Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6 - Page 20 - TennisForum.com
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 08:43 PM   #286
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by StoneRose View Post
Now who's focused on rankings, you brought up all those numbers first. Of course Petra was ranked 4-5 most of the year, YEC points hadn't gone off yet. Caro couldn't fall that much further. It doesn't even matter, they're 8th and 10th now and that reflects how they've played this year.
What it doesn't reflect is the wide difference in ranking points between the two of them. Petra earned 1310 or 35% more ranking points than Caroline. Quite a big gap if you ask me.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 08:44 PM   #287
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

Caro doesn't care about this MM tournament. She's going after the Australian open!!
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 08:54 PM   #288
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by bandabou View Post
I didn't miss the point..but you were dissing Vika a bit too much imo. When you said she was lucky, etc, etc..when she beat the same sharapova that Petra couldn't beat at the Oz open.

Vika vs Petra? Would've been a good match..no certainty for either player. At RG and Wimbledon? That I give you..Petra would've been the favorite.


About Caro..her game as it is now, leaves her too much into the opponent's hands, so..you might be right on that one too.
Yes, you did miss the point. Those were two separate post. Come on man.

Once again. You're looking for too much.

Petra had already beaten Vika 4 in a row and was on a high from 2011. So you're telling me if she would have faced Vika (who she had just beat less than two months ago), she wouldn't have been favored or have a good chance winning??..Come on now.

Plus, if you really read what I said. And it's obvious you didn't. I did say 'one, several all or all of them (the majors I was discussing)". So once again, you're fixing for some type of fight (am I talking about Sharapova or something now), that's not there.

Wozniaki is self explanatory.

And since you keep pushing to go there. I'll say this once, and let it go: Vika, Serena and Masha all had great years last year. However, it doesn't mean that their success or match ups (albeit on slow surfaces in Petra's case with Masha as an example) will be duplicated. This is especially true, when you consider their recent success (or lack of it) the past several years.

Things are very fluid in this sport, especially with the women.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:01 PM   #289
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Piotr View Post
And what are you doing? You are playing - you are standing, two meters behind the line - in Brisbane [probably the courts are on the outskirts of the city?]... You can't come to the net when you are standing in Brisbane. You play the ball, approach the net, but you are too late at the net because you are so far away. If you were closer to the balls like that you would make a volley every time. But you can't make it because you hit your shot in Brisbane and start running.
It's because she's standing on the "Brisbane" painted behind the baseline.

Is this now common coaching terminology? [oracene]get out of melbourne[/oracene]
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:01 PM   #290
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
Yes, you did miss the point. Those were two separate post. Come on man. Once again. You're looking for too much.



Petra had already beat Vika 4 in a row and was on a high from 2011. So you're telling me if she would have faced Vika (who she had just beat less than two months ago), she wouldn't have been favored or have a good chance winning??..Come on now.

Plus, if you really read what I said. And it's obvious you didn't. I did say 'one, several all or all of them (the majors I was discussing)". So once again, you're fixing for some type of fight (am I talking about Sharapova or something now), that's not there.

Wozniaki is self explanatory.

And since you keep pushing to go there. I'll say this once, and let it go: Vika, Serena and Masha all had great years last year. However, it doesn't mean that their success or match ups (albeit on slow surfaces in Petra's case with Masha as an example) will be duplicated. This is especially true, when you consider their recent success (or lack of it) the past several years.

Things are very fluid in this sport, especially with the women.
well she had beaten Maria at Wimbledon too, didn't stop her from losing, no?!

I'm not picking any fights..I think you're very dismissive of Vika, like she's a nobody or something. You DID say that she got some lucky breaks to win last year, right? So just had to call you on that part.

For the rest..well, the ball is in Petra's corner, no? She's the one who has to prove she has got what it takes to enter the winner's circle again.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:06 PM   #291
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by moby View Post
It's because she's standing on the "Brisbane" painted behind the baseline.

Is this now common coaching terminology? [oracene]get out of melbourne[/oracene]
Commentators have definitely been using it for some time in reference to court positioning, wouldn't be surprised if it's getting picked up elsewhere.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:20 PM   #292
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
Hey Chrissie Fan.

What's your opinion on Caro (sorry I haven't read anything from you recently or looked into your subforum)?

