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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 07:37 AM   #1216
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennis Fool View Post
Sorry, fixed.

Number of Slams first.*
Number of Slam finals next.
Ranking is third.
Non-slam career titles fourth.
Doubles titles serve as a tiebreak, when all else is even.


* In the case Player A holds one Slam less than Player B, but Player A has been ranked #1, Player A will be given the edge. This is the only time a ranking trumps a Slam.
Should still be li, then schiavone, then stosur!
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 07:40 AM   #1217
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennis Fool View Post
Note: This list is completely subjective, and is based on how I think players will be remembered.

Please Read Criteria:
Number of Slams first.*
Slam finals second.
Ranking is third.
Non-slam career titles fourth.
Doubles titles serve as a tiebreak, when all else is even.

* In the case Player A holds one Slam less than Player B, but Player A has been ranked #1, Player A will be given the edge. This is the only time a ranking trumps a Slam.

***************
Updated 11/5/12.

Top 20 Active Players

And on a DIFFERENT PLANE OF EXISTENCE...

1. Serena.
30 USA

1 Career Golden Slam, 11 other Slams, 4 other Slam finals, 13 GS Doubles, 2 GS Mixed, 3 Olympic Doubles Gold Medals, 32 other singles, 4 other doubles, 123 weeks at No. 1. YE No. 1 player: 2009, 2002.












The Mere Earthlings...

2. Venus Williams 32 USA

7 Slams, 1 Olympic Gold, 7 other Slam finals, 13 GS Doubles, 2 GS Mixed, 3 Olympic Doubles Gold, 36 other singles, 5 other doubles, 11 weeks at No. 1.

3. Maria Sharapova, 25 RUS

1 Career Slam, 1 Olympic Silver, 3 other Slam finals, 23 other singles, 3 doubles, HR No. 1, 21 weeks.

4. Victoria Azarenka, 23 BLR

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 1 Olympic Bronze, 1 Olympic Mixed Gold, 2 GS Mixed, 13 singles, 5 doubles, hr. #1 for 37 weeks. Year ending #1 player, 2012.

5. Svetlana Kuznetsova, 27 RUS

2 Slams, 2 other Slam Finals, 2 Slam Doubles, 11 other singles, 12 other doubles, hr. # 2

6. Ana Ivanovic, 24 SRB

1 Slam, 2 other GS finals, 10 other singles, hr. #1, 12 weeks.

7. Sam Stosur, 28 AUS

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 2 Slam Doubles, 2 Slam Mixed Doubles, 2 singles, 20 other doubles, hr #4.

8. Li Na, 30, CHN

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 5 other singles, 2 doubles, hr. #4.

9. Francesca Schiavone, 31 ITA

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 4 other singles, 7 doubles, hr. #4.

10. Petra Kvitova, 22 CZE

1 Slam, 8 singles, hr. #2

11. Caroline Wozniacki, 22 DEN

1 Slam final, 20 singles, 2 doubles, hr. #1 for 67 weeks. Year ending #1 player, 2010, 2011.

12. Jelena Jankovic, 27 SRB

1 Slam final, 1 GS Mixed, 11 singles, 1 doubles, hr. #1 for 19 weeks, year-ending #1 player: 2008.

13. Vera Zvonareva, 28 RUS

2 Slam finals, 1 Olympic bronze, 2 Slam doubles, 2 Slam mixed, 12 singles, 13 other doubles, hr. #2.

14. Agnieszka Radwanska, 23 POL

1 GS Final, 10 singles, 2 doubles, hr. #2

15. Sara Errani, 25 ITA

1 Slam final, 2 Slam Doubles, 7 singles, 13 other doubles, hr. #6

16. Marion Bartoli, 28 FRA

1 GS Final, 7 singles, 3 doubles, hr. #7

17. Kimiko Date Krumm, 42 JPN

3 GS semis, 8 singles, 3 doubles, hr. #4

18. Nadia Petrova, 30 RUS

2 GS Semis, 12 singles, 1 Olympic doubles bronze, 15 doubles, hr. #3

19. Angelique Kerber, 24 GER

2 GS Semis, 2 singles, high rank #5.

20. Jelena Dokic, 29 AUS

1 Slam semi, 6 singles, 4 doubles, hr. #4.

Errani shouldnt be in the top 20. A slam final and one decent overall year does not make her better than the likes of Krum, Petrova, Dokic, Hantuchova, and others, not yet anyway. Putting her above Date especialy is a joke. Date at 40 was competitive on todays tour, Errani at 40 wouldnt even get games in a futures event. Date just peaked in a really tough era with Graf, Seles, Hingis, Davenport, Sanchez Vicario, Sabatini, Novotna, Martinez, Pierce, Navratilova, and others.

