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Old Jan 19th, 2013, 10:10 PM   #421
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

Note to Asherapova:

Though some things I posted in my original response to Unclesilas overlap, with what I said with you today (especially to start). There are additional things, such as Petra's perpetual hitting partner situation and practice habits, training in the Czech Republic and Prostojev, and it's disadvantages; more on Petra's asthma and it's management;Martina's comments on Petra (she's said it several times on Tennis Channel, and Pavel Slozil's recent recommendations (someone posted those comments and link here--in her subforum), along with my summary and analysis of all I said to him.

Most of the actual events and scenarios I said to him, can be found in articles posted here, over the past year. Plus any keyword search on Google of Milos Cernosek (I think that's his first name), David Kotyza, Joseph Ivanko (I think that's his first name), especially related to Petra Kvitova, can bring up many of these article. You'll just have to use Google translate (which is fine), if you don't come here for confirmation and opinion, by our resident Czech's. Unless, you can read it yourself, which you may?

I hope that helps/enjoy.
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Old Jan 19th, 2013, 10:11 PM   #422
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

Yeah, it's been a great help. Thanks again.
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Old Jan 19th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #423
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Asherahpova View Post
Yeah, it's been a great help. Thanks again.
Your Welcome.

I added to the last paragraph of my last response (in case you didn't see it), mentioning you can keyword search Petra's manager--Cernosek, David Kotyza--her coach, Joseph Ivanko (former Fitness instructor), etc., in relation to Petra Kvitova, and the tournament, date or topic your particularly looking for.

And as I said, they're some recent articles posted and re-printed here, from the past few days, and past few weeks (which should/would be easy to find).
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Old Jan 19th, 2013, 10:29 PM   #424
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
OK Asherapova.

I found it. Here's the detailed response I gave to UncleSilas repeated questions. I'm posting it here, instead of private messaging it, in case some one else ask, wants to know. So calm down some of my Czech Comrades.

This discussion, actually came out of Petra's Czech Extraliga loss/panic (lol), back in late December (the 18th or 19th, 2012). Here it is below, with the original question and link. I didn't realize that, when I copied it, but screw it.



Wow!

Where do I start?

I tried to be polite, discreet and respectful.

But yes, it's her management.

They are not set up like the management of top 10, young Wimbledon, future potential multi Grand Slam champion. They're set up like a top 100-200 player operation. And they possess too many conflicts of interest, all controlled by one person.

I, along with others, have spoken about this Plenty in Petra's subforum. But I've never went into detail here on GM. And I still won't. It's just too many examples. However, I'll try to give a decent overview.

1) Her Manager/Management seems to only hire Czech's or Slovak's within his network. Now, I don't have a problem with that if they're the best people. However, if they're not and/or presents significant delays to Petra's development, then that's a problem.

Her last Fitness Person was Ivanko. That was the gentlemen you were mentioning. He was very good actually. But he was let go. Her new fitness person (another Management choice), appears to be nothing to write home about, and almost embarrassing for a player of Petra's caliber. Trust me. That's a problem!

2) Her Manager (who's not a coach or tennis player, but a business man) actually chooses her coaches and even peripheral staff. That choice should be between Petra and her coach (and or independent tennis advisors she consults with). But her manager actually publicly brags that he's the one calling the shots and controls Petra's decision making. Can you believe that? Tacky!

And even her current coach (David Kotyza), who shows promise in some areas, and lack of promise in others; is a stooge of her manager. I think his hearts in the right place. Nonetheless he's a YES MAN for her manager. And I doubt, Petra will receive outside help (specialist--for example--to work on different tennis areas) anytime soon, if ever, at all.

3) Her Management has massive conflicts of interest. He owns/runs the Prostojev club; he's Petra's personal Manager (with massive control over her personell, career and events participation). He's a Czech Tournament promoter (Fed Cup, Prague 100K and Extraliga); and Prostojev is involved with player development as well. He's also manager of Tomas Berdych and Lucie Safarova, who are also members of the Protojev club, just as a FYI. And of course he's active in Politics.

Because of the various conflicts of interest, Petra is frequently asked (and he's actually bragged in Czech publications that he can get Petra to do what he wants) to promote or play in his silly events--even when she should be home resting/preparing for Slams or out the country practicing on outdoor hard courts, as opposed to indoor in cold ass Czech Republic. So you know; Prostojev is mainly an indoor facility.

