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Old Jul 11th, 2012, 09:16 AM   #121
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

I have seen, that updating is already made. All right, let will be CET.
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Old Jul 11th, 2012, 09:39 AM   #122
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

purtov,

MTF uses midnight local time as the deadline and I can tell you it is a nightmare for the person running the commitments thread (yes I run it) because the weekly tournaments usually run on vastly different time zones and the person running the commitment thread virtually has to be at their pc 24/7 announcing on the thread when commitments for a particular tournament are closed. If an announcement isn't made on the thread that a particular tournament is closed to commitments, then players will still commit to play there because they can't be bothered to check if it is past midnight local time. I live in the UK and often have to carry out an update to the MTF PAW Commitments thread early on Monday morning because of the commitment deadlines for US tournaments - it is not something that I particularly enjoy having to do when I get into work on Monday morning!

By having one commitment deadline of 9pm CET (as we have had on WTA for the past 5 years) then all players get used to this deadline time and there is no confusion whatsoever. For the past 5 years, players from Europe have run the PAW Commitments thread, so 9pm is a convenient time on Saturday or Sunday evening for them to update the thread and therefore the PAW Managers have a definative list of registered players at the same time every week.

Hopefully this answers your question.
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Old Jul 11th, 2012, 10:21 AM   #123
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Shaun,
I understand your difficulties, but there is an excellent way to do your work and on it to sleep easy!

For example in Miami midnight, when in London 6:00am. You publish the PAW-list in 10:00pm in the end of a thread, and the prevention, that before closing the list there were 8 hours. On it your mission is finished, the manager will add those who will in addition place an order. You can make final edition of the list even in the next evening.

Your predecessor kingroger did not publish the table, probably had difficulties with its creation. When I was the manager, I repeated its work, scanned posts with commits to have the preliminary list, it was simple. It is especially simple to add 5-10 additional commits, I think, managers me will support all.
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Old Jul 12th, 2012, 09:09 PM   #124
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

I can not understand why should we have the commitment deadline that close to the start of the tournament.
I would even suggest that the deadline is two or three days or even a week earlier.
If it is 2 hours before the start of the tournament or with the start of the first match, why do we actually need it??
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Old Jul 13th, 2012, 06:06 AM   #125
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgbgbg View Post
I can not understand why should we have the commitment deadline that close to the start of the tournament.
I would even suggest that the deadline is two or three days or even a week earlier.
If it is 2 hours before the start of the tournament or with the start of the first match, why do we actually need it??
IMHO
The deadline is necessary to the manager to have the list in alphabetic order before the beginning of copying of posts. The players who have asked WC, appear in the end of the list and break the alphabetic order. If a deadline two weeks always will be 5 WC. This extra inconvenience.
Creation macros for reception of the alphabetic order is possible. Then the deadline (and commitment!) is completely not necessary. But the table becomes more complex.

Last edited by purtov : Jul 13th, 2012 at 06:16 AM.
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Old Jul 13th, 2012, 08:20 PM   #126
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Quote:
Originally Posted by purtov View Post
IMHO
The deadline is necessary to the manager to have the list in alphabetic order before the beginning of copying of posts. The players who have asked WC, appear in the end of the list and break the alphabetic order. If a deadline two weeks always will be 5 WC. This extra inconvenience.
Creation macros for reception of the alphabetic order is possible. Then the deadline (and commitment!) is completely not necessary. But the table becomes more complex.
purtov, I am aware of what the manager has to do. Although I am very busy in the last years and just play, I have also managed a few tournaments in the past... However I would say PAW is a game that should be enjoyed by the players, not by the managers; respectively the rules should make it more enjoyable for the players and not easier for the managers. PAW is a game very close to the real WTA tour and this is the reason for having the commitments! Otherwise we can just sign in the tournaments' threads with the message "in", as in other games here.
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Old Jul 13th, 2012, 09:30 PM   #127
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Firstly, may I say that the only game on the forum which is truely close to the real WTA Tour is Tennis Tipping which uses player rankings and real commitments to determine which players can play in certain tournaments.

