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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 02:01 PM   #76
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo109 View Post
Often Wikipedia is not reliable.
And we know for sure that Roy Emerson's wife was a tennis player.
http://news.google.com/newspapers?ni...g=4937,3190189

Besides Jill Blackman stopped to play circa 1968
Maybe Jill didn't stop playing tennis in 1968, but married and played in local tournaments under her husband's name Emerson/Emmerson ? In 1980-ies she won some Australian senior titles as Jill Emmerson from New South Wales - it's not any proof, but the AO runner-up in the women's doubles in 1971 was from NSW too.

http://www.tennisseniors.org.au/pdfs...mp_Results.pdf

According to Ugarte she also won the Eastern Suburbs Hard Court doubles championship in 1973.

In this article from 1964 Joy Auld-Emerson said : "I used to play", so it seems she talked about the past.

Last edited by LKK : Oct 3rd, 2013 at 02:11 PM.
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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 02:17 PM   #77
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Re: 1971 results

I will look at all the relevant sources again and see what we can come up with.

Another option is to see if we can get ahold of Lesley Hunt!
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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 02:41 PM   #78
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
Maybe Jill didn't stop playing tennis in 1968, but married and played in local tournaments under her husband's name Emerson/Emmerson ? In 1980-ies she won some Australian senior titles as Jill Emmerson from New South Wales - it's not any proof, but the AO runner-up in the women's doubles in 1971 was from NSW too.

http://www.tennisseniors.org.au/pdfs...mp_Results.pdf

According to Ugarte she also won the Eastern Suburbs Hard Court doubles championship in 1973.

In this article from 1964 Joy Auld-Emerson said : "I used to play", so it seems she talked about the past.
Joy married Roy Emerson circa 1958, had two sons and then, I think, she played sometimes, as in AO 1971 Doubles.
Your link has Jill Emmerson (the former Jill Blackman born 13 November 1936) that played the 40 Singles in 1984 etc., but the official site of the Australian Open (more reliable than Wikipedia) has Joy Emerson as winner in Doubles, not Jill Emerson (or Emmerson).
http://www.australianopen.com/en_AU/...events/LD.html
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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 03:54 PM   #79
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo109 View Post
Joy married Roy Emerson circa 1958, had two sons and then, I think, she played sometimes, as in AO 1971 Doubles.
Your link has Jill Emmerson (the former Jill Blackman born 13 November 1936) that played the 40 Singles in 1984 etc., but the official site of the Australian Open (more reliable than Wikipedia) has Joy Emerson as winner in Doubles, not Jill Emerson (or Emmerson).
http://www.australianopen.com/en_AU/...events/LD.html
It's possible that people responsible for the results on the Australian Open website tried to fill gaps in their draws after many years. Only the sources from 1971 can tell us the truth. In Australian newspapers published during AO'71 Roy Emerson is listed as a player from Queensland, and according to the article posted by Jimbo he had met his wife during some junior event in Brisbane (so she probably comes from the same state). J. Emerson(Emmerson?) - who was L. Hunt's doubles partner - was from N.S.W... Let's change her name to "Joill", it's some compromise, hehe.
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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 06:20 PM   #80
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Re: 1971 results

Jill Blackman does make a certain amount of sense, as the Emmerson (or Emerson)/Hunt team were the #4 seeds.

Jill would explain the seeding, while Joy is virtually unknown to me.

Found this: http://www.grandslamhistory.com/inde...erByIDU&id=348
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Old Oct 3rd, 2013, 11:03 PM   #81
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
Jill Blackman does make a certain amount of sense, as the Emmerson (or Emerson)/Hunt team were the #4 seeds.

Jill would explain the seeding, while Joy is virtually unknown to me.

Found this: http://www.grandslamhistory.com/inde...erByIDU&id=348
I agree with you and LKK, but WTA and ITF have Joy Emerson as Doubles RU in Australian Champs. 1971 (but they have wrong DOB for Joy)
http://www.wtatennis.com/players/pla...merson#results
http://www.itftennis.com/procircuit/...yerID=20004940

We have need of our Australian experts: AndrewTas and GeeTee!!
I will write them a PM.
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Old Oct 4th, 2013, 03:03 PM   #82
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
I agree with you and LKK, but WTA and ITF have Joy Emerson as Doubles RU in Australian Champs. 1971 (but they have wrong DOB for Joy)
http://www.wtatennis.com/players/pla...merson#results
http://www.itftennis.com/procircuit/...yerID=20004940

We have need of our Australian experts: AndrewTas and GeeTee!!
I will write them a PM.
Thanks Jimbo. Perhaps I will PM TennisVideos as well. He may know Lesley Hunt-who of course would recall her doubles partner!

