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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 12:28 AM   #1
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Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior



http://nypost.com/2014/01/04/tiger-m...r-than-others/

Amy Chua, the self-proclaimed “Tiger Mom” who, in 2011, published a book arguing that Chinese women are superior mothers — thus their offspring superior children — has even more to say.

In “The Triple Package,” Chua and her husband, co-author Jed Rubenfeld, gather some specious stats and anecdotal evidence to argue that some groups are just superior to others and everyone else is contributing to the downfall of America.

Unsurprisingly, the Chinese Chua and the Jewish Rubenfeld belong to two of the eight groups they deem exceptional. In no seeming order of importance, they are:
  • Jewish
  • Indian
  • Chinese
  • Iranian
  • Lebanese-Americans
  • Nigerians
  • Cuban exiles
  • Mormons

These groups — “cultural,” mind you, never “ethnic” or “racial” or “religious” — all possess, in the authors’ estimation, three qualities that they’ve identified as guarantors of wealth and power: superiority, insecurity and impulse control.

“That certain groups do much better in America than others — as measured by income, occupational status, test scores and so on — is difficult to talk about,” the authors write. “In large part, this is because the topic feels so racially charged.”

And so begins their cat-and-mouse polemic, in which they claim they’re courageously agitating for a greater good: the revival of America itself as a “Triple Package Culture.” It’s a series of shock-arguments wrapped in self-help tropes, and it’s meant to do what racist arguments do: scare people.

Chua, a law professor at Yale, became a media sensation in 2011, when The Wall Street Journal published an extract from her book “Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother.” She herself is an American, raised in the Midwest, but she used her heritage and all the worst stereotypes of Chinese women — cold, rigid Dragon Ladies, hostile towards their own children — to criticize the Western way of parenting, which she also said would be the downfall of America.

On to the distinguishing factors that make these eight groups the best in America:

1. A superiority complex

Any group that collectively believes they are inherently better than any other, say the authors, has an advantage. They do not note that this is perhaps humanity’s oldest and ugliest flaw, the bottom-line cause of wars and genocide. In their estimation, it’s not nearly common enough in America, where “the Superiority Complex . . . is antithetical to mainstream liberal thinking . . . the stuff of racism, colonialism, imperialism, Nazism.” This way of thinking, they write, has been a big boon to Mormons and Jews, though they also fail to note that believing in the superiority of a belief system is the driving force behind almost all organized religion. (Except the Amish. The authors freely note that the Amish are losers for this very reason.)

2. Insecurity

Here are the authors sounding most like Malcolm Gladwell: Posit something, make a solid case for it, then immediately refute it with equal fervor. The result: Readers are so confused that they can only conclude that this book is so much smarter than they are.

The authors are very impressed with their boldness in juxtaposing insecurity with superiority. “That insecurity should be a critical lever of success is another anathema, flouting the entire orthodoxy of contemporary popular and therapeutic psychology,” they write. In fact, insecurity has long been known as a prime motivator among actors, artists, CEOs, despots. “Imposter syndrome,” the term used to describe highly successful individuals who believe, deep down, they are frauds, was identified back in 1978.

“Note that there’s a deep tension between insecurity and a superiority complex,” the authors continue. “It’s odd to think of people being simultaneously insecure but also convinced of their divine election or superiority.” Really? Just ask anyone who’s ever met a narcissist, or read a profile of A-Rod.

3. Impulse Control

Yet another hallmark of self-help, impulse control is considered to be a key factor in personal success — the ability to delay instant gratification in the service of a greater goal. But this isn’t really what the authors have in mind: “As we’ll use the term,” they write, “impulse control refers to the ability to resist temptation, especially the temptation to give up in the face of hardship or quit instead of persevering at a difficult task.”

You know who’s bad at this? Americans not among their eight groups. “Because all three elements of the Triple Package run so counter to modern American culture, it makes sense that America’s successful groups are all outsiders in one way or another,” they write. “Paradoxically, in modern America, a group has an edge if it doesn’t buy into — or hasn’t yet bought into — mainstream, post-1960s, liberal American principles.”

As curious as the groups that Chua and Rubenfeld elevate are the absence of ones they denigrate. Aside from the Amish (not big book-buyers), the only other group the authors take aim at are the Appalachian poor, noting, without irony, that “it’s far more socially acceptable today to insult and look down on ‘white trash’ than the poor of any other racial group.’”