Saying that PAW is a game which should be enjoyed by the players, not the managers is a rather sensitive issue. As we all know, PAW has struggled over the years to attract enough managers to run the games - only this week, purtov had to step in at the last hour to run PAW Stanford and he/she has very kindly volunteered to run a lot of PAW tournaments this year due to lack of managers. Therefore, I strongly feel that the PAW rules should be geared towards making the PAW Management task as easily as possible in order that we can encourage more new managers into the game.

With regards to the existing 9pm CET commitment deadline for PAW tournaments, I don't ever remember this being a major issue with both managers and players over the past 4 or 5 years. I agree with purtov that the manager does need some time before the start of main draw matches to be able to organise their spreadsheet with names of committed players in alphabetical order, so that they are able to copy picks into the spreadsheet. Having a deadline days before the start of the tournament will just increase the demand for wildcards and having the deadline very close to the start of the tournament just creates unnecessary problems for the manager.

It all comes down to finding a commitment deadline time which benefits both the players and managers. I strongly believe that the existing 9pm CET deadline is a good compromise which has worked well for many years and the players have learned to live with this deadline. Why change something that is not broken?
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Old Jul 14th, 2012, 06:52 AM   #128
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdtoot
I strongly believe that the existing 9pm CET deadline is a good compromise which has worked well for many years and the players have learned to live with this deadline.
I agree on 100 %!

Unfortunately, I did not know about long-term tradition, and did not guess, that any significance is attached to it.
I did not gather to change anything at all. Only the single variation facilitating a life to me and several late...

Now item 18 is changed, and I hope, that no discussions in the future on subject matter of a deadline will exist.

Shaun, small question: whether there is a main arbitrator or organizing committee?
If yes, who personally?

Last edited by purtov : Jul 14th, 2012 at 07:31 AM.
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Old Jul 14th, 2012, 07:23 AM   #129
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgbgbg View Post
purtov, I am aware of what the manager has to do. Although I am very busy in the last years and just play, I have also managed a few tournaments in the past... However I would say PAW is a game that should be enjoyed by the players, not by the managers; respectively the rules should make it more enjoyable for the players and not easier for the managers. PAW is a game very close to the real WTA tour and this is the reason for having the commitments! Otherwise we can just sign in the tournaments' threads with the message "in", as in other games here.
Nevertheless there are tournaments in which in general there is no registration, even messages 'in'. Registration considers PAW01.
PAW it is pleasant for players? PAW tries to reduce number of players. Some people addressed to me with a question about PAW. When they learned, that two months it is necessary to be engaged in a spam or flud, their interest vanished...
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Old Jan 4th, 2013, 03:12 PM   #130
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Code:
PAW10: Hampton over Radwanska 
PAW11: Wickmayer over Barthel
PAW12: Barthel over Wickmayer
Is this way of picking valid?
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Old Jan 5th, 2013, 12:33 PM   #131
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

no.
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Old Jan 5th, 2013, 10:43 PM   #132
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuckii View Post
Code:
PAW10: Hampton over Radwanska 
PAW11: Wickmayer over Barthel
PAW12: Barthel over Wickmayer
Is this way of picking valid?
Code:
PAW10: Hampton over Radwanska
If the manager uses Evita's Templates, it deletes a symbol ":".
Code:
PAW10: Hampton over A.Radwanska
Here the manager deletes ":" and "A.".
For simplification of work of the manager write so:
Code:
PAW10 Hampton over Radwanska
Two picks on one match (PAW11 and PAW12) are invalid.
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Old Jan 5th, 2013, 11:18 PM   #133
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Re: The Official PAW (Pick-A-Winner) Rules and FAQ'S

From the PAW Rules in post #1 of this thread:-

> You cannot post two PAW picks for the same match. i.e. PAW10 Safina over Kuznetsova, PAW11 Kuznetsova over Safina. In this case, both picks will be declared invalid and may be replaced.
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