[Steffibestever]

Goolagong had a nice game but didnt have anywhere near the power, groundstrokes, serving ability (even for her own time), or overall natural instictive will to crush and win and physical imposing quality of Venus. Henin please, prime Venus is better in every department of the game- forehand, backhand, serve, return, volleys, overheads, speed, mental toughness.

[JarkaFish]

Someone's going on my ignore list.

[faboozadoo15]

Seles less talented than Venus?

Please. Seles achieved a lot more as a teenager than Venus will in a 20 year career.

[JarkaFish]

Originally Posted by faboozadoo15

Seles less talented than Venus?

Please. Seles achieved a lot more as a teenager than Venus will in a 20 year career.

And Seles did it while dealing with his proclaimed "best ever".

[Steffibestever]

Originally Posted by faboozadoo15

Seles less talented than Venus?

Please. Seles achieved a lot more as a teenager than Venus will in a 20 year career.

Simply put Venus in the summers of 2000 and 2001 played at a higher level on both grass and had courts than any women in history other than Serena has. Many experts at the time said exactly that (minus the Serena part, as that hadnt happened yet). Talent and ability isnt just a stats game. Otherwise Court would have more talent and ability than Navratilova, King would have more than Connolly, Clijsters would have more than Davenport, Sanchez would have more than Mandlikova and we all know none of that is the case.

Venus at her best serves way better, hits harder, is far more athletic, runs much faster, plays better defense, and plays more punishing offense than Seles even at her best did. Seles big edge is making alot less unforced errors. Venus very rarely loses matches in her career, 90% of more of her losses she beat herself with a huge unforced error count, and I am not even a Venus fan but that is reality if you followed tennis during her career. Mary Carillo said it best, you cant win a match from a Williams, only hope to be on court when they lose it.

[Steffibestever]

Originally Posted by JarkaFish

And Seles did it while dealing with his proclaimed "best ever".

Venus had alot more competition in her peak years of 2000-2003 than Seles from 1990-1993, another reason she won less, along with that she tended to specialize on faster courts in an era that the WTA and ATP have slowed courts , even grass, down to being piss slow and favoring the grinders. Overall careers aside Serena of 2002 and 2003 >>>>>>>> Graf of 1991 and 1992. The rest of the field is a 36 year old Navratilova, 1 slam wonder Sabatini, and 2-18 vs Hingis Sanchez up against prime Henin, prime Clijsters, prime Hingis, and prime Davenport. Take your choice, lol! Do you think for a moment Seles wins 3 slams a year facing the Serena of 2002-2003 like prime Venus had to, along with the many other multi slam champions at or near their career peaks to battleto, dont make me laugh.

[Steffibestever]

Lastly comparing Venus to Seles it isnt clear Seles has achieved more. Seles has only 2 more singles slams, and dozens less doubles slams. To those who value a combination of singles and doubles play to any even slight degree, Venus overall has achieved more. Add to that their Olympic record, 4 golds for Venus including a singles gold, and 1 bronze for Seles. Add the Worlds most prestigous and historic important tournament Venus has won FIVE times and is considered one of the best ever, while Seles has managed zero and is generally regarded as a joke at that #1 tournament of tennis. I could also throw in their head to head which is self explanatory, even a far from her prime Venus in 1998 and 1999 was winning their matches easily for the most part already.

[DeucesAreWild]

Well, Venus certainly still has the talent. With her illness it will obviously be even more difficult. However, given the right set of circumstances and a good draw it could be possible. I'll be rooting for her.

[MegaDethly]

Originally Posted by faboozadoo15

Seles less talented than Venus?

Please. Seles achieved a lot more as a teenager than Venus will in a 20 year career.

Oh wow, she played well as a teenager. Nothing out of the ordinary there; that's all thanks to her coaches who pushed her. I doubt Seles, with the pressure her style of tennis put on her body, would have kept a respectable career going for twenty years like Venus has so far. She was always going to be a short spark that would burn out quickly.

The legacy Venus has left for tennis leaves Seles a forgotten memory.

[Volcana]

Venus has had, and continues to have, a great career, but another slam singles title? No. She could make it back into the top ten, as she's defending basically nothing in the slams.

[jrollaneres25]

Originally Posted by Steffibestever

Simply put Venus in the summers of 2000 and 2001 played at a higher level on both grass and had courts than any women in history other than Serena has. Many experts at the time said exactly that (minus the Serena part, as that hadnt happened yet). Talent and ability isnt just a stats game. Otherwise Court would have more talent and ability than Navratilova, King would have more than Connolly, Clijsters would have more than Davenport, Sanchez would have more than Mandlikova and we all know none of that is the case.

Venus at her best serves way better, hits harder, is far more athletic, runs much faster, plays better defense, and plays more punishing offense than Seles even at her best did. Seles big edge is making alot less unforced errors. Venus very rarely loses matches in her career, 90% of more of her losses she beat herself with a huge unforced error count, and I am not even a Venus fan but that is reality if you followed tennis during her career. Mary Carillo said it best, you cant win a match from a Williams, only hope to be on court when they lose it.

[BodyElectric.]

I really hope so. Venus needs to get a career slam before she retires.

[Dominic]

I wish she did, but unfortunately I don't see it happening

[faboozadoo15]

Originally Posted by Steffibestever

Simply put Venus in the summers of 2000 and 2001 played at a higher level on both grass and had courts than any women in history other than Serena has. Many experts at the time said exactly that (minus the Serena part, as that hadnt happened yet). Talent and ability isnt just a stats game. Otherwise Court would have more talent and ability than Navratilova, King would have more than Connolly, Clijsters would have more than Davenport, Sanchez would have more than Mandlikova and we all know none of that is the case.

Venus at her best serves way better, hits harder, is far more athletic, runs much faster, plays better defense, and plays more punishing offense than Seles even at her best did. Seles big edge is making alot less unforced errors. Venus very rarely loses matches in her career, 90% of more of her losses she beat herself with a huge unforced error count, and I am not even a Venus fan but that is reality if you followed tennis during her career. Mary Carillo said it best, you cant win a match from a Williams, only hope to be on court when they lose it.

Seles, far removed from her peak took Venus to 3 sets twice during Venus's 35 match win streak in 2000. And Seles ended Venus's 27 match win streak in 2002.

So um, get that shit out of here.

[faboozadoo15]

Originally Posted by MegaDethly

Oh wow, she played well as a teenager. Nothing out of the ordinary there; that's all thanks to her coaches who pushed her. I doubt Seles, with the pressure her style of tennis put on her body, would have kept a respectable career going for twenty years like Venus has so far. She was always going to be a short spark that would burn out quickly.

The legacy Venus has left for tennis leaves Seles a forgotten memory.

Keep dreaming.