Is it her; Rory; her father; her game; all of the above, etc.?

Whadda you think/what's your opinion?
Hard to say. A combination of all or some of those things and perhaps a few others as well I guess.

Rory? Could be, but we don't know that for a fact. We do know for a fact though that she started to struggle as soon as he got into her life. But she's clearly in love with the guy (and he with her), so for that reason alone I don't agree with those who argue that she should just break up with him. Sounds corny, I know, but I don't begrudge two people the love they feel for each other. Besides, I doubt that a brokenhearted Caroline would play any better than a Caro in love.

The coaching situation? I think that Caroline feels indebted to Piotr for bringing her this far. She probably feels that it would be an act of betrayal on her part to give him the boot. It's always complicated when there's family involved, especially family as close as a father, and even more especially when the're as close as those two. She'd probably be better off with another coach at this point, but she has never stuck with one long enough to find out if it would make a difference in the long run. Of one thing I'm convinced though - the worst thing she can do (and did do in 2012) is changing coaches every couple of months with everyone whispering (in Piotr's case yelling ) different things in her ears. That can, and has only confused her.

Her game? Obviously. Not only isn't she successful in terms of making more winners or improving her serve and forehand, but she doesn't even play error free tennis anymore like she did when she was at her best. The traditional "she beat herself" excuse that fans of other players always came up with when their girl lost a match to Caro sounds lamer than ever because these days Caro is perfectly capable of "beating herself" herself. In short, she hasn't improved her offensive game - or not enough anyway to compensate for all those errors she's making now.

Lack of confidence? Definitely. In the past when a match was as close as this one I had a big smile on my face because I knew that nine times out of ten she would win it. If you couldn't hit Caroline off the court you would lose because she was mentally the stronger. But in the last eighteen months or so she has lost a truckload of close matches that the 2010-early 2011 version of Caro probably would have won. In fact, it's become common for her to win a first set (and sometimes quite convincingly) only to end up struggling from the start of the second set onwards.

And perhaps the media, bloggers, comments from specialists like Navratilova and Hingis and so on also played their part. Could be that they were part of the reason that she stopped believing and ultimately why she started experimenting with different coaches. But she didn't see it through because she panicked when she didn't get the short term results she had hoped for.

In other words, despite the lenght of this post I have no idea, but it's probably a bit of eveything really.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:21 PM   #293
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

Quote:
Originally Posted by bandabou View Post
well she had beaten Maria at Wimbledon too, didn't stop her from losing, no?!

I'm not picking any fights..I think you're very dismissive of Vika, like she's a nobody or something. You DID say that she got some lucky breaks to win last year, right? So just had to call you on that part.

For the rest..well, the ball is in Petra's corner, no? She's the one who has to prove she has got what it takes to enter the winner's circle again.
I don't know why we keep discussing this. But it is your habit, I guess?

What is it you don't understand about "one, several or all"? How am I dismissing Vika there, if Petra only wins one out of three?? That means Vika could have very well won that Australian. So just please stop (not including the fact that if they would have played back then--win or lose, Petra would have been favored). So just relax.

This was all in contrast to Wozniaki in the first place. And I don't even remember how Petra came up (the reason why you're really doing this), but I wasn't even the one to introduce her in the discussion.

My discussing Vika in another post (not the one you initially claimed to argue), was self explanatory and in a much broader historical context, which so many here have already argued and discussed, ad nauseam. It wasn't a slight to anyone

Please, let's not take over the thread. There's nothing else to say.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:31 PM   #294
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post
I don't know why we keep discussing this. But it is your habit, I guess?

What is it you don't understand about "one, several or all"? How am I dismissing Vika there, if Petra only wins one out of three?? That means Vika could have very well won that Australian. So just please stop (not including the fact that if they would have played back then--win or lose, Petra would have been favored). So just relax.

This was all in contrast to Wozniaki in the first place. And I don't even remember how Petra came up (the reason why you're really doing this), but I wasn't even the one to introduce her in the discussion.

My discussing Vika in another post (not the one you initially claimed to argue), was self explanatory and in a much broader historical context, which so many here have already argued and discussed, ad nauseam. It wasn't a slight to anyone

Please, let's not take over the thread. There's nothing else to say.

