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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 04:07 PM   #1606
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by TimeyWimey View Post
they have GS finalist, YEC finalist and Olympic medalist in rubber five
I'm talking about THIS YEAR. And I meant to say winning SINGLES and a GOLD medal as well.
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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 04:35 PM   #1607
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Let's not kid ourselves here;Cermosek didn't 'make' Petra any more than sleazebag Don King made Muhammad Ali a great boxer.King is a promoter,a conduit who co-ordinates fights,but he doesn't make the boxers better fighters...and aye SERIOUSLY doubt that Petra's Czech mafia stooge fixer has improved HER any more than King has done with any great fighters
Not hard to get the best Czech players, when you're basically the only game in town (Similar to the Mafia).

The question is, what do you with that talent and how do you cultivate it?

Petra got her "easy" Grand Slam and YEC. Now she's got to fight and work hard for her next ones.

And Berdych is a very talented player; knocking on the door. However, he hasn't shown that he can be counted on as well, even when he doesn't face one of the big 4.

Let's see what happens the next 1-3 yrs for Petra (and with Berdych and Safarova, it's been long counting already)?

And you're right Bruce: Cernosek is a promoter, manager--a business person, not the actual TALENT (including coaches) in tennis rich Czech Republic. He's eminently expendable. When his players win some more Grand Slams (after Petra first), then maybe I'll be a believer.

I mean look at how Safarova's, Berdych and even Petra's career has gone the past 1-5 yrs (if you wanna use Petronius and TimeyWiney's reference)?

Last edited by Excelscior : Nov 19th, 2012 at 04:45 PM.
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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 04:42 PM   #1608
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
Not hard to get the best Czech players, when you're basically the only game in town (Similar to the Mafia).

The question is, what do you with that talent and how do you cultivate it?

Petra got her "easy" Grand Slam and YEC. Now she's got to fight and work hard for her next ones.

And Berdych is a very talented player; knocking on the door. However, he hasn't shown that he can be counted on as well, even when he doesn't face one of the big 4.

Let's see what happens the next 1-3 yrs for Petra (and with Berdych and Safarova, it's been long counting already)?

And you're right Bruce: Cernosek is a promoter, manager--a business person, not part of the talent network in tennis rich Czech Republic.

He's eminently expendable. When he wins some more Grand Slams (after Petra first), then maybe I'll be a believer.

I mean look at how Safarova's, Berdych and even Petra's career has gone the past 1-5 yrs.
Well,we can't have it both ways: we can't minimize his credit for Petra's success and then blame him when Petra or some other player underachieves.....but you caught my main plank with the first sentence in your second-to-last paragraph.Yes,he's organized tennis schools in CR,yet he hasn't done anything outstanding for Petra that lots of other benefactors couldn't have easily done....NOTHING that would make her OWE him unquestioned allegiance and unquestioning acceptance of how he assigns the Pyle Brothers to run her team with Dr.Bernard Pikola,Barney Fife's Czech cousin,neding several YEARS to find the right inhaler for Petra

EDIT:And I phrased the first part poorly;obviously,I'm putting at least PART of the blame on The Fixer,but the main culpability is Petra's because she's an adult and should be held accountable for her own decisions
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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 05:00 PM   #1609
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Well,we can't have it both ways: we can't minimize his credit for Petra's success and then blame him when Petra or some other player underachieves.....but you caught my main plank with the first sentence in your second-to-last paragraph.Yes,he's organized tennis schools in CR,yet he hasn't done anything outstanding for Petra that lots of other benefactors couldn't have easily done....NOTHING that would make her OWE him unquestioned allegiance and unquestioning acceptance of how he assigns the Pyle Brothers to run her team with Dr.Bernard Pikola,Barney Fife's Czech cousin,neding several YEARS to find the right inhaler for Petra
Oh no.

I agree with your original premise. I was only using Petronius and TimeyWiney's example.

He's not a coach, talent developer; just the recipient of it. I get you. The players and the coaches are the talent, and should be responsible for their own destiny as well. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if Petra realizes or is interested in that (at the moment), and Kotyza may of been hired by Cernosek so he may not feel totally empowered. We'll see?

Nonetheless, I dearly hope that either he or Petra will go outside of his network (within or outside the Czech Republic) to get her the best people, salient advice and/or advisors. She needs them.