Schiavone does not deserve to be above Kvitova and Wozniacki, no way. Na and Stosur should not be above Kvitova and possibly Wozniacki as well.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 08:15 AM   #1218
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by lenas warriors View Post
Should still be li, then schiavone, then stosur!
Technically right, but I'm using the tiebreak rule for Stosur, since their number of non-slam titles is all under 5. Sue me.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 08:26 AM   #1219
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by forehand27 View Post
Errani shouldnt be in the top 20. A slam final and one decent overall year does not make her better than the likes of Krum, Petrova, Dokic, Hantuchova, and others, not yet anyway. Putting her above Date especialy is a joke. Date at 40 was competitive on todays tour, Errani at 40 wouldnt even get games in a futures event. Date just peaked in a really tough era with Graf, Seles, Hingis, Davenport, Sanchez Vicario, Sabatini, Novotna, Martinez, Pierce, Navratilova, and others.

Schiavone does not deserve to be above Kvitova and Wozniacki, no way. Na and Stosur should not be above Kvitova and possibly Wozniacki as well.

Thanks for the thoughts, but did you have to repost the whole opening thread

Quote:
Errani shouldnt be in the top 20. A slam final and one decent overall year does not make her better than the likes of Krum, Petrova, Dokic, Hantuchova, and others, not yet anyway.
I think it does. She will be remembered for a greater achievement that those others never attained.

Quote:
Schiavone does not deserve to be above Kvitova and Wozniacki, no way. Na and Stosur should not be above Kvitova and possibly Wozniacki as well.
Petra had multiple opportunities to move above Fran, Na and Sam, but failed to get to another Slam final or reach No. 1.

She will have the opportunity to move up next year, of course, and also if the rumors are true that Fran will be retiring.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 08:49 AM   #1220
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by Tennis Fool View Post
Thanks for the thoughts, but did you have to repost the whole opening thread

I think it does. She will be remembered for a greater achievement that those others never attained.
20 years from now, heck even 10 years from now, nobody will remember Errani reached a slam final. It will be as random a fact as Betsy Nagelson and Sharon Walsh and Kathy Jordan having reached slam finals and lost, something only us extreme tennis nerds have any clue about. Only slam winners general nobody types (aka Errani types) are remembered, even if some for dubious reasons (eg Chris O Neill). Date will be much more famous for coming back to tennis strongly at 40 and playing some great matches in the Graf era than Errani will ever be.

Quote:
Petra had multiple opportunities to move above Fran, Na and Sam, but failed to get to another Slam final or reach No. 1.
If reaching No. 1 were so valuable than Wozniacki with 2 year end numbers 1s which would rank over Petra. I would much rather Petras career than Fran, Na, or Stosur if they all retired today, it is no contest. Petra has a Wimbledon title, a WTA Championships title, and won more titles in 2011 alone than Fran, Na, or Sam managed their whole careers. Yet this is overcome by a 2nd slam final which they all lost. Just no. Anyway the rankings are often BS, Petra was by far the real number 1 of 2011 and as she won every Player of Year award and had the best stats in every sense, most everyone will probably just assume she was ranked 1 that year anyway, lol!
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 09:04 AM   #1221
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by forehand27 View Post
If reaching No. 1 were so valuable than Wozniacki with 2 year end numbers 1s which would rank over Petra.
Nope, read the rules to the ranking (I reposted them in bold in the opening post).
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:03 AM   #1222
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

Quote:
Originally Posted by forehand27 View Post
20 years from now, heck even 10 years from now, nobody will remember Errani reached a slam final. It will be as random a fact as Betsy Nagelson and Sharon Walsh and Kathy Jordan having reached slam finals and lost, something only us extreme tennis nerds have any clue about. Only slam winners general nobody types (aka Errani types) are remembered, even if some for dubious reasons (eg Chris O Neill). Date will be much more famous for coming back to tennis strongly at 40 and playing some great matches in the Graf era than Errani will ever be.



