sometimes unreasonable goals your parents have set. Respect and discipline are foremost.

Many of us moan and groan sometimes but end up raising our children the exact same way.

We see the other side of the coin, ie the « western » way of doing things. Applying our own very functioning brains, we choose NOT to divert nor deviate from our own upbringing and values thank you very much. Your way may be right for you but please don’t tell us what is right for us.

 

Guys Emma's father is Romanian I never knew Romania is in Asia😂