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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 05:51 PM   #46
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Re: WW II thread

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Juno Beach is the sector of Courseulles sur Mer, it's about 10 minutes from where my parents live (which is more Sword Beach). There is a museum (well, there are tons of WW2 museums in Normandy) and remains of German bunkers in Courseulles and Graye sur Mer (there is a good spot to fish seabass in front of the bunker, there are no more war boats, but fishing boats now), a Canadian cemetery in not far (in the village of Revier, you can also fish trouts in the river there).


is this sort of what it looks like now?

i've never visited a major battlefield, though i want to see juno beach, ypres, somme, el alamein etc. it must feel really strange walking on that ground.
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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 06:11 PM   #47
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Re: WW II thread

Yes it looks like that now. Except some remains of bunkers and museums , you can't tell there was war there, the see erased everything. There are the big concrete blocks from the Arromanche artificial harbour which are still there though.

If you go in some areas of northern/east France, there are the battlefields of the WW1, and you can still see the trenches and artillery shells holes, it's much more impressive. It looks like that near Verdun:

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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 06:36 PM   #48
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Re: WW II thread

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Yes it looks like that now. Except some remains of bunkers and museums , you can't tell there was war there, the see erased everything. There are the big concrete blocks from the Arromanche artificial harbour which are still there though.

If you go in some areas of northern/east France, there are the battlefields of the WW1, and you can still see the trenches and artillery shells holes, it's much more impressive. It looks like that near Verdun:



is that a deserted historic place now or does it get a lot of tourists?
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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 06:45 PM   #49
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Re: WW II thread

Juno was a such a tough battle, and so overlooked--I suspect because it was the Canadian beach. Going right into a built up area made it particularly tough. Despite facing the second heaviest defenses after Omaha, the Canadian 3rd Division made the furthest penetration inland of any Allied unit. Me Mum's cousins* did themselves proud.


(*well, in truth, any cousins of hers would have been distant cousins indeed, since her relatives were actually in the 1st Division which was deployed in Italy).

My dad was in the Pacific.
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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 07:11 PM   #50
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Re: WW II thread

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is that a deserted historic place now or does it get a lot of tourists?
It's not deserted and there are some tourists. As you see the grass is quite clean and the area is preserved.
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Old Jun 7th, 2012, 08:05 PM   #51
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Re: WW II thread

Russian Army Commander Makarov is pissed off!

He thinks Finland should have no co-operation with NATO whatsoever. Some might remember that USA/NATO missile shield in Poland? Today Russia proposed their version. THEIR SHIELD covers three Baltic countries (Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania) and Finland...

Here we go again Hope international media picks this. This is nothing but bullying from Russian part. Then again, for some odd reason, our current foreign minister is as red as they come
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Old Jun 20th, 2012, 09:38 PM   #52
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Re: WW II thread

from Wiki page of Arthur Harris;

"Despite protests from Germany as well as some in Britain,[32] the Bomber Harris Trust (an RAF veterans' organisation formed to defend the good name of their commander) erected a statue of him outside the RAF Church of St. Clement Danes, London in 1992. It was unveiled by Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother who looked surprised when she was jeered by protesters, one of whom shouted "Harris was a war criminal". The line on the statue reads "The Nation owes them all an immense debt." The statue had to be kept under 24-hour guard for a period of months as it was often vandalised by protesters and iconoclasts.[33][34][35][36]"

I wonder if there was any attempt of Harris' life?

I'm reading

and I recommend it wholeheartedly for the European campaign of WWII. He examines every aspect and from every point of view too, quite fair imo.