If reaching No. 1 were so valuable than Wozniacki with 2 year end numbers 1s which would rank over Petra. I would much rather Petras career than Fran, Na, or Stosur if they all retired today, it is no contest. Petra has a Wimbledon title, a WTA Championships title, and won more titles in 2011 alone than Fran, Na, or Sam managed their whole careers. Yet this is overcome by a 2nd slam final which they all lost. Just no. Anyway the rankings are often BS, Petra was by far the real number 1 of 2011 and as she won every Player of Year award and had the best stats in every sense, most everyone will probably just assume she was ranked 1 that year anyway, lol!
See, I don't really agree with the list, but I think Errani rightfully deserves her place. I like Date a lot but she's much more memorable is due to the fact she comes back at almost 40, not because she won a slam or something. And it's not about who is gonna remember whom 20 years from now on, it's about what and how much they achieve as of this moment, and 1 slam final > 0 slam final, no matter how weak this era is to you. 1>0 is a fact, while weak or not is merely an opinion.

Plus you can always do your own list. It's not like Tennis Fool says that the list is official or something. It's nice to see some stats anyway.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:11 AM   #1223
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by pancake View Post
Plus you can always do your own list. It's not like Tennis Fool says that the list is official or something. It's nice to see some stats anyway.
Yeah, then your list will get merged into his by the mods and only his flaw ones remain on page one

Too bad there isn't any category where Azarenka > Serena or we would see Azarenka ranked #1 on his list
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:14 AM   #1224
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

I guess Azarenka needs some more weeks being #1 to be ahead of Sharapova)) ......

By the way, I'm making my own list. See it very soon on TennisForum
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:22 AM   #1225
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

If someone can update these two stats, I'll start a new thread or post it here with a system of my own open to criticism and suggestions and some help perhaps lol but if I have to do all the updating it'll take time so if anyone has the updated versions, please post.

top 1/3/5/10/20 weeks count - http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=432901 - last updated on 7th May 2012, top 10 is enough, don't need top 20.


top 10 wins count - http://www.tennisforum.com/showthrea...=top+10+active - this a bit older,
last updated on Jun 20th, 2010
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:46 AM   #1226
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My take on the Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

My take on the greatest 20 active singles players.

This list is based on tennis fools list:
http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=132958

which kind of covers who performs in GSs well and my own list
http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=470903

of who has achieved on the bigger singles events on the tour. These did not have any weight in tennis Fools list.

Personally i think players who perform and win big on the regular the tour is important as well as those who perform well in the (often occasional) slams (admitting that in the longer term non-major-tennis fans wont know much about who wins the former events).

The list in order of the minimum cumulative score of tennis fool's list and my list. Where there is a tie tennis fools list dictates who comes out first here.

To be eligible for this list a player needs to have reached at least 1 GS semi (tennis fools higher players have done this) and won at least 1 Tier 1/PM/P5- players on my list have done this.

Here we go:

1. The one and only Serena Williams

1 Career Golden Slam, 11 other Slams, 4 other Slam finals, 13 GS Doubles, 2 GS Mixed, 3 Olympic Doubles Gold Medals, 32 other singles, 123 weeks at No. 1. YE No. 1 player: 2009, 2002
12 T1/PM/P5 wins and 6 T1/PM/P5 final losses

2. Venus Williams

7 Slams, 1 Olympic Gold, 7 other Slam finals, 13 GS Doubles, 2 GS Mixed, 3 Olympic Doubles Gold, 36 other singles, 11 weeks at No. 1
8 T1/PM/P5 wins and 5 T1/PM/P5 final losses

3. Maria Sharapova

1 Career Slam, 1 Olympic Silver, 3 other Slam finals, 23 other singles, HR No. 1, 21 weeks
10 T1/PM/P5 wins and 9 T1/PM/P5 final losses

4. Victoria Azarenka

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 1 Olympic Bronze, 1 Olympic Mixed Gold, 2 GS Mixed, 13 singles, hr. #1 for 37 weeks. Year ending #1 player, 2012
5 T1/PM/P5 wins and 3 T1/PM/P5 final losses

5. Ana Ivanovic

1 Slam, 2 other GS finals, 10 other singles, hr. #1, 12 weeks
3 T1/PM/P5 wins and 2 T1/PM/P5 final losses

6. Svetlana Kuznetsova

2 Slams, 2 other Slam Finals, 2 Slam Doubles, 11 other singles hr. #
2 T1/PM/P5wins and 7 T1/PM/P5 final losses

7. Jelena Jankovic

1 Slam final, 1 GS Mixed, 11 singles, hr. #1 for 19 weeks, year-ending #1 player: 2008
6 T1/PM/P5 wins and 5 T1/PM/P5 final losses

8. Caroline Wozniacki

1 Slam final, 20 singles, hr. #1 for 67 weeks. Year ending #1 player, 2010, 2011
5 T1/PM/P5 wins and 2 T1/PM/P5 final losses

