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Old Nov 13th, 2012, 08:25 PM   #61
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Petkorazzi View Post
Haven't seen Sara Sorribes Tormo's name thrown out there. 16 year old Spaniard who could Rise up the ranks with a smart schedule.
On clay she is a top junior player for sure (she lost in three against Towsend, and defeated Lottner) and she is the european champion u16 too, but i don't know if she can pull the same kind of results out of clay.
We'll see soon, because i think she will play Australian Open jr next year, she has enought wta ranking to play qualification
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Old Nov 13th, 2012, 09:03 PM   #62
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

Here's my similar thread which focuses on teens inside Top 250.

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthrea...947&highlight=

Here are some stats about the players born 1994 and after:

Top 5 in rankings:
#53 Laura Robson
#78 Annika Beck
#109 Donna Vekic
#114 Elina Svitolina
#124 Yulia Putintseva

Best WTA results in 2012:
Laura Robson - F of Guangzhou
Donna Vekic - F of Tashkent
Alison van Uytvanck - QF of Brussels
Eugenie Bouchard - QF of Washington

Best wins on tour in 2012:
Laura Robson - #8 Li Na
Ons Jabeur - #33 Zheng Jie
Daria Gavrilova - #35 Yanina Wickmayer
Alison van Uytvanck - #39 Ksenia Pervak
Carina Witthoeft - #42 Tsvetana Pironkova

Junior winners:
Laura Robson
Elina Svitolina
Daria Gavrilova
An-Sophie Mestach
Ons Jabeur
Ashleigh Barty
Grace Min
Taylor Townsend
Annika Beck
Eugenie Bouchard
Samantha Crawford

Robson leads every category from this generation currently. Highest ranked, best slam result, best victory, most tour wins, first and youngest junior winner etc.

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Old Nov 13th, 2012, 09:05 PM   #63
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

1. Keys
2. Vekic
3. Witthoeft
4. Barty
5. Danilina
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Old Nov 13th, 2012, 09:40 PM   #64
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

Okay, firstly Robson and Beck I don't include. As far as I'm concerned both are now comfortably in the top 100 and have convinced me that at the very least they will be fixtures on the WTA tour for quite a few years to come. Quite simply, these two have already graduated.

Vekic and Barty obviously both merit special attention as they are by far the youngest players in the top 200. Personally I think both most likely have very good futures. But I don't think either of them is ready for a big breakthrough yet. Vekic is very close to the top 100 and she will probably get there next year, but I think she will likely find herself a little bit out of her depths at this stage. Likewise, I don't see Barty as being able to compete at WTA level next year. But give these girls another year and both should be ready to make some noise in 2014.

Of those that are 18 and under and in the top 250, there are several I really need to see more of before having any sort of opinion of them. But there are a few I do have significant reservations about. Irina Khromacheva seems to lose almost all her matches by very uncompetitive scorelines. That is not what you want to see in a young player and it suggests to me a lack of heart and motivation. Yulia Putintseva is a small girl and she does seem to have attitude problems. Having seen her play I don't think she is terrible but there wasn't much about her game that impressed me either. I am certainly not convinced she is a future star. Saisai Zheng, I watched a little at Roehampton last year and while she is solid she has a long way to go before being competitive against top 100 opposition. She has obviously benefited from playing a lot of relatively easy ITF events. There is still time for further improvement and she may yet turn out to be a solid top 100 player in the future but next year? I don't think so.

So who are the players I do think can make some noise next year?
The five I'm going with are Elina Svitolina, Eugenie Bouchard, Madison Keys, Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova. These are the five players 18 and younger, ranked in the top 250 but outside the top 100, who I have the most confidence in and I think all these players will make a significant impression on the tour next year.

A few other slightly older players I'd keep an eye on are Monica Puig, Maryna Zanevska and Paula Ormaechea.
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Old Nov 13th, 2012, 10:11 PM   #65
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

Really great thread! I am not as knowledgeable with non-USA juniors; however, I do believe Vekic and Bouchard are two of the top prospects that will make a splash next season.

I really feel the US has MAJOR potential in the next few years. It is great to see some talent coming through. My top US girls to make breakthroughs would be (one could name many more as well):

Keys
Crawford
Townsend
Pegula
Duval
Vickery
Jeukeng
Min
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 11:46 AM   #66
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Shvedbarilescu View Post
Okay, firstly Robson and Beck I don't include. As far as I'm concerned both are now comfortably in the top 100 and have convinced me that at the very least they will be fixtures on the WTA tour for quite a few years to come. Quite simply, these two have already graduated.

