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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 06:27 PM   #2521
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

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Originally Posted by HowardH View Post
She looks so cute in her outfit.






Where did you guys hear she doesn't strength train? I'm finding that quite hard to believe, but it would explain a few things. I heard she used to use weights- did she stop at some point?

In her most recent presser she mentions she's been spending time in the gym. Now that doesn't necessarily mean she was using weights, since there are other things you can do there, cardio and stuff, but... surely she does strength train? Although if she does, her program seems to need a little tweaking, unless she is actually much stronger than she looks (which I doubt).
Q. So what are you bench pressing?
ANA IVANOVIC: I haven't gone that far yet. I'm still with rubber bands (laughter).
Ridiculous. She doesn't have to look like Stosur, but come on...
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 06:37 PM   #2522
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Just because someone doesn't use free weights or do bench presses, doesn't mean they're not doing strength training

Those bands sure kick my ass when I go to the gym
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 06:59 PM   #2523
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

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Originally Posted by Tennislover23 View Post
Just because someone doesn't use free weights or do bench presses, doesn't mean they're not doing strength training

Those bands sure kick my ass when I go to the gym
Why stretching some bands? A couple of push-ups and pull-ups and she'll be like terminator. Anchinator.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 07:08 PM   #2524
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

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Originally Posted by fANAtic View Post
Why stretching some bands? A couple of push-ups and pull-ups and she'll be like terminator. Anchinator.
It's not about being a terminator, it's about being strong. I used to work with weights and I had some muscles and I thought I was strong, but when I started stretching those bands I realized how weak I was.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 08:20 PM   #2525
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

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Originally Posted by fANAtic View Post
Why stretching some bands? A couple of push-ups and pull-ups and she'll be like terminator. Anchinator.
Because the bands provide WAY more resistance than the weights do

If I tried to do a pull up, I'd die. I think I actually passed out a little when I attempted one
It's not as simple as it sounds...

When lifting weights you have to remind yourself to tense and work against gravity; the bands do that for you
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 09:14 PM   #2526
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardH View Post
She looks so cute in her outfit.

Where did you guys hear she doesn't strength train? I'm finding that quite hard to believe, but it would explain a few things. I heard she used to use weights- did she stop at some point?

In her most recent presser she mentions she's been spending time in the gym. Now that doesn't necessarily mean she was using weights, since there are other things you can do there, cardio and stuff, but... surely she does strength train? Although if she does, her program seems to need a little tweaking, unless she is actually much stronger than she looks (which I doubt).
As fANAtic posted, Ana said she is not doing bench pressing yet, she has been at max using the rubber bands.

I know rubber bands are good and all.. but they are not meant for you to create muscles. They are meant for enhancing existing muscles and muscle resistance. Ana needs to add muscles, so rubber band exercises are never going to be enough. And she said this while saying she had spent more time in the gym after RG, so imagine what she was doing before!

I remember Ana used to do bench pressing before, so she stoped at some point. It does explain the fact that her shots are clearly softer than they used to be. She has a LOT less power now than she used to have. Also explains injuries. It's just another dumb decision she/people around her made at some point.. another one for the long long list of mistakes.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 09:18 PM   #2527
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajka View Post
It's not about being a terminator, it's about being strong. I used to work with weights and I had some muscles and I thought I was strong, but when I started stretching those bands I realized how weak I was.
Weights and rubber bands are different exercises with different purposes. As a pro athlete, she should do both. Especially someone who relies on a power game. She was probably not doing anything like that, which is why she has started with rubber bands, especially during competition. She needs to add some muscles if she wants some power back into her shots though, so she will have to do bench pressing at some point.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 09:31 PM   #2528
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaviotabr View Post
Weights and rubber bands are different exercises with different purposes. As a pro athlete, she should do both. Especially someone who relies on a power game. She was probably not doing anything like that, which is why she has started with rubber bands, especially during competition. She needs to add some muscles if she wants some power back into her shots though, so she will have to do bench pressing at some point.
Of course she must use both, but if she had an injury recently it's safer to use bands. And she was laughing when she said that so...
She will probably add some muscles, she's really thin atm. But even when she was chubby she didn't have strong arms with huge muscles, now you can see a muscle definition on her body (since there's no fat anymore ) but her shots are less powerful somehow. Maybe it's that losing weight affected her health somehow, maybe she had a very healthy diet and good training sessions during the off season, but it still affects the body. At least it was how I reacted when I was losing weight, my blood test results were fine, but I didn't feel good.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 10:29 PM   #2529
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaviotabr View Post
Weights and rubber bands are different exercises with different purposes. As a pro athlete, she should do both. Especially someone who relies on a power game. She was probably not doing anything like that, which is why she has started with rubber bands, especially during competition. She needs to add some muscles if she wants some power back into her shots though, so she will have to do bench pressing at some point.
An interesting discussion. There are many ways of becoming stronger, including resistance bands. However, for pro athletes, as Bel points out, rubber bands are usually used as an assistance exercise, rather than as a base for building real strength.

