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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 02:29 PM   #4501
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

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Originally Posted by terjw View Post
Same here. I was really up for Caro doing well at the Kremlin Cup and winning it I was so wanting her to win. But I can't get excited about Sofia.

I really don't care whether she plays Sofia or not. The only thing I would want is if she does play there (and I think she will), I would want her to give it her all and really try to win what would be title #21. If she were to turn up at Sofia and give a half hearted performance - that would just leave a little bit of a bad taste in my mouth after her title and play in Moscow.
Aside from the fact that she won,how WAS Caro's play in Moscow?Did she go purely back to being the 'old Caro',or did she serve more powerfully and incorporate a few aggressive elements into her game??
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 02:49 PM   #4502
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Aside from the fact that she won,how WAS Caro's play in Moscow?Did she go purely back to being the 'old Caro',or did she serve more powerfully and incorporate a few aggressive elements into her game??
Well...the serve was rather messy, really few aces and a bad ratio of 1st serve in, but the slow surface probably didn't help...her overall game has been pretty good though, mostly in the first sets she has always been aggressive and her fh seemed more solid than ever this season....she turned too defensive when to lose out and it nearly cost her an early loss to cibulkova abduction then against sofia...today i dunno as i sadly couldn't march
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 02:52 PM   #4503
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

I feel like she is starting to strike the right 'balance.' I really don't want to speak too early but the signs are really promising. I am definitely excited for next season now, really hoping she can keep this up
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 03:06 PM   #4504
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

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Originally Posted by Fantasy Hero View Post
Well...the serve was rather messy, really few aces and a bad ratio of 1st serve in, but the slow surface probably didn't help...her overall game has been pretty good though, mostly in the first sets she has always been aggressive and her fh seemed more solid than ever this season....she turned too defensive when to lose out and it nearly cost her an early loss to cibulkova abduction then against sofia...today i dunno as i sadly couldn't march
Thanks for the update;I never wanted Caro to drastically change her game,but she at least had/has to be able to serve effectively to not be so vulnerable vs. strong ROS'ers,and she must be able to finish off points against quality opponents when they are NOT in error mode...and,as I mentioned previously,I'd like to see her use pace better in counterstriking when she's facing brainless BBs who are on a hot streak

Off-topic: Has anyone seen the entry list for the new 125K in Taiwan the week after this one?The tourney's not listed on the ITF webpage and the official tourney website has the player entry list from 2011.Any news at all on who's gonna be there?...Let's say,the highest seed?I'm just curious to see if the field is gonna be any different from what you'd get at a typical 100k
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 03:11 PM   #4505
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

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Originally Posted by Lachy View Post
I feel like she is starting to strike the right 'balance.' I really don't want to speak too early but the signs are really promising. I am definitely excited for next season now, really hoping she can keep this up
Yep, in terms of gamestyle this was close to ideal from Caroline. I was especially impressed with the improved forehand. The serve still needs some improvement, but every player has something they need to work on all the time.
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 03:20 PM   #4506
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Did any of you think about how similar today's final was to Stosur's SF (until the last half set)?
Ana/Caro plays an excellent first set, breaking 3 for 1 and taking the set 6-2. The second set is even most of the way, neither player managing to pull away until the last two games where Stosur closes it out with a break and a hold. Stosur continues the good rhytm in the early part of set 3, goes up a break and serves at 3-2.
At this point in the match, Ana gave up. You could tell from her body language that she no longer believed she could win. She seemed to get a small injury at this point, but I think she would have lost regardless. Ana almost never shows the necessary mental strength to turn a match around against a high ranked opponent when the tide is against her. Caro used to have that mental strength, then she lost it for a period and now she may have regained it. At least she did today. Instead of giving up, she dug in, evened the match and eventually pulled ahead in the last game.
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 06:55 PM   #4507
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

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I can't get that excited by Sofia. It strikes me as a rather pointless tournament.
Well, it's interesting in the sense that it's a tournament Caro has never played in before. She's so much a 'veteran' at this point, there aren't many tournaments left to try for the first time (for a player at her level). I think the last time Caro played a tournament for the first time was Brussels 1½ years ago.
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 07:07 PM   #4508
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

could finally watch some parts of the match and write my review about her title

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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 09:09 PM   #4509
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

I guess that those of us who were worried about the stopover in Turkey with Rory and thought that maybe she was unprepared for Moscow could not have been more wrong (yes, I was one of those people).
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 10:12 PM   #4510
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce goose View Post
Aside from the fact that she won,how WAS Caro's play in Moscow?Did she go purely back to being the 'old Caro',or did she serve more powerfully and incorporate a few aggressive elements into her game??
OK - how did she play in Moscow? Well you've asked for it but here goes. Much more looking to take the initiative if she could. Controlled aggression.

Serve was never going to be a big factor on this slow surface. Her ROS was really good especially surprising Stosur. I mean Stosur is rated for her kick serve as one of the best and Caro sometimes had to take that really high. But she still got it back really deep and at a pace that sometimes took Sam by surprise. So it was overall how she played and the serve itsel by her or her opponent wasn't an important factor. So don't worry when people say her matches were awful or she was bad because she was always getting broken.