Vekic and Barty obviously both merit special attention as they are by far the youngest players in the top 200. Personally I think both most likely have very good futures. But I don't think either of them is ready for a big breakthrough yet. Vekic is very close to the top 100 and she will probably get there next year, but I think she will likely find herself a little bit out of her depths at this stage. Likewise, I don't see Barty as being able to compete at WTA level next year. But give these girls another year and both should be ready to make some noise in 2014.

Of those that are 18 and under and in the top 250, there are several I really need to see more of before having any sort of opinion of them. But there are a few I do have significant reservations about. Irina Khromacheva seems to lose almost all her matches by very uncompetitive scorelines. That is not what you want to see in a young player and it suggests to me a lack of heart and motivation. Yulia Putintseva is a small girl and she does seem to have attitude problems. Having seen her play I don't think she is terrible but there wasn't much about her game that impressed me either. I am certainly not convinced she is a future star. Saisai Zheng, I watched a little at Roehampton last year and while she is solid she has a long way to go before being competitive against top 100 opposition. She has obviously benefited from playing a lot of relatively easy ITF events. There is still time for further improvement and she may yet turn out to be a solid top 100 player in the future but next year? I don't think so.

So who are the players I do think can make some noise next year?
The five I'm going with are Elina Svitolina, Eugenie Bouchard, Madison Keys, Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova. These are the five players 18 and younger, ranked in the top 250 but outside the top 100, who I have the most confidence in and I think all these players will make a significant impression on the tour next year.

A few other slightly older players I'd keep an eye on are Monica Puig, Maryna Zanevska and Paula Ormaechea.
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 11:59 AM   #67
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Asadinator View Post
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...
Well, the thread is the youngsters to watch next year, not who is going to have a better future in tennis.

I really like Barty, but i don't think next year will be her year. She is small, and she probably will need some time to cause trouble to top players.

We have examples, and Michelle is very obvious, that having good results very soon, doesn't mean anything at all. Michelle has impressive results at a very young age and right now a lot of players her age are doing better.

I'm pretty sure that there are a good bunch of players flying under the radar who will make an impact. In fact we can see that with Kontaveitt or Vekic. They were good but they were not the top players of their age when they were 14.

And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
This is a tennis forum so it's normal that a young girl with impressive results on juniors or itfs will be mentioned. It's not the same that a 6 year old being hyped on the press
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 12:11 PM   #68
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by jj74 View Post
Well, the thread is the youngsters to watch next year, not who is going to have a better future in tennis.

I really like Barty, but i don't think next year will be her year. She is small, and she probably will need some time to cause trouble to top players.

We have examples, and Michelle is very obvious, that having good results very soon, doesn't mean anything at all. Michelle has impressive results at a very young age and right now a lot of players her age are doing better.

I'm pretty sure that there are a good bunch of players flying under the radar who will make an impact. In fact we can see that with Kontaveitt or Vekic. They were good but they were not the top players of their age when they were 14.

And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
This is a tennis forum so it's normal that a young girl with impressive results on juniors or itfs will be mentioned. It's not the same that a 6 year old being hyped on the press
I know that, so like I said those predictions were based on age alone. Otherwise there is no way you can predict those 2 players will perform better next year, I mean they are better now. So random.


You are half right with Barty, she was not ready this year to win at WTA level. But at ITF level this year she has won pretty much everything she has played, played only seniors and has had the taste of every GS. There is nothing left to prove or learn. If she isn't ready now then she never will be ready.

Kontaveit was well known when she was young (hello chingching ), but she has stalled in 2012.

Yes Vekic has had poor results in juniors and come out of nowhere in late-2011/2012. But she isn't a player like Bouchard who is much older and started being good at only 18, Vekic is still 16 so this is not the same case as you are saying. These girls like Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova aren't suddenly gonna become world beaters

Michelle is a worst case scenario, it doesn't mean Vekic will take the same route as her.

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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 01:50 PM   #69
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Asadinator View Post
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...
Please...you obviously don't have a clue. At the very least try to comprehend what I am saying, and criticise me for that, not for the delusional stuff you have convinced yourself that I said which I have not.

Barty has yet to beat a top 100 player. And in the few instances she has played one she has been outclassed. Mostly very outclassed. Van Uytvanck has played several top 100 players, beaten a number of them and proven she can be competitive at that level already. Barty is yet to do so. Her successful ITF results are almost entirely based on Australian 25ks. Additionally I do not say I don't believe she will be successful. Quite the reverse. I believe she will have a fine career. What I do say is that she is not yet ready to compete at top 100 level right now. And I stand by that.

Take a look at the results of Van Uytvanck and Barty. Maybe it will give you a degree of clarity you are obviously missing right now. If Alison played Ashleigh tomorrow she would kick her ass. That has nothing to do with who will be the better player in the future. That is something that has yet to be decided and neither of us know how either of their careers will pan out. But right now Alison is far more ready to compete at WTA level than is Ashleigh.
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #70
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by jj74 View Post
And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
I remember hearing about that guy when he was like 4/5 years old So did nothing really happen to him? He was coached by Patrick Mouratoglou so I wonder if he's still there. Here's his video from many years ago



I completely forgot about him but as soon as you mentioned his name I knew exactly who you were talking about. It seems he's the male case of Monique Viele...You can't help but feel sorry for these kids

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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:10 PM   #71
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Shvedbarilescu View Post
Please...you obviously don't have a clue. At the very least try to comprehend what I am saying, and criticise me for that, not for the delusional stuff you have convinced yourself that I said which I have not.

Barty has yet to beat a top 100 player. And in the few instances she has played one she has been outclassed. Mostly very outclassed. Van Uytvanck has played several top 100 players, beaten a number of them and proven she can be competitive at that level already. Barty is yet to do so. Her successful ITF results are almost entire based on Australian 25ks. Additionally I do not say I don't believe she will be successful. Quite the reverse. I believe she will have a fine career. What I do say is that she is not yet ready to compete at top 100 level. And I stand by that.

Take a look at the results of Van Uytvanck and Barty. Maybe it will give you a degree of clarity you are obviously missing right now. If Alison played Ashleigh tomorrow she would kick her ass. That has nothing to do with who will be the better player in the future. That is something that has yet to be decided and neither of us know how either of their careers will pan out.
I was never talking about potential, I am saying now and 2013.

I think you might need to take a closer look at results. Beating top 100 players doesn't mean much if you're losing at challengers and futures. For example Van Uytvanck lost to Alize Lim 1 & 1. There are plenty more where that came from but I won't bother.

Beating top 100 players is also about opportunity, so it is a bit of a lottery who has more success with the limited opportunity. ITF results are conclusive though.

Specifically on Barty, she lost because she played bad and was very nervous. I think every match with 30 unforced errors, double faults and tactical mistakes. But if she played an opponent like Van Uytvanck, she would win in 2 easy sets. Same goes for Vekic. It is a no brainer.


This is why I am puzzled with your choice, of course players like Keys, Bouchard and maybe Svitolina make sense, but not the other two because even now there are far more likelier players who will do better.
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:13 PM   #72
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Asadinator View Post
I know that, so like I said those predictions were based on age alone. Otherwise there is no way you can predict those 2 players will perform better next year, I mean they are better now. So random.


You are half right with Barty, she was not ready this year to win at WTA level. But at ITF level this year she has won pretty much everything she has played, played only seniors and has had the taste of every GS. There is nothing left to prove or learn. If she isn't ready now then she never will be ready.

Kontaveit was well known when she was young (hello chingching ), but she has stalled in 2012.

Yes Vekic has had poor results in juniors and come out of nowhere in late-2011/2012. But she isn't a player like Bouchard who is much older and started being good at only 18, Vekic is still 16 so this is not the same case as you are saying. These girls like Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova aren't suddenly gonna become world beaters

Michelle is a worst case scenario, it doesn't mean Vekic will take the same route as her.
I wasn't talking about that. Kontaveitt is doing well for a couple of years, but no so much time ago she was very far from Putintseva, Uberalova, Rohanova, Vickery or Khromacheva. And the same for Vekic, she was always good, but she wasn't at the level of De Vroome, Tsuji, Dean or Korasvilli.
Improvement is what's matter, and it's very easy to see with spanish girls, Torro or Muguruza weren't (by far) one of the top players of their age, and now they are ahead of player who dominated not so much time ago.

And of course Michelle is a worst case sceneario, but we have Vaidisova too. And on the other side of spectrum we have Kvitova who never was a top junior (she played very few tournaments), or even in u14 or u16 and now she is doing better than people her age who seemed more promising when they were younger.

Vekic results are quite weird, she has great results on itfs and very poor results on juniors (very poor for someone who is near top 100). Of course at her age irregularity is pretty normal (well some top players don't know what regularity means either).

When you bet on people to do well next season, the probabilities are in favour of someone who is 18, specially because lately the people rising in wta rankings are not (generally) teenagers.

But of course, people like Vekic or Barty can continue improving and breaking big next year. In fact, it would be fantastic for wta to have a couple of new teenage queens
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:16 PM   #73
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

Vekic
Sasnovich
Min
Keys
Beck
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:37 PM   #74
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

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Originally Posted by Asadinator View Post
I was never talking about potential, I am saying now and 2013.

I think you might need to take a closer look at results. Beating top 100 players doesn't mean much if you're losing at challengers and futures. For example Van Uytvanck lost to Alize Lim 1 & 1. There are plenty more where that came from but I won't bother.

Beating top 100 players is also about opportunity, so it is a bit of a lottery who has more success with the limited opportunity. ITF results are conclusive though.

Specifically on Barty, she lost because she played bad and was very nervous. I think every match with 30 unforced errors, double faults and tactical mistakes. But if she played an opponent like Van Uytvanck, she would win in 2 easy sets. Same goes for Vekic. It is a no brainer.


This is why I am puzzled with your choice, of course players like Keys, Bouchard and maybe Svitolina make sense, but not the other two because even now there are far more likelier players who will do better.
This summer Alison was focused on completing high school, not on her tennis. It was inevitable her results would suffer. I am much more interested in how she has done throughout career when she has had a big opportunity. These have been the times she has played her best. For the record Alison's results against top 100 IS RELEVENT and can not be swept under the carpet. In her short, parttime career, which she has hardly devoted herself fully too most of the time, until the Autumn when she completed her education, she has played 9 top 100 players. She has won 5 of those matches. Go on, aside from Laura Robson, find me another 18 year old or younger player who has had results like that against top 100 players.

If you really think beating a bunch of players ranked in the 200s means more than beating 5 out of 9 top 100 players then I have nothing further to say to you.
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Old Nov 14th, 2012, 02:39 PM   #75
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Re: Your Top 5 Youngsters to Watch in 2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by DevilishAttitude View Post
Here's my similar thread which focuses on teens inside Top 250.

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthrea...947&highlight=

Here are some stats about the players born 1994 and after:

Top 5 in rankings:
#53 Laura Robson
#78 Annika Beck
#109 Donna Vekic
#114 Elina Svitolina
#124 Yulia Putintseva

Best WTA results in 2012:
Laura Robson - F of Guangzhou
Donna Vekic - F of Tashkent
Alison van Uytvanck - QF of Brussels
Eugenie Bouchard - QF of Washington

Best wins on tour in 2012:
Laura Robson - #8 Li Na
Ons Jabeur - #33 Zheng Jie
Daria Gavrilova - #35 Yanina Wickmayer
Alison van Uytvanck - #39 Ksenia Pervak
Carina Witthoeft - #42 Tsvetana Pironkova

Junior winners:
Laura Robson
Elina Svitolina
Daria Gavrilova
An-Sophie Mestach
Ons Jabeur
Ashleigh Barty
Grace Min
Taylor Townsend
Annika Beck
Eugenie Bouchard
Samantha Crawford

Robson leads every category from this generation currently. Highest ranked, best slam result, best victory, most tour wins, first and youngest junior winner etc.
Um, it kind of helps that she's also older than all the girls you mentioned, some of them by several years, given she's born in January 1994. Not trying to take away what she's achieved but you need to put it in perspective. Several of the girls are just as good if not better than her, just younger. Vekic reached a WTA final before Robson despite being two and a half years younger. Not to mention several of those girls have won pretty big events, like Svitolina in Pune last week as well as Beck winning some high level ITFs. Robson broke Top 100 when she was 18y4m, Vekic is 95% certain to break Top 100 by around 16y9m, if not earlier, given she has no points to defend until April 2013 and at #109 is around 50 points outside Top 100. Barty is also ranked way higher than Robson was at the same age.

One record that Robson definitely holds over the other girls you listed is the most wildcards received, although I think everybody knows that one

Last edited by BlueTrees : Nov 14th, 2012 at 02:45 PM.
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