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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 01:54 PM   #1606
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Originally Posted by overrule View Post
I think playing Charleston is a good move. It's a nice little tournament and good transition to the red clay in Europe. Caroline needs to play her way back into form. Also, I will be there, so I'm a little biased.
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 02:24 PM   #1607
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Originally Posted by Chrissie-fan View Post
I take note of burisleif's point about the racquet, but I find it hard to believe that they can't develop one according to Caroline's specific needs and wishes. If you go to the store to buy a, say, Roger Federer racquet you won't get the exact same version that Roger plays with either because if he wants, say, more weight at the top they will of course do that for him. I'm sure that this goes for every player, let alone elite players. It's just racquet science, not rocket science. How hard can it be to make a racquet that's exactly how Caroline wants it to be?
Sure they can, but we are talking marginal differences having a huge impact on results. If anything the stick being to her spec could be at the heart of the problem. She wanted more spin right? I'm not blaming the maker... However, She wouldn't be the first player to see a drop post switch... What I noticed was an increase in shanked FH just pre switch, followed by the rapid disapearance of her BHDTL post switch. Again I'm not saying it's all down to the stick, but loosing your primary instinctive match winning shot is going to hurt. What I see now is Caro spraying length errors when she tries to put the hurt on even in basic rally play, and still not getting the ball spead she used to get, thus greatly hurting her ability to control points. I'm also seeing less oponant errors on Caro's FH, which I'm guessing is due to the stroke not having the mix and surprise it used too.

Besides the stick, we have also endured a lengthy period of reduced mobility post ankle, irrespective if the ankle was the enduring reason, we are only starting to see a return of court speed now. That brings us back to fitness which I think she is 100% correct in focusing upon as the primary foundation to her game. However, on top of that we need to see a return of consistancy of accuracy in the way she handles shots on the run. She was aproaching Kim levels of angles and ability in that department at her peak, and I want to see that instictive ability return so she can focus on her tactics again rather than string tension.

The transition from fearless youth to thinking veteran was always going to be the defining moment in Caro's Career imho, and she only at the begining of that process. I'm still not worried.

I will admit to not watching Miami... It doesn't suit her game, and typicaly is far to advantageous to power hitters, so I really didn't expect anything there. I do expect to see some progress at stutgart (assuming she plays).
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 02:45 PM   #1608
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Originally Posted by goldenlox View Post
I question everything she's working on. And Caroline should also.
If she's fit, why couldnt she continue her IW success in Miami? Sharapova was able to.

Starting slow pre-AO? Caroline's January was a loss to Pervak then 2 losses to Sveta. Thats unacceptable for a former #1 who was in 3 finals in her last 5 events in 2012.

She's way below the top group now, and very inconsistent. And if she thinks she can blow off january, which has one of the 2 hardcourt majors, then she's on cruise control and finished as a slam contender

I dont know what she's thinking, but she should be very concerned, because no one considers her a slam contender or an upcoming young player
Answered above.

She always has. Matchplay is the key to her form traditionally

I disagree. She is right up there with the elite, even if she can't bring the game, she as an athlete has the quality, and has demonstrated her potential and place. Every change takes time, and every change is a huge risk. The question is, is the team aware of the cause and effect, and how long to get the balance back. There is a lot more to balance with her game than there would be if she was a BBB, and traditionally her type of game has struggled to dominate, even more so since the advent of the modern rocket stick. It makes any success all the more sweet though.

