International series SEC, Bali - TennisForum.com
TennisForum.com   Wagerline.com MensTennisForums.com TennisUniverse.com
TennisForum.com is the premier Women's Tennis forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.Please Register - It's Free!
Reply

Old Jul 6th, 2010, 03:32 PM   #1
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
International series SEC, Bali

Since it would be only logical that we also play this event in Tipping, we have to figure out how we'll apply the rules to our game, so I created this thread where all of us will give our opinions, suggestions and ideas to make this event a great one.

The problem is that we can't copy the exact rules for qualifying for this event from real tennis, cause there only those winners of IS events that are ranked outside of top20 are allowed to play Bali. Applying that rule in Tipping wouldn't really be possible, cause probably only about 2-3 players would fit that criteria by the end of the year, and that's not enough players to make the tournament interesting. So here are a few ideas, feel free to say if you like any of them or express your own if you think you've come up with something better

a) Only winners of IS (international series) events qualify, if someone wins two such events it doesen't matter, we'll have less players qualifying.

b) Winners of IS events qualify, but if someone wins more than one such event, we allow the best runner-up of the season (the one with the most points won in an event in which he/she was ranked 2nd) to qualify, so that there is the same number of players in Bali as there is international series events.

c) In case of someone winning his second IS event, the runner-up from that particular event gets to qualify, even if he's not the best runner-up of the season.

d) Only winners of IS events who haven't qualified for Doha and those players who have earned the most points overall on IS events get to play Bali, for a total of 11 players (same as the number of IS events) - so if 4 IS winners qualify, the other 7 places will go to players who have earned the most points playing IS events.

So give your votes for a), b) or c), or give an idea on the subject if you have one.

---

Another problem is that we never decided if players will be allowed to qualify for both, Bali and Doha (in real tennis that's not possible), so here are some options/ideas:

1) Anyone can qualify for both.

2) If you play Doha you can't play Bali.


Those are all of the ideas I came up with, so cast your votes (a simple post with something like "a and 2" or "c and 1" will do) or give some opinions if you think things should be done otherwise.



Here's how a list of qualifiers by tournament looks at the moment (I'm also listing runner-ups, just in case we decide to allow some of them to qualify as well):

Brisbane
1st *Jean*, 2nd Drake1980
Acapulco
1st Lover_of_myskina, 2nd *Jean*
Monterrey
1st Elle-marie, 2nd Tennisfan_77
Ponte Vedra Beach
1st Tennisfan_77, 2nd Tales
Birmingham
1st Tennisfan_77, 2nd Gemeos
Bastad
1st Ma re, 2nd Sasja
Prague
1st KittyTennis, 2nd Volume3d
Portoroz
1st Broseghini, 2nd Drake1980

Last edited by ma re : Aug 27th, 2010 at 03:16 PM.
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old Jul 6th, 2010, 04:14 PM   #2
country flag WhoAmI?
Senior Member
 
WhoAmI?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,392
WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

My 2 cents: only winners would qualify to Bali. The ones qualifying for Doha, can't play Bali, but if someone in the top 8 has won an International, then give it's place to the runner-up.

Quote:
2) Anyone can qualify and qualifiers for Doha are decided after Bali has been played (not before, like in option 1).
I don't understand this one. Isn't Bali played after Doha? Or what did you mean??
WhoAmI? is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 6th, 2010, 04:22 PM   #3
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

^^ I had a brain-freeze, so disregard the quoted part, I corrected my post. So your vote would be C and 2, right?
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 6th, 2010, 04:51 PM   #4
country flag WhoAmI?
Senior Member
 
WhoAmI?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,392
WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Yes it's C* 2


*runner-up qualifies if the person who won the event qualifies for Doha.
WhoAmI? is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 11th, 2010, 08:18 AM   #5
country flag Sasja
Senior Member
 
Sasja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 25,780
Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute Sasja has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

I also like C and 2 :

C: In case of someone winning his second IS event, the runner-up from that particular event gets to qualify, even if he's not the best runner-up of the season.

2: If you play Doha you can't play Bali.


Txs for the great ideas ma re. I think it's great to work towards Doha and Bali
__________________
BERTENS SHARAPOVA KVITOVA MUGURUZA GIORGI HAMPTON
SAFAROVA PAVLY KANEPI BARTHEL TOWNSEND KLEYBANOVA

DEL POTRO TSONGA MONFILS
LISICKI FLIPKENS MATTEK-SANDS ARVIDSSON KRAJICEK REZAI
Sasja is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 11th, 2010, 09:49 AM   #6
country flag Tales
Senior Member
 
Tales's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,369
Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold Tales is a splendid one to behold
Re: International series SEC, Bali

A2 + if the winner plays Doha, the runner up takes the place, but not if one player(who will play Bali) won two events.

We need to decide for bonus points distribution for both YEC and Bali and possible someway to not have everyone end up with the same points. Especially in Bali where there are only 7 matches to pick. I was thinking we guess the games for every match, YEC too, and the one who got closes recieves one additional point(only one person), doubling the amount of points you can get. That would increase the chances for not ending up with a lot of ties. I haven't thought about bonus points yet, but in the real tour, YEC and Bali are worth more than Premier 5 and International tournaments respectively.
__________________
Ivanovic - Jankovic - Bartoli - Cirstea
Tipping:
#9 Highest #1 Titles: 2009: Budapest, Los Angeles, Cincinnati, 2010: Sydney, Moscow
Suicide Tennis: #51 Highest #23 Win: Bad Gastein 09, 's-Hertogenbosch 10, RU: Osaka 09, Luxembourg 09
TT Singles: #114 Highest #106
TT Doubles: #62 Highest #62 Titles: 2009 ITF Saint-Gaudens(w Marco tennis), 2010 Barcelona (w WhoAmI)

Last edited by Tales : Jul 11th, 2010 at 10:31 AM.
Tales is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 11th, 2010, 03:07 PM   #7
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Tales, what about the case when both, winner and runner up, will play Doha (it's possible that'll happen with at least some of the events)? Get the third best to qualify?

As for bonus points, there's still plenty of time to decide on that, but I remember coming up with point distribution for these events some months ago and posting it in one of the threads, but I'll have to find it. I remember I made them in such a way that both tournaments are larger than Premier events, and that Doha gives more points than even grand slams (if I remember correctly).

And what do you mean by "only 7 matches to pick" in Bali? Last year they had 4 groups, 3 round-robin matches was played in each group and then semis and finals - that's a total of 15 matches.

About picking games for every match - what do you think about guessing the number of sets in which a player will win? For example, if you say someone will win in two and you get it right, you win 2 points, but if you say it'll be in three and she wins in two, you get only 1 point (you get nothing if you miss it entirely, of course). That should lower the chance of ties.
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 11th, 2010, 03:29 PM   #8
country flag WhoAmI?
Senior Member
 
WhoAmI?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,392
WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute WhoAmI? has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Quote:
Originally Posted by ma re View Post

And what do you mean by "only 7 matches to pick" in Bali? Last year they had 4 groups, 3 round-robin matches was played in each group and then semis and finals - that's a total of 15 matches.
Bali isn't in round-robin format this year:
Quote:
Instead of the round-robin format used during the 2009 event, players will now have just one opportunity to advance to the semi-finals in an all-or-nothing knockout. The Tournament shall consist of a singles draw of 8 players (including two (2) wild card spots) in a single elimination format to be determined by the WTA.
So it's indeed just 7 matches.
WhoAmI? is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 11th, 2010, 04:48 PM   #9
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

^^ Missed that bit of info. Thnx!

I guess we'll have to figure something out to make this tourney as interesting as possible, but I think guessing sets could still be implemented to reduce the chance of ties.

Anyway, two votes for C and 2 and one for A and 2. I guess we'll see what majority thinks in the weeks to come before we decide on anything.
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 12th, 2010, 05:00 PM   #10
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Here's an idea for point distribution in Bali. It's something similar to what Tales suggested. Players try to guess the number of games in ever of the seven matches played, and those who guess the winner get the points.

But how much...my suggestion is that if we, for example have 12 players in Tipping Bali, the one who got closest with the number of games (but also gets the winner right) gets 12 points. The one who was second best gets 11 and so on. We do that for every match and there's a very small chance of ties.