Let's just leave it at this. I think we understood each other, despite you trying to play dummy right now acting like you didn't say when everybody read what you said.

Cool, no problemos. Petra do your thing in 2013.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:35 PM   #295
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Chrissie-fan View Post
Hard to say. A combination of all or some of those things and perhaps a few others as well I guess.

Rory? Could be, but we don't know that for a fact. We do know for a fact though that she started to struggle as soon as he got into her life. But she's clearly in love with the guy (and he with her), so for that reason alone I don't agree with those who argue that she should just break up with him. Sounds corny, I know, but I don't begrudge two people the love they feel for each other. Besides, I doubt that a brokenhearted Caroline would play any better than a Caro in love.

The coaching situation? I think that Caroline feels indebted to Piotr for bringing her this far. She probably feels that it would be an act of betrayal on her part to give him the boot. It's always complicated when there's family involved, especially family as close as a father, and even more especially when the're as close as those two. She'd probably be better off with another coach at this point, but she has never stuck with one long enough to find out if it would make a difference in the long run. Of one thing I'm convinced though - the worst thing she can do (and did do in 2012) is changing coaches every couple of months with everyone whispering (in Piotr's case yelling ) different things in her ears. That can, and has only confused her.

Her game? Obviously. Not only isn't she successful in terms of making more winners or improving her serve and forehand, but she doesn't even play error free tennis anymore like she did when she was at her best. The traditional "she beat herself" excuse that fans of other players always came up with when their girl lost a match to Caro sounds lamer than ever because these days Caro is perfectly capable of "beating herself" herself. In short, she hasn't improved her offensive game - or not enough anyway to compensate for all those errors she's making now.

Lack of confidence? Definitely. In the past when a match was as close as this one I had a big smile on my face because I knew that nine times out of ten she would win it. If you couldn't hit Caroline off the court you would lose because she was mentally the stronger. But in the last eighteen months or so she has lost a truckload of close matches that the 2010-early 2011 version of Caro probably would have won. In fact, it's become common for her to win a first set (and sometimes quite convincingly) only to end up struggling from the start of the second set onwards.

And perhaps the media, bloggers, comments from specialists like Navratilova and Hingis and so on also played their part. Could be that they were part of the reason that she stopped believing and ultimately why she started experimenting with different coaches. But she didn't see it through because she panicked when she didn't get the short term results she had hoped for.

In other words, despite the lenght of this post I have no idea, but it's probably a bit of eveything really.
No, I definitely appreciate your response, and it was well thought out.

I heard a lot from others here (both friend and foe of Caro and in between alike), so I was curious to your opinion, since we hadn't spoken in a while. It makes sense.

Happy New Year!
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:39 PM   #296
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by edificio View Post
Thank you for the translation. Just as I thought, though, two things: too much information and too demeaning.
You're welcome.

I loved his "stay positive" line after all that .

To his defence, he had more time than usual this time around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moby View Post
It's because she's standing on the "Brisbane" painted behind the baseline.

Is this now common coaching terminology? [oracene]get out of melbourne[/oracene]
I haven't thought about it, pretty sure you are right .
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:39 PM   #297
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by Excelscior View Post

Happy New Year!
Same to you.
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:46 PM   #298
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Originally Posted by bandabou View Post
Let's just leave it at this. I think we understood each other, despite you trying to play dummy right now acting like you didn't say when everybody read what you said.

Cool, no problemos. Petra do your thing in 2013.
Gotta Love Bandabou and his relentless postings, digging.

You do realize, our initial post (me and some others), were never about Petra. Kvitova came into the mix, when another poster tried to compare Petra and Woz by their 'similar rankings', after/because another poster had brought up a near Petra 1st rd loss to the player Caro lost to--Pervak. That's it. Outside of that: It's really wasn't that important.

You just took every thing else, and ran with it to your taste.

Happy New Year Bandabou!!!!!
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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 09:53 PM   #299
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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Old Dec 31st, 2012, 10:16 PM   #300
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Re: Brisbane R1 - [Q] Xeniya Pervak def [8] Karolina Wozniacki 2-6 6-3 7-6

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"She had more matches than me", "I misjudged the wind", "It all went in for her" .

Girl, you were #1 only a year ago. Time to ease up on the excuses.
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