We know she thinks about her game development from a long term perspective, and so what re opinions, and why is that remotely important? It's ironic to me that the opinion givers at the forefront now are mostly players that I detested in there day.
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 02:47 PM   #1609
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

Though I'm ignorant on the nuances of racket technology,I agree that two years is an awful long time to struggle with a racket switch.Don't understand why Caroline wouldn't be pushing HARD for Yonex to tweak things until she felt comfortable.If she doesn't think that they're capable,then she should bite the bullet,buy out the contract and seek out someone whom she thinks IS capable
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 02:56 PM   #1610
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

I dont think there was anything wrong with her game. You cant make the semis of 12 out of 14 tournaments in a row when your game is a mess that has to be improved. She went from Rogers Cup 2010-Stuttgart 2011, 14 events. 7 titles, 3 finals, 2 semis

Her problem was scheduling. Maybe they knew she wouldnt do well at FO & Wimbledon, so Brussels before FO. That killed off Radwanska in 2012. She lost badly 3rd round FO also, like Caro in 2011. Copenhagen in between FO & W, then Bastad after Wimbledon.

That led to criticism that she only does well in small tournaments, and probably was too much tennis after all the wins earlier, and burned her out a little.

But thats 2 years ago. Now she's gone thru 8 events in 2013 and only got past the Round of 16 twice of 8 events, when big 3 players withdrew after the draw was done

So I think Caro has a lot to worry about. Not just because she wont make the Hall of Fame. She will be considered a weak player who never was any good, because she fell off at a time when she was underachieving at majors, which is where top players try to peak. Now she's just in draws, doing well when there's withdrawals from top players. Her last 4 slams are terrible results
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 03:05 PM   #1611
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

I'd like to see her improve, but she cant start the year like this year and be talked about as a contender at big tournaments. They arent talking about Kuznetsova as a contender, and her January was much better than Caroline's.

If she's working on something, they've done it in a way that wrecked her career. Confidence and belief and consistency and rhythm. Its all gone. And its not easy to get the first time
she was in 3 QF's in 8 events. But only 1 YEC win against a struggling Kerber
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 03:17 PM   #1612
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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I'd like to see her improve, but she cant start the year like this year and be talked about as a contender at big tournaments. They arent talking about Kuznetsova as a contender, and her January was much better than Caroline's.

If she's working on something, they've done it in a way that wrecked her career. Confidence and belief and consistency and rhythm. Its all gone. And its not easy to get the first time
she was in 3 QF's in 8 events. But only 1 YEC win against a struggling Kerber
I think they made a huge mistake... However, the movement looks to be coming back, so we can only trust they (Sven) can help sort out the balance. He was behind her best serving to date... Remember the kick serve late 2010?
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 03:23 PM   #1613
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Though I'm ignorant on the nuances of racket technology,I agree that two years is an awful long time to struggle with a racket switch.Don't understand why Caroline wouldn't be pushing HARD for Yonex to tweak things until she felt comfortable.If she doesn't think that they're capable,then she should bite the bullet,buy out the contract and seek out someone whom she thinks IS capable
Two years is a long time... How long was she using the old stick for though? Didn't she grow up using it? Some things are just really hard to get used too... Take Tom Cruise as an example
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 03:29 PM   #1614
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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But thats 2 years ago. Now she's gone thru 8 events in 2013 and only got past the Round of 16 twice of 8 events, when big 3 players withdrew after the draw was done

So I think Caro has a lot to worry about. Not just because she wont make the Hall of Fame. She will be considered a weak player who never was any good, because she fell off at a time when she was underachieving at majors, which is where top players try to peak. Now she's just in draws, doing well when there's withdrawals from top players. Her last 4 slams are terrible results
Right now getting into the Hall of Fame is about as far away from being a problem as it can be (as in I wouldn't even think about it). The problem is everything Caro does, maybe fairly, maybe wrongly is now going to be measured against being number 1 for 67 weeks. The only thing she can really do that improves her standing in the game is win grand slams, but right now her chances are diminishing. The only way to really measure Caro right now is how close is she to the very top players, and that gap right now appears as big as it has ever been. Going up a couple of ranking spots in the scheme of her career is pretty meaningless, albeit it could be the start of the process Caro needs to go on, because you won't get back to the top overnight. More importantly for me though is there needs to be some progress vs the very top players.