9. Agniezska Radwanska

1 GS Final, 10 singles, hr. #2
3 T1/PM/P5wins and 2 T1/PM/P5 final losses

10. Li Na

1 Slam, 1 Slam final, 5 other singles, hr. #4
1 T1/PM/P5 win and T1/PM/P5 final 2 losses

11. Petra Kvitvoa

1 Slam, 8 other singles, hr. #2
2 T1/PM/P5 wins and 0 T1/PM/P5 final losses

12. Nadia Petrova

2 GS Semis, 12 singles, hr. #3
3 T1/PM/P5 wins and 2 T1/PM/P5 final losses

13. Vera Zvonareva

2 Slam finals, 1 Olympic bronze, 2 Slam doubles, 2 Slam mixed, 12 singles, hr. #2
1 T1/PM/P5 win and 5 T1/PM/P5 final losses

14. Jelena Dokic

1 Slam semi, 6 singles, hr. #4
2 T1/PM/P5 wins and 2 T1/PM/P5 final losses

15. Kimiko Date Krumm

3 GS semis, 8 singles, hr. #4
1 T1/PM/P5 win and 1 T1/PM/P5 final loss

16. Daniela Hantuchova

1 Slam semi, 5 singles, hr. #5
2 T1/PM/P5 wins and 1 T1/PM/P5 final loss

17. Anna Chakvetadze

1 Slam semi, 8 singles, hr. #5
1 T1/PM/P5 win and 0 T1/PM/P5 final losses

HM; Stosur, Schiavone, Errani, Bartoli, Kerber, MJMS, Rezai. As each of these are still active they all still have a great chance to win big and change my perception of them.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:47 AM   #1227
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Re: My take on the Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

Jankovic and Wozniacki over Kvitova?
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:48 AM   #1228
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Re: The 20 Greatest *Active Singles* Players on the WTA Tour

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Originally Posted by coolfish1103 View Post
Yeah, then your list will get merged into his by the mods and only his flaw ones remain on page one

Too bad there isn't any category where Azarenka > Serena or we would see Azarenka ranked #1 on his list
done my list lets see if it gets merged...
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Li, Sharapova, Pavlyuchenkova, Makarova, The Other Russians, Kerber, Kanepi, Shvedova, Martic, Watson, Robson, Kimiko, Barthel, Erakovic
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 10:56 AM   #1229
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The 20 Greatest Active Single Players in WTA

This list is an attempt to make TF ranking objective, players are ranked in accordance with the scoring system

Only results in singles are counted
1.Major Winner - 100pts
2.Majors on 2diff surfaces +50pts
3.Majors on 3diff surfaces +75pts
4.Career Grand Slam +150pts
5.Major Runner Up 40pts
6.Major SemiFinalist 15pts
7.Olympic Gold 50pts
8.Olympic Silver 20pts
9.Olympic Bronze 10pts
10.WTA Championships winner 50pts
11.WTA Championships RU 20pts
12.Tier I(PM, P5) winner 10pts
13.Tier II(Premier) winner 4pts
14.Tier 3/4/5 (Internationals) 2pts
15. Number of weeks on #1 - 1pt per week
16. Year-Ending #1 =10 pts per year
*Major winner is granted 100 pts bonus just for winning GS title, it helps to make a bigger gap between Major Winners and those who can't make main achievement in tennis

1. Serena Williams
31 USA

1 Career Grand Slam, 15 Major titles, 4 other Majore Runner-Ups, 3 other SemiFinals, Olympic Gold, 3 WTA Championshops titles, 2 YEC Runner-Ups, 12 Tier I Titles, 14 Tier II Titles , 123 weeks #1, YE #1 in 2002 and 2009 .
Total: 2514 points

2.Venus Williams
32 USA

7 Major titles on 2 different surfaces, 7 other Runner-Ups, 5 other SemiFinals, Olympic Gold, 1 WTA Championships title , 1 WTA Championship Runner-Up, 8 Tier I titles, 17 Tier II titles, 9 other titles, 11 weeks #1
Total: 1502 points

3. Maria Sharapova
25 Russian Federation

1 Career Grand Slam, 4 Majore titles, 3 other Runner-Ups, 8 other SemiFinals, Olympic Silver, 1 WTA Championships title, 2 WTA Championships Runner-Ups, 10 Tier I titles, 4 Tier II Titles, 8 other titles, 21 weeks #1
Total: 1153 points