In the end, we add bonus points to those already won during the tournament, and my suggestion is that the winner gets 300, the runner up 225, those placed 3rd and 4th 175 each, those ranked between #5 and #8 125 each and all the rest 100 each. That way players could earn more points in Bali than on premier tournaments, but less than on grand slams.
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 18th, 2010, 11:03 AM   #11
country flag Håkon
Senior Member
 
Håkon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Bonn, NRW
Posts: 18,388
Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Quote:
Originally Posted by ma re View Post
Here's an idea for point distribution in Bali. It's something similar to what Tales suggested. Players try to guess the number of games in ever of the seven matches played, and those who guess the winner get the points.

But how much...my suggestion is that if we, for example have 12 players in Tipping Bali, the one who got closest with the number of games (but also gets the winner right) gets 12 points. The one who was second best gets 11 and so on. We do that for every match and there's a very small chance of ties.
n00b thoughts

I think you'd get more than 75 % who gets the winner right in most matches, so if someone has say 4 & 6 points they're beaten by someone who only tips one match and gets 12. It may even out, but I think you're likely to get a winner with fewer tips correct...

May I suggest we tip sets instead? But as 2-0 is more common than 2-1, you get more points for tipping 2-1 right? Something like

3pts if 2-1 win correct
2pts if 2-0 win

(and then 4/3 for SF and 6/4 for the final?)

Personally I'd slightly prefer A2 as qualifying rule, but I don't mind C2 either
__________________
My twitter | FWTT: Cornelia du Preez
game wins: FITD US Open '12, Guangzhou '10 (#1 since 8 July 2013), TT Indian Wells '11, TT doubles Moskva '11, Brussel '12, Pattaya '13, Stuttgart '13 (w/Andreas), PAW 4 titles, Suicide Olympic gold + 2 titles, Tipping 3 titles (#1 for 25 weeks, USO Series '12), Q-Ball 7 titles, Blackjack #1 2012, Pentathlon #1 2012 (5 titles)
Азарэнка | Павлюченкова | Arvidsson | Halep | Eikeri | Clijsters | Rus | Van Uytvanck | Watson | Bertens | Superboerin Hogenkamp | Weijers
Håkon is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 18th, 2010, 01:03 PM   #12
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Sam, I see your concers about my idea of point distribution and you may be right to some degree.

However, what you suggest at the end of your post is very similar to the idea I proposed in post #7, last paragraph. What do you think about that?
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 18th, 2010, 01:35 PM   #13
country flag Håkon
Senior Member
 
Håkon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Bonn, NRW
Posts: 18,388
Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute Håkon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

Quote:
Originally Posted by ma re View Post
However, what you suggest at the end of your post is very similar to the idea I proposed in post #7, last paragraph. What do you think about that?
Must not have read that post properly I like that system too, it depends how complicated you want it And then the final can have the normal 'games' tiebreaker that we use in all other tournaments.
__________________
My twitter | FWTT: Cornelia du Preez
game wins: FITD US Open '12, Guangzhou '10 (#1 since 8 July 2013), TT Indian Wells '11, TT doubles Moskva '11, Brussel '12, Pattaya '13, Stuttgart '13 (w/Andreas), PAW 4 titles, Suicide Olympic gold + 2 titles, Tipping 3 titles (#1 for 25 weeks, USO Series '12), Q-Ball 7 titles, Blackjack #1 2012, Pentathlon #1 2012 (5 titles)
Азарэнка | Павлюченкова | Arvidsson | Halep | Eikeri | Clijsters | Rus | Van Uytvanck | Watson | Bertens | Superboerin Hogenkamp | Weijers
Håkon is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Aug 27th, 2010, 03:19 PM   #14
country flag ma re
Senior Member
 
ma re's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,263
ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute ma re has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

I got another idea and edited the initial post with an "option d)", so feel free to say what do you think about it. I think that this would probably be the best solution as to whom to let play Bali. So that one would suggest any winner of IS event that doesen't end the season inside top8, and that other places are filled with the most successful players of IS events for a total of 11.
ma re is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old Aug 27th, 2010, 04:44 PM   #15
country flag Hele.
Senior Member
 
Hele.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 16,464
Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute Hele. has a reputation beyond repute
Re: International series SEC, Bali

I think the best option is that best 8 ranked players who not play YEC play here. If there will not be enough players then there should play the best ranked players without an international title who not play YEC.
Hele. is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios