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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 08:39 AM   #1
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Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

This should be its own thread.
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 08:41 AM   #2
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

I believe that Mrs. Court continues to shove her prejudice against the GLBT community down the throats of anyone who will listen or give her the forum to do so. And she's definitely still involved in tennis. Take a look at the interview she gave in January 2010, http://www.scotsman.com/sport/margar...ersy_1_1364266, where she said the following:

Quote:
I should have won a lot more. I beat myself at different times. This is the truth. If I'd known then what I know now I'd have won six Wimbledons instead of three. I'd have won a lot more tournaments. ... In the scriptures it does say that homosexuality is a sin of the flesh and it is something we can change. I remember a mother telling me that her son was fine until somebody told him, "I think you're gay." He took that thought and he started to think on it so much that he believed that's what he was. There will be some reason that they are the way they are. But God made Adam and Eve and male and female to multiply the Earth.
When asked in that same interview whether King and Navratilova are lesser people because they're lesbian, Mrs. Court said:

Quote:
No, no, I don't think less of them. But my view is that it's a lifestyle they've chosen which they didn't have to. And I'll say this, if I had a child playing tennis today I wouldn't let that child go on her own on the circuit because I think there is a wrong spirit on the women's tour. Young people can get snared into that world. People go into homosexuality thinking they're like that and they're actually not. I'd want to keep them on the straight and narrow.
Her official biography on the webpage of her Victory Life Centre begins with her kissing the Wimbledon singles trophy and says (http://www.victorylifecentre.com.au/blog/?page_id=2):

Quote:
Margaret Court is an Australian Champion; the world’s most successful tennis player ever. Three times Wimbledon champion and with 62 Grand Slam titles. For sheer strength, performance and accomplishment there has never been a tennis player to match Margaret Court who took the Grand Slam by winning Australian, French, Wimbledon and US singles in 1970, to be only the second woman ever to achieve this. But its her life after tennis that sees the now, Rev Dr Court taking her champion spirit into another realm, pastoring Victory Life Centre, a thriving church of 1800 members just 10 minutes north of Perth City.
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 10:03 AM   #3
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

I do not have much time at all for Margaret Court. She has proven her homophobia time and time again.

My problem with her is rather personal. When she said Martina was a bad role model due to her sexuality, it was the most infuriating thing Ive ever heard because of my own personal experience...

Ive posted this story before, but the reason I love Martina so much is about more than tennis. I came across her as a 10 year old in 87.. By 1989 I was 12 and having my first sexual experiences and realising/accepting that you're different to everyone else in a small rural town of 5 thousand people was a very terrifying thing to go through... So my teenage years were filled with sleepless nights laying in bed worrying about the day when all my friends and family would shun me for being gay... So in 1990, when I saw Martina climb the stands to hug Judy Nelson, I was old enough to know that Judy was her lover... So that scene (and the many interviews where Martina spoke up on behalf of the gay community) were the two biggest factors, that helped me through those scarey nights worrying about everyone hating me for being gay - I remember clinging to the thought 'Martina is gay and people like her and she obviously has people who love her around her so it MUST be possible to be gay and lead a decent life'..... Given the outrageous stats about how much higher gay youth suicide is than straight youths, its examples like what Martina set that actually make her THE BEST role model for gay youth.

If I was rather religious and came across comments from Court, it'd have pushed me down the darker road of being sure the life ahead of me was going to be one long awful struggle and Id end up in hell at the end of it.

Having said all that, she's just another religious wingnut imo.
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 10:52 AM   #4
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

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...If I was rather religious and came across comments from Court, it'd have pushed me down the darker road of being sure the life ahead of me was going to be one long awful struggle and Id end up in hell at the end of it.