You know, Petra hadn't had a male hitting Partner all year in 2012? Last year, she periodically used her boyfriend--Adam (also a member of her Managers Prostojev club by the way) to hit with, and look at the results she had? This year, the only time, I can recall she hit with a male hitting partner, was when she hit with the Prostojev Junior boys. Yes, you read right. And the irony of that?....Petra actually extolled the virtues of hitting with a male hitting partner (albeit junior boys), but she hadn't had one all year. Come to think of it; she hit with a Junior boy (in Adam), periodically last year as well. Amazing! SMH.

How in the world does a player with Petra's stature and presumed expectations, not have a part time, per diem or full time male hitting partners?

4) Petra was diagnosed with asthma in 2009 at the US Open. And it appears they had taken three years to find the proper inhaler. Why? They had a host of the world doctors to choose from, and it appeared they only focused on their local Czech doctors to find the solution. Puzzling. And you can say this about practically every decision her team makes. They don't operate like a top team. And to make it worse, Petra trust them and appears to not encourage or insist in her own decision making.

5) This would explain why Martina Navratilova has said more than a few times on Tennis Channel "I don't know what's wrong with that kid, she doesn't contact me", when asked by Lindsay or her other broadcast partners on the air. This year at Fed Cup, Martina wasn't initially invited. Yes it's true. Apparently, it was a dis by one of the Czech tennis Big wigs that her manager cozies up with. It appears they may encourage her (directly or indirectly), not to speak to outside tennis advisors, due to their established, internal Czech Cliques?

Former Steffi Graf coach, and Czech Pavel Složil , stated in a Czech magazine article that Petra should seek out Djokovic's people regarding her conditioning, diet, asthma and further fitness. And I agree. You see, Pavel is an independent Czech, not affiliated with Petra's manager, so speaks freely like any other normal person would. Unfortunately, I highly doubt she will.

And here in lies the big problem (and why I wrote so long ). Petra's hasn't taken charge of her career yet. And the people she has (in my opinion) don't appear to be able to take her to the next level. They caught lightening in bottle with Petra in 2011. And it was her talent, youthful optimism and confidence, which carried her through. Don't get me wrong. They did their parts/job. However, Petra needs additional support, advisors, fitness, practice and mental strength, etc., if she's to fulfill her promise. Unfortunately, her management (who appears to make the decisions) seems content, with using the people they have in their network, even if they may not be the most qualified, reputable or convenient choices.

Petra has earned enough money and the reputation (in tennis circles) to hire the best or at least top notch people in assisting her to potential greatness. However, for most of the year she didn't have an actual team. At first it was Petra, her coach and Fitness instructor. When he left, it became only Petra and her coach, until Katie The PR LADY (probably from WTA) traveled with them. And in Montreal it got so bad, that Petra actually hit with Katie before her matches there. Now give Petra credit, she won Montreal (though she could have very well lost in the first round). But how in the world can you hit with your PR Lady, who's not even a tennis player? SMH

Pavel Složil , mentioned in his interview, that he used to have Steffi hit with the top male players (and I mean the VERY top) after an easy match to get her reps. Now, not only did Petra not have any male hitting parter in 2012 in any capacity, but I've never heard of her hitting with Tomas Berdych (despite the management connection) at any slam or combined event. SMH

Until things change, Petra's team from top to bottom is just not anything to write home about. As a matter of fact, it's kind of embarrassing for a player of her caliber and recent, current success and alleged aspirations.

In short: It's like Petra has a Bad Father/Controller/Coach, that can't let go (and neither can she for that matter). Yeah, we've all seen, heard that before. The difference is; it's a greedy businessman out to further his won self interest and ego--many times at Petra's expense and detriment, I feel. She could get rid of him tomorrow if she wanted (or choose her own people to work with, if he insisted on keeping her). We know, Petra doesn't need and can get rid of him. It happens all the time with player, managers. Granted; it's a little more difficult with your mother or father as coach or manager. But that happens to.

Hopefully (though I'm not counting on it anytime soon), Petra will. We'll see?

