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That's how you deal with drama queens. Camila ain't have something bad, so she wanted to finish it fast. :hearts:

My fave has a winnable SF opponent, but I am more than happy with this showing! Stay rested for USO, darling.
 

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Caught the end of the first set and the second set Giorgi was in blistering form while Cornet had no answer to the bullet returns that came back deep and fast.

Wang Qiang :scared:
 

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What, no Fall Cometh thread for Cornuts?

Actually, I guess it's more like the fall cameth and wenteth.

.
 

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Giorgi's ground strokes are faster than those of any ATP player. The men have bigger serves but their ground strokes are not huge.
In Cincinnati, of all the players including the men, the stats were showing Keys had the fastest ground strokes on average . The commentators kept bringing it up in the conversation.
Yes, I have been saying this for a while. Top women hit the balls harder/faster and flatter than the men.
 

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Now that's a awesome win by Giorgi!

Never lost her serve game, only one break point offered, but saved, and breaking 5 times Cornet!

That's dominance!
 

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Giorgi's ground strokes are faster than those of any ATP player. The men have bigger serves but their ground strokes are not huge.
In Cincinnati, of all the players including the men, the stats were showing Keys had the fastest ground strokes on average . The commentators kept bringing it up in the conversation.
Yes, I have been saying this for a while. Top women hit the balls harder/faster and flatter than the men.

no

just no

dont go there
 

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numbers shmumbers

the ball is lighter and the rpms arent even in the same ballpark

it is apples to oranges
Both of you are right, at least partly.

Apart ball weight difference (I don't know how much it is, and if it exists in every tournament), if the ball is hit flatter it will travel faster.

Of course the "heaviness" of the ball is related to the energy carried by the ball, that comes from it's linear speed AND the spin speed.

For men the spin rate is often displayed, never for women, but we basically know that for women fast ground stroke are usually very flat, with few spin.

So basically it may happen that big hitters as Key (but sometime even small girls like Giorgi) can send a flat ball at linear speed if not higher at least comparable with men, but the energy transferred to the ball by men, with the much higher spin, is of course higher.
 

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numbers shmumbers

the ball is lighter and the rpms arent even in the same ballpark

it is apples to oranges
And don't you know that with a lighter ball it is harder to reach the same high average traveling speed? (Try to throw away a match box and a stone with the same size, and you'll see it. Against the air friction the lighter ball decelerates much faster. The same applies to the rotating speed. As long as the balls have the same size, with heavier balls higher average rpm and traveling speed can be achieved, supposing THE SAME RACKET HEAD HITTING SPEED. - If it is favorable, that is a big question.)
 

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Both of you are right, at least partly.

Apart ball weight difference (I don't know how much it is, and if it exists in every tournament), if the ball is hit flatter it will travel faster.

Of course the "heaviness" of the ball is related to the energy carried by the ball, that comes from it's linear speed AND the spin speed.

For men the spin rate is often displayed, never for women, but we basically know that for women fast ground stroke are usually very flat, with few spin.

So basically it may happen that big hitters as Key (but sometime even small girls like Giorgi) can send a flat ball at linear speed if not higher at least comparable with men, but the energy transferred to the ball by men, with the much higher spin, is of course higher.
With a decent video editor program (investigating the individual frames, step by step) it is evident that most of the shots by men are slower (compared to the hardest hitter women's), and they are using more energetic shots only in well chosen moments, and even in those cases they prefer to put larger part of the energy into the rotating. This makes the men's shots EASIER TO REACH, but HARDER TO HANDLE.

I think the men's playing style evolved into this direction, because the generally TALLER and FASTER men are usually capable of reaching any ball, therefore ==> it is easier to win the points via forcing the opponent to make errors thanks to the TRICKY SPINNING, while in the women's tour the simplest way of winning the points remained to hit the ball powerfully enough out of the opponent's reach.
 

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:haha::haha::haha: TF the gift that keeps on giving.
 

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Giorgi is finally in good form. If she doesn't tax herself too much in the SF and F, if she gets there , she could win a few rounds in the open. She's got a tough first rounder versud Sakari.
 

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And don't you know that with a lighter ball it is harder to reach the same high average traveling speed? (Try to throw away a match box and a stone with the same size, and you'll see it. Against the air friction the lighter ball decelerates much faster. The same applies to the rotating speed. As long as the balls have the same size, with heavier balls higher average rpm and traveling speed can be achieved, supposing THE SAME RACKET HEAD HITTING SPEED. - If it is favorable, that is a big question.)
The lighter ball was introduced to speed up the women’s game. Obviously, because of the friction, the lighter ball decelerates faster. But the initial speed is faster. And it’s probably less tiring on the arm, so in the long run, it is probably speeding up the pace of rallies.
 

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The lighter ball was introduced to speed up the women’s game. Obviously, because of the friction, the lighter ball decelerates faster. But it’s probably less tiring on the arm, so in the long run, it is probably better for the quality of tennis.
I agree, the lighter ball is really less tiring during the normal hitting, and favors the nicer, more technical tennis and longer rallies - at the expense of fewer big aces.
(Expecting that it can speed up the game is strange.)

You might remember what may happen when the ball is heavier: In 2016 French Open R16 Halep played vs. Stosur, but the match was interrupted with several rain delays and the balls were WET and HEAVIER. And because Stosur was much more muscular than Halep (Stosur: 175 cm, 70 kg vs. Halep: 168 cm, 60 kg) she could benefit from the heavier balls: her shots arrived with a much faster speed (and energy) at Halep, who lost the match.

---------
Addition:
- The difference between the little heavier or lighter balls cannot be felt by the hitting players (0.25% difference).
- But it can be felt by the returning players (5% difference).

This is the explanation why Keys didn't felt that in the Cincinnati final for a while they played with heavier balls (for man).
 

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I agree, the lighter ball is really less tiring during the normal hitting, and favors the nicer, more technical tennis and longer rallies - at the expense of fewer big aces.
(Expecting that it can speed up the game is strange.)

You might remember what may happen when the ball is heavier: In 2016 French Open R16 Halep played vs. Stosur, but the match was interrupted with several rain delays and the balls were WET and HEAVIER. And because Stosur was much more muscular than Halep (Stosur: 175 cm, 70 kg vs. Halep: 168 cm, 60 kg) she could benefit from the heavier balls: her shots arrived with a much faster speed (and energy) at Halep, who lost the match.
But the initial speed of the lighter ball would be higher, so it would speed up the game, wouldn’t it? The tennis court is quite small... so maybe the ball would still be travelling faster by the time it reached the other player.

A better example would be perhaps be golf. A lighter golf ball would definitely travel slower. But that’s because a golf course covers a much greater distance.

//

The same thing happened to Radwanska that year. She lost to Pironkova despite leading a set and 2 breaks in the 2nd.
 
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