[hingis-seles]

The closest we ever got to seeing peak Seles was in 1993, not 1991/1992. She was constantly improving leading up to the stabbing. In the Australian Open final, she was taller than Graf and served more aces than her not to mention showed incredible defence. That was when Graf really began doubting herself against Seles than in 1991/1992.

[Sammo]

Peak Seles would beat the crap out of Peak Serena on clay, so I voted peak Serena on all surfaces except clay

[Otlichno]

I don't think Peak Monica would have even beaten Peak Serena on clay.

Peak Monica's game of hitting angles and forcing opponents to move side to side, fits directly into what Peak Serena would want. No one could beat Serena at that game, she was far too physically superior.

[Start da Game]

poll results are entirely wrong......seles was not a pushover on hardcourts by any means......she was the first real power hitter on tour on the women's side and a great player......if she had the modern equipment that serena enjoys, imagine what she could have done......her serve was lethal before 1993 and she is 2 inches taller than serena!!

[Matt01]

Originally Posted by forehand27

OK I have to ask you something here out of curiosity. I notice you are the same poster who in the Peak Pierce thread was arguing profusely that Peak Pierce was better than peak Serena on all but grass, and maybe even on grass, lol! Yet in a thread comparing Serena to peak Seles you are giving Serena all but clay. So do you:

1. Believe peak Pierce is superior to peak Seles in which case ROTFL!!!
2. Just believe Pierce is a tougher "matchup" for Serena than Seles which I cant see possibly how, but you are entitled your opinion I guess

Of course I think that Peak Pierce is superior to Peak Seles, shouldn't be that hard to figure out.

And please don't pretend to not know me because we all know which formerly banned poster you are. But don't worry I won't report you

[forehand27]

Originally Posted by Matt01

Of course I think that Peak Pierce is superior to Peak Seles

Well then you couldnt be more wrong. Even a depressed and grossly overweight Seles due to her fathers impending death, and in the worst year of tennis of her career, could beat and overpower a very in form Pierce:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DdmSxMt8cs

Case closed.

[forehand27]

Originally Posted by hingis-seles

The closest we ever got to seeing peak Seles was in 1993, not 1991/1992. She was constantly improving leading up to the stabbing. In the Australian Open final, she was taller than Graf and served more aces than her not to mention showed incredible defence. That was when Graf really began doubting herself against Seles than in 1991/1992.

Valid and interesting point but keep in mind this is a thread about peak SERENA vs peak Seles, not peak Graf vs peak Seles. I think most would concede regardless which is the hard court GOAT factoring in overall career (obviously one of Graf or Serena) that peak Serena >>>>> peak Graf on hard courts in sheer playing level, especialy on Australian Open hard courts which is the match you reference and the only kind of hard court Seles ever managed to beat Graf on anyway, and that Serena is a much tougher matchup for Seles than Graf was. Seles could only beat Graf on a hard court by attacking her backhand and 2nd serve, but against Serena there would be nothing to attack. The only way to beat Serena on a hard court is to attack her consistency but you need great retrieving skills to have a chance at doing that, which Seles does not.

[jj74]

On clay Seles is clearly superior, on the rest Serena clearly on clay, and Serena, a lot more tight, on hard

[hingis-seles]

Originally Posted by forehand27

Valid and interesting point but keep in mind this is a thread about peak SERENA vs peak Seles, not peak Graf vs peak Seles. I think most would concede regardless which is the hard court GOAT factoring in overall career (obviously one of Graf or Serena) that peak Serena >>>>> peak Graf on hard courts in sheer playing level, especialy on Australian Open hard courts which is the match you reference and the only kind of hard court Seles ever managed to beat Graf on anyway, and that Serena is a much tougher matchup for Seles than Graf was. Seles could only beat Graf on a hard court by attacking her backhand and 2nd serve, but against Serena there would be nothing to attack. The only way to beat Serena on a hard court is to attack her consistency but you need great retrieving skills to have a chance at doing that, which Seles does not.

The reason I cited the Graf match was because along with Seles, those were the only two players at that level at the time, along with it highlighting Seles' improving game - she had closed the gap in areas where Graf had the edge while maintaining the strengths she had. All of this plays into Peak Seles, which is a part of the subject of this thread. The closest look we ever got at what might have been.

I've said it in other threads already but the level of tennis Serena displayed in 2002 was the best I have ever seen from a woman, irrespective of the weak competition arguments others keep dredging up. But as far as mental toughness goes, I'd have to give the nod to Seles.

I don't think it'd be so cut and dry as most responses in this thread suggest. Neither one would be winning easily or destroying the other on clay/grass. Both were fiercely proud champions who despised losing which was highlighted during their peaks.

[forehand27]

Well you are entitled your opinion but even peak Seles was crushed by peak Graf on grass, and IMO peak Serena > peak Graf on grass (again just talking peak level play, not historical ranking) so I dont think grass would be close. Clay would be closer, but peak Serena was dominated by non prime Henin on clay, and peak Seles > peak Henin on clay IMO so even that I wouldn see being that close either. The only really good matches would be on hard courts. JMO

[Matt01]

Originally Posted by forehand27

Well then you couldnt be more wrong. Even a depressed and grossly overweight Seles due to her fathers impending death, and in the worst year of tennis of her career, could beat and overpower a very in form Pierce:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DdmSxMt8cs

Case closed.

Pierce in 1997 wasn't even close to her peak.

[azinna]

Peak Seles would have a strong chance on RG clay, especially if the '91-'93 version of herself could borrow her '95 serve. If she couldn't, she'd need Serena RG '03 QF to not show up.

....

[Pops Maellard]

Serena on all surfaces IMO. Seles could perhaps equal Serena off the ground at times but between the two Seles' serve would be challenged a lot more .

[jaredlikesbieber]

serena on grass and US hardcourts, seles on slower HC and clay courts.

[rjd1111]

I like Monica But:


Seles started Power Tennis


Serena perfected it.