Having said all that, she's just another religious wingnut imo.
My parents both accepted the fact, but we never really talked about it. Mom simply gave me a newspaper clipping about this new disease killing gay men called AIDS, and now and again referred to me as her little "interior decorator" when I lived at home and got ambitious. My dad was Archie Bunker to the T, and I know I sometimes embarrassed him, but I also know he loved me. His only words about the subject were just as you said, "it's a hard life". He thought it was a choice I could just turn away from, and he even fixed me up with a girl to take out on a date once. Needless to say, she didn't stick. None of my experiences with Mom and Dad was bad, and I just accepted that it was a taboo subject, and joined the Navy and ended up in San Francisco, with my mother praying for me the whole time. Not everyone grows up with that parental support (albeit something we disagreed upon). Many kids are disowned and even physically harmed. It does need the light of day. Remember Bronski Beat's "Smalltown Boy"? It rings as true today as when it was first released in the early 80s. Oh, and to the creator of this thread, it's Reverend, not Reverand.
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 11:51 AM   #5
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

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My parents both accepted the fact, but we never really talked about it. Mom simply gave me a newspaper clipping about this new disease killing gay men called AIDS, and now and again referred to me as her little "interior decorator" when I lived at home and got ambitious. My dad was Archie Bunker to the T, and I know I sometimes embarrassed him, but I also know he loved me. His only words about the subject were just as you said, "it's a hard life". He thought it was a choice I could just turn away from, and he even fixed me up with a girl to take out on a date once. Needless to say, she didn't stick. None of my experiences with Mom and Dad was bad, and I just accepted that it was a taboo subject, and joined the Navy and ended up in San Francisco, with my mother praying for me the whole time. Not everyone grows up with that parental support (albeit something we disagreed upon). Many kids are disowned and even physically harmed. It does need the light of day. Remember Bronski Beat's "Smalltown Boy"? It rings as true today as when it was first released in the early 80s. Oh, and to the creator of this thread, it's Reverend, not Reverand.
LOL @ 'my little interior decorator'.. I like that!

I was the equivalent of the high school football captain (which was great cover so noone would suspect), and I was playing rugby for my hometown by the age of 18, quite well known around town.. So I used to lay there and think of the reality vs the image people had of me... Once my parents found out, they were actually incredible supportive, but I would never have imagined they could be so supportive at age 13, 14, 15 etc
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 12:22 PM   #6
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

Should this even be in a tennis forum? Well if it remains, have fun with further propelling hatred and judging others. As far as I am concerned, slagging off others for their beliefs is just as hypocritical as anything Margaret has said. Hate is hate and just begets more hate. It's a never ending spiral. And unless you have walked in another's shoes, who are we to judge? We have no idea what path has taken someone to reach their own beliefs - and their beliefs are just that - their truth.

Oh who cares ... get on with your bashing for I shan't be back in this thread.
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 03:08 PM   #7
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

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Should this even be in a tennis forum? Well if it remains, have fun with further propelling hatred and judging others. As far as I am concerned, slagging off others for their beliefs is just as hypocritical as anything Margaret has said. Hate is hate and just begets more hate. It's a never ending spiral. And unless you have walked in another's shoes, who are we to judge? We have no idea what path has taken someone to reach their own beliefs - and their beliefs are just that - their truth.

Oh who cares ... get on with your bashing for I shan't be back in this thread.
Sorry Craig, but when she goes public with her comments and feelings about homosexuals, then it opens it up for us to say what we think of her opinion of us.. I agree with 'unless you've walked in anothers shoes, who are we to judge' - if Madge followed that exact same train of thought, we wouldnt be in here attacking her for her homophobia
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Old Oct 13th, 2011, 06:06 PM   #8
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

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LOL @ 'my little interior decorator'.. I like that!

I was the equivalent of the high school football captain (which was great cover so noone would suspect), and I was playing rugby for my hometown by the age of 18, quite well known around town.. So I used to lay there and think of the reality vs the image people had of me... Once my parents found out, they were actually incredible supportive, but I would never have imagined they could be so supportive at age 13, 14, 15 etc
Oh, my dad would've loved you. Outside of tennis, I wasn't interested in baseball, football, or going hunting with Dad and my brother. I did once, but stayed in the cabin cooking while they went out and froze their butts off waiting for a buck to pass by. When he was playing professional baseball, and in New Orleans, he and a bunch of players used to invade the drag queen section of town to get drunk and make fun. I was always thankful he showed me unconditional love, because I had an idea what he might have been capable of with someone else. He just thought I needed a girl and everything would be good.
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 07:34 AM   #9
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

In 1990, Court said that Martina Navratilova and other lesbian and bisexual players were ruining the sport of tennis and setting a bad example for younger players. (http://www.nytimes.com/1991/05/24/sp...anted=2&src=pm)

In November 1994, when delivering a speech at Parliament House in Canberra, Mrs. Court exclaimed, "Homosexuality is an abomination to the Lord! Abortion is an abomination to the Lord!"