Caro had this forehand down the line today and she was controlling some points and using that to win some of her points. I really loved the way she did that. She did miss the line a few times - once in the 3rd set throwing her racket on the floor in disgust when she'd set the point up so well. But that FDL took Sam by surprise. Just something Sam didn't seem to expect.

The biggest problem for Caro though this tournament in the earlier rounds is how she played when serving for the match or serving very close to the finishing line and up a break. Although serving at the end of 2nd set against Sofia - Sofia played her best tennis then so it's a bit unfair to blame Caro too much there. We had that 44 stroke rally and another one nearly as long soon after which Sofia won with a winner both times. But in the 3rd set against Sofia - the last 3 service games when Caro was up a break - she was bad. And by that I mean UEs as well as being passive. For some reason, she just played and rallied so much worse than when she was serving than when on ROS. Nothing to do with the serve itseld. Just her whole game was bad on those last three 3rd set service games and really good play with controlled aggression on ROS.

Against Sam, she never had to serve for the match. She did have two poor games on her last service game in the 2nd set and her 1st service game in the 3rd set. But then mentally was the stronger player and continued with controlled aggression based on sound play and actually controlling more points than I've come to expect. Also her defence and her movement hadn't gone away either. She was moving as fast as she was when #1.

I have to say that the match today was on a knife edge and could easily have gone either way. Caro had 3BPs against her on her last service game of the match at 5-5. The last one and on a 2nd serve to the backhand court, Sam ran around on to her forehand and hit the ball angled cross court so hard I couldn't see the bounce and I thought she'd got the break. But it was out and Caro went on to hold her serve and then break Sam for the match.

So - I loved the way she was playing. Except when serving for the match or up a brak and near the end of the match. She hung tough and mentally stron against Sam. But that's the first time she's done that for some time. And she didn't have to aerve the match out. She broke to win.
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Old Oct 21st, 2012, 11:08 PM   #4511
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

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Originally Posted by terjw View Post
OK - how did she play in Moscow? Well you've asked for it but here goes.
Very accurate and thoughtful description of her play this week

However, I would add that many of her shots were still lacking in lenght. And she still has troubles in finishing her points. Many of those long rallies were due not only to Caroline's exceptional defense, but also to her inability to end the points with a winner. This is particularly worrying since Stosur and Arvidsson have regularly won those long exchanges. If she can't pass through those players, It will be near impossible against the best defensive players at their best. If she's going to beat the best players again, she'll have to fix it.

I must say that her ROS was indeed particularly impressive against Stosur. That's good to see.
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Old Oct 22nd, 2012, 05:02 AM   #4512
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Quote:
Originally Posted by terjw View Post
OK - how did she play in Moscow? Well you've asked for it but here goes. Much more looking to take the initiative if she could. Controlled aggression.

Serve was never going to be a big factor on this slow surface. Her ROS was really good especially surprising Stosur. I mean Stosur is rated for her kick serve as one of the best and Caro sometimes had to take that really high. But she still got it back really deep and at a pace that sometimes took Sam by surprise. So it was overall how she played and the serve itsel by her or her opponent wasn't an important factor. So don't worry when people say her matches were awful or she was bad because she was always getting broken.

Caro had this forehand down the line today and she was controlling some points and using that to win some of her points. I really loved the way she did that. She did miss the line a few times - once in the 3rd set throwing her racket on the floor in disgust when she'd set the point up so well. But that FDL took Sam by surprise. Just something Sam didn't seem to expect.

The biggest problem for Caro though this tournament in the earlier rounds is how she played when serving for the match or serving very close to the finishing line and up a break. Although serving at the end of 2nd set against Sofia - Sofia played her best tennis then so it's a bit unfair to blame Caro too much there. We had that 44 stroke rally and another one nearly as long soon after which Sofia won with a winner both times. But in the 3rd set against Sofia - the last 3 service games when Caro was up a break - she was bad. And by that I mean UEs as well as being passive. For some reason, she just played and rallied so much worse than when she was serving than when on ROS. Nothing to do with the serve itseld. Just her whole game was bad on those last three 3rd set service games and really good play with controlled aggression on ROS.

Against Sam, she never had to serve for the match. She did have two poor games on her last service game in the 2nd set and her 1st service game in the 3rd set. But then mentally was the stronger player and continued with controlled aggression based on sound play and actually controlling more points than I've come to expect. Also her defence and her movement hadn't gone away either. She was moving as fast as she was when #1.

I have to say that the match today was on a knife edge and could easily have gone either way. Caro had 3BPs against her on her last service game of the match at 5-5. The last one and on a 2nd serve to the backhand court, Sam ran around on to her forehand and hit the ball angled cross court so hard I couldn't see the bounce and I thought she'd got the break. But it was out and Caro went on to hold her serve and then break Sam for the match.