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthrea...=472200&page=6

PS: I also came across an asthma article around that time as well. This one was actually posted on GM and not here....Maybe I'll private message it to you (only cause of the older date, and I don't want to confuse readers), if/when I get the chance? Hell, maybe I'll re post it, since her asthma continues anyway.
Ex, thanks for pulling all the info together, I had myself missed some of details due to my long sabbatical – you should copy all the answers you gave Asherahpova to one of the following thread so it not lost again and can be easily referenced :
PK and coaches - your take / PETRA TEAM bashing thread
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 01:24 AM   #425
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Asherahpova View Post

Sweet Jesus, no hitting partner? Hitting with the effing PR LADY?
I have never heard the likes of that, and it's even stranger considering only her fans in here seem to know what's going on. I mean I would have thought that when it reached hitting with the PR Lady the Twitter journos etc would have had a field day. I'll never get my head round that one, how does she even practice? By herself?

Thanks for all the insight by the way, some things there are truly shocking. But yeah, a male hitting partner is a basic requirement for a player like Petra.
I almost missed this, cause the page flipped so fast, due to the length of the thread.

Yeah, it's crazy. Most of GM doesn't know this. And I guess the press does (or maybe they don't), and keeps it quiet. Like I said, so much of this is revealed in the Czech press. And maybe that's the reason why, the English speaking press doesn't know or reports it.

And yes, we know Petra hit with the PR lady, cause she told us in ONE OF THOSE ARTICLES. LOL

As far as the NO HITTING PARTNER SITUATIONS, I think it's twofold.

1) Both Petra's manager and coach (as I mentioned in that long post), have mentioned in the past, that 'Petra doesn't like redundant activities', so they have to give her 'different methods' to train her. So I think the monotony of a hitting partner, Petra may not like. Her manager, may also be too cheap to hire one, if he's paying for it and not Petra. How else can you explain it?

2) Of course, the REAL problem of not having one is: It explains, why Petra, can so many times be horrid in her form to start a tournament, especially when she doesn't carry her brain with her. And if you use last year as an example, this may also explain why she couldn't beat Maria or Serena and made so many errors on the slower clay and Plexicushion vs Sharapova. Yeah, she could get by with out one (hitting partner), against most of the field. But not against Maria, Serena, and some of the other losses she had. It's a different level of pace, consistency and determination she's going to face, compared to previous opponents, leading up to them.

Common sense says: Why doesn't she or handlers get/realize this, I know???

But yes, it's true. And she still doesn't have one.

Last edited by Excelscior : Jan 23rd, 2013 at 07:57 PM.
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 01:26 AM   #426
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

Ok, thanks Moose. I'll get to it, when I get a chance .

And thanks, for the feedback and idea.
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 05:41 AM   #427
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Petronius View Post
Go ahead, don't be shy

I'm just hoping that the idiot/clown/etc. wordcount will stay at zero to keep this place civilized
Let me say first off that I may have used overly strong language towards you,and for THAT,specifically,I apologize.There was a death in the family a couple days ago so maybe that's nagging at me a bit...and maybe I should avoid the subforum for a bit to keep from hurting your feelings.

Quite frankly,I have no respect at all for your stab at logic;to hear YOU tell it,I should call the benefactor who funded the firehouse--and not the fire department--if my house went ablaze.Yeah,Cermosek built some facilities,great,but you haven't shown me ANY evidence on how he advised Hingis on training methods,coached her or did jack shit to claim credit for her Slam titles.If you're suggesting that Martina couldn't have found some OTHER courts to train on...and that she would've been some ITF player had Cermosek not built those facilities,well.....maybe you've been stealing from Moose's mushroom supply.

On the contrary,why in the heck should neutral,non-Czechs believe that the big shot did ANYthing major for Hingis when we see how amateurishly he's treated Petra??That is: No male hitting partner;Huggy Bear coach instead of a seasoned,respected professional;asinine scheduling of events;ludicrous treatment of Petra's asthma and other health problems.......we could continue,but let's look at how Petra was SUCH a late bloomer,is still raw in several respects,and puzzlingly lacks confidence.....It doesn't seem as if all those years at the CCC helped her that much,does it??If anything,it looks like Petra succeeded IN SPITE OF your favorite Czech mafia stooge and NOT because of him.