I also emailed a Jill Emmerson who runs a driving school in Australia-could it be her?

LKK has convinced me it is Jill. She married between September of 1967 and September of 1968. A Trove article from 1968 has the answer-but hasn't been digitized yet. My bet is she married Sydney player Peter Emmerson-this explains the NSW origin. Jill must have been from the Canberra area-as there are frequent articles about her.

Mavis was just too weak IMO to make the 1971 final IMO. Jill was a good level above her AND the double M (I checked and it is Emmerson) is the clincher for me.
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Old Oct 8th, 2013, 07:43 AM   #83
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Re: 1971 results

I believe it is Jill Blackman Emmerson. World of Tennis has Emmerson as the spelling. The Sydney Morning Herald also confirms this on March 11 1971.

Jill Blackman played after she got married into the mid 1970's mainly in and around Sydney.
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Old Oct 12th, 2013, 11:16 PM   #84
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by chaton View Post
Adding to Dutch Open, Hilversum

1R Kora Schediwy d Marijke Schaar 6-4 6-4
1R Isabel Fernandez d Katja Ebbinghaus 10-8 6-1
Dutch newspaper has those as second round matches.

Other results from the same source:

1R Kora Schediwy d Anneloes Schothorst 6–1 6–2
1R Trudy Walhof d Carol Kalogeropoulos 6–4 6–0
1R Laura Rossouw d Els Veentjer 6–3 6–2
1R Katja Ebbinghaus d Mary Phillip Moore 6–1 6–2
1R Brenda Kirk d Ada Bakker 6–4 6–4

2R Brenda Kirk d Hetty-Taphoorn Baas 6–0 6–4
2R Alena Palmeova d Tsing Ling Tsang 6–4 6–1
2R Rachel Giscafre d Nora Lauteschlager 6–2 6–4
2R Judith Dibar d Dorien Falkenburg 6–4 6–2
2R Evonne Goolagong d Joan Koudelka 6–0 6–2
2R Betty Stove d Laura Rossouw 7–5 8–6
2R Trudy Walhof d Junko Sawamatsu 6–1 6–1
2R Isabel Fernandez d Katja Ebbinghaus 10–8 6–1

?R Christina Sandberg d Judith Dibar 6–1 7–5

QF Betty Stove d Alena Palmeova 7–5 11–9
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Old Oct 25th, 2013, 08:12 PM   #85
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Re: 1971 results

corrected Mrs Emmerson-thanks Andrew Tas!

Added in Wolbo's Dutch results-thanks Looks like there was a third round in that event.

Added Kitzbuehel results-Thanks Chaton

Last edited by Rollo : Oct 25th, 2013 at 08:29 PM.
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Old Oct 25th, 2013, 10:01 PM   #86
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
Added in Wolbo's Dutch results-thanks Looks like there was a third round in that event.
I got these results from the Dutch newspaper archive. They are a bit fragmentary and at times even confusing and contradictory but it looks like it was a 32 draw women's tournament without a third round. At least I could not find a specific mention of a third round.

The full quarterfinal results are as follows (source: World of Tennis '72, p.313)
QF: Goolagong d Walhof 3-6 6-1 7-5
QF: Schwediwy d Kirk 6-4 6-8 6-3
QF: Stove d Palmeova 7–5 11–9
QF: Sandberg d. Ebbinghaus 6-2 7-5

The last QF result means that the 2R: Isabel Fernandez d Katja Ebbinghaus 10–8 6–1 from the newspaper archive can not be correct so please strike that one.

Also
2R: Rachel Giscafre d Nora Lauteschlager 6–2 6–4
2R: Judith Dibar d Dorien Falkenburg 6–4 6–2
should be first round results, and

?R: Sandberg d Judith Dibar 6–1 7–5
should be a second round result.

The tournament dates are July 26 - August 1.
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Old Oct 26th, 2013, 09:46 AM   #87
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Re: 1971 results

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolbo View Post
I got these results from the Dutch newspaper archive. They are a bit fragmentary and at times even confusing and contradictory but it looks like it was a 32 draw women's tournament without a third round. At least I could not find a specific mention of a third round.

