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Old Feb 17th, 2004, 07:53 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daze11

serena grand slam titles: 6
margaret court grand slam titles: 24

how come people who are so don't want to start a new thread? that way, you could discuss this exciting topic and others would join you who feel just as strong about it?? i am not disrespting your conversation but it belongs on a thread about that topic...and DEFINITELY NOT in the 'Blast from the Past' area.



Yes, margaret Court joined the Virginia Slims tournaments; the conflicts of the original players holding out was resolved in the mid-70s.
Now, now....yet you still joined it.
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Old Feb 17th, 2004, 09:05 PM   #62
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i did.
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Old Feb 17th, 2004, 09:43 PM   #63
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OK-OK-I've NEVER had to delete a post or thread in the Blast as a mod, and I know this won't be the first time. So can we take the Graf-Seles debate into another thread please? (Hint, hint, strong hint-blaming no one)
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Old Feb 17th, 2004, 09:48 PM   #64
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P.S. A Graf-Seles, who was better", Graf-Seles "who gives a shit, or a rat's ass" would be quite funny. Daze had me with that one!

Back to the wood-metal debate. If Court and Martina came along today with metal do you think they could still serve and volley? I agree the metal kills variety, but how much do hard court surfaces play into it?
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Old Feb 17th, 2004, 10:11 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo
P.S. A Graf-Seles, who was better", Graf-Seles "who gives a shit, or a rat's ass" would be quite funny. Daze had me with that one!

Back to the wood-metal debate. If Court and Martina came along today with metal do you think they could still serve and volley? I agree the metal kills variety, but how much do hard court surfaces play into it?
Yes, I do think Court and Navratilova in their prime would and could serve-and-volley on any surface, and in fact Court did play quite a bit of hard court and indoor court tennis during her playing days. However, I think (at least for me) the material of the racquet isn't at issue, it's the size of the frame head. Make the frame out of cheese if it fits the player's inclination, but regulate the size back to somewhere near 65 square inches, and that good ole' serve-and-volley player would return en masse!

Conversely, if you put a 1969 Court smack dab in the middle of todays game, she'd get killed until she learned this new brand of smack-the-winner-in-the-first-few-seconds "style" of baseline bashing. I doubt she'd be interested in learning it, but she is still one of the greatest athletes to ever have played tennis. Can you imagine her first serve with a 104 square inch carbon frame?
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Old Feb 18th, 2004, 12:01 AM   #66
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I prefer to envision Serena Williams with a look of strange and SERENE enlightenment on her face, staring at the artfully-crafted wood racquet in her hand, with a hue of awe and wonder about her lips and eyes, thinking, "I LOVE the challenge that this presents me with!! I can be GREAT in a whole new way! What a BLAST (from the past...)!! I really feel like a champion now and I'll no longer spend my christmas holidays injured!" I actually think Justine Henin & Roger Federer would be the most pleased of all, even though they are #1. I think it would only make their games stronger.

I have stated my opinion ad naesum, but there is a subtlety I'm trying to dig out of the red clay here...it is not necessarily going BACKWARD to embrace wood or SUPPLER substances than some of today's racquets, but FORWARD toward what MAY be considered the game's inherent thoughtful (and healthful) nature. And yes, i agree at the least the smaller sweet-spot Alfajeffster is suggesting would at the least be a big step in this direction.

But...Is tennis SERVED by all this SERVING? Isn't tennis SMASHED by all this SMASHING?! With lobbing, dropping; no longer match-stopping? Racquets popping, with far too much whiz!? It is, I tell you, it is! Has it not been thought, has it not been said? That one must go backward to move straight ahead? So I think its true, i think we should, consider this coup, and return now to wood!

...That last Dr. Seuss part was for you, Rollo. I admit it's not great but I felt the need to entertain you.

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Old Feb 18th, 2004, 04:58 AM   #67
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I just don´t get why people are moaning about the players of today hitting winners at the first chance...how are they supposed to win then?! ´Cause eventually you will HAVE to hit a winner to win.
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Old Feb 19th, 2004, 03:53 PM   #68
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Yes. ROLLO is a MODERATOR. That means he can KICK ASS if he wants to and END this THREAD. And he wrote that he had "NEVER had to delete a post or thread" here before, as a threat, so let's keep to the topic.