The main reason is measurability. Weights give you the ability to measure your improvement and make sure you are actually progressing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fANAtic View Post
Why stretching some bands? A couple of push-ups and pull-ups and she'll be like terminator. Anchinator.
I actually agree that, especially as a woman, Ana can become quite strong through bodyweight exercises. Let's say she was able to train herself to do, say, 10 dips, 5 pull ups, 25 push ups. She would be decently strong for a woman, not amazing, but decent.

For the lower body it gets more difficult without weight, but she could learn to do single leg pistol squats (or work up to it). It's easier to train legs if you have weights though, then her target could be to squat between 1 to 1.5 times her bodyweight within a year. Deadlift over 1.5 times bodyweight. I wonder if asking her to try a glute-ham raise is unrealistic?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajka View Post
It's not about being a terminator, it's about being strong. I used to work with weights and I had some muscles and I thought I was strong, but when I started stretching those bands I realized how weak I was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennislover23 View Post
Because the bands provide WAY more resistance than the weights do

If I tried to do a pull up, I'd die. I think I actually passed out a little when I attempted one
It's not as simple as it sounds...

When lifting weights you have to remind yourself to tense and work against gravity; the bands do that for you
It's nice to know so many users on this forum work out. I would say that if you found the weights easier than the bands then you were probably using weights that were too light for you and not challenging yourself enough. This was probably because weights are more scary, so you didn't push your limit, while bands are user friendly, so you were able to push yourself harder. Either that or your form might not have been good (people often don't use very strict form and end up not working the muscles effectively.) Also, as Tennislover points out, there is definitely more technique required when using free weights. You have to understand the technique of squatting, deadlifting etc. But there are benefits if you master the exercises. A pro tennis player should master them.

So, for people who aren't super strong yet and used to heavy weights, bands are indeed very useful. Good for rehab, I agree. By the way, you can use the bands to assist you when you try pull ups if you can't do them yet. Wrap the band around the pull up bar and around your shoulders (you may have to double up the band). It will lighten your bodyweight and make the exercise easier. Or, you can try flexed hangs for time (hold yourself at the top of a pull up position for 30 sec- you can use a chair to get up to the top) or partial range chin ups. There are ways to build up to a pull up.

Overall, I would give Ana a little leeway if she feels she is coming back from an injury, but sooner or later she will need to strength train seriously if she wants to reach her potential. She doesn't necessarily have to bench press, but I would like her to be able to do 10-15 full range dips. Even better if she can do the dips with weight attached to her. (Weighted dips work a very similar set of muscles to bench press, and someone like Ana might find bench press scary, with the weight up above her- although this shouldn't be a problem if she has a spotter or a power cage with safety bars.) I wonder how many dips/pull ups the current Ana can actually do?

It's a long term process too. Losing weight and getting to a low bodyfat level actually puts Ana in a good position to gain some muscle and get stronger. She should set herself some strength targets to reach by the end of the year. Not really sure she will though...

Last edited by HowardH : Jun 24th, 2011 at 10:39 PM.
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 11:17 PM   #2530
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardH View Post
I actually agree that, especially as a woman, Ana can become quite strong through bodyweight exercises. Let's say she was able to train herself to do, say, 10 dips, 5 pull ups, 25 push ups. She would be decently strong for a woman, not amazing, but decent.

For the lower body it gets more difficult without weight, but she could learn to do single leg pistol squats (or work up to it). It's easier to train legs if you have weights though, then her target could be to squat between 1 to 1.5 times her bodyweight within a year. Deadlift over 1.5 times bodyweight. I wonder if asking her to try a glute-ham raise is unrealistic?
Ana squating and deadlifting? Extremely hard to even imagine and she probably doesn't want bigger quads. They're big as it is. Maybe some sprinting would be beneficial for her legs?
It seems you know a lot about these things. Could you give me some exercise tips?
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Old Jun 24th, 2011, 11:46 PM   #2531
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardH View Post
An interesting discussion. There are many ways of becoming stronger, including resistance bands. However, for pro athletes, as Bel points out, rubber bands are usually used as an assistance exercise, rather than as a base for building real strength.

