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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 09:57 PM   #31
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

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Originally Posted by Gagsquet View Post
Of course.
Gays are gays because they are a bunch of fucking hipsters wannabee.
The OP isn't suggesting "society makes people feel attracted to others of the same sex/gender" He is - I hope - suggesting that society has created rigid constructs around sexuality and that - without those constructs - sexuality is often more fluid. See my above post for more.

And BTW there are circles where getting it on with someone of the same sex is considered hip.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 11:37 PM   #32
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

I haven't read everything posted (and so any clarifications that may have been made) but I disagree. I think there is a biochemical element to sexuality, at least to natural feelings of attractions. I don't have a body of evidence to back this up but the first time I was attracted to a man, it was upon sensing his pheromones. Something was stirred within me, a feeling of intoxication - I had to be near him. What I'm saying is that I suspect there is at least a blueprint perhaps, a trigger of arousal that is innate and can generally different in heterosexual men and women. I suspect in gay men the blue print is similar to those of women, and lesbian vice versa. There is some evidence for (some) gay men have psychobiology that is similar to women. A study by someone called Levay is quoted, I read it in a Biogogical Psychology book.

But I do accept sexual behaviour is not as simple as that. So I can appreciate that precise sexual tastes may be conditioned / constructed as life goes on, perhaps at key stages. For instance how and when do we decide if we prefer certain races, hair colours, fetishes and sexual roles (Femdom, bondage and all that).

But I feel that to suggest sexual orientation is almost purely a social construct, as if everyone is bisexual at their root - certainly contradicts my personal experience and just doesn't sound accurate. If it were so, shouldn't bisexuality be the order of the day in the animal kingdom. I have heard of gay animals, but sexual orientation in animals seems pretty rigid.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 11:40 PM   #33
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

What about asexuals? and pansexuals?
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Old Apr 11th, 2013, 12:09 AM   #34
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

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Originally Posted by pov View Post
If one day he met Mary and they both felt the urge - it wouldn't be a thing.
And how exactly is it a "thing" now?

Literally everything in human experience can be reduced to a "social construction". But that wouldn't make us much smarter since it would only make us go back to square one since it's impossible to recreate some purely "natural" tabula rasa state.

Besides, I don't see why labels should necessarily be a bad thing. If anything, it's good for men who are interested in men to know that there are other people like them around instead of operating under the assumption that all other men might or might not be interested in men.
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Old Apr 11th, 2013, 12:29 AM   #35
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

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Originally Posted by Nicolás89 View Post
What about asexuals? and pansexuals?
Is this for me?

If so, I just have to say here that I don't have any hard evidence to back my beliefs which are complex and cross over into more complex subjects like spirituality and the nature of existence. I haven't given this subject too much thought so it's not easy to put anything forward with clout. But I'll give it a go.

All living things have an inherent drive to reproduce (and diversify). Plants, animals and whatnot. This drive has biological manifestations (e.g. gender specific pheromones etc), but it has a non-physical / spiritual / energetic root. This has to be the case to sustain an environment of diversity, change, expansion and creativity (even within groups) - which the earth is intended to be. [As intended by God/Source/Non-physical].

Looking specifically at humans, if you for a moment consider that we are eternal spiritual beings at our core (eternal souls), and so also entertain the idea of reincarnation - you are more open to considering the idea that between lifetimes, decisions and intentions are made at the soul level about what else or what new way of life can be experienced by a given spiritual entity in their next physical form (- ideally an intention that may benefit the expansion of humanity as a whole and allow the soul to expand in terms of knowledge about the countless ways humanhood can be experienced). Past experiences are taken into account (been there, done that). Hence, all souls have experienced being men, being women, being third/fourth gender, being every race, and every ability.

Gosh I hope you've been able to follow this mess of an explanation so far.

Pansexuality and Asexuality may fit into this system by offering new relatively unique vantage points to the human experience. Isn't it just interesting to experience life without the drive to connect sexually (asexual) or without rigid ideas about who you should be connecting with and in what way (pansexual).