If you think that the word 'clown' is so harsh and unbearable,then you may have had a very sheltered life.Perhaps the Old Ladies' Mah Jongg Forum would suit you better than TF.You'd have a heckuva time coping in Mexico,where bastard,sewer-dwelling narcos will shoot a 3-year-old girl just because her mommy works in the Justice Department.To ME,using the word 'clown' to describe Petra's manager doesn't sound so universe-shaking when he's arrogantly boasted of his control over her while undermining such a rare talent and sweet gal.You/he should be happy that I didn't use a word that was much WORSE....and it's phony b.s. for you to gripe at ME when Ex has used equally-strong language(and justifiably so).....I'm done with that!
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 12:04 PM   #428
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Petronius View Post
No biggie, I obviously see many things that may be improved in Petra's team, preparation methods, potential moving to a warmer country, etc. and we've discussed these issues here many times, but it's up to Petra, if she takes the necessary steps or not

I'm just not a fan of cheap digs or fast conclusions like somebody is a 'clown', 'idiot', 'amateur', etc. when things are not perfect.

Any civilized discussion is warmly welcomed

Last, I would have loved if Ivan Lendl were appointed Petra's coach. Could you imagine the results? We all know that Lendl, sometimes dubbed 'Father of Modern Tennis', would force Petra work hard, improve her diet, etc. and bring her to a higher level. There's little doubt that Lendl >>>> Kotyza

But this is just wishful thinking, he opted for Andy and good for them both.
I dont think it would work. He would need someone who was willing to be almost machine-like in the training, or a veteran who knows exactly what they need to give them the mental edge, sort of like the Na-Rodriguez setup. Murray really wanted that extra last bit of coaching to become a champion and he was willing to push himself to the limit. Cant see how well Kvitova would react to that kind of coaching.
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 02:05 PM   #429
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

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Originally Posted by Melange View Post
I dont think it would work. He would need someone who was willing to be almost machine-like in the training, or a veteran who knows exactly what they need to give them the mental edge, sort of like the Na-Rodriguez setup. Murray really wanted that extra last bit of coaching to become a champion and he was willing to push himself to the limit. Cant see how well Kvitova would react to that kind of coaching.
What you're saying maybe true, but maybe not?

Here's a story, about a Tennis Channel program on Pete Sampras yesterday, that I commented on 'The Fall Cometh' thread on Petra. The commentator--I was responding to, was a fan, but disappointed with Petra's recent awful form, and possible future. Here's what I said to him/her about the program:

Quote:
This is all true.

Funny though: I was indirectly watching a Tennis Channel special on Pete Sampras, when he experienced something similar. Note: I'm not comparing Petra to Pete Sampras. But they're similarities that can be drawn.

After Pete won his first major/The US Open, he admitted the following year there--he was "nervous" and didn't want to deal with the pressure as defending champion, and lost.

Needless to say, Jimmy Connors--who beat him, skewered Pete regarding his non-competitive comments and his wilting under the pressure. And for the next two years Pete had (admittingly), so so results; hadn't found himself on the court; didn't know what to make out of his tennis career, while a self described poor practice player at the time.

Guess what!? Eventually Pete changed coaches and found Tim Gullickson--who he clicked with, where he learned to practice better and harder, in addition to focus and refine his game under.

Two years later, after his infamous loss and comments, in defense of his US Open title, and his subsequent struggles after....Pete Sampras overcame his demons (and poor clay season leading up to it), and won Wimbledon. Needless to say: He won it 7/8 years, and picked up a few other Slams along the way.

And the rest was history (including his tenure with Paul Annacone, after Gullickson became sick and eventually died).

Sampras is not the first Grand Slam winner, with great potential to experience this (poor or up and down results, and lack of confidence and focus after their first major), then later mature and dominate. This goes for both sexes. So Hopefully, Petra will be the same.
You cold be right. Lendl may not be the coach for Petra. I don't know. But who ever it is; Petra should click with them, so what ever they ask from her, she will do. The first step is to buy into what they're selling/offering (like any good coach needs). Once that happens, then the hard work and tough advice, becomes welcomed and accepted, cause the player sees the common goal, once the coach has the players attention.

We'll see?