Last edited by Excelscior : Nov 19th, 2012 at 08:29 PM.
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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 06:37 PM   #1610
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

For Petra fans and non-Czech speakers, during the interview with Mr. Složil he said 'I am a big fan of Petra and we text each other frequently.'

This is great news, if Petra can consult with the guy who won the Golden Slam with Steffi Graf and used to coach Capriati, Kournikova and Maleeva.

I would even argue it's equal to having access to Navratilova's advice.
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Old Nov 19th, 2012, 08:02 PM   #1611
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by Petronius View Post
For Petra fans and non-Czech speakers, during the interview with Mr. Složil he said 'I am a big fan of Petra and we text each other frequently.'

This is great news, if Petra can consult with the guy who won the Golden Slam with Steffi Graf and used to coach Capriati, Kournikova and Maleeva.

I would even argue it's equal to having access to Navratilova's advice.
I wonder if it's true (or is Slozil just being gracious/exaggerating--speaking about a Czech Champion to an interviewer)?

If so, what do they talk about? And why Slozil and not Navratilova (Not cause I think she would be better; just curious why him and not her; since she complains Petra doesn't contact her enough)?

Lastly, I wonder if this is part of Petra experiencing some frustration regarding her year and showing a little independence (Remember, it appeared that Petra wasn't sure if she was going to play Extraliga and wanted to wait giving an answer on Fed Cup next year), from Cersonek and pressure at home to automatically commit to these events?

We only hope.
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 04:22 AM   #1612
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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For Petra fans and non-Czech speakers, during the interview with Mr. Složil he said 'I am a big fan of Petra and we text each other frequently.'
Have vague recollections of seeing him play during my childhood...he appeared frosty and passionless a` la the Young Lendl...this was long before he became a Petra fan
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 01:33 PM   #1613
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
I wonder if it's true (or is Slozil just being gracious/exaggerating--speaking about a Czech Champion to an interviewer)?

If so, what do they talk about? And why Slozil and not Navratilova (Not cause I think she would be better; just curious why him and not her; since she complains Petra doesn't contact her enough)?

Lastly, I wonder if this is part of Petra experiencing some frustration regarding her year and showing a little independence (Remember, it appeared that Petra wasn't sure if she was going to play Extraliga and wanted to wait giving an answer on Fed Cup next year), from Cersonek and pressure at home to automatically commit to these events?

We only hope.
that, to me, sounds a toddler, after taking some tentative steps toward the unknown world (during which she won Wimbledon and YEC) then quickly retreats back to her mother and refuses to leave again

instead of Cersonek not letting her go, i noticed some kind of complacency in Petra to play for these people

if so, the question of "why not Navratilova?" would become "why Navratilova?"

maybe the difference between them is just too big to make the collaboration work
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 01:45 PM   #1614
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by TimeyWimey View Post
that, to me, sounds a toddler, after taking some tentative steps toward the unknown world (during which she won Wimbledon and YEC) then quickly retreats back to her mother and refuses to leave again

instead of Cersonek not letting her go, i noticed some kind of complacency in Petra to play for these people

if so, the question of "why not Navratilova?" would become "why Navratilova?"

maybe the difference between them is just too big to make the collaboration work
Obviously, there's some problem with Navratilova (from her not initially being invited to the Fed Cup by the Czech Tennis big wigs; to Martina's complaints that Petra doesn't contact her).

We know Petra's too tied into the Cernosek Circle. I just hope that the little that I've heard/read after Fed Cup (being talked into Extraliga by Cernosek and not giving a commitment on playing Fed Cup next year, gives us some hope).

I know it's not much, cause Petra's still playing Extraliga final and will probably commitment to Fed Cup next year. And maybe it's been this way all along (Petra's always getting talked into what Cernosek and the Old Man Czech Mafia want)? But hopefully, she really does text Slozil, and he's not just being polite.

The irony is, Slozil recommended publically, that Petra should contact or hook up with Lendl's coach and people (regarding her nutrition, fitness and ailments).

We'll see?
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 02:02 PM   #1615
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

Guys somebody knows if Petra is under some kind of contract with Prostejov and Cernosek? She still young and I dont think she has a clue about bussines...
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 02:15 PM   #1616
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

I just read your discussion here and I'd like to share my observations.