Also I'm not sure I agree with this idea that Miami is that advantageous to power hitters. It's slower than the majority of clay court events, which may make it hard to for defensive players to get through the court, but it's certainly not helping the power players get through the court either when you have to hit 3-4 extra shots to win a point.
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 03:34 PM   #1615
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Right now getting into the Hall of Fame is about as far away from being a problem as it can be (as in I wouldn't even think about it). The problem is everything Caro does, maybe fairly, maybe wrongly is now going to be measured against being number 1 for 67 weeks. ...
Yeah, there's no problem, because if she cant do it at that level any more, then she cant do it. Its just life, you cant do everything you would like to do.

Its just discussion of what went wrong, and to me, it could be a book written starting from 2 years ago, till now.
But its possible its just not there anymore. Same as with Jankovic & Ivanovic
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 06:21 PM   #1616
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Originally Posted by ozza View Post
Right now getting into the Hall of Fame is about as far away from being a problem as it can be (as in I wouldn't even think about it). The problem is everything Caro does, maybe fairly, maybe wrongly is now going to be measured against being number 1 for 67 weeks. The only thing she can really do that improves her standing in the game is win grand slams, but right now her chances are diminishing. The only way to really measure Caro right now is how close is she to the very top players, and that gap right now appears as big as it has ever been. Going up a couple of ranking spots in the scheme of her career is pretty meaningless, albeit it could be the start of the process Caro needs to go on, because you won't get back to the top overnight. More importantly for me though is there needs to be some progress vs the very top players.

Also I'm not sure I agree with this idea that Miami is that advantageous to power hitters. It's slower than the majority of clay court events, which may make it hard to for defensive players to get through the court, but it's certainly not helping the power players get through the court either when you have to hit 3-4 extra shots to win a point.
Miami is NOT a clay court event,but perhaps you were trying to say that it was a hard court that played more slowly than certain clay courts.It wasn't 100% clear from the sentence structure,but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt.

Wasn't trying to nitpick,though,because your post was pretty good,and I tend to agree that Caro will be viewed as a disappointment,overall,if she fails to win a Slam after having been ranked #1 for so long
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 06:49 PM   #1617
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Miami is NOT a clay court event,but perhaps you were trying to say that it was a hard court that played more slowly than certain clay courts.It wasn't 100% clear from the sentence structure,but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt.
That was my entire point. Miami isn't a clay court obviously, but surface speed wise it is slower than Stuttgart and Madrid for sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it's slower than all the main clay court events tbh.

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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 09:29 PM   #1618
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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Well, I don't doubt for a minute that Caroline IS working very hard. I mean, not perving (not this time anyway )but just look at that body! That's the body of a girl in the best physical shape she can possibly be in. So for me the question is not if she's working hard enough but rather if she is training in the right way for someone with her specific strenghts and weaknesses. It's hard to answer that for an outsider, but perhaps she should just spend an hour a day, or every two days less on her fitness and one hour more on just hitting tennis balls and technique. She's after all not a marathon runner but a tennis player. But I have of course no knowledge of her training schedule or routines, so I'm just guessing and thinking out loud without having a clue.
I'm pretty nervous about these types of suggestions although more by posts from other posters rather than this one. The ones that say she needs to spend time on tennis and not on her fitness.

Firstly whenever she has described her day - runs, gym, tennis on the practice courts - it seems a good balance to me. She's certainly not neglecting time on the practice couts for fitness if those are her typical day.

Second, these "she should spend time on her tennis" arguments at the expense of fitness reminds me oh so much how she used to have such a great backhand and she didn't make errors. All the advice was she needed to be more aggressive and work on that forehand and she doesn't need to worry about that backhand.

Well that backhand that was her strength is nothing like as consistent and the strength that it used to be and that's what can happen if you neglect your strengths when everyone with an opinion tells you that you should be doing this and that instead. Fitness is an absolutely must. It oesn't just stay there because you've always been fit. You have to work to ensure you stay fit. I know it won't win her matches on its own. But she should take care not to do anything to jeopardise that strength. If she followed advice and neglected that - I dread to think what would happen.

