TennisForum.com - Reply to Topic
Thread: Suicide Rome Reply to Thread
Title:
Message:
Trackback:
Send Trackbacks to (Separate multiple URLs with spaces) :
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the TennisForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










  Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

  Topic Review (Newest First)
May 20th, 2019 12:16 AM
Monzanator
Re: Suicide Rome

Well, Osaka vs Bertens didn't even happen hence the BU is used for this specific reason. What else it would be used for?

@Ceze
May 19th, 2019 05:43 PM
to paradise.
Re: Suicide Rome

@twight6 to the rescue!
May 19th, 2019 04:25 PM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by twight6 View Post
Hi Ceze!

It’s my understanding that the backup is always used if either player withdraws, even when an LL is in play. For example:

DAY01 has Bertens vs Lisicki, and you pick Bertens. If lisicki withdraws, a LL is put in place, Mladenovic. Even though Bertens still plays, your pick is invalid and a back-up is used. This is because you picked Bertens to beat Lisicki; she now plays Mladenovic, making your pick invalid.

At least, that’s how I’ve always understood the rule now that you ask about it though, I could be wrong In which case, I’d argue that a “walkover” is different than a withdrawal before the match starts.
thanks for your answer
Here I disagree: in your example I didn't pick Bertens to beat Lisicki, but I picked her to be the winner and go to the next round, whoever her opponent is. A bit as in FITD, the aim of suicide game is to go as far as possible in the rounds by picking "survivors", and my player survived!

Quote:
Originally Posted by twight6 View Post
More importantly, back to your initial question of WHY this rule was in place for Osaka. The biggest reason is that we never know WHEN a player withdraws. Sometimes it’s done in press conference, sometimes on twitter, sometimes not until a player walks on court. So, in theory, often it’s nearly impossible to tell WHEN the walkover was actually granted. Therefore, I could pick Bertens after I knew Osaka had a walkover, but before it was made official, thereby making it impossible for the tournament runner to know whether my pick was made on time or not. Essentially, “start time” is impossible to determine, unlike a normal match where start = “first point”

This, plus the other obvious reason of the fact that no match was actually played, are the two big reasons why we void a walkover no matter what
Here I agree and I better understand the interest of this rule Thanks for the explanation. Even if I'm sad it prevented me from winning this week (Osaka )
May 19th, 2019 03:48 PM
twight6
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceze View Post
I meant that retirement or withdrawal doesn't lead to the use of the BU in every situations
Hi Ceze!

It’s my understanding that the backup is always used if either player withdraws, even when an LL is in play. For example:

DAY01 has Bertens vs Lisicki, and you pick Bertens. If lisicki withdraws, a LL is put in place, Mladenovic. Even though Bertens still plays, your pick is invalid and a back-up is used. This is because you picked Bertens to beat Lisicki; she now plays Mladenovic, making your pick invalid.

At least, that’s how I’ve always understood the rule now that you ask about it though, I could be wrong In which case, I’d argue that a “walkover” is different than a withdrawal before the match starts.



More importantly, back to your initial question of WHY this rule was in place for Osaka. The biggest reason is that we never know WHEN a player withdraws. Sometimes it’s done in press conference, sometimes on twitter, sometimes not until a player walks on court. So, in theory, often it’s nearly impossible to tell WHEN the walkover was actually granted. Therefore, I could pick Bertens after I knew Osaka had a walkover, but before it was made official, thereby making it impossible for the tournament runner to know whether my pick was made on time or not. Essentially, “start time” is impossible to determine, unlike a normal match where start = “first point”

This, plus the other obvious reason of the fact that no match was actually played, are the two big reasons why we void a walkover no matter what
May 19th, 2019 02:08 PM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by to paradise. View Post
I'm not sure I understand your second point. If you picked a player for the first day and she withdraws after the OOP is released then yes, your back-up would be used.

There are a lot of rules that I think could be re-visited, but no one ever really makes an effort at the end of the year so everything just stays the same.
I meant that retirement or withdrawal doesn't lead to the use of the BU in every situations
May 19th, 2019 01:46 PM
to paradise.
Re: Suicide Rome

I'm not sure I understand your second point. If you picked a player for the first day and she withdraws after the OOP is released then yes, your back-up would be used.