Someone questioned whether Petra might be lazy and if she considers tennis as her hobby or profession. I'm not familiar with her history in full, but didn't she train in her hometown several times a week before getting invited to Prostejov at 16? Isn't that too late? Maybe Petra is still transitioning to accepting that tennis is her profession now and things are going to change.

As for the fitness questions - I think she's making some steps in that direction. This year she was on an intensive camp in Turkey, who knows, maybe she will go there again some time. I also think ideal fitness shape cannot happen overnight, it may take a year or two, as evidenced by Azarenka when she started working with Scott Byrnes (sp?) or even Djokovic. This year she's had plenty of niggles that to me have prevented her from training properly. I'm sure Petra and her team know that and will take care of it. No matter how skeptical you are of the members of her team, you have to be ignorant not to see the improvements that need to be made. But once again I say this might take a long period. (If there's anyone familiar with the case of Norwegian biathlete Tarjei Boe, there're similarities with Petra). Also, speaking of Djokovic, he tried to add new people to his team and change his serve and that backfired, so maybe Petra's team is taking it slowly instead of rushing things. To me, Petra had visible improvement in her movement in January at the AO and the small injuries just stalled her progress. Once Petra shakes her disappointment of the season on vacation and starts preparing for the new season, thing will get better. Side note on her "belly" - I'm not sure she'll ever lose it, irrespective of fitness coaching, that's just her body structure, similar to Safina's, who had great endurance.
I understand your concerns about training on Protejov in winter instead of outdoors in e.g. Miami, but maybe this has something to do with her asthma. She's said she feels bad in North America, so maybe a 2-week camp in Australia before the AO is the best option for her.
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 02:23 PM   #1617
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Guys somebody knows if Petra is under some kind of contract with Prostejov and Cernosek? She still young and I dont think she has a clue about bussines...
Even if she had a contract with Cernosek and Prostojev, it couldn't/wouldn't stop Petra and Kotyza from talking to and choosing her own people to work with. The WTA and ITF would never stand for that, if challenged.

Secondly, even if they had a contract, so what!? If Petra left the Czech Republic and moved to another country--like Monaco (which I know many of us feel Petra would never do), there's nothing Cernosek could do.
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 03:12 PM   #1618
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by iva_ds87 View Post
I just read your discussion here and I'd like to share my observations.

Someone questioned whether Petra might be lazy and if she considers tennis as her hobby or profession. I'm not familiar with her history in full, but didn't she train in her hometown several times a week before getting invited to Prostejov at 16? Isn't that too late? Maybe Petra is still transitioning to accepting that tennis is her profession now and things are going to change.

As for the fitness questions - I think she's making some steps in that direction. This year she was on an intensive camp in Turkey, who knows, maybe she will go there again some time. I also think ideal fitness shape cannot happen overnight, it may take a year or two, as evidenced by Azarenka when she started working with Scott Byrnes (sp?) or even Djokovic. This year she's had plenty of niggles that to me have prevented her from training properly. I'm sure Petra and her team know that and will take care of it. No matter how skeptical you are of the members of her team, you have to be ignorant not to see the improvements that need to be made. But once again I say this might take a long period. (If there's anyone familiar with the case of Norwegian biathlete Tarjei Boe, there're similarities with Petra). Also, speaking of Djokovic, he tried to add new people to his team and change his serve and that backfired, so maybe Petra's team is taking it slowly instead of rushing things. To me, Petra had visible improvement in her movement in January at the AO and the small injuries just stalled her progress. Once Petra shakes her disappointment of the season on vacation and starts preparing for the new season, thing will get better. Side note on her "belly" - I'm not sure she'll ever lose it, irrespective of fitness coaching, that's just her body structure, similar to Safina's, who had great endurance.
I understand your concerns about training on Protejov in winter instead of outdoors in e.g. Miami, but maybe this has something to do with her asthma. She's said she feels bad in North America, so maybe a 2-week camp in Australia before the AO is the best option for her.
Hey iva_ds87

Thanks for your comments and don't be a stranger.

Yes, Petra went Prostojev at 16-17 yrs old (though supposedly she was invited at a much earlier age and her father said "no"), and she didn't play much juniors either. So you are correct. Petra's is very inexperienced to the world travel, competitiveness and petty killer instinct compared to many of her contemporaries.

Petra has made great fitness strides in the past three years (though I noticed in that Safina match at the 2009 US Open 4th rd, when Petra was much bigger she played a great match for hrs in the sun), if you go by the weight she lost. Agreed. And she was actually at the height of her movement, during the 2011 season (Paris Indoor, Australian Open, YEC, Linz, Wimbledon).

And I also agree, the stomach may not go any where: Cause as Petra's lost about 25lbs the past several years, she still has one (though it's not as big as some people make it out to be). We've discussed that here many times.

Djokovic's additions to his team worked very well, except the serve experiment. He changed his diet, increased his conditioning, cured his health ailments, and got tougher, while adding more skill to his tennis arsenal. I think it worked.

The issue with Petra is, everyone seems to come from her Managers stable, as opposed to the tennis world in general (outside of his network). And they have made a series of critical mistakes through out 2012--hampering Petra, which have been discussed ad nauseum here. Sure questionable parents or management has happened to other players before. The question is, when will Petra wake up, notice, make her own decisions or care, if she's not being helped?

Petra can train outdoors in Monaco, Italy or Spain. It doesn't have to be in America (though many players live/train there, cause there's an abundance of tennis talent and facilities).

Remember, the Australian's an outdoor event. And though people couldn't really put there finger on it at the time, we knew one of the reasons why Petra didn't play as well on outdoor hard court in NA (though they were several reasons), was her affinity of practicing indoors in Europe at Prostojev. It was psychological.

Petra's team may very well prove to be excellent in 2013. So I don't doubt your speculation or advice of patience. However, they haven't given us too many reasons to feel the same in 2012. There were many self inflicted screw ups too numerous to re-hash.

Maybe it's just growing pains for her team in tandem with Petra's "transitional/adjustment" year following her 2011 success and expectations. But an argument can be made she's outgrown them, or at least Petra needs additional/new people or advisors and perspective.

And here in lies much of our concern. We don't know if Petra or any of her people, are comfortable or even allowed to seek anyone in the tennis world to advise, assist, coach or work with her in any capacity. Her manager, has already indicated publically--virtually boasting, that he chooses her coaches that she and Kotyza can choose from. He also boasted that he talked her into Extraliga 2012, and almost promised he could talk her into Fed Cup 2013 as well (both events he has a financial, status and political interest in--I may add), that Petra could benefit skipping, or delaying her commitment.

They're too many apparent conflicts of interest and pressure placed on Petra as well, under the current arrangement. That cannot help. It must get better or change.
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 03:14 PM   #1619
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Guys somebody knows if Petra is under some kind of contract with Prostejov and Cernosek? She still young and I dont think she has a clue about bussines...
Definitely. She pays a certain percentage of her on-court and off-court earnings to the club and this is surely regulated by contract.
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Old Nov 20th, 2012, 03:50 PM   #1620
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Re: Petra Kvitova News and Articles

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Originally Posted by Petronius View Post
Definitely. She pays a certain percentage of her on-court and off-court earnings to the club and this is surely regulated by contract.
But that contract (even if it was written that way--which we know it's not) has nothing to do with him picking Petra's coaches, fitness people, etc., which he appears to do. That's why he always chooses his words carefully, when he discusses it publically (although his arrogance won't allow him to have complete discretion). It's not his place to.

Secondly, it means nothing. Like I said: If Petra left the country tomorrow, and moved some where else and claimed citizenship, there's not a damn thing Cernosek could do. If anything, he may look bad complaining about Petra to the Czech media, if she claimed she was mis/micromanaged under Cernosek. His hands would be tied.

Like I say: These things happen all the time in entertainment and sports (talent leaving the people they actually pay or who get a cut of their revenue). And the contracts aren't usually long anyway (unless Petra's that stupid). This is so the player or artist can move freely if/when unhappy or seek a better opportunity.

Outside of him being Czech, I don't see any benefit Cernosek provides Petra, that any other manager couldn't? If anything, he appears to be limiting her opportunities (both promotional, self development and tennis wise).

I mean, does she even get to hit with Berdych, anytime they're in the same town or event? Who cares about taking photos or promoting Czech tourism regions with him. Do like Slozil, and have Petra actually hit with Tomas, instead of hitting with the Prostojev teen boys or Adam (and who knows, maybe he's a Cernosek plant as well). SMH Who's to say he didn't nurture that relationship?
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