[DennisFitz]

Originally Posted by iainmac

I think though that it would be safe to say for such a great all court player with a really natural grass court game, that she did underachieve at Wimbledon save for the years 75 and 77. Then again she was a late developer and the fact that she also reached the semis of the US on clay in 77 indicates that she did settle into her self much later in her career. Mind you she was very close to defeating Evert in the quarters of 75, that would have been her greatest ever singles victory.

Don't know if I would say Betty underachieved at Wimbledon, save 1975 and 1977. Always a talented player, but never a consistent one until late in her career, I would say she excelled at Wimbledon. She reached QF in 1975, R16 in 1976, Finals in 1977, R16 in 1978-1979. I believe those are her best results in a major. And losses to Evert (2x), Wade, and Fromholtz aren't bad losses.

[iainmac]

Originally Posted by DennisFitz

Don't know if I would say Betty underachieved at Wimbledon, save 1975 and 1977. Always a talented player, but never a consistent one until late in her career, I would say she excelled at Wimbledon. She reached QF in 1975, R16 in 1976, Finals in 1977, R16 in 1978-1979. I believe those are her best results in a major. And losses to Evert (2x), Wade, and Fromholtz aren't bad losses.

Although I would say that losing to Ruzici in the last 16 of 78 wasnt a great result when Stove went into Wimbledon in the best form of her career probably. I know Ruzici had won the French a few weeks before but she was never comfortable on grass. My point was that she did not achieve quite what she could have at Wimbledon. Comparing the results there with other GS for Stove is pointless. She never played the Australian Open apart maybe twice, the French not often and it was on clay, and the US was on clay courts during her peak years.

[DennisFitz]

Originally Posted by iainmac

Although I would say that losing to Ruzici in the last 16 of 78 wasnt a great result when Stove went into Wimbledon in the best form of her career probably. I know Ruzici had won the French a few weeks before but she was never comfortable on grass. My point was that she did not achieve quite what she could have at Wimbledon. Comparing the results there with other GS for Stove is pointless. She never played the Australian Open apart maybe twice, the French not often and it was on clay, and the US was on clay courts during her peak years.

OK, I am gonna defend Big Bad Betty, and still say her Wimbledon singles results were very good. She did not underachieve at all. And if you want to say her 1978 R16 loss to newly crowned French champ Virginia Ruzici was a bad loss, OK. (Betty had more than her share of bad losses.) But in the 6 years from 1975-1980, she either lost to the eventual champs (Wade and Goolagong), or #1 seed (Evert, 2x), or #6 Fromholtz. She won 18 of 24 matches in those years. Prior to 1975 Betty wasn't really a force in singles. She scored the occasional good win (she also reached R16 at Wimbledon in 1972). But without a doubt her results at Wimbledon were the best singles results of any major. Could/should she have achieved more in singles there? I am not so sure. Doubles yes. But in singles at Wimbledon, I think she fared quite well. And, if you compared Stove's results 1975-1980 with other comparable player's efforts in similar 6 year periods, like Barker, Durr, Turnbull, or Melville Reid, Big Bad Betty's results are better.

[iainmac]

Originally Posted by DennisFitz

OK, I am gonna defend Big Bad Betty, and still say her Wimbledon singles results were very good. She did not underachieve at all. And if you want to say her 1978 R16 loss to newly crowned French champ Virginia Ruzici was a bad loss, OK. (Betty had more than her share of bad losses.) But in the 6 years from 1975-1980, she either lost to the eventual champs (Wade and Goolagong), or #1 seed (Evert, 2x), or #6 Fromholtz. She won 18 of 24 matches in those years. Prior to 1975 Betty wasn't really a force in singles. She scored the occasional good win (she also reached R16 at Wimbledon in 1972). But without a doubt her results at Wimbledon were the best singles results of any major. Could/should she have achieved more in singles there? I am not so sure. Doubles yes. But in singles at Wimbledon, I think she fared quite well. And, if you compared Stove's results 1975-1980 with other comparable player's efforts in similar 6 year periods, like Barker, Durr, Turnbull, or Melville Reid, Big Bad Betty's results are better.

DennisLove ya fella. And as always when you put your arguments over like that I have to agree. But still that loss to Ruzici in 78...............

[Rollo]

Here is a picture of Lidy Jansen-Venneboer and Betty Stove getting off the plane in Sydney late in 1966. They had flown from Amsterdam. I shudder to think of how long the flight was then!