The history of homosexuality in tennis - Page 5 - TennisForum.com
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post #61 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 03:32 PM
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A thread on homosexuals. How queer.

-Only in the Centenary Year-
~At 14, one is particularly vulnerable to obvious temptations of the age, boyfriends, parties, etc. (Virginia Wade in 'Courting Triumph' The best book on earth)~
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post #62 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert1
Because that seems to be the only relationship Graf had before this weird marriage with Agassi. Stubbs was together with Graf and later with Raymond.
Steffi had relationships with a professional German Motorcycle rider for years and the German tennis player Alexander Mronz before that, so she had 2 well known relationships. Irma can correct me on Mronz if I am wrong, but I read it somewhere. Stubbs was together with Graf? What evidence do you have of that or is it just some rumor? Also why is her marraige to Andre 'weird'? They seem happy and have 2 kids, nothing too weird about it to me.


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post #63 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raquel
Steffi had relationships with a professional German Motorcycle rider for years and the German tennis player Alexander Mronz before that, so she had 2 well known relationships. Irma can correct me on Mronz if I am wrong, but I read it somewhere. Stubbs was together with Graf? What evidence do you have of that or is it just some rumor? Also why is her marraige to Andre 'weird'? They seem happy and have 2 kids, nothing too weird about it to me.
it's all based on some dumb comment her father made at the end 92 that he paid michael b and so that relationship was fake and then because stubbs was often seen at steffi's matches. people started to make a rumour that they must have been in a relationship (and as said steffi was linked to many people so why not women too)
that's all. the spiegel did research to prove it, but they came to the conclusion that it was all nonsense and daddy justed wanted to point out that he was in control.
steffi before michael b was in a relationship with a photographer kalled kenn nahoum or something like that, but steffi never confirmed that till in the tennismagazin retirement interview in 2000 (even when certain gossipmagazines seemed to pretty sure about it anyway so it was more like an open secret )

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post #64 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by tennisvideos
Hi Rollo

We were in London when Maria was 'outed'. Basically it was the trashy papers that ran sensationalistic headlines and pics on the front pages! I kept a copy but can't find it now amongst all the tennis junk! LOL. Although I shouldn't call in junk.

Yes, your hunch about Maria & Darlene was right. I even have a video of their Wimbledon final in 1959 when Maria beat Darlene - and it is rather cute but funny... coz after the match Darlene kept planting kisses on Maria and grabbing her. The commentator made a funny comment about what a great sport Darlene was kissing her opponent after suffering a loss. But Darlene just kept right on kissing and grabbing Maria and after a couple of times you could tell Maria was getting uncomfortable!!!!! LOL

I always suspected that Darlene and Maria were a couple, too. When Maria came down with hepatitis during the French Championships in 1961, Darlene stayed in Paris to help nurse her (and she also contracted the illness herself) and missed Wimbledon. As the reigning US title-holder you'd think that Darlene would have jumped at the chance of winning Wimbledon at last with her main rival absent, but I guess her loyalties lay elsewhere.
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post #65 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by tilden
This is a great thread Rollo - thanks for bumping it back into action. BTW I think the Australian player that Larry King was close to (see discussion earlier in thread) was Janet Young.

That's right, tilden. I re-read Grace Lichenstein's "Behind The Scenes in Women's Pro Tennis" over Christmas and it clearly says they had a public affair in 1973.
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post #66 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 08:24 PM
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I have followed Rennae over ten years and run a web site of which she is involved. If anyone can show me a photo, a quote from an article, which proves she is gay, had a relationship with Graf, I will gladly hold my hands up and say I was wrong.

Consider this guys, how many tennis players are on tour, how many people are connected with players. I mean, family, friends, coaching staff, staff and people at the tournaments, hotel staff etc. How come so many people remain silent, why do people not take photos, go public to the papers? How do all these players, and some of the them big names, manage to hide this secret life you accuse them of living?
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post #67 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irma
steffi was rumoured to be in a relationship with half the world
The tramp!!
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post #68 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 5th, 2004, 11:12 PM
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I had no idea that Andrea Jaeger was actually a lesbian... I've heard of the "problems" she had when Wendy Turnbull "coached" her during a few months, so I didn't think she turned out to be a real lesbian. I also don't think that Steffi minded Hana when she told about the player who had a pass on her, but she was talking about a player we assumed as straight... Despite her wedding that has not be the case for Hana, I guess... .
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post #69 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 12:37 AM Thread Starter
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As far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter if so and so is or isn't gay or straight. Lets face it though-as humans a lot of us are curious, and call me guilty on that count!

Stubbsy wrote:

Quote:
Consider this guys, how many tennis players are on tour, how many people are connected with players. I mean, family, friends, coaching staff, staff and people at the tournaments, hotel staff etc. How come so many people remain silent, why do people not take photos, go public to the papers? How do all these players, and some of the them big names, manage to hide this secret life you accuse them of living?
Stubbsy-unless someone admits to being lesbian OR is actually seen in bed with another woman what all those people "know" is merely rumour, conjecture, and hearsay. In other words, any newspaper printing an accusation would face one mother of a lawsuit.

Samantha Stevenson tried many times to write an expose on lesbians on tour (she was one of the ones saying young girls wern't safe in showers ) but the New York Times killed it because of a fear of lawsuits. This was in the late 1970s.
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post #70 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 12:56 AM
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Exactly Rollo. There are lots of cover ups in world sports, hollywood etc. Much of the time it is common knowledge, but not many people dare to print it due to the lawsuit issue.
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post #71 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 01:09 AM Thread Starter
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I think the Stubbs example might be perfect to illustrate the "traps" people can fall into.

Trap A-People think she's a lesbian because of ..but she is straight.

1. Her doubles partners is a lesbian [ask Pam Shriver about this!]
2. She's not known to date guys. [she could keep them a secret]
3. She DOES date guys,but she's "obviously" not interested in them.
[she just might put her career first and like to keep her private life
private]

Trap B-she "must" be straight because

1. She says she is or has boyfriends. And she wouldn't lie about it.
[with the exception of Mauresmo every homosexual HAS lied about it
or at the least refuses to discuss her personal life].
2. She is (or has been) married [no barrier to Marble, Dupont, King, Hard, and Mandlikova].

Either way a celebrity can't stop people from talking and guessing. I think most of it is pure speculation, but some talk is so loud [Conchita Martinez is a good example] it's obvious, while others are so boy crazy [Chris Evert] that's obvious.

Almost everyone else will get talked about. And since most every woman who plays tennis gets labeled as a lesbian at some point the tendency is to "protect" the tour as a whole.

And money is still a factor. God knows if I were a lesbian I wouldn't come out for all the world. Too much of endorsement money is tied to sex appeal-and the brutal fact is 90% of the world is straight. Had I been King, Navratilova, or Mandlikova I would have denied it all like they did until I couldn't.

A final factor is how these women view themselves. Do women who sleep with other women "feel" lesbian? It seems like a lot of women who have relationships on tour still dream of having a marriage with kids after tennis. Or they tell themselves they are bisexual (Martina does this in her book). Or they get married and then find out it's not for them. In other words how can they be honest with the world when they aren't even sure themselves?
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post #72 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tennisvideos
Exactly Rollo. There are lots of cover ups in world sports, hollywood etc. Much of the time it is common knowledge, but not many people dare to print it due to the lawsuit issue.

Many magazines (the ones who are interested in this stuff) have an insurance for stories like this. When for different stories, but princess caroline is putting lawsuits against them about every week.
Take Steffi if there was any (or only 1%) prove that she would have a secret life outside her marriage, do you think the bild would not make headlines for about 2 weeks? They would not care if she sued them or not (there have been worse stories in these magazines. I rather read that I have sex with women then with my own dad.).

That doesn't say steffi can't have a secret life(how can I know that), but then the magazines have not found out yet

But anybody who wants to come out and live in peace, then they can always come and live here.
here when you are famous. we speculate if you are straight instead
considering 80% of the people in showbizz are gay

In the middle of the night
I go walking in my sleep
Through the desert of the truth
To the river so deep
We all end in the ocean
We all start in the streams
We're all carried along
By the river of dreams
In the middle of the night
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post #73 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 07:35 AM
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I know someone who is in the Berlin Tennis Club in which Graf was entered, too, and this club member said that it is true, that Mronz got paid by Peter Graf to be around in order to stop roumors of S.Graf being a lesbian.
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post #74 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 07:40 AM
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Andrea Jaeger had some trouble with Wendy Turnbull, I don't know the whole story, just heard that Roland Jaeger had some bad influence in that matter, too. But all that doesn't make Andrea a lesbian. Who said that?
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post #75 of 534 (permalink) Old Jan 6th, 2004, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert1
I know someone who is in the Berlin Tennis Club in which Graf was entered, too, and this club member said that it is true, that Mronz got paid by Peter Graf to be around in order to stop roumors of S.Graf being a lesbian.
And stories that daddy didn't allow Steffi a BF and did everything to keep the men away so that he could keep his influence.
Steffi didn't consider him as a bf anyway otherwise she had remembered him in 99.

In the middle of the night
I go walking in my sleep
Through the desert of the truth
To the river so deep
We all end in the ocean
We all start in the streams
We're all carried along
By the river of dreams
In the middle of the night
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