Last edited by Excelscior : Jan 23rd, 2013 at 07:58 PM.
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 02:51 PM   #430
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

With a new wave of rising stars like Stephens, Robson, Keys and Vekic, WTA can reach a new golden age if Petra rejuvenates and joins Serena and Maria at the top of the rung. Petra is important because Serena and Maria won't stick around for too much longer.

Vika, Aga and Li are decent players but that they'll most likely be outgunned by the younger generation.
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Old Jan 20th, 2013, 10:30 PM   #431
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Let me say first off that I may have used overly strong language towards you,and for THAT,specifically,I apologize.There was a death in the family a couple days ago so maybe that's nagging at me a bit...and maybe I should avoid the subforum for a bit to keep from hurting your feelings.
Sorry to hear this sad news. I wish you all the best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Quite frankly,I have no respect at all for your stab at logic;to hear YOU tell it,I should call the benefactor who funded the firehouse--and not the fire department--if my house went ablaze.Yeah,Cermosek built some facilities,great,but you haven't shown me ANY evidence on how he advised Hingis on training methods,coached her or did jack shit to claim credit for her Slam titles.If you're suggesting that Martina couldn't have found some OTHER courts to train on...and that she would've been some ITF player had Cermosek not built those facilities,well.....maybe you've been stealing from Moose's mushroom supply.

On the contrary,why in the heck should neutral,non-Czechs believe that the big shot did ANYthing major for Hingis when we see how amateurishly he's treated Petra??That is: No male hitting partner;Huggy Bear coach instead of a seasoned,respected professional;asinine scheduling of events;ludicrous treatment of Petra's asthma and other health problems.......we could continue,but let's look at how Petra was SUCH a late bloomer,is still raw in several respects,and puzzlingly lacks confidence.....It doesn't seem as if all those years at the CCC helped her that much,does it??If anything,it looks like Petra succeeded IN SPITE OF your favorite Czech mafia stooge and NOT because of him.

If you think that the word 'clown' is so harsh and unbearable,then you may have had a very sheltered life.Perhaps the Old Ladies' Mah Jongg Forum would suit you better than TF.You'd have a heckuva time coping in Mexico,where bastard,sewer-dwelling narcos will shoot a 3-year-old girl just because her mommy works in the Justice Department.To ME,using the word 'clown' to describe Petra's manager doesn't sound so universe-shaking when he's arrogantly boasted of his control over her while undermining such a rare talent and sweet gal.You/he should be happy that I didn't use a word that was much WORSE....and it's phony b.s. for you to gripe at ME when Ex has used equally-strong language(and justifiably so).....I'm done with that!
Sorry, my time is too precious for engaging in these arguments. Let's just say we agree to disagree.
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Old Jan 21st, 2013, 04:50 AM   #432
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

Watching the Bojana-Stephens match and Jesus Christ has Kvitova fucked up.

In form she'd roll both of these players as she should, instead one of these two clowns is going to get a GS QF under their belt.
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Old Jan 21st, 2013, 04:53 AM   #433
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

I still can't deal with the idea of Jovanovski in a GS QF.
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Old Jan 21st, 2013, 05:49 AM   #434
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Re: Petra shot down by Laura in Melbourne

This might not mean that much to most of you,but a QB showed some resolve today for the first time in a huge playoff game(he offered a foretaste the previous week),and he outdid one of the legends of the sport in leading his team to the Super Bowl.He had a history of some of the most pathetic mental errors and,unlike Petra,he had never won any major championships to suggest that his F-ups weren't his destiny(he'd won division titles;however,there are EIGHT different geographical divisions,so that's not as impressive as it sounds).

There's no evidence that he's seen a sports counsellor or anything;apparently,he just reached down within himself and found the courage to fight.I'm offering encouragement here in that,if a habitual big-game screwup found a way to be strong,then Petra should have every reason to believe in herself,deep down,and make herself stronger,too
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Old Jan 22nd, 2013, 03:40 PM   #435
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Re: 2013 Australian Open - Stuck in the mud

I don't know about you guys. But I'm quite envious (no, not really. But you know what I mean, LOL) to read on GM, that 4 Grand Slam Winners may make a Slam semi's for the first time in 7 years--if Serena beats Sloane, and Petra's not one of them.

Our Petra should be a part of the festivities.....And I feel so left out as a fan.

Bawl!!!!!!!!!!!
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