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It`s obvious that we all should be careful in this situation, but tbh, the matter is far more complicated since human factors, tons of unknown and medical questions are clearly involved here.
There are always unknowns because we never possess a 100% accurate crystal ball whether in meteorology or epidemiology.
It's a matter of threat assessment and determining whether life can continue as normal or there's a public safety issue that requires a response.

Many nations would have preferred to have ignored COVID-19 and some the early messaging encouraged citizens to continue as normal ("it's a flu").
A week later their tunes started changing because the problem was growing too quickly.
 

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I do think the Chinese government bears a huge responsibility for this. They chose to not ban these wet markets after SARS which arose the same way. WHY NOT? Because their whole social contract is that the people should stay out of politics and just concentrate on making a lot of money while the political leadership does everything to help you make a lot of money. In exchange the people are allowed to eat anything, watch anything, buy anything that doesn't contradict the party.

Can anyone believe for a second the CCP couldn't ban these markets? If I were to stick one anti-communist flag on a pole in one of their cities, i'd be arrested within minutes with the surveillance they have. Just look at how they used it to enforce the Wuhan quarantine. You can't tell me a market with thousands of live animals in a city centre of 10 million people can exist if they want to ban it.
The CCP did come out with a nationwide ban on wildlife trade this time around. It remains to be seen if it will be enforced.

We also can't ignore that much of the wildlife trade is not just people wanting to spend money to buy and eat exotic animals. Despite all of its progress in the last 50 years, the vast majority of the population is still relatively uneducated and scientifically illiterate. Traditional medicine is propped up by authorities and co-exists alongside Western medicine even in hospital settings. Although most of the wildlife cures are bogus scams that have no history in traditional Chinese medicine, people are often keen to try easy-fix solutions in the absence of a social safety net that provides affordable health care for most citizens. When it is people eating goji berries or ginseng it's pretty harmless but clearly there are cases when it is a public health, environmental, or animal welfare concern and I hope China shifts away from those practices through a mix of regulation and changing social attitudes. The consumption of shark fin, for example, is declining among younger Chinese.
 

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The CCP did come out with a nationwide ban on wildlife trade this time around. It remains to be seen if it will be enforced.

We also can't ignore that much of the wildlife trade is not just people wanting to spend money to buy and eat exotic animals. Despite all of its progress in the last 50 years, the vast majority of the population is still relatively uneducated and scientifically illiterate. Traditional medicine is propped up by authorities and co-exists alongside Western medicine even in hospital settings. Although most of the wildlife cures are bogus scams that have no history in traditional Chinese medicine, people are often keen to try easy-fix solutions in the absence of a social safety net that provides affordable health care for most citizens. When it is people eating goji berries or ginseng it's pretty harmless but clearly there are cases when it is a public health, environmental, or animal welfare concern and I hope China shifts away from those practices through a mix of regulation and changing social attitudes. The consumption of shark fin, for example, is declining among younger Chinese.
i know when my grandmother passed, we had a whole pantry full of "eye of newt" to deal with and we're here in Canada. LOL My brothers and I joke whenever we pass a store we refer to as "a Chinese Apothecary". Most of it is harmless as you say but some of it is as dangerous as self-medicating with fish tank chemicals.

The CCP didn't ban the markets last time because of politically expediency. They aren't going to force changes the population won't accept as it breaks the social contract of buy/eat anything you want. It might make people see the party as not good. This time it's different, it cost them money not just a few lives.
 

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My city's become a ghost town in the last few days. Can't complain about that. The stormy weather helped, for sure. That's when springtime comes with sun and singing birds that people may forget the importance of confinement. Maybe we should hope that it keeps raining - it's good for agriculture anyway. But now that's a sector seeking help for lacking workforce outside.
 

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Miracle Worker, as I see him, is probably one of the last person who would watch Fox News. More the kind of person who approaches the global politics of the world with high level of distrust, even utter disgust towards the western world. If you collect his posts over the years, that's pretty much the image that remains.

He was a fine Q-Ball manager but I sure would'nt vote for him to manage the world.
You would be surprised how amazing I am. And still after all years I was right about Syria - even if people call me a Putin's troll I still was right.

I have no clue about fox new.


It may pain him/her to hear it but Miracle Worker sounds exactly like an extreme right-winger from the western world. And what I have gathered from his/her posts is not "utter disgust towards the western world" but failure to read and try to understand the science. There is a clear distinction between the two.
I understand the science pretty well. But what we have now is no science but propaganda in epic proportions.

maybe Miracle Worker deserves his own thread but I'm afraid it's forbidden on TF. 🤡
Easy choice for TWAT 2020.
And for my fans - there is no excess mortality in Europe.


And - coronaviruses are really common for years.

 

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I understand the science pretty well. But what we have now is no science but propaganda in epic proportions.
you dumb ignorant mofo, in italy and spain corona victims over 60 years die in fucking masses right now because they are being triaged, a thing that never happenend in the those countries at such scale since fucking WW2.
stop being a pathetic dumbfuck for once, jeezus christ.
 

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And - coronaviruses are really common for years.
OMG just stop it. You're simply spreading lies. No one in the media has ever denied the existence of coronaviruses FFS. Show me source of this denial. The coronaviruses are not the same. The thing is this virus is far more contagious than the previous ones. The guy from the video is spreading some epic BS (I know he became popular in Germany).
The latest EURO MOMO data could be still imprecise (as stated under the link you provided).
You previously mixed pneumonia with virus infection and you're saying you know science pretty well? No you don't.
How on earth would you explain the situation in Italy and Spain then? If this is just a regular flu. Why the health system is overloaded with country on lockdown for few weeks now. Please explain this.
If you can't stop spreading this dangerous BS.
 

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This brings to mind Prince Philip's words: "In the event that I am reincarnated, I would like to return as a deadly virus, to contribute something to solving overpopulation."

Hope Charles gets better but it would certainly be poetic justice if it got his fascist creep of a father.
Prince Philip really is something of an embarrassment. Hard to know where to place him on an embarrassment scale with Prince Andrew. Which is one is worse? Very tough to decide. I think I will leave that one to others. The royal family does seem to have a lot of disfunction in it that's for sure. I blame it on inbreeding myself.

Needless to say, I'm not a royalist or a big fan of the royal family by and large, but it is good to see Charles and Camilla setting a good example by self isolating in a proper way.
 

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I wonder if the evolution of the reporting on this is confusing for some people who haven't been following closely enough.
The early designation "novel coronavirus" [novel meaning NEW] has often been shortened to "coronavirus" even in recent media reports.

I've seen claims that this virus "is nothing new" because "coronavirus" was seen listed on old disinfectant labels as one of the pathogens killed.
But coronavirus is a CLASS of virus just as feline is a class of mammal. I'll play with someone's house cat but I'm going nowhere near their pet lion.
 

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Can anyone believe for a second the CCP couldn't ban these markets? If I were to stick one anti-communist flag on a pole in one of their cities, i'd be arrested within minutes with the surveillance they have. Just look at how they used it to enforce the Wuhan quarantine. You can't tell me a market with thousands of live animals in a city centre of 10 million people can exist if they want to ban it.
I'm sure they can relocate the market somewhere else, but banning it is probably not in China's interests due to its role in the food supply and economics for locals.

Check out this video:
 

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Interesting read on the subject of worldwide pandemic fear, if you're bored. Dan Brown's INFERNO (2013)
Or as a movie (2016) Inferno (2016) - IMDb
I find it quite ironic that the plot is set in Italy and the hero is Tom Hanks in the movie, the first to get infected.

Years ago I read a book called I Promessi Sposi (The Betrothed in English) by Alessandro Manzoni. It's partially set against the background of a plague in 17th century northern Italy, and current events there brought it to mind.
 

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Despite all those brilliant minds repeating covid-19 is like normal flu and such things being common for years, I can guarantee that never in my entire life I've witnessed piles of trucks packed with dead bodies to be carried away and incinerated in several other crematoria scattered around the region, with relatives and dear ones prevented from attending, because a city is so overloaded with corpses that the local cemetery can't process them all.
And yeah, such scenes in Italy have been unprecedented since WW2 at least, but morons will be morons I guess.
 

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Germany has reportedly offered assistance to Italy and Spain and the Czech govt to discuss tomorrow sending medical teams to help these two hardest-hit countries contain the virus. Will other countries follow?