So - I loved the way she was playing. Except when serving for the match or up a brak and near the end of the match. She hung tough and mentally stron against Sam. But that's the first time she's done that for some time. And she didn't have to aerve the match out. She broke to win.
Thank you for your detailed comments.If I can't watch Caro's match,then live scoring threads just don't appeal to me,so such a thorough,forensic breakdown is appreciated
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Old Oct 22nd, 2012, 05:15 AM   #4513
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Many people seem to think this very slow HC is tailor-made for Caro - because it makes her defense easier - but after her SF she said that the surface suited SA's game better than her own. I think what Caro means is, that the surface seemed to slow down top spin shots (Caro's) more than flat shots (SA's). For instance Ivanovic could still hit winners fairly easy with her hard, flat shots. Even Stosur with her powerful, heavy top-spin FH was relatively effective. But if Caro hit her normal FH - medium pace, medium top-spin - the ball seemed to lose almost all its speed when it hit the surface. It practually FORCED Caro to flatten out her shots if she wanted to hit winners, so in that sense it was a good surface for her.
I'm interested in seeing how Caro's game works in Sofia, where I expect a more normal surface. Will she still flatten out her FH? Will her serve be more effective? Etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by terjw View Post
OK - how did she play in Moscow? Well you've asked for it but here goes. Much more looking to take the initiative if she could. Controlled aggression.

Serve was never going to be a big factor on this slow surface. Her ROS was really good especially surprising Stosur. I mean Stosur is rated for her kick serve as one of the best and Caro sometimes had to take that really high. But she still got it back really deep and at a pace that sometimes took Sam by surprise. So it was overall how she played and the serve itsel by her or her opponent wasn't an important factor. So don't worry when people say her matches were awful or she was bad because she was always getting broken.

Caro had this forehand down the line today and she was controlling some points and using that to win some of her points. I really loved the way she did that. She did miss the line a few times - once in the 3rd set throwing her racket on the floor in disgust when she'd set the point up so well. But that FDL took Sam by surprise. Just something Sam didn't seem to expect.

The biggest problem for Caro though this tournament in the earlier rounds is how she played when serving for the match or serving very close to the finishing line and up a break. Although serving at the end of 2nd set against Sofia - Sofia played her best tennis then so it's a bit unfair to blame Caro too much there. We had that 44 stroke rally and another one nearly as long soon after which Sofia won with a winner both times. But in the 3rd set against Sofia - the last 3 service games when Caro was up a break - she was bad. And by that I mean UEs as well as being passive. For some reason, she just played and rallied so much worse than when she was serving than when on ROS. Nothing to do with the serve itseld. Just her whole game was bad on those last three 3rd set service games and really good play with controlled aggression on ROS.

Against Sam, she never had to serve for the match. She did have two poor games on her last service game in the 2nd set and her 1st service game in the 3rd set. But then mentally was the stronger player and continued with controlled aggression based on sound play and actually controlling more points than I've come to expect. Also her defence and her movement hadn't gone away either. She was moving as fast as she was when #1.

I have to say that the match today was on a knife edge and could easily have gone either way. Caro had 3BPs against her on her last service game of the match at 5-5. The last one and on a 2nd serve to the backhand court, Sam ran around on to her forehand and hit the ball angled cross court so hard I couldn't see the bounce and I thought she'd got the break. But it was out and Caro went on to hold her serve and then break Sam for the match.

So - I loved the way she was playing. Except when serving for the match or up a brak and near the end of the match. She hung tough and mentally strong against Sam. But that's the first time she's done that for some time. And she didn't have to aerve the match out. She broke to win.
You remember slightly wrong: it was at 4-4 Caro faced BPs, at 5-5 she held to love.
Good description of her play, otherwise.
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Old Oct 22nd, 2012, 09:23 AM   #4514
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

Quote:
Originally Posted by C. W. Fields View Post
Many people seem to think this very slow HC is tailor-made for Caro - because it makes her defense easier - but after her SF she said that the surface suited SA's game better than her own. I think what Caro means is, that the surface seemed to slow down top spin shots (Caro's) more than flat shots (SA's). For instance Ivanovic could still hit winners fairly easy with her hard, flat shots. Even Stosur with her powerful, heavy top-spin FH was relatively effective. But if Caro hit her normal FH - medium pace, medium top-spin - the ball seemed to lose almost all its speed when it hit the surface. It practually FORCED Caro to flatten out her shots if she wanted to hit winners, so in that sense it was a good surface for her.
I'm interested in seeing how Caro's game works in Sofia, where I expect a more normal surface. Will she still flatten out her FH? Will her serve be more effective? Etc.


You remember slightly wrong: it was at 4-4 Caro faced BPs, at 5-5 she held to love.
Good description of her play, otherwise.
Caro was going for her shots more than usual in New haven for instance and that's a lot faster than Moscow.

I think Caro was having problems with her serve in the past couple of tournaments but this surface exacerbated them.

I was thinking at the time that if Caro held for 5-4 3rd set after saving those break points that she'd break for the match in the next game as she'd gain in confidence and Stosur would be a bit deflated.
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Old Oct 22nd, 2012, 09:38 AM   #4515
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Re: Danish Delight - Caroline Wozniacki thread - vol 5

It seems Zheng Jie will be in the Sofia field. I hope Caro gets the chance to play her, it's about time she straightened out that 1-3 H2H.
http://www.tennisforum.com/showthrea...4#post22358324
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