4. Svetlana Kuznetsova
27 Russian Federation

2 Major titles on 2 different surfaces, 2 other Runner-Ups, 1 other SemiFinal, 2 Tier I titles, 5 Tier II titles, 4 other titles, hr-#4

Total: 493 points

5. Victoria Azarenka
23 Belorus

1 Major title, 1 other Runner-Up, 2 other SemiFinals, Olympic Bronze, WTA Championships Runner-Up, 5 Tier I titles, 3 Tier II titles, 5 other titles, 37 weeks #1, YE #1 in 2012
Total: 419 points

6. Anna Ivanovic
25 Serbia and Montenegro

1 Major title, 2 other Runner-Up, 1 other SemiFinal, 3 Tier I titles, 3 Tier II Titles, 2 Tournament of Champions titles, 2 other titles, 12 weeks #1
Total: 361 points

7. Petra Kvitova
22 Czech Republic

1 Major title, 3 other SemiFinals, 1 WTA Championships title, 2 Tier I Titles, 2 Tier II titles, 3 other titles , hr #2
Total: 329 points

8. Caroline Wozniacki
22 Denmark

1 Major Runner-Up, 3 other SemiFinals, WTA Cahmpionships Runner-Up, 5 Tier I titles, 6 Tier II titles, 7 other titles, 67 weeks #1 , YE#1 in 2010 and 2011
Total: 280 points

9. Samantha Stosur
28 Australia

1 Major title, 1 other Runner-Up, 2 other SemiFinals, 1 Tier II title, 1 other title, hr.#4
Total: 276 points

10. Li Na
30 China

1 Major Title, 1 other Runner-Up, 1 other SemiFinal, 1 Tier I title, 1 Tier II title, 3 other titles, hr.#4
Total: 275 points

11. Francesca Schiavone
32 Italy

1 Major title, 1 other Runner-Up, 1 Tier II title, 3 other titles, hr.#4
Total: 250 points

12. Jelena Jankovic
27 Serbia and Montenegro

1 Major Runner-Up, 5 other SemiFinals, 6 Tier I titles, 2 Tier II titles, 4 other titles, 18 weeks #1
Total: 209 points

13. Vera Zvonareva
28 Russian Federation

2 Major Runner-Ups, 2 other SemiFinals, Olympic Bronze, Wta Championships Runner-Up, 1 Tier I title, 1 Tier II title, 10 other titles, hr. #2
Total: 174 points

14. Agnieszka Radwanska
23 Poland

1 Major Runner-Up, 3 Tier I titles, 4 Tier II titles, 3 other titles, hr.#2
Total: 92 points

15. Nadia Petrova
30 Russian Federation

2 Major SemiFinals, 2 Tier I titles, 5 Tier II titles, 1 Tournament of Champions Title, 2 other titles, hr.#3
Total: 92 points

16. Kimiko Date-Krumm
42 Japan

3 Major SemiFinals, 1 Tier I title, 3 Tier II titles, 4 other titles, hr.#4
Total: 75 points

17. Marion Bartoli
28 France

1 Major Runner-Up, 1 other SemiFinal, 2 Tier II titles, 5 other titles, hr#7
Total: 73 points

18. Sara Errani
25 Italy

1 Major Runner-Up, 1 other SemiFinal, 6 other titles, hr#6
Total: 67 points

19. Elena Dokic
29 Australia

1 Major SemiFinal, 2 Tier I titles, 1 Tier II title, 3 other titles, hr#4
Total: 45 points

20. Daniela Hantuchova
29 Slovakia

1 Major SemiFinal, 2 Tier I titles, 1 Tier II title, 2 other titles, hr.#5
Total: 43 points
__________________
Maria Sharapova
Career Grand Slam Winner
Wimbledon 2004 ~ US Open 2006 ~ Australian Open 2008 ~ French Open 2012 and 2014

WTA Championships 2004
London Olympics silver medallist

32 WTA titles , including 12 Tier I titles
21 weeks #1 player

Last edited by NashaMasha : Nov 8th, 2012 at 12:04 PM.
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Old Nov 8th, 2012, 11:07 AM   #1230
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Re: The 20 Greatest Active Single Players in WTA

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Lena D and Navratilova
Clijsters
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Amaze-arenka, Kvitty-GOAT and Halep
Hantuchova, Petrova, Zvonareva, Goerges, Koukalova, The Other Czechs, Halep, Keys, Townsend, Paszek
Li, Sharapova, Pavlyuchenkova, Makarova, The Other Russians, Kerber, Kanepi, Shvedova, Martic, Watson, Robson, Kimiko, Barthel, Erakovic
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