I don't think I'm doing a good job explaining, but what I'm trying to say it that, there is a need to heterosexual drives to ensure the survival of the species (which may account for why heterosexuality is the dominant orientation in all living things), but alternative sexualities are not disorders. They are deliberately intended perhaps just for the experience of something other than heterosexuality, but also as a reminder to humanity to not get so bonded to ideas about beingness and the rightness of things. God/Source/Non-physical is a fluid and creative - process/thing.

Diversity is just the order of the day. There's no good reason for different races other than the diversity (as with the different colours of flowers and birds).


Fuck this. I'm sure you guys will dismiss this as baseless mumbo jumbo - but as I said, I haven't focused on this topic in this way, so it's difficult to lay down an argument with real clout. But I think my essential point is that, these topics can be almost impossible to grasp because we leave god/soure/that-which-we-don't-understand out of the equation. It's like trying to answer the question where does water come from, by saying 'the tap'. When in reality, there is a bigger picture available.
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Old Apr 11th, 2013, 12:38 AM   #36
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelle View Post
Is this for me?

If so, I just have to say here that I don't have any hard evidence to back my beliefs which are complex and cross over into more complex subjects like spirituality and the nature of existence. I haven't given this subject too much thought so it's not easy to put anything forward with clout. But I'll give it a go.

All living things have an inherent drive to reproduce (and diversify). Plants, animals and whatnot. This drive has biological manifestations (e.g. gender specific pheromones etc), but it has a non-physical / spiritual / energetic root. This has to be the case to sustain an environment of diversity, change, expansion and creativity (even within groups) - which the earth is intended to be. [As intended by God/Source/Non-physical].

Looking specifically at humans, if you for a moment consider that we are eternal spiritual beings at our core (eternal souls), and so also entertain the idea of reincarnation - you are more open to considering the idea that between lifetimes, decisions and intentions are made at the soul level about what else or what new way of life can be experienced by a given spiritual entity in their next physical form (- ideally an intention that may benefit the expansion of humanity as a whole and allow the soul to expand in terms of knowledge about the countless ways humanhood can be experienced). Past experiences are taken into account (been there, done that). Hence, all souls have experienced being men, being women, being third/fourth gender, being every race, and every ability.

Gosh I hope you've been able to follow this mess of an explanation so far.

Pansexuality and Asexuality may fit into this system by offering new relatively unique vantage points to the human experience. Isn't it just interesting to experience life without the drive to connect sexually (asexual) or without rigid ideas about who you should be connecting with and in what way (pansexual).

I don't think I'm doing a good job explaining, but what I'm trying to say it that, there is a need to heterosexual drives to ensure the survival of the species (which may account for why heterosexuality is the dominant orientation in all living things), but alternative sexualities are not disorders. They are deliberately intended perhaps just for the experience of something other than heterosexuality, but also as a reminder to humanity to not get so bonded to ideas about beingness and the rightness of things. God/Source/Non-physical is a fluid and creative - process/thing.

Diversity is just the order of the day. There's no good reason for different races other than the diversity (as with the different colours of flowers and birds).


Fuck this. I'm sure you guys will dismiss this as baseless mumbo jumbo - but as I said, I haven't focused on this topic in this way, so it's difficult to lay down an argument with real clout. But I think my essential point is that, these topics can be almost impossible to grasp because we leave god/soure/that-which-we-don't-understand out of the equation. It's like trying to answer the question where does water come from, by saying 'the tap'. When in reality, there is a bigger picture available.
Great post.

I honestly don't have much to say since I'm mostly uneducated about the subject but great posts everyone really, it has been really interesting to read your ideas.
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Old Apr 11th, 2013, 04:51 AM   #37
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Re: Is homosexuality a social construction?

All sexual orientations are. They're just the oversimplified labels we come up with to talk about sexual attraction.
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