[Matt01]

Originally Posted by Anabelcroft

Did not say that,of course, just that Graf always had the upper hand in their matches...even when Monica was number 1!I know you like this thing fact so much

Your stats are meaningless as I've told you already 1000 times.

I could also say that Seles had the upperhand over Graf in 90s. She had the upperhand when Seles started her domination in clay court court season in 1990. I could say that Seles had the upperhand over Graf in the Slams when Seles was number one. I could say that Seles beat Graf 3 tournaments before before the stabbing.

See, my stats are almost as twisted as yours.

They are meaningless so please stop reapeating them over and over again because, no offense, that makes you look

[Matt01]

Originally Posted by cehowardrx7

Matt it is very plain to see that you are a Graf-Tard.

This is not the first someone called me a Graf-tard. Must be because of my flag

[Excelscior]

Originally Posted by Matt01

This is not the first someone called me a Graf-tard. Must be because of my flag

If he only knew.

I guess he didn't read through the thread.

[Matt01]

Originally Posted by Excelscior

If he only knew.

I guess he didn't read through the thread.

[cehowardrx7]

Originally Posted by Anabelcroft

Well,not even up to that point Seles wasn't beating Graf, just look at their meetings

At first, Serena and Venus weren't beating Hingis either, but what happened down the line?

Ya Dig?

[thrust]

Originally Posted by Excelscior

OK.

Fair enough (on the what Seles could do part).

We still have some slight disagreement on your reaction of Gunther Parche's intentions.

I could see you feeling he did his job, if he would have permanently, physically harmed Seles. He didn't.

The rest was up to Seles. Not that it makes her bad or what he did good. But when you say what you say, you don't account for the fact that not every player "would of went out like that".

I would say that Gunther's intention was to physically harm Seles so that she could no longer compete at the top level of the game. The fact is that Graf did benefit from the stabbing, while Monica's dsire, confidence and game suffered. Most of the problem may have been mental, but the the mind rules the body. The day Monica was stabbed was one of the luckiest days in Steffi Graf's tennis career, which IMO, inflated her slam total amount.

[Anabelcroft]

Originally Posted by cehowardrx7

At first, Serena and Venus weren't beating Hingis either, but what happened down the line?

Ya Dig?

True, unlike Graf and Seles case where Steffi continued beating Monica even after

[cehowardrx7]

Originally Posted by thrust

I would say that Gunther's intention was to physically harm Seles so that she could no longer compete at the top level of the game. The fact is that Graf did benefit from the stabbing, while Monica's dsire, confidence and game suffered. Most of the problem may have been mental, but the the mind rules the body. The day Monica was stabbed was one of the luckiest days in Steffi Graf's tennis career, which IMO, inflated her slam total amount.

All true, not only, it is there for all to see. The motive of the stabber and the aftermath. None of that is secret. Yet, the Graf-Tards won't to say it doesn't affect Graf's record. How can it NOT affect Graf's record. No matter what the Graf fans say, history has it recorded correctly. And please don't let the #1 Graf-Tard tell me about online polls..

[cehowardrx7]

Originally Posted by Anabelcroft

True, unlike Graf and Seles case where Steffi continued beating Monica even after

Were these slams played on the moon???As Graf the opponent!

1990 Roland Garros (Paris) Final 7-6, 6-4 Monica Seles

1992 Roland Garros (Paris) Final 6-2, 3-6, 10-8 Monica Seles

1993 Australian Open (Melbourne) Final 4-6, 6-3, 6-2 Monica Seles

[Anabelcroft]

Originally Posted by cehowardrx7

Were these slams played on the moon???As Graf the opponent!

1990 Roland Garros (Paris) Final 7-6, 6-4 Monica Seles

1992 Roland Garros (Paris) Final 6-2, 3-6, 10-8 Monica Seles

1993 Australian Open (Melbourne) Final 4-6, 6-3, 6-2 Monica Seles

And were these matches played on the moon?As I said, before and after as Seles the number 1 opponent!

1991 San Antonio (US) Final 6-4 6-3 Steffi Graf

1991 Hamburg (Ger) Final 7-5 6-7(4) 6-3 Steffi Graf

1992 Wimbledon (UK) 6:2 6:1 Steffi Graf

1995 US OPEN (US) 7-6(6) 0-6 6-3 Steffi Graf

1996 US OPEN (US) 7:5 6:4 Steffi Graf

[cehowardrx7]

Originally Posted by Anabelcroft

And were these matches played on the moon?As I said, before and after as Seles the number 1 opponent!

1991 San Antonio (US) Final 6-4 6-3 Steffi Graf

1991 Hamburg (Ger) Final 7-5 6-7(4) 6-3 Steffi Graf

1992 Wimbledon (UK) 6:2 6:1 Steffi Graf

1995 US OPEN (US) 7-6(6) 0-6 6-3 Steffi Graf

1996 US OPEN (US) 7:5 6:4 Steffi Graf

Glad you posted that, it proves I am correct. The San Antonio and Hamburg are NOT SLAMS.

The 1992 Wimbledon is Graf's. She gets CREDIT FOR THAT.

However, the 1995, 1996 US OPEN is TAINTED.

Seles was stabbed in Oct 1993..All slams of Graf after that are TAINTED, therefore making her slam and match record after Oct 1993 all TAINTED.

History has recorded that, and nothing you say or post can change that. Graf's main rival was stabbed for the sole purpose of advancing Graf!

You lose again.. Sorry...

[Anabelcroft]

Originally Posted by cehowardrx7

Glad you posted that, it proves I am correct. The San Antonio and Hamburg are NOT SLAMS.

We were talking about their meetings in general as comparation of their games,styles and how they adapted to each others game and you brought up Grand Slams yourself just to find an excuse for her other losses under the premise that it is irrelevant,but in fact you know that it isn't!

[Anabelcroft]

Originally Posted by cehowardrx7

However, the 1995 and 1996 US OPEN is TAINTED.

Until the final Monica was in better form then Graf with already 11-0 matches and just 23 games lost until the final,unlike Graf who lost one set,41 games until the final and even lost in the first round of the tournament Monica won so...

In 1996 US Open Monica lost just 18 games until the final while Graf lost 37,so again Monica was the one dominating the field,but not Graf!

[Anabelcroft]

And you still refuse to answer my question and that would be:

"If Graf's records are tainted why is she always voted as the greatest?"

[cehowardrx7]

Originally Posted by Anabelcroft

We were talking about their meetings in general as comparation of their games,styles and how they adapted to each others game and you brought up Grand Slams yourself just to find an excuse for her other losses under the premise that it is irrelevant,but in fact you know that it isn't!

If you ask any and all the pro tennis players what do they prefer to win, or what really counts, they will say SLAMS!! Not only that if you asked them, about the tier tournaments, opposed to slams, slams again wins. In other words, if most pro tennis players could get enough practice without playing the lessor tournaments, and I think they would only play slams. If they thought they could win all four of the slams by concentrating on them, they would do it..

Picture a player not winning on playing in lessor tournaments, but wins all four of the slams that year..That is what counts. Just like when we talk of past players, we talk of their slam count. So, I listed 3 slams close together that Seles won. Two FO and a AO. Then she was STABBED. Self explanatory!!