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Old Feb 1st, 2012, 10:16 PM   #1891
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

?? ... *scratching head* ... Sorry, but I don't get that.

Just kidding, nothing much.

Hey Bia, if you are in the media, 'selective amnesia' is a required quality. Remember that you cannot generate a story or hype about the present if you don't have amnesia to to the past. So don't blame them and it serves their purposes as they always have only once side of the story as Steffi has the decency of not talking and involving other people in unnecessary controversies.
Yeah, you are right, she visited the hospital the next day morning and not two days after as the book mentions. Also hate to put it here (but can't resist), she had selective amnesia about her old, billionaire boy friends (Paul Allen and Tom Golisano) and the press obliged to ignore it as well.
Again, have lots of empathy for what Seles had to go through and wouldn't expect anyone to go through that but you don't have to show other people in a negative light and distort facts to gain sympathy which she already had from the public and the media (just have to read how many media outlets focussed on 'Steffi visited but acted like nothing happened story' and Monica mentioning the same in multiple interviews as well).
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Old Feb 2nd, 2012, 01:55 AM   #1892
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

By the way, just to make sure that I am not making any baseless accusations or changing the facts, here is Monica Seles talking on ESPN Classic about Steffi Graf (hate that program by the way as it concentrates on Steffi's off court struggles than on court achievements and it is supposed to be a tribute for her on court achievements) and you can watch Monica Seles talking around 3:50 mark, talking about the hospital visit and mentions 'on camera' of how it was emotional for both of them and they both just cried...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGVF4IchDs0

Here is a NY Times article from 1993 talking about the voting and how 17 of the top 25 players voted and Seles family was mad at WTA director and not the players as the family beleived the players were given wrong information about her state. The book has a different tone to the whole episode.

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/05/30/sp...on.html?src=pm
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Old Feb 2nd, 2012, 08:47 AM   #1893
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by bia View Post
she also said that Steffi went to visit her in hospital on sunday and that she told her she was in a hurry because she had to play the final.
Seles was attacked on Friday, April 30. Graf went to visit her in the hospital on Saturday, May 1. The May 2 newspapers reported Graf's visit.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...hospital&hl=en

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...hospital&hl=en

Seles seems to be a drama queen who's fond of revisionist history and will say whatever she thinks will help sell her books. Wasn't she quoted as saying during the promotion of her last book that Graf stayed with her for only a couple of minutes in the hospital before rushing off to play her semi-final? In spite of all her claims about having moved on, Seles still appears to be bitter about what happened and I get the feeling that she continues to resent Graf. So much for the years of therapy she had!
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Old Feb 2nd, 2012, 06:53 PM   #1894
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

Well, I'm not the one who's gonna criticize Monica for not having gotten over such a terrible thing that destroyed her first and incredible career, I'd rather be sad as a human being myself if she is still is bitter about it, even after all these years and the amount of therapy. But I also think that doesn't entitle you to be untruthful about such a delicate issue which involves a public person's reputation around a whole world, if that's the case here.
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Old Feb 2nd, 2012, 07:27 PM   #1895
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by gabybackhand View Post
Well, I'm not the one who's gonna criticize Monica for not having gotten over such a terrible thing that destroyed her first and incredible career, I'd rather be sad as a human being myself if she is still is bitter about it, even after all these years and the amount of therapy. But I also think that doesn't entitle you to be untruthful about such a delicate issue which involves a public person's reputation around a whole world, if that's the case here.
Huge +1.
I won't ever criticize Seles for not getting over it, whatever the way, even if "she may have lie a little bit", whatever, that's her way to go through it, so.
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Old Feb 2nd, 2012, 09:04 PM   #1896
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by djul14 View Post
Huge +1.
I won't ever criticize Seles for not getting over it, whatever the way, even if "she may have lie a little bit", whatever, that's her way to go through it, so.
Agree with not criticizing Seles for not getting over it but disagree about 'even if she may have to lie a little bit' part.
What Seles had to go through is tough and difficult to explain especially when you are a 19 yr old and at the top of the world. Also, can completely understand the hard feelings she has about the incident even to date and indirectly towards Steffi as well. But you don't have to change the facts about the incident or lie to get your point across especially when it involves another person who is as unfortunate as you to be in that position in the first place. Neither Seles nor Graf deserved what they got on that fateful day in Hamburg. In the long run, I consider them both to be victims in a strange way that no one ever wants to be in their shoes, period.

Do we really have to lie to get over something esp when the lie might have repercusions on someone else????? Does that really mean 'getting over' in the first place?? Why lie when you don't even need to do that ?? The book would have been received with more respect if it stayed true to the facts.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 08:19 AM   #1897
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by Seleção82 View Post
Oki, I just wrote to them by the contact form on steffi-graf.net. Let's see what they will say about it.

Thanks again Bia!

And for me it's bedtime now. Good night!
Steffi's site is showing up as being in 'maintainance mode'. Hopefully, the admin will be able to fix the issue permanently. Looks like your message reached the intended people.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 04:50 PM   #1898
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by Stef-fan View Post
Agree with not criticizing Seles for not getting over it but disagree about 'even if she may have to lie a little bit' part.
What Seles had to go through is tough and difficult to explain especially when you are a 19 yr old and at the top of the world. Also, can completely understand the hard feelings she has about the incident even to date and indirectly towards Steffi as well. But you don't have to change the facts about the incident or lie to get your point across especially when it involves another person who is as unfortunate as you to be in that position in the first place. Neither Seles nor Graf deserved what they got on that fateful day in Hamburg. In the long run, I consider them both to be victims in a strange way that no one ever wants to be in their shoes, period.

Do we really have to lie to get over something esp when the lie might have repercusions on someone else????? Does that really mean 'getting over' in the first place?? Why lie when you don't even need to do that ?? The book would have been received with more respect if it stayed true to the facts.
Yes but what I am meaning here is if "she changes the reality", there is a reason, she doesn't do it for fun, you know what I mean (I hope you know lol)? She "needs" it in a way.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 05:16 PM   #1899
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by djul14 View Post
Yes but what I am meaning here is if "she changes the reality", there is a reason, she doesn't do it for fun, you know what I mean (I hope you know lol)? She "needs" it in a way.
Yeah, may be she 'needs' it to get over but did not expect that from Seles. May be, I was wrong in having high expectations on her.
Its one thing to change it in the book, I get it, may be she 'needs' it but once you say the same thing in almost every interview out there in promoting the book and everyone blindly accepts it as truth as no one wants to confront Seles as she is trying to get over it, that I have a problem with.
By the way, just mentioned o two issues here that are related to Steffi directly, there are lot more issues in the book that are different from the reality, just did not want to discuss it here as this is Steffi's thread and not Monica's and nor is it the thread discussing her book.
Strongly beleive that to get over something, you need to accept the truth which is the most difficult part of moving forward, everything else works out well once that initial hurdle has been met and I always respected Seles and did not think that after so many years, she is still at the initial stages of moving on, still having trouble to see that she was not the only one who did not have control on events that happened that day or after that.
Sorry, if I am boring you all with prolonging this discussion, promise to stop the discussion here and not talk any further.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 06:58 PM   #1900
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by Stef-fan View Post
Just reading day 2 chat on AO at Tennis.com, Peter Bodo was asked to name the three greatest tennis players of all time and his response:
Rod Laver, Steffi Graf and Roger Federer.
Wow, nice to see Steffi included in that list of 3 people (both men and women). I think it was Peter Bodo who wrote an article entitled 'Amazing Graf' back in early 1996, talking about her stellar 1995 and saying she was player of the year and was on track to be the greatest female tennis player.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 07:02 PM   #1901
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by alfajeffster View Post
You know, I was watching the Wozniaki / Mattek-Sands match the other day from the Hopman Cup- and (objectively) I can't help but say that Steffi would take either one of them to the cleaners- especially Caroline. How this girl made it to the top with a forehand like that just shows how poor the quality of play has become. Here it is 12 years later, and I still miss watching the consummate professional play- incredible.
I take it this means that you do not agree with Jon Wertheim (from CNN SI) that you can make a case that Wozniacki could be at Hingis' level? I think he wrote once before that if is was Wozniacki who was playing in 1997 instead of Hingis, Wozniacki could've duplicated Martina's 3-slam year.

(Is Caroline's forehand really that bad? I thought it was decent, and in the few AO matches of hers that I saw, she did get her forehand back deep and with a lot of topspin quite a lot.)
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 07:03 PM   #1902
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

I have to say that I totally agree with Stef-fan about Seles. I actually think that there are many others controversial aspects about her behaviour, but this is not the place to discuss it. I respect her, anyway.
Bytheway, Steffi's site has finally been fixed.
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 07:37 PM   #1903
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by Stef-fan View Post
Strongly beleive that to get over something, you need to accept the truth which is the most difficult part of moving forward, everything else works out well once that initial hurdle has been met and I always respected Seles and did not think that after so many years, she is still at the initial stages of moving on, still having trouble to see that she was not the only one who did not have control on events that happened that day or after that.
Sorry, if I am boring you all with prolonging this discussion, promise to stop the discussion here and not talk any further.
Totally agree, that's what I think too and what I thought by saying she needs it, = for the moment, as perhaps she is not ready for the truth.
And you're not boring
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 07:37 PM   #1904
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by XTN View Post
I take it this means that you do not agree with Jon Wertheim (from CNN SI) that you can make a case that Wozniacki could be at Hingis' level? I think he wrote once before that if is was Wozniacki who was playing in 1997 instead of Hingis, Wozniacki could've duplicated Martina's 3-slam year.

(Is Caroline's forehand really that bad? I thought it was decent, and in the few AO matches of hers that I saw, she did get her forehand back deep and with a lot of topspin quite a lot.)
Firstly, Hingis would (and probably still could with a little training) dismantle Wozniaki. Caroline has an extreme grip on her forehand, and the production is decidedly long and unsteady / unpredictable. That's why she usually hits it with loopy spin with depth to protect against the possibility of an error. Billie Jean once said "the first thing that breaks down under pressure is bad technique". She was right on point, even though speaking about Jana Novotna's forehand at the time. Caroline has great anticipation, but still not as great as Hingis was (IMO).
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Old Feb 3rd, 2012, 07:52 PM   #1905
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Re: Steffi Graf Admiration Thread Vol 2

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Originally Posted by bia View Post
Bytheway, Steffi's site has finally been fixed.
Indeed it looks like it now. If I'm not totally mistaken the reason was a certain iframe-scriptcode which they simply removed totally now. Due to this iframe-script the site was flagged as dangerous not only by Google, furthermore also by some other anti-malware programmes like bit-defender, f-prot, and sophos (for instance). But that seems to be resolved now.
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