Political professor once told us that Anglo-Saxons are the most brutal, in Harris is a prime example of that I guess (And the Area Bombing wasn't event particularly successful Harris predicted numerous times that bombing would lead them to victory but the ground forces found otherwise )
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Old Jun 20th, 2012, 11:01 PM   #53
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Re: WW II thread

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Originally Posted by fantic View Post
from Wiki page of Arthur Harris;

"Despite protests from Germany as well as some in Britain,[32] the Bomber Harris Trust (an RAF veterans' organisation formed to defend the good name of their commander) erected a statue of him outside the RAF Church of St. Clement Danes, London in 1992. It was unveiled by Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother who looked surprised when she was jeered by protesters, one of whom shouted "Harris was a war criminal". The line on the statue reads "The Nation owes them all an immense debt." The statue had to be kept under 24-hour guard for a period of months as it was often vandalised by protesters and iconoclasts.[33][34][35][36]"

I wonder if there was any attempt of Harris' life?

I'm reading

and I recommend it wholeheartedly for the European campaign of WWII. He examines every aspect and from every point of view too, quite fair imo.

Political professor once told us that Anglo-Saxons are the most brutal, in Harris is a prime example of that I guess (And the Area Bombing wasn't event particularly successful Harris predicted numerous times that bombing would lead them to victory but the ground forces found otherwise )
Not convinced that the so called Anglo-Saxons were the most brutal in World War 2...

The reality was that all sides commited dreadful acts, though the weight of blame should fall on those who started the war...I live now in Japan, a country which both commited dreadful acts and ultimately suffered terribly from them. It's an amazing country, and it's surreal to think of all that happened here not so long ago.
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 02:35 AM   #54
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Re: WW II thread

oh, I wasn't talking about WWII, the professor said 'generally' Harris was also called 'butcher' by the way Germans and Russians were of course more brutal, Japanese absolutely, in WWII. By the way unlike Germany, Japan was very stingy in saying sorry to the victims nation; hence, sometimes tense relationships with China and two Koreas.
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 03:04 AM   #55
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Re: WW II thread

On the other hand, the Allied bombing campaign tied up hundreds of thousands of men and countless resources that might have otherwise been deployed against the troops on the ground, and from 1941-43 were really all the Western powers could do to take pressure off the USSR. While the bombing campaign was not a complete success, it was never the complete failure some critics paint it up to be--especially once the RAF and USAAF started to focus on Germany's fuel supplies.

Also, while much is made of the fact German production did actually increase despite the Allied air offensive, there's no doubt that it was affected, though again never as much as the British and Americans thought it would be.
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 03:07 AM   #56
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Re: WW II thread

I'm reading about Operation Totalize.

Superior Canadian technology wins the day--

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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 06:34 AM   #57
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Re: WW II thread

It looks like some kind of M7 Priest with the gun removed. Mighty Canadians don't need guns to win a battle, guns are for pussies
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 07:41 AM   #58
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Re: WW II thread

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On the other hand, the Allied bombing campaign tied up hundreds of thousands of men and countless resources that might have otherwise been deployed against the troops on the ground, and from 1941-43 were really all the Western powers could do to take pressure off the USSR. While the bombing campaign was not a complete success, it was never the complete failure some critics paint it up to be--especially once the RAF and USAAF started to focus on Germany's fuel supplies.

Also, while much is made of the fact German production did actually increase despite the Allied air offensive, there's no doubt that it was affected, though again never as much as the British and Americans thought it would be.
You're right, just that the concept of 'Area Bombing' didn't achieve much, even militarily. I heard that the Dresden railroad wasn't even that much destroyed after the bombing AND with the horrendous casualties for civilians to boot. No wonder some Germans call it Holocaust..

Well, Churchill did have to show something to assuage Stalin for not opening the 2nd Front early enough.
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 01:02 PM   #59
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Re: WW II thread

Do you find it fair that France was among the winners of WWII while we cooperated with Hitler?
I think it is, because we still had the Resistance but not sure though
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Old Jun 21st, 2012, 01:58 PM   #60
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Re: WW II thread

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Do you find it fair that France was among the winners of WWII while we cooperated with Hitler?
I think it is, because we still had the Resistance but not sure though
The Resistance had a great role of course but don't forget Free French Forces leaded by De Gaulle who fought in Africa and took part of the liberation of Europe.
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