It will be also interesting to see the developments in Sweden, as they've taken a very different approach to the epidemic, with e.g. ski resorts still operating. The ceiling on gatherings is 500 people (in Germany or Czechia it's just two people) and the country's borders, hotels and restaurants remain open.
 

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It seems a consensus is emerging among experts that the best way to contain the virus, i.e. the way that suppresses the outbreak the most while at the same time allowing the economy to function and daily life to continue mostly normally for most people, is through massive testing and contact tracing.

Massive testing and isolating those who test positive even without contact tracing can dramatically suppress the virus. If you add contact tracing to the mix, hopefully finding a way to do contact tracing without raising serious privacy concerns, than you can really destroy the virus in record time.

The current hammer method of quarantining everybody and locking down everything is a result of our failure as a society to prepare adequately for a pandemic. As we can see, nations who prepared better for pandemics such as South Korea and Singapore were able to use a more surgical approach as opposed to the hammer method we in the West are currently being forced to employ.

Hopefully next time an outbreak occurs, whether it be a new virus/bacteria or even another outbreak of SARS-COV-2 later down the line, we are more prepared to quickly scale up testing and do contact tracing so we can tackle the outbreak with surgical, targeted strikes instead of resorting to this massively destabilizing hammer of total lock downs. Things did not have to be anywhere near this bad.
 

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It seems a consensus is emerging among experts that the best way to contain the virus, i.e. the way that suppresses the outbreak the most while at the same time allowing the economy to function and daily life to continue mostly normally for most people, is through massive testing and contact tracing.

Massive testing and isolating those who test positive even without contact tracing can dramatically suppress the virus. If you add contact tracing to the mix, hopefully finding a way to do contact tracing without raising serious privacy concerns, than you can really destroy the virus in record time.

The current hammer method of quarantining everybody and locking down everything is a result of our failure as a society to prepare adequately for a pandemic. As we can see, nations who prepared better for pandemics such as South Korea and Singapore were able to use a more surgical approach as opposed to the hammer method we in the West are currently being forced to employ.

Hopefully next time an outbreak occurs, whether it be a new virus/bacteria or even another outbreak of SARS-COV-2 later down the line, we are more prepared to quickly scale up testing and do contact tracing so we can tackle the outbreak with surgical, targeted strikes instead of resorting to this massively destabilizing hammer of total lock downs. Things did not have to be anywhere near this bad.
All countries should be using the technoloy-led appraoch of South Korea imo. Clearly it works. Yes, there are privacy issues but at a time like this we really can't worry about that for the duration of the pandemic. And let's face it, if the state wants to know anyone's whereabouts it will be able to find out anyway. Personally I don't care if the government knows that I've been to the supermarket or am currently sitting at home if it helps to get on top of this thing.
 

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In the last few days more and more physicians and other guys are popping up in Germany who are having different opinions and views. Like Wodarg they either get ignored or shot down like if there`s no tomorrow in the German medias.
So once again it shows that there`s another and probably a lot more dangerous virus around. It`s sitting in the minds, operates completely autonomously and if the fear button is pushed for once there`s no way back.
From that point on people don't question anymore for instance the deliberate and immediate way they are ready to give up their individual freedoms while being convinced to do the right thing and acting reasonable.
Then some also don`t notice the way they condemn others and transfer the thing on a political level.
Similar mechanics makes them ready to even go to war for their ideas, beliefs,etc. while not noticing the obvious contradiction to their apparent civilized attitude.
 

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  • Better hygiene practices, work from home, school closures, rigorous testing, and wider vaccination coverage are among factors that made influenza less fatal
  • Number of deaths more than halved at 113 this year from 356 in 2019, while intensive care unit admissions dropped from 601 to 182
Health experts have said social distancing and increased awareness resulting from the coronavirus pandemic helped end Hong Kong’s winter influenza season nine weeks earlier this time than last year, but 113 people still died of the flu.

The number of deaths in the city more than halved from 356 in 2019, while intensive care unit admissions dropped from 601 to 182.

By Wednesday afternoon, the city reported 410 Covid-19 infections, including four fatalities.
 
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