In 2001, a gay-rights reform law was proposed (and eventually passed) in the parliament of Western Australia. The law proposed to lower the age of homosexual consent from 21 to 16, bring gay awareness into schools, and give same-sex couples the same rights as married ones. In November 2001, Mrs. Court said while stridently campaigning against the law (http://www.galewa.asn.au/component/content/article/87-other-australian-newspapers/388-courts-crusade.html):

Quote:
God's hand is on this nation [Australia]. I believe we will see revival. I believe we will see such a move of God and I think that people don't want it to go back into darkness like some other nations have. Immorality threatens to engulf the state. When we start making something that is wrong right in the eyes of people, there is a price to pay. You can't go into schools and take that [homosexuality] in and say it is right because, in the scriptures, in the word of God, God created Adam for Eve. He didn't create Adam for Steve, or Eve for Mary. And what we do is we start to open the nation to more immorality, to more darkness. I think people have had enough of what is happening in society. People are thinking about it a lot more, people are looking a lot more. They want some of the good morals to come back. They need foundation. We [her taskforce against the reform law] believe that ... if you start to come against the family and you start to tell people what is right when it is wrong, then we will become a force in this city [Perth]. This government had better watch out. I think when it comes around to next election there are people out there who may not be Christian, but morally they know that things are wrong.
In a roundtable discussion on ABC radio on 5 December 2001 about the gay-rights reform law, the following was said (http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2001/s433523.htm):

Quote:
JIM MCGINTY, WA ATTORNEY-GENERAL: I think, in Western Australia, we have lagged a long way behind the other States when it's come to a whole host of issues.

PASTOR MARGARET COURT, VICTORY LIFE CHURCH: What this Labor Government is doing right across the nation is so wrong. I just hope that those men and women can sleep of a night.

JIM MCGINTY: We're the most homophobic State. Our current laws are the most discriminatory in the nation. We're going to fix that.

PASTOR MARGARET COURT: Jesus Christ loves the homosexual but he hates the sin and we love the homosexual and we're there to help them to overcome it.

JIM MCGINTY: Gay sex between people aged 16 to 21 is punishable by five years' imprisonment. I don't think there's any parent anywhere that would want to expose their son, or their daughter for that matter, to the prospect of imprisonment for doing what comes naturally to them.

PASTOR MARGARET COURT: What they do behind the scenes is their business but to be able to do it out on the streets in front of our young is very wrong.

MICK O'DONNELL: Through IVF [in vitro fertilization], Leanne has already had Blake and twins are on the way. While Kerry [her cousin], who has a woman partner, is denied.

KERRY MCGUCKIN: It's just so discriminatory that I can't, and we both have the same problem, very similar, in fact we have the same doctor, but I can't go any further with my quest for another child.

PASTOR MARGARET COURT: Two females to have one -- a child and then they bring up that child, who most likely would come up in that circumstance as a lesbian, I don't think that that's healthy at all.

KERRY MCGUCKIN: So any child would be a lesbian. I just find that quite ludicrous. Um, there's plenty of gay children that come out of straight families and there's plenty of straight children that come out of gay families. So it does not matter what the environment is. It's what's inside one's heart.

PASTOR MARGARET COURT: I love my nation. I played for my nation and I just see families being destroyed, whether it's through homosexuality. You see a marriage breakdown, you see children being abused.
In 2002, Court said that homosexuals commit "sins of the flesh" and can be "changed." She also said that when she went overseas as a naive young person, she did not realise "that all existed," although two top players were lesbians. She said when open tennis began, "there was quite a lot of it in there." Young players would mix with "a few of the older ones that were that way" and "they were sort of snared in with it, and then we finished up having quite a lot of them on tour that were like that." (http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/...174301749.html)

In a speech at the Australian National Marriage conference in 2004, Mrs. Court called homosexuality a "sin of the flesh" and claimed that children of same-sex parents felt "shame and guilt." "I think they're thinking about a relationship for their own selfishness and not for the children." (http://www.solidarity.net.au/current...ts-under-labor and http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=11303)

