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Pentathlon - General discussion thread

4K views 32 replies 8 participants last post by  Chiquitita. 
#1 ·
We can discuss if you have any idea, question, etc.
 
#2 ·
Should we go back to discarding on team part?

1. We should go back to discarding and finally the same team members' point count for all disciplines. (If captains are serious then it is a bloody hard task TBH)
2. All five members points count. (if one stop sending it kills the whole team)
3. The current best 3 count automaticly is fine.
4. Lets have 4 members per team. All counts, if one does not send that is their problem.
5. In addition to the current format, I can create a FEDCUP like team competition. Player 1 of team A and B plays each other, same for player 2s, 3s, 4s 5s. (unfortunately number of teams should be even)
 
#3 ·
My thoughts:

Why not use the discarding option, but do it automatically, without the captains. On discarding days, the team member with the lowest points, should be automatically discarded. If there is a tie, you can always discard the player who is ranked lower.
If there are less members in a team, than they don't discard at all if 3 members,or only once if 4 members..( should be minimum of three players per team).
 
#6 ·
Ranking points chart:

Code:
1	280	470	900	1000	2000
2	200	320	620	700	1400
3	160	250	500	560	1120
4	130	200	395	450	900
5	115	180	345	400	800
6	100	160	305	350	700
7	85	140	265	300	600
8	70	120	225	250	500
9	65	112	212	236	472
10	60	104	199	222	444
11	55	96	186	208	416
12	50	88	173	194	388
13	45	81	161	180	360
14	40	74	149	166	332
15	35	67	137	153	306
16	30	60	125	140	280
17	29	58	122	136	272
18	28	56	119	132	264
19	27	54	116	128	256
20	26	52	113	124	248
21	25	50	110	120	240
22	24	48	107	116	232
23	23	46	104	112	224
24	22	44	101	108	216
25	21	42	98	104	208
26	20	40	95	100	200
27	19	38	92	96	192
28	18	36	89	92	184
29	17	34	86	88	176
30	16	32	83	84	168
31	15	30	80	80	160
32	14	28	77	77	154
In case of tie average points given.
 
#7 ·
It is very easy to take part of the game. Depending on your timeframe you have to follow the following steps. If you have only a minute only then do step 1, if you have more go forward to following steps.

Tipping players:

Step 1 – Simply copy your tipping picks and PM to the manager. You take part of the game immediately. That is a 20 seconds extra exercise.
Step 2 – Attach set rates to the winners (20 or 21). 2-0 is automatically assigned, so if 2-0 is good for you then you can jump to the next step.
Step 3 – Move the most possible winners up in the queue, ambiguous matches down. (So Azarenka should be up, Yakimova down)
Step 4 – After a few try send a different set of picks for WAR. (30% of the experienced players do it so don’t bother at the beginning)

TT players:

Step 1 – PM your picks to the manager. You take part of the game immediately. That is a 20 seconds extra exercise.
Step 2 - Move the most possible winners up in the queue, ambiguous matches down. (So Azarenka should be up, Yakimova down) Manager will reverse the order your TT pick if you ask for it.
Step 3 – After a few try send a different set of picks for WAR. (30% of the experienced players do it so don’t bother at the beginning)
 
#8 ·
Scoring example


Code:
Order of Play	                 Results	SR 	                   Player  Pick
Dubois vs Vesnina	         Vesnina	20	                   Hlavackova 2-0
Date-Krumm vs Hercog	         Hercog	        20	                   Medina-Garrigues 2-0
McHale vs Wozniak	         Wozniak	21	                   Scheepers 2-0
Hampton vs Stephens	         Hampton	20	                   Zahlavova-Strycova 2-0
Dokic vs Voskoboeva	         Voskoboeva     NSR	                   Vesnina 2-1
Scheepers vs Ormaechea	         Ormaechea      21	                   Hercog 2-0
Oudin vs Medina	                 Medina	        21	                   McHale 2-1
Falconi vs Hlavackova	         Hlavackova     20	                   Stephens 2-1
Govortsova vs K.Bondarenko	 K.Bondarenko	21	                   Voskoboeva 2-0
Daniilidou vs Kudryavtseva	 Daniilidou	20	                   K.Bondarenko 2-0
Zahlavova vs Giorgi	         Zahlavova	20	                   Daniilidou 2-1
Voegele vs Gajdosova	         Voegele	21	                   Gajdosova 2-1
U.Radwanska vs Hradecka	         Hradecka	20	                   Hradecka 2-0
Dushevina vs Chan	         Dushevina	20	                   Dushevina 2-1
Minella vs Lucic	         Lucic	        20	                   Lucic 2-0
Rodionova vs Czink	         Rodionova	21	                   Rodionova 2-1


TC You had 6 correct picks with correct SR (Hlavackova20, Zahlavova20, Hradecka 20, Hercog 20, Lucic 20, Rodionova 21) 3 points each.
You had 6 correct picks with incorrect SR (Voskoboeva, Medina, Vesnina, Daniilidou, Dushevina, Bondarenko ) 2 points each.
You had 4 incorrect picks , no points.