BTW, I've started a thread called "Graf & Seles: Who Gives a Shit?" right here in Blast from the Past. You can even talk about Serena there, playing Seles... playing a fictitious Graf, whatever! Knock yourselves out...

http://www.wtaworld.com/showthread.php?p=3064747

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Old Feb 19th, 2004, 08:33 PM   #69
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Back to the topic at hand, and a lovely quote which indicates, at least to some extent, that Margaret Court indeed was a power player, but had to use her brain:

"On court, with the combination of her strength and indefatigable attitude, she was like a bull mastiff in the same cage with a white mouse. The outcome wouldn't depend on the other player's level of brilliance that day. You could be playing your best, she could be slightly off, but somehow, however close to the precipice she came, she seldom fell off...

...I remember playing her in the semifinal of Forest Hills in 1969, on a court squelching with rain. Neither of us was great, we were very even. I led 5-4 and 40-0 on her serve. She came up with a series of points that totally ignored my presence on the other side of the net. From then on she never put a foot wrong and I was wiped out. Her performances were of a predictably indominatable level. She would always say, 'Two hours a day isn't very long to concentrate"- VIRGINIA WADE
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Old Feb 19th, 2004, 09:46 PM   #70
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Nice quote Alfa
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Old Feb 20th, 2004, 05:07 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alfajeffster
Back to the topic at hand, and a lovely quote which indicates, at least to some extent, that Margaret Court indeed was a power player, but had to use her brain:

"On court, with the combination of her strength and indefatigable attitude, she was like a bull mastiff in the same cage with a white mouse. The outcome wouldn't depend on the other player's level of brilliance that day. You could be playing your best, she could be slightly off, but somehow, however close to the precipice she came, she seldom fell off...

...I remember playing her in the semifinal of Forest Hills in 1969, on a court squelching with rain. Neither of us was great, we were very even. I led 5-4 and 40-0 on her serve. She came up with a series of points that totally ignored my presence on the other side of the net. From then on she never put a foot wrong and I was wiped out. Her performances were of a predictably indominatable level. She would always say, 'Two hours a day isn't very long to concentrate"- VIRGINIA WADE

Well, well.....hungering to the time of no "power"-tennis of the ´60-´70 era and what do we find out?! That the era´s-best was a power-player herself!! Now, now...ooh, but she did have a "brain"...would u believe it?!
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Old Feb 20th, 2004, 06:19 AM   #72
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Concerning Margaret's record, I had no clue until just checking the records that Court won a whopping 7 slams in a row from 69-71 - simply amazing. Further, she won 22/26 slam finals, superior to Martina (18/32), Chris (18/34), BJK (12/18), Evonne (6/17) and virtually everyone else (perhaps Steffi was close, didn't check hers). Regardless, it seems you have a point Alfajeffster...
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Old Feb 20th, 2004, 11:10 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Santorofan
Concerning Margaret's record, I had no clue until just checking the records that Court won a whopping 7 slams in a row from 69-71 - simply amazing. Further, she won 22/26 slam finals, superior to Martina (18/32), Chris (18/34), BJK (12/18), Evonne (6/17) and virtually everyone else (perhaps Steffi was close, didn't check hers). Regardless, it seems you have a point Alfajeffster...
That's right Santorofan ... and that was coming back from retirement while she got married and settled down for a time.

Then she had a baby in 71 (or early 72) and came back to win 3 of 4 Slams in 73! Alfajeffster does have a point indeed ...

Then she retired for a 3rd time to have her second baby in 74 and came back again but was never the same force, although she did still win a Wimbledon Mixed in 75.
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Old Feb 20th, 2004, 12:18 PM   #74
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Santoro fan-are you sure it isn't 6 in a row?


1969 US Open
the 4 slams in 1970
1971 Oz

Then she lost to Lovera at the French.


Bandabou-What's the oldest tennis match you've seen?

You are right about Court being a power player. The point the others are making is she had to temper it and mix it in due to the conditions she played under. It's the VARIETY we all miss. Once people see an old match where women actually served and volleyed they will know exactly what we mean.
That's the reason for my question.
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Old Feb 20th, 2004, 01:26 PM   #75
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AND what's so fasinating with Court's period of play is that you had rivalries of TWO serve&volleyers BOTH rushing net, ala King & Court (check out 1970 wimbledon final...and that's with both injured!!), Court & Goolagong, even Court & Martina had some great clashes (have seen only clips of those!) but clearly it was near the end of Court's career, so its not as relevant. But then you also miss, today, the type of rivalry of Evert & Navratilova representing polar opposites forces in the universe; complete contrasts with both, when at their best, representing the 'ultimate' in baseline as a strategy against serve&volley as a strategy. NOW the only VARIETY is that there are either two BLACK girls or two BLONDE girls! (yes, that was a JOKE...)

But that's back when the tools of tennis allowed for a proper balance of energy-exchange on court. whistles...walks away...

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