There's a precedent with JJ disastrously coached by Pat Etcheberry for fitness (Henin's former fitness coach) after JJ became #1 at the end of 2008. Pat (with the blessing of Sanchez) got her building up strength and bulking up. She lost all her movement and was terrible - too slow - and that always used to be her strength. She had to fire Etcheberry and then to lose weight. This also shows that a coach who had done wonders for Justine was a complete disaster for JJ and is not always the be all cure. You do have to be careful.
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 10:33 PM   #1619
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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I'm pretty nervous about these types of suggestions although more by posts from other posters rather than this one. The ones that say she needs to spend time on tennis and not on her fitness.

Firstly whenever she has described her day - runs, gym, tennis on the practice courts - it seems a good balance to me. She's certainly not neglecting time on the practice couts for fitness if those are her typical day.

Second, these "she should spend time on her tennis" arguments at the expense of fitness reminds me oh so much how she used to have such a great backhand and she didn't make errors. All the advice was she needed to be more aggressive and work on that forehand and she doesn't need to worry about that backhand.

Well that backhand that was her strength is nothing like as consistent and the strength that it used to be and that's what can happen if you neglect your strengths when everyone with an opinion tells you that you should be doing this and that instead. Fitness is an absolutely must. It oesn't just stay there because you've always been fit. You have to work to ensure you stay fit. I know it won't win her matches on its own. But she should take care not to do anything to jeopardise that strength. If she followed advice and neglected that - I dread to think what would happen.

There's a precedent with JJ disastrously coached by Pat Etcheberry for fitness (Henin's former fitness coach) after JJ became #1 at the end of 2008. Pat (with the blessing of Sanchez) got her building up strength and bulking up. She lost all her movement and was terrible - too slow - and that always used to be her strength. She had to fire Etcheberry and then to lose weight. This also shows that a coach who had done wonders for Justine was a complete disaster for JJ and is not always the be all cure. You do have to be careful.
This post would make sense if her game was in good condition. Your 4th paragraph is what I think is people's point. Caro's tennis strokes have not improved in years (they've arguably declined). The only logical reason for that being the case can be down to her training schedule/not working on the right things. Your tennis strokes are not meant to decline at 22 years old.
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Old Apr 2nd, 2013, 11:04 PM   #1620
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 6

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This post would make sense if her game was in good condition. Your 4th paragraph is what I think is people's point. Caro's tennis strokes have not improved in years (they've arguably declined). The only logical reason for that being the case can be down to her training schedule/not working on the right things. Your tennis strokes are not meant to decline at 22 years old.
I agree with this post completely. Arguably no part of her game has improved over the last two years. Worse, most of us seem to agree that parts of her game have regressed, certainly she is making more errors now than she did during her purple patch. Maybe focusing on her game more than/or in addition to her fitness would be a disaster, I can't say for sure. What we do know is that focusing on her fitness is not working. If what she is doing is not working I think it makes sense to try something else. I'm certainly not saying that she should neglect her fitness completely but what Chrissie-fan suggested sounds good to me. A little less daily focus on fitness and a little more on her game.

You just need to watch her matches to see that there are many parts of her game that could be dramatically improved. This isn't a six month slump. It has been nearly two years of very mixed results and a (near?) total lack of progress in her game. I just can't understand the argument that her game is fine and if she just got a little fitter that she would be back to being a slam contender. Her game is not fine and it needs a lot of work. If she doesn't realise that and put the work in she is not going to become a better player and contend for grand slams. That's why I believe that if she doesn't show dramatic improvement by the end of the year that Piotr needs to step down and let someone else try to rebuild her game. People can blame Sanchez and Johansson but Piotr was there too and was always the primary coach. Look at the results she had in the second half of 2011 into 2012 and now in 2013. How much longer does this need to go one before both Caroline and Piotr realise that a change should happen?
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