The full quarterfinal results are as follows (source: World of Tennis '72, p.313)
QF: Goolagong d Walhof 3-6 6-1 7-5
QF: Schwediwy d Kirk 6-4 6-8 6-3
QF: Stove d Palmeova 7–5 11–9
QF: Sandberg d. Ebbinghaus 6-2 7-5

The last QF result means that the 2R: Isabel Fernandez d Katja Ebbinghaus 10–8 6–1 from the newspaper archive can not be correct so please strike that one.

Also
2R: Rachel Giscafre d Nora Lauteschlager 6–2 6–4
2R: Judith Dibar d Dorien Falkenburg 6–4 6–2
should be first round results, and

?R: Sandberg d Judith Dibar 6–1 7–5
should be a second round result.

The tournament dates are July 26 - August 1.
Concerning the second round result: Fernandez vs. Ebbinghaus: I have the same result from the 1971 issue of the german tennis magazine. So might be there is something wrong on world tennis?
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Old Oct 29th, 2013, 02:16 PM   #88
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Re: 1971 results

Thank you both for all the help with the draws.

This is what I have so far (with comments in bold)

July 26-August 1 Dutch Open, Hilversum, Netherlands (Clay)

Singles (Draw=at least 32. Possibly had qualifying rounds)

?R: Rachel Giscafre (Arg) d Nora Lauteschlager 6–2 6–4 (Only result that makes no sense, as Giscafre no where else in draw. Could this really be Isabel Fernandez instead of Giscafre? Or maybe a qualifying match?)

1R: Evonne Goolagong (Aus) d A. Valentine (US) 6-0 6-2
1R: Joan Koudelka (SA) d Judith Salome 3-6 6-3 6-4
1R: Trudy Walhof d Carol Kalogeropoulos (US) 6–4 6–0
1R: Junko Sawamatsu (Jpn) d. ????
1R: Kora Schediwy d Anneloes Schothorst 6–1 6–2
1R: Marijke Schaar d. ????
1R: Brenda Kirk d Hetty Taphoorn Baas 6–0 6–4 (1R and not 2R IMO)
1R: Ada Bakker d Mrs N Mankad (Ind) 6-3 2-6 6-0 (From World Tennis, which makes the Kirk-Baas result a 1R result and not 2R)

1R: Betty Stove d ????
1R: Laura Rossouw (SA) d Els Veentjer-Spruyt 6–3 6–2
1R: Alena Palmeova d ????
1R: Tsing Ling Tsang d. ????
1R: Katja Ebbinghaus (Ger) d Ann Phillip Moore 6–1 6–2
1R: Isabel Fernandez (Col) d ????
1R: Judith Dibar (Rom) d Dorien Falkenburg 6–4 6–2
1R: Christina Sandberg (Swd) d Ana Maria Pinto-Bravo (Arg) 1-6 6-2 6-2


2R: Goolagong d Koudelka 6–0 6–2
2R: Walhof d Sawamatsu 6–1 6–1
2R: Schediwy d Schaar 6-4 6-4
2R: Kirk d Baas 6–0 6–4

2R: Stove d Rossouw 7–5 8–6
2R: Palmeova d Tsang 6–4 6–1
2R: Ebbinghaus d. Fernandez 10–8 6–1
2R: Sandberg d Dibar 6–1 7–5 (or 6-4 7-5 per World Tennis)

QF: Goolagong d Walhof 3-6 6-1 7-5
QF: Schwediwy d Kirk 6-4 6-8 6-3
QF: Stove d Palmeova 7–5 11–9
QF: Sandberg d. Ebbinghaus 6-2 7-5

SF: Goolagong d Schwediwy 6-3 6-2
SF: Sandberg d Stove 11-9 6-1

FI: Evonne Goolagong d Christina Sandberg 8-6 6-3.

DF: Christina Sandberg/Betty Stove d. Katja Ebbinghaus/Trudy Walhof 6-1 6-2

What do you all think?
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Old Oct 30th, 2013, 01:23 PM   #89
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Re: 1971 results

HI ROLLO

I HAVE IN FIRST ROUND
GISCAFRE d Lauteslager 6-2 6-4
Palmeova d Ching Ling Chang 6-4 6-1

2 round
Palmeova d Giscafre 6-0 6-2
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Old Oct 30th, 2013, 09:55 PM   #90
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Re: 1971 results

Wonderful Ugarte! That solves that.

Thanks to you, Wolbo, and Chaton for the team effort
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