In 2008, Perth Lord Mayor Lisa Scaffidi said that she wished to make Perth as gay-friendly as Sydney and San Francisco. Mrs. Court responded (http://hoydenabouttown.com/20080929.2254/perth-homophobes-hyperventilate-over-mayors-call):

Quote:
Ms Scaffidi’s comments did not represent the majority of people or families with values.
On 11 August 2011, Mrs. Court said in her blog (http://www.victorylifecentre.com.au/blog/?p=37):

Quote:
It is a time, in the history of our Nation, where we need to make a stand for righteousness for the family. God ordained family and marriage between a man and a woman. With such a decline of immorality in our nation we need to protect family like never before.

In Genesis 2:24 it says: “Therefore, a man shall leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his wife and they shall become one flesh.” It says it again in Ephesians 5:31. Marriage is ordained by God – it is all the way through the bible that a husband and wife would multiply the earth.

The bible is a living book; it is our TV guide to life and how to have a successful marriage and how to raise a family. It also says that homosexuality, adultery, fornification, is an abomination. God loves the person and we are to love the people but nowhere does it say that two people of the same sex should marry and have children.

Let us all be a Voice and stand up for marriage and family as God has ordained it.
On 5 October 2011, Mrs. Court said in response to a comment about her blog (http://www.victorylifecentre.com.au/blog/?p=37):

Quote:
Thank you for your comment. Because a person doesn’t agree that homosexuality is right doesn’t mean they are insecure or fearful or that they don’t love the people; and yes all mankind has a right to be loved. No matter what the argument, living a homosexual lifestyle is not what we were created for. God created Eve for Adam, not Steve.
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 09:02 AM   #10
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

Oh she really loved the old chestnut line of 'god made adam and eve not adam and steve' - very original Madge...
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 09:11 AM   #11
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

I can't hold back on much of that post. The "Bible" as we know it was written by a patriarchal Hebrew society, and the general design is to control women, who just happened to be prominent in peaceful societies that pre-date Hebrew and Islamic dogma by thousands of years. There are all sorts of symbols and religious icons that the Catholic church borrowed from thee early "pagan" lifestyles. An educated conversation on this usually falls on deaf, indoctrinated ears, so I choose not to go there on most occasions.
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 10:57 AM   #12
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

So - since there are so many experts on what MARGARET says about homosexuality in tennis, how many times has she actually been quoted on this subject in her 70+ year old life????

Is it three supposed quotes from interviews in the last 25 years???? (15 years after she retired from playing the game)?

And WHY do so many people want to ask her about this subject???

Should people be asking BJK about her views on bi-sexuality or abortion?

Asking Martina about her views on republican politics or what her parents think/thought about homosexualit??

Asking Olga Morozova what she thinks about communism??

Asking Monica Seles what she thinks about passport-swapping???

Asking Sue Barker about her 'relationship' with Cliff Richard????

Geez....
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 05:44 PM   #13
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

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Oh she really loved the old chestnut line of 'god made adam and eve not adam and steve' - very original Madge...
Just as an aside, God did indeed make Adam and Steve, and boy did she do a great job!
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 09:10 PM   #14
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Re: Reverend Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

I'll introduce some thoughts here. Please express your thoughts freely. "Freely" extending thoughts does not extend however to name calling or being rude to other posters.

So....


1. Remember I'm on vacation.

2. Be NICE to each other

3. Very Nice. Because should the mod have to intrude on this thread before he returns from vacation he will not be very nice. He will be very Zeus-like and hurling thunderbolts or become a sort of Blast from the Past Pope and excommunicate his flock from our community.

Have fun discussing this in a civil and polite manner all

Rollo-van Brugge

P.S. The message above is a very general one and in no way is meant to target one person or group.
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Old Oct 14th, 2011, 09:19 PM   #15
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Re: Reverand Margaret Court's beliefs and advocacy about gays and lesbians

Quote:
Originally Posted by alfajeffster View Post
When he was playing professional baseball, and in New Orleans, he and a bunch of players used to invade the drag queen section of town to get drunk and make fun.
I heard this from about football great, Billy Cannon, except his was a bit more on the violent side.
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