The main reason is measurability. Weights give you the ability to measure your improvement and make sure you are actually progressing.



I actually agree that, especially as a woman, Ana can become quite strong through bodyweight exercises. Let's say she was able to train herself to do, say, 10 dips, 5 pull ups, 25 push ups. She would be decently strong for a woman, not amazing, but decent.

For the lower body it gets more difficult without weight, but she could learn to do single leg pistol squats (or work up to it). It's easier to train legs if you have weights though, then her target could be to squat between 1 to 1.5 times her bodyweight within a year. Deadlift over 1.5 times bodyweight. I wonder if asking her to try a glute-ham raise is unrealistic?





It's nice to know so many users on this forum work out. I would say that if you found the weights easier than the bands then you were probably using weights that were too light for you and not challenging yourself enough. This was probably because weights are more scary, so you didn't push your limit, while bands are user friendly, so you were able to push yourself harder. Either that or your form might not have been good (people often don't use very strict form and end up not working the muscles effectively.) Also, as Tennislover points out, there is definitely more technique required when using free weights. You have to understand the technique of squatting, deadlifting etc. But there are benefits if you master the exercises. A pro tennis player should master them.

So, for people who aren't super strong yet and used to heavy weights, bands are indeed very useful. Good for rehab, I agree. By the way, you can use the bands to assist you when you try pull ups if you can't do them yet. Wrap the band around the pull up bar and around your shoulders (you may have to double up the band). It will lighten your bodyweight and make the exercise easier. Or, you can try flexed hangs for time (hold yourself at the top of a pull up position for 30 sec- you can use a chair to get up to the top) or partial range chin ups. There are ways to build up to a pull up.

Overall, I would give Ana a little leeway if she feels she is coming back from an injury, but sooner or later she will need to strength train seriously if she wants to reach her potential. She doesn't necessarily have to bench press, but I would like her to be able to do 10-15 full range dips. Even better if she can do the dips with weight attached to her. (Weighted dips work a very similar set of muscles to bench press, and someone like Ana might find bench press scary, with the weight up above her- although this shouldn't be a problem if she has a spotter or a power cage with safety bars.) I wonder how many dips/pull ups the current Ana can actually do?

It's a long term process too. Losing weight and getting to a low bodyfat level actually puts Ana in a good position to gain some muscle and get stronger. She should set herself some strength targets to reach by the end of the year. Not really sure she will though...
Great post Howard.

It's just amazing to think Ana, being a pro athlete and all, hasn't been doing much strength training. It's no wonder she has had all these freak injuries and has complained about feeling weak. I can't understand her having such training plan.
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Old Jun 25th, 2011, 12:04 AM   #2532
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

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Originally Posted by gaviotabr View Post
Great post Howard.

It's just amazing to think Ana, being a pro athlete and all, hasn't been doing much strength training. It's no wonder she has had all these freak injuries and has complained about feeling weak. I can't understand her having such training plan.
Again, just because she's not using weights and benching, doesn't mean she's not working on her strenghth.

She can't just run into the gym and start benching 70lbs because we think she should. Any work out regimen, whether it's to build mucle or lose weight, needs to be eased into. She never said she wouldn't bench, she simply said she's not not there YET. She's doing absolutely the right thing by starting off slow

Yes, she is an athlete; one that's coming off a wrist injury. At my gym, the minimum you can bench is 40lbs. It hurt my chest and my wrist, and I wasn't hurting beforehand. Can you imagine what it would feel like to bench 40lbs with an injured wrist
She also had that abdominal strain. When you're working with weights, you work your core. Perhaps that's why she stopped Maybe the regmen she had was making life difficult. It did flare up a second time

I understand your frustrations, Izzy, but sometimes, you're really hard on Ana. You pick apart every little thing that she says and declare it a horrible decision, either by her or the adidas team. I understand, really, I do, and I'm not trying to start trouble, but it seems you always post what Ana should or shouldn't be doing. I don't know if you know this, but when reading your posts, it comes across as 'what I say is right, she should totally be listening to me, if she listned to my posts everything would be better'. I'm pretty sure that's not your intention, but that's how it's coming across.

The change can't all happen at once. She's going to say generic things. I, for one, don't believe anything that is said by pro's in the press. It's all coached, I think, but with Ana, you never know.
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Old Jun 25th, 2011, 12:10 AM   #2533
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardH View Post
It's nice to know so many users on this forum work out. I would say that if you found the weights easier than the bands then you were probably using weights that were too light for you and not challenging yourself enough. This was probably because weights are more scary, so you didn't push your limit, while bands are user friendly, so you were able to push yourself harder. Either that or your form might not have been good (people often don't use very strict form and end up not working the muscles effectively.) Also, as Tennislover points out, there is definitely more technique required when using free weights. You have to understand the technique of squatting, deadlifting etc. But there are benefits if you master the exercises. A pro tennis player should master them.