There are a lot of rules that I think could be re-visited, but no one ever really makes an effort at the end of the year so everything just stays the same.
May 19th, 2019 01:39 PM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by to paradise. View Post
You would have picked Konta to beat Bertens?
yes I picked her, thinking I was still in...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceze View Post
day6: Konta (Pliskova)
Quote:
Originally Posted by to paradise. View Post
That's been the rule forever and I'm surprised you haven't seen it before. That's why back-ups are so important!
Probably because I didn't see this case before. I think that this rule is not fair, for at least 2 reasons:
1/ the player I picked won her match, even if her opponent withdrew. She's in the next round but I'm not, despite I picked her as a winner... that's strange!
2/ when a player withdraws in the first round and is replaced by a LL, the LL is taken into accound, the BU is not used. But when there's no LL (in next rounds), as in Bertens vs Osaka, then the BU is used. In my opinion the BU should be used only if the player you picked withdraws, not in the case it's her opponent.
May 19th, 2019 01:27 PM
to paradise.
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceze View Post
thanks for your answer. I think this rule is very unfair...
Because of this rule and Osaka's fake retirement, I lose the title here (with Konta on day 6 and Pliskova on day 7 I would have won, all my picks being correct, even the Bertens' one )
You would have picked Konta to beat Bertens?

That's been the rule forever and I'm surprised you haven't seen it before. That's why back-ups are so important!
May 19th, 2019 01:19 PM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by to paradise. View Post
No, it's if either player withdraws.
thanks for your answer. I think this rule is very unfair...
Because of this rule and Osaka's fake retirement, I lose the title here (with Konta on day 6 and Pliskova on day 7 I would have won, all my picks being correct, even the Bertens' one )
May 19th, 2019 01:15 PM
to paradise.
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceze View Post
btw this rule should be used only when the player you picked withdraws, not when it's the opponent! It's the first time I see this rule used when it's the opponent who withdraws...
Could other managers tell me if I'm correct or wrong? @twight6 @to paradise. @Broseghini @CharlDa @DAVAJ MKirilenko @Alejan_Milos @wtatourfan @aerosmash
No, it's if either player withdraws.
May 19th, 2019 07:29 AM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Power Shot View Post
4. In the case of a walkover, or a withdrawal, each player is allowed to have a back-up pick, selected at the same time as their initial pick. That back-up pick will only be used in the occurrence of a walkover or withdrawal, as stated above.

Osaka gave Bertens a walkover on Day 5.
btw this rule should be used only when the player you picked withdraws, not when it's the opponent! It's the first time I see this rule used when it's the opponent who withdraws...
Could other managers tell me if I'm correct or wrong? @twight6 @to paradise. @Broseghini @CharlDa @DAVAJ MKirilenko @Alejan_Milos @wtatourfan @aerosmash
May 18th, 2019 11:22 PM
Monzanator
Re: Suicide Rome

Day 7
Konta

May 18th, 2019 02:39 PM
povanetto
Re: Suicide Rome

Lol I don't like this rule
May 18th, 2019 02:24 PM
Ceze
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Power Shot View Post
4. In the case of a walkover, or a withdrawal, each player is allowed to have a back-up pick, selected at the same time as their initial pick. That back-up pick will only be used in the occurrence of a walkover or withdrawal, as stated above.

Osaka gave Bertens a walkover on Day 5.
omg I forget this rule! Thanks! In my opinion this rule is not really fair though My pick went to the next round, but you need to use my BU, that's strange!
May 18th, 2019 02:01 PM
Power Shot
Re: Suicide Rome

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceze View Post
my day5 pick was Bertens (not Vondrousova, who was my back up), so I should be still in @Power Shot
4. In the case of a walkover, or a withdrawal, each player is allowed to have a back-up pick, selected at the same time as their initial pick. That back-up pick will only be used in the occurrence of a walkover or withdrawal, as stated above.

Osaka gave Bertens a walkover on Day 5.
This thread has more than 15 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome