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Old Sep 25th, 2012, 09:53 PM   #6106
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by annetcl View Post
Ha! No wonder Sammy was struggling! You didn't do the jinx dance!

I actually don't have much problems with Domi saying what she said (I am pretty sure she meant her spin etc) but the words she used, can be taken out of context - but as long as she keeps losing to Sam, she can say it all she wants

Cibulkova, when asked later to clarify her comment, said that she did not mean to imply that Stosur had any unfair advantage, only that the heaviness of her ball and her style of play reminded her of playing a man.
"As a player, she's very fit," Cibulkova said. "I'm not saying anything bad. I'm just saying she's playing like a man."
"I mean nobody has a serve like her," Cibulkova added. "She's kicking the serve so much so she gets me out of the court, and her topspin from the forehand, nobody is playing topspin like her. It's more men's style, so it's what I meant."
I remembre that RG episode too.

Later, Sam was asked what she thinks her "playing like a man" in general. As usual, she was really nice, saying that it is a compliment but she added that sometimes it can be said quite negatively too.
I do not feel that expression is used in a positive way most of the time. If you want to say it clearly and positively, you (for example) say, "she is serving like R. nadal, has his top spin" etc. And we know all tennis men do NOT play like R. Nadal: that just makes a difference. As a generality, the "playing like a man" does not refer to a technique, but a body, and there lies the ambiguity: and why Cibulkova was asked to clarify what she meant - beside journalists love those situations and they exactly know what was meant.

The same situation happened when she was asked - by a journalist - if her first name, "Sam", is difficult to handle. In a Freudian mode, it means something negative, even if it is said in a positive mode. Someone honest just perceives it.

B.

PS: I have never heard Sam saying something negative about someone, anytime. Her sportsmanship award goes along with that spirit too. That 4th title also represent something that makes a difference for me.

Last edited by bertisonline : Sep 25th, 2012 at 10:19 PM.
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Old Sep 25th, 2012, 11:16 PM   #6107
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by Sinclair View Post
Totally agree. Watched a bit of the stream. Almost eerie quiet....I swear you could hear a pin drop. I'm optimistic about finding a stream for Sam's match...just saw that here in US, the Tennis Channel will have some live coverage tonight.

*runs off to find a world time conversion website*

Edit: Never mind - for those who can get it, the Tennis Channel won't start live coverage until the QF's. My mistake.
This really sucks....Sammy better win so we can get some live action on Thursday

I will probably sleep through this. Just rewatched her quarters against Domi at Roland Garros....oh how well and loose she played that day - don't know how many times she painted the lines that day. Makes me really sad she froze against Sara one match later

No doubt she will have to play a lot better than she did today to win against Domi. Go Sammy....Hoping to wake up to good news!
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Old Sep 25th, 2012, 11:21 PM   #6108
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by bertisonline View Post
I remembre that RG episode too.

Later, Sam was asked what she thinks her "playing like a man" in general. As usual, she was really nice, saying that it is a compliment but she added that sometimes it can be said quite negatively too.
I do not feel that expression is used in a positive way most of the time. If you want to say it clearly and positively, you (for example) say, "she is serving like R. nadal, has his top spin" etc. And we know all tennis men do NOT play like R. Nadal: that just makes a difference. As a generality, the "playing like a man" does not refer to a technique, but a body, and there lies the ambiguity: and why Cibulkova was asked to clarify what she meant - beside journalists love those situations and they exactly know what was meant.

The same situation happened when she was asked - by a journalist - if her first name, "Sam", is difficult to handle. In a Freudian mode, it means something negative, even if it is said in a positive mode. Someone honest just perceives it.

B.

PS: I have never heard Sam saying something negative about someone, anytime. Her sportsmanship award goes along with that spirit too. That 4th title also represent something that makes a difference for me.
The "Sam" question was so plan silly - if it were Vika she will probably say "what kind of stupid question was that" - I was really surprised at how cool and calm Sam was about that question. That so called journalist is such a moron

Sam deserves some luck and a title to end the year! She is too hard working and nice to finish 2012 empty handed!
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Old Sep 25th, 2012, 11:25 PM   #6109
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by Siderophyre View Post
Dudes! I kinda like Domi. I mean yes she talks a lot of shit, but I just love how focused she is - a little dynamo. And what is she, three feet tall? I usually go and watch her if I'm at a tournament - she's pretty good value.

That being said, I hope Sam crushes her.
No doubt she makes up for her lack of height with intensity and fight. Besides she is probably one of only a few players to give Vika trouble so props to her for that! But Sam - please crush her to pieces in a few hours!
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Old Sep 25th, 2012, 11:33 PM   #6110
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by bertisonline View Post
PS: I have never heard Sam saying something negative about someone, anytime. Her sportsmanship award goes along with that spirit too. That 4th title also represent something that makes a difference for me.
How true. I find it amusing to read the discussions on GM about players who take too much time between serves, shriek too much, use medical time-outs and bathroom breaks tactically etc. Fans of those players seem to believe that this behaviour is OK because it's "within the rules". Well, perhaps it is, but I think it's safe to say that those players won't be winning a sportsmanship award anytime soon.
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 01:45 AM   #6111
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Re: ...HardCourt

I guess I just take the 'plays like a man' comment too personally. Why not compare Sam's tennis to a particular player? How does a man play? Sure, she explained her comments later, but I agree with Bertrand that the journalists and media know exactly what was meant by that comment, and as much as I try to give Domi the benefit of the doubt, I think it was intentionally meant as an insult. Like the journalist who pressed her with questions about the nickname Sam....if her nickname was ReeRee or Kuzzy or Sabs (you know, something cute and feminine), she would never have gotten that question. Some players and journalists just cannot accept that she is extremely fit and isn't going to swish her hair and smile for the cameras wearing a bikini running on a beach in slow motion so the fanboys can get their dose of T&A.

I must be old-fashioned or something, because in my experience, doing something that's considered traditionally masculine (like sports) "like a girl" meant you were weak, poor, inadequate, inferior, etc. Doing something "like a man" meant strong, confident, proud.....BUT it also meant you were somehow less of a woman. As long as you were putting on lipstick or cooking or rocking some nice Jimmy Choos, everything was ok. But the idea of a woman being able to rebuild an engine on her truck or managing a large corporation or being a good athlete still irritates and intimidates people. And when people feel intimidated, they resort to cheap shots and insults, pointing out the flaws and weaknesses trying to diminish someone's worth. Being told that you are less of a woman (or less of a man, for that matter) can be devastating to some people's self-esteem, confidence, and quality of life. Not that I think Sam takes any of it personally.

Damn - I will just apologize now. I feel like I have beaten this dead horse for too long, and I didn't intend to go so far off topic and distract from the purpose of this thread. Really guys, I am truly sorry for taking crap like that simple comment so personally and ranting about it. I've said all I'm going to say about this and will stop spamming the thread with my opinion on it.

Back to tennis....I guess since Sunsets21 has given up the jinxy dance, we've got to prepare something else before the next match. Sushi and voodoo, perhaps...
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 02:59 AM   #6112
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Re: ...HardCourt

Don't apologise Sinclair - I think your post is pretty dead on. This kind of subtle homophobia/gender roles BS does still go on in the world of women's tennis. It's pretty clear from who gets the major sponsorships, who gets to play in the major stadiums and who gets put onto the banners for certain grand slam events etc.

It would be really interesting to know how Sam felt about that comment actually. I think her press conference persona is great at minimising conflict and defusing potential dramas that will take away from her ability to perform on court, but I think sometimes what she says and what she feels are two different things, at least as far as the media is concerned. I agree those kinds of comments could be quite hurtful. At the very least, given previous media storms over similar incidents, Domi could have chosen her words a lot better - as you and Bertrand said, she should have just complimented her on her topspin and kick serve rather than gendering it. She must have heard about Hingis/Amelie...

Excited for today's match I'm still holding out for a stream...
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 03:59 AM   #6113
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Re: ...HardCourt

Sam has said something about people saying she plays like a man.
Quote:
Because you hit with a lot of spin you may have heard a few people say you "hit like a man." How do you feel about that?
It's probably not great wording. You can take it as good or bad. They're talking about the spin and that's fine, but they may not always mean it in a good way.
I mean I think Sam is spot on. Its not great wording and its up to you how you take it.

I think Sinclair is right though - if people specified a male player to compare Sam to it would be alot better. Like "she plays like Rafa with her spin" or something.

Oh and dont apologise, its great to have discussions and different opinions, particularly when its pleasant. Its a change from GM

Still doesnt look like there will be a stream today unless somebody has found one ... otherwise SB it is.
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:26 AM   #6114
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Originally Posted by Siderophyre View Post
How true. I find it amusing to read the discussions on GM about players who take too much time between serves, shriek too much, use medical time-outs and bathroom breaks tactically etc. Fans of those players seem to believe that this behaviour is OK because it's "within the rules". Well, perhaps it is, but I think it's safe to say that those players won't be winning a sportsmanship award anytime soon.
Spot on! The funny thing is that people love to bitch about stuff like this as long as it doesn't involve their fave.

As for sportsnamship awards, unfortunately I don't think anybody much cares if their fave doesn't win one. The WTA treats its own award like a checkbox item (yeah, we've got one of those, what else do we need?), and never pays any real attention to the winners of the award and what they did to deserve it. Sadly, I think the reason they don't is probably because to praise the fair players is to implicitly criticize the ones who aren't so fair. And we all know who they are
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:35 AM   #6115
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Re: ...HardCourt

Errani took Bartoli out, which will mean Sam can create a little bit more breathing space between her and Marion if she wins today. It would be nice if NaNa lost now (and Errani lost her next round match).
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:38 AM   #6116
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Re: ...HardCourt

Sara has finally finished her match against Marion, so now it's Sam's turn to shine

Btw: it's probably not very good form to take pleasure from somebody's loss, but as long as Sam can get a win today she will increase the buffer she has compared to Marion. And with either Na or Caro sure to lose today as well, a deep run could really enhance Sam's YEC prospects.
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:39 AM   #6117
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Re: ...HardCourt

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Errani took Bartoli out, which will mean Sam can create a little bit more breathing space between her and Marion if she wins today. It would be nice if NaNa lost now (and Errani lost her next round match).
You beat me to it
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:44 AM   #6118
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Re: ...HardCourt

Don't want to get anybody's hopes up, but Eurosport has a spot scheduled on one of it's channels for WTA Tokyo, starting in about 5 mins. Maybe it's a false alarm, but you might want to check whether there are any streams available through HaHa, LS, etc.
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:48 AM   #6119
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Re: ...HardCourt

It's live guys, they're warming up and it's on Eurosport at least!
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Old Sep 26th, 2012, 05:49 AM   #6120
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Re: ...HardCourt

Yaaaasss :
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