So, for people who aren't super strong yet and used to heavy weights, bands are indeed very useful. Good for rehab, I agree. By the way, you can use the bands to assist you when you try pull ups if you can't do them yet. Wrap the band around the pull up bar and around your shoulders (you may have to double up the band). It will lighten your bodyweight and make the exercise easier. Or, you can try flexed hangs for time (hold yourself at the top of a pull up position for 30 sec- you can use a chair to get up to the top) or partial range chin ups. There are ways to build up to a pull up.

Overall, I would give Ana a little leeway if she feels she is coming back from an injury, but sooner or later she will need to strength train seriously if she wants to reach her potential. She doesn't necessarily have to bench press, but I would like her to be able to do 10-15 full range dips. Even better if she can do the dips with weight attached to her. (Weighted dips work a very similar set of muscles to bench press, and someone like Ana might find bench press scary, with the weight up above her- although this shouldn't be a problem if she has a spotter or a power cage with safety bars.) I wonder how many dips/pull ups the current Ana can actually do?

It's a long term process too. Losing weight and getting to a low bodyfat level actually puts Ana in a good position to gain some muscle and get stronger. She should set herself some strength targets to reach by the end of the year. Not really sure she will though...
Thanks for the advice Howard! I also have a pull up bar at home, and I'm terrified of taking down the house

I have no idea if I've installed correctly

I'll deffo try the band method for the pull ups. I go to the gym when there's no one there, so it's okay if I make a fool of myself
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Old Jun 25th, 2011, 12:16 AM   #2534
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennislover23 View Post
Again, just because she's not using weights and benching, doesn't mean she's not working on her strenghth.

She can't just run into the gym and start benching 70lbs because we think she should. Any work out regimen, whether it's to build mucle or lose weight, needs to be eased into. She never said she wouldn't bench, she simply said she's not not there YET. She's doing absolutely the right thing by starting off slow

Yes, she is an athlete; one that's coming off a wrist injury. At my gym, the minimum you can bench is 40lbs. It hurt my chest and my wrist, and I wasn't hurting beforehand. Can you imagine what it would feel like to bench 40lbs with an injured wrist
She also had that abdominal strain. When you're working with weights, you work your core. Perhaps that's why she stopped Maybe the regmen she had was making life difficult. It did flare up a second time

I understand your frustrations, Izzy, but sometimes, you're really hard on Ana. You pick apart every little thing that she says and declare it a horrible decision, either by her or the adidas team. I understand, really, I do, and I'm not trying to start trouble, but it seems you always post what Ana should or shouldn't be doing. I don't know if you know this, but when reading your posts, it comes across as 'what I say is right, she should totally be listening to me, if she listned to my posts everything would be better'. I'm pretty sure that's not your intention, but that's how it's coming across.

The change can't all happen at once. She's going to say generic things. I, for one, don't believe anything that is said by pro's in the press. It's all coached, I think, but with Ana, you never know.
But that's the thing... I'm not saying she should start by lifting 70 lbs, I'm saying now should not be a start. If it's starting now it means she hasn't been doing it. The injuries she has been having are a direct result of being weak.. and she is weak due to not doing the strength training before.

I think you are missing the point of my post completely. Of course if she is starting now she needs to start slow. She will have to do the weight training and build muscle if she is to ever recover power in her shots though. And the power in her shots are necessary for a real success of her game, to be able to beat more than scrubs. I'm not sure she will do it though... she hasn't been doing it for how long? If she was working her strength, it wasn't in an effective way, as she can't last in long matches, her shots are weak and lacking power and she has complained of lack of energy time and again.

And I'm sorry you don't like my posts.. can't do much about that. Maybe I am hard on Ana, but the decisions she has been making have been SO obviously dumb, it's no wonder it's going from failure to more failure. That was actually the only posible result from it. Hard to believe they actually took those decisions. I mostly write in total disbelief of what I see it's happening, of the choices being made, of the thought process being shown. And it's not all that much what she says, though it does represent much of what she does, and that is the point.
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Old Jun 25th, 2011, 12:30 AM   #2535
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Re: Ana Ivanovic Pictures Thread vol.2

I guess this discussion should not be in the pictures thread though.
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