As for why African-Americans don’t make the list, the authors believe that the Civil Rights Movement took away any hope for a superiority narrative, and so the black community is screwed — even as they cite Mitt Romney’s loss to Barack Obama as evidence of Mormon ascendancy.

“In this paradoxical sense, equality isn’t fair to African-Americans,” they write. “Superiority is the one narrative that America has relentlessly denied or ground out of its black population.”

Nigerian immigrants, they argue, are bolstered by the belief that they are better than other West Africans — much as the Lebanese believe, as descendants of Phoenicians, that they are superior, or that the Chinese believe that their 5,000-year-old civilization makes them superior. But feeling superior to other nations, races or religions is nothing more than that — a feeling.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 01:53 AM   #2
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

You know, Unitarians do better on the SAT than Asian-Americans and Jews. I guess they must be the superior religion.

And Anglo-Americans actually fare better than some of the ethnic groups on that list, coming in at #6. Where are the South Africans immigrants (#2), the Filipinos, and the Maltese?


This doesn't sound like these ladies did much homework.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...usehold_income
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 01:57 AM   #3
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

She knows how to market herself, you've to give her that.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 02:03 AM   #4
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by miffedmax View Post
You know, Unitarians do better on the SAT than Asian-Americans and Jews. I guess they must be the superior religion.

And Anglo-Americans actually fare better than some of the ethnic groups on that list, coming in at #6. Where are the South Africans immigrants (#2), the Filipinos, and the Maltese?


This doesn't sound like these ladies did much homework.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...usehold_income
Are Chua and hubby talking about those groups as minority groups in the US? The fact that it is "Chinese" and "Lebanese-Americans" and not "Chinese-Americans" and "Lebanese" makes me think that this isn't meant to be US-specific.

But anyway, they are just out to sell books by causing controversy.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 02:05 AM   #5
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

She seems desperate for attention, and I bet she'd never write this if her ass were raised in China.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 02:06 AM   #6
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by moby View Post
She knows how to market herself, you've to give her that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by njnetswill View Post
Are Chua and hubby talking about those groups as minority groups in the US? The fact that it is "Chinese" and "Lebanese-Americans" and not "Chinese-Americans" and "Lebanese" makes me think that this isn't meant to be US-specific.

But anyway, they are just out to sell books by causing controversy.
Yeah, well when your first book gets called as
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/6/prweb10791222.htm

I guess you need to come up with more to make a dollar.

Actually, everyone knows it's Canadian-Americans who really pull down the big bucks. Between me and Ted Cruz, we're just slaying.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 02:23 AM   #7
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

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Originally Posted by miffedmax View Post
You know, Unitarians do better on the SAT than Asian-Americans and Jews. I guess they must be the superior religion.

And Anglo-Americans actually fare better than some of the ethnic groups on that list, coming in at #6. Where are the South Africans immigrants (#2), the Filipinos, and the Maltese?


This doesn't sound like these ladies did much homework.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...usehold_income
The household income list by ethnicity is heavily eschewed anyway... in countries like India, China and South Africa, for example, mostly the wealthier are granted American Visas to stay or study, while the majority of the poor and/or undeducted applications are denied at the source... this predisposition inflates the household income of certain countries immigrants, the basic core of their expatriates are already wealthy and well versed to begin with and have a better chance to succeed, much (if not completely) independently of the particular origin... Cuban-Americans are another group that do not behave like others either... firstly because, prior to Mariel, most of the Cuban exile consisted of the economic elite of the island, so a very wealthy group of people... Cuban immigration has become mostly economic for the past decade, as people are fleeing the island seeking better economic opportunities instead of political persecution, so the income numbers will naturally fall, as more and more regular folks come to the US.. but Cubans still enjoy a benefit that is not granted to any other nationality, that of the "dry foot" policy that makes it easier to become a resident/citizen...
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 03:09 AM   #8
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

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Originally Posted by miffedmax View Post
.....
Next thing you know, Tiger Mom will be telling blonde jokes.

Though actually....
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 03:59 AM   #9
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

I believe 100% in tiger parenting. I was raised this way and will raise my children in this manner as well. Kids these days have it easy and their parents are too easily pleased with mediocre grades.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 04:10 AM   #10
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

As a member of the richest ethnic group in America and also simultaneously a member of the poorest religion in the world (Hinduism) our success in America is due to cultural factors (intact families, value placed on education, keeping up with the Joneses syndrome; its much worse in India than in the US; everyone is judged by how good or bad they are and their families are vis a vis others) but its not something that's exclusive to Indians. Its more an immigrant mentality. Look at South Africans coming second in the list. Most South Africans of Indian origin that I know say that they have to work hard here and get green cards so that they don't go back to the violent crime ridden country that South Africa has become for Indians there. Most can't imagine raising their families there. I am guessing its the same for South Africans of white or black origin also who come here.

Any immigrant will work harder than natives because he has more to lose.
Basically if you have an option to fail you will most likely fail and the safety net in America makes it easy to fail without any consequences. That's why third generation Indian Americans are on average as useless as average Americans. They have been thoroughly Americanized.

BTW by this logic SDG must be validated.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 04:17 AM   #11
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

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I believe 100% in tiger parenting. I was raised this way and will raise my children in this manner as well. Kids these days have it easy and their parents are too easily pleased with mediocre grades.
+1.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 04:29 AM   #12
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

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Originally Posted by Williamsser View Post
  • Jewish
  • Indian
  • Chinese
  • Iranian
  • Lebanese-Americans
  • Nigerians
  • Cuban exiles
  • Mormons
she's generally accurate in singling out these groups as having a different sort of work-ethic/mentality towards financial success. but does that make them superior? no. more importantly, are they actually happier than other groups? doubt it
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 04:44 AM   #13
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

I seem to remeber some article detailing how she regretted her approach later in life because it caused a hostile and irreparable relationship with her children. Yes, they're successes, but they also bear psychological scars that ensure they'll always resent their parents. Specifically:

Quote:
She was determined to raise her daughters the way she and her three sisters had been raised — which, she said, left them adoring their parents. By her account, her elder daughter, Sophia, complied, excelled and played piano at Carnegie Hall. But the younger, Lulu, rebelled. At the turning point of the memoir, Lulu, then 13, begins smashing glasses in a Moscow restaurant and yelling at her mother, “I HATE my life, I HATE you.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/16/fa...anted=all&_r=0

I don't envy the nursing homes those tiger mothers will be put in.

Anyway, I'm sure I don't have to go into debunking this racist/ethno-superior drivel. If you believe it, please get far...and I mean FAR the fuck away from me.

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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 06:10 AM   #14
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by Expat View Post
As a member of the richest ethnic group in America and also simultaneously a member of the poorest religion in the world (Hinduism) our success in America is due to cultural factors (intact families, value placed on education, keeping up with the Joneses syndrome; its much worse in India than in the US; everyone is judged by how good or bad they are and their families are vis a vis others) but its not something that's exclusive to Indians. Its more an immigrant mentality. Look at South Africans coming second in the list. Most South Africans of Indian origin that I know say that they have to work hard here and get green cards so that they don't go back to the violent crime ridden country that South Africa has become for Indians there. Most can't imagine raising their families there. I am guessing its the same for South Africans of white or black origin also who come here.

Any immigrant will work harder than natives because he has more to lose.
Basically if you have an option to fail you will most likely fail and the safety net in America makes it easy to fail without any consequences. That's why third generation Indian Americans are on average as useless as average Americans. They have been thoroughly Americanized.

BTW by this logic SDG must be validated.

I'm chinese outside of tennis forum And I think another part of the tiger parenting and doing better than our western friends has something to do with asians being more materialistic than your typical American. I know as a child I was constantly reminded how you have to do well in school if you want to have fancy things. My parents would actually pay me for good grades like it was a job and I have to say it was highly motivating!

We're also much more into status and giving the appearance of being superior in one way or another. Everything is a competition and you always want to be compared favorably with your peers. Like my Vietnamese doctor neighbors got a new BMW... My parents went out the next month and got the comparable Mercedes model...their kids won some violin prize...we had to go take piano lessons. Bottom line is that Asian parents like to show off and brag about their children and it continues throughout their adult lives... If I have to hear about how my old neighbor Cathy is now a neurosurgeon one more time I'll explode

I don't resent my parents or their parenting methods at all. I am thankful. Because of it I live a comfortable life without having to really worry about money and I have a degree from one of the top schools I the world.

More kids in this country should be so lucky to have strict parents that don't settle for Bs.
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Old Jan 6th, 2014, 06:31 AM   #15
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Re: Tiger Mom: Some cultural groups are superior

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Originally Posted by Sally Struthers View Post
I believe 100% in tiger parenting. I was raised this way and will raise my children in this manner as well. Kids these days have it easy and their parents are too easily pleased with mediocre grades.
And as we all know it did you no harm
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