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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:35 PM   #1
Steffica Greles
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Greatest Clay Courters of the Open Era

1. Chris Evert
2. Steffi Graf
3. Aranxta Sanchez-Vicario
4. Monica Seles
5. Martina Navratilova
6. Conchita Martinez
7. Gabriela Sabatini
8. Justine Henin-Hardenne
9. Jennifer Capriati
10. Mary Pierce

Other mentions to...

Novotna, Fernandez, Venus, Serena, Mandlikova, Hingis

Last edited by Steffica Greles : May 4th, 2004 at 11:54 PM.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:39 PM   #2
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This is tricky. I definitely wouldn't have Arantxa ahead of Monica.

I would plump for Evert at #1, Graf at #2 ( due to titles amassed ) & Seles at #3 though on the tennis I watched I definitely feel Seles had greater clay court skills and ability than Graf.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:43 PM   #3
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Venus at #10!?!?!?! What the hell! Serena, Capriati, Hingis ALL are ahead of Venus in terms of claycourt ability.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:46 PM   #4
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I'd have Seles as no.1, and I agree with you, but she just cruelly had the numbers taken away from her...although I don't want to get into the sob story routine.

Aranxta was in no less than 10 French Open semi-finals or better, finishing runner-up 3 times and winner 3 times. Most of her 29 titles were on clay, and she beat both Graf and Seles (and even Evert as a 16 year old) on that surface. She also lost in the quarter finals in 1987 (at 15), 1988, 199....what the hell, I'll write out her finishes...

1987 QF
1988 QF
1989 W
1990 R2
1991 F
1992 SF
1993 SF
1994 W
1995 F
1996 F
1997 QF
1998 W
1999 SF
2000 SF
2001 R2
2002 R1
You can't put Seles above Aranxta on that record. There's an argument that Navratilova could be above both Aranxta AND Monica, but I just don't think she was as formidable on clay as either of them.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:47 PM   #5
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Add Virginia Ruzici and Mima Jausovec to that list since they both had great clay-court rusults in their careers.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:48 PM   #6
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As far as I'm concerned, I REALLY think Arantxa should be at 1st or 2nd rank... I don't say it because she's my favorite, but she really deserves the first rank. Just have to see her Roland-Garros palamres... 3 times winner, 3 runner-up, 4 semis ans others are almost only quarters... I'm convinced the 1st rank is Arantxa's place for that.

Vamos Arantxa!
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:50 PM   #7
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Ryan:

Venus Williams 98 Final of Italian Open, QF French Open; 99 Hamburg winner, Rome winner; 2000 French QF; 2002 Amelia Island winner, French Open F; 2004 Warsaw winner, Amelia Island winner.

Venus is no slouch on clay, and I'd rate her above Hingis.

But I agree, I forgot (how did I do it?) that Jenn WON RG in 2001, and of course, the Barcelona Olympics.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steffica Greles
I'd have Seles as no.1, and I agree with you, but she just cruelly had the numbers taken away from her...although I don't want to get into the sob story routine.

Aranxta was in no less than 10 French Open semi-finals or better, finishing runner-up 3 times and winner 3 times. Most of her 29 titles were on clay, and she beat both Graf and Seles (and even Evert as a 16 year old) on that surface. She also lost in the quarter finals in 1987 (at 15), 1988, 199....what the hell, I'll write out her finishes...

1987 QF
1988 QF
1989 W
1990 R2
1991 F
1992 SF
1993 SF
1994 W
1995 F
1996 F
1997 QF
1998 W
1999 SF
2000 SF
2001 R2
2002 R1
You can't put Seles above Aranxta on that record. There's an argument that Navratilova could be above both Aranxta AND Monica, but I just don't think she was as formidable on clay as either of them.
But Martina was formidable on clay. People forget she grew up on the dirt and she won every major clay-court tournment except the Italian Open.

Even on clay, Martina was devastating.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:51 PM   #9
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Vamos Aranxta: She does have a great record - true But I think you'll find Evert and Graf have better records. And even Navratilova and Seles would have arguments to be higher. But I placed her 3rd because of her longevity.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:52 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steffica Greles
Ryan:

Venus Williams 98 Final of Italian Open, QF French Open; 99 Hamburg winner, Rome winner; 2000 French QF; 2002 Amelia Island winner, French Open F; 2004 Warsaw winner, Amelia Island winner.

Venus is no slouch on clay, and I'd rate her above Hingis.

But I agree, I forgot (how did I do it?) that Jenn WON RG in 2001, and of course, the Barcelona Olympics.
That is absolutely ludicrous. Someone who's only made one RG final and 2? Quarters is no way in the top 10 open era claycourters. Thats absurd.
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Old May 4th, 2004, 11:56 PM   #11
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Ryan: What's absurd, if I may say, is that you failed to read my post and notice that I acknowledged I'd made a mistake with Jenn. I've placed her 9th now.

Off the top of my head, I can't think of somebody who's won more clay tournaments than Venus AND reached the French final. Can you? There may be someone.
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Old May 5th, 2004, 12:05 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steffica Greles
1. Chris Evert
2. Steffi Graf
3. Aranxta Sanchez-Vicario
4. Monica Seles
5. Martina Navratilova
6. Conchita Martinez
7. Gabriela Sabatini
8. Justine Henin-Hardenne
9. Jennifer Capriati
10. Mary Pierce

Other mentions to...

Novotna, Fernandez, Venus, Serena, Mandlikova, Hingis
Not to be nitpicky (for once), but to which Fernandez are you referring? Mary Joe? Gigi? Clarisa ?
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Old May 5th, 2004, 12:16 AM   #13
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Hehe

Certainly not Gigi the serve-volleyer who probably could count on one hand her career clay court wins.

Not Clarissa (what happened to her, is she injured?).

I was talking of Mary Jo, of course. 93 finalist and a handful of other good clay results. Berlin 97, too.
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Old May 5th, 2004, 12:22 AM   #14
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What are u smokin? Venus above Hingis on clay? Go n check the numbers already!
Hingis may not have won the FO but even just compaing her with Venus on their clay abilities is disrespectful for Martina!
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Old May 5th, 2004, 12:26 AM   #15
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Not smoking anything, just tired.



Yeah, you're right. I was looking at Venus' wins over MArtina on clay 99 Italian final and Hamburg 2002.

Hingis has a much better record on clay now I think about it. Neither of them belong in the top 10, though, in my opinion.
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