6*3 + 6*2 = 30



WAR

Code:
Hlavackova2-0	5   (5 picked Falconi)
Medina-G  2-0	3   (3 picked Oudin)
Scheepers 2-0	0   (wrong pick)
Zahlavova 2-0	2   (2 picked Giorgi)
Vesnina 2-1	3   (3 picked Dubois)
Hercog 2-0	6   (6 picked Date)
McHale 2-1	0   (wrong pick)
Stephens 2-1	0
Voskoboeva 2-0	0
KBondarenko 2-0	4
Daniilidou 2-1	3
Gajdosova 2-1	0
Hradecka 2-0	10
Dushevina 2-1	1
Lucic 2-0	11
Rodionova 2-1	12


SEQ

Code:
Hlavackova2-0	correct pick
Medina-G  2-0	correct pick
Scheepers 2-0	wrong pick , after your first wrong pick the rest does not matter, you have 12*12 points


PRO

Code:
Hlavackova 2-0                correct pick correct SR  16*2 points
Medina-Garrigues 2-0          correct pick incorrect SR 15*1 points
Scheepers 2-0                 incorrect pick 14*0    points
Zahlavova-Strycova 2-0        correct pick correct SR  13*2 points
Vesnina 2-1                   correct pick incorrect SR 12*1 points
Hercog 2-0                    correct pick correct SR  11*2 points
McHale 2-1                    incorrect pick 10*0 points
Stephens 2-1                  incorrect pick 9*0 points
Voskoboeva 2-0                (etc)
K.Bondarenko 2-0
Daniilidou 2-1
Gajdosova 2-1
Hradecka 2-0
Dushevina 2-1
Lucic 2-0
Rodionova 2-1

FO

You got 40 points for each correct pick on R1 matches ( and you will get 60 on R2). 12 correct picks 480 points.
 
#10 ·
I am not for or against any team format. Just my thoughts:

-Discarding would be better if we had full (5player) teams AND captains had taken it seriously. It was fully autodiscard at the end.
-In both format you fight for your team and individual too. The difference is that in discarding you rather fight against your team members too (to avoid discarding) while in FC format you fight against 1 person of the opposite team.
-I guess FC format is easier to understand for a rookie.
 
#11 ·
Too bad we do not have more teams then it would be more fun (I do not understand why people do not want to play)

How would be to play in the league format. If we have 16 regular players and everyone with everyone plays one match (15 tournaments). For every win you get 3 points and for tie 1. Whoever is first on the list at the end of the season (after 15 tournaments) will win the title.

When we have two (or three) tournaments in a week we can pick matches for both tournaments.

In 2013 we would have 30 tournaments (without a Grand Slam) and that would be two seasons. At Grand Slams we can play in teams (in this or the previous format).

New players can play in second division. At the end of the season first 4 from second division go to first and last 4 from first division go to second.

If we somehow manage to organize this format of the game it might be interesting.

Bad side is that some of the players maybe will not be able to play tournaments every week.
 
#14 ·
How about we have a set number (say 15 %) byes per round? A player on holiday could then say in advance whether he would not play, and he would not be added to the fixture list.

The league format could also be part of the team game - and the two best teams could play a final at the YEC.

Mind, I kinda like the idea of one winner - or at least one team winner - per tournament.
 
#15 ·
Just to check if I understand. Lets assume Group A with 8 person

W1 - Brisbane - League match 1
W2 - Sydney - League match 2
W5 - Paris - League match 3
W7 - Doha - League match 4
W8 - Dubai - League match 5
W9 - SA MMs - League match 6
W10 - IW - League match 7
W12 - Miami - "Rain day" for postponed matches

All plays against all others. At the end of the league 1-2 player relegated to Group B. But for all above tourneys everybody plays and we still keep the current structure too, to have tourney winners. Is that what you (more or less) thinking about?

(I can imagine this for singles, but I cannot see how it works for teams. It is relatively hard for a new team to join.)
 
#16 ·
With 8 players, I'm thinking 1 bye per round (which becomes 2 because it's impossible to pair off 7 people). So there would be 3 matches each round and 2 players sitting out. To make room for all 28 matches required, we would therefore need 10 weeks to play a league with 8 teams.

We might have 2 league rounds during Grand Slams and other 2-week tournaments, as well.

I can see that the new teams would cause a problem...so maybe we should just have a league during each tournament? 1st and 2nd day is 1st match, 3rd and 4th day is 2nd match, QFs, SFs and F is the final match?
 
#17 ·
Watching some WAR picks, I see some just reverse his whole picks (without thinking of it at all)
I am thinking of limiting the WAR changes to lets say 33% of the number of matches (or 1 if less then 3 matches). Then you should really think where to change.

Opinions?
 
#19 ·
As long as more people realise the correct tactics for WAR, that should even itself out. At some point it will be impossible to gain points from it.
 
#25 ·
I don't have patience or knowledge to type this much as Laszlo did :lol: but I don't want to miss Penta . So please make it happening in any format :)

Sent from my WT19i using VerticalSports.Com App
 
#26 ·
Hm. I think the game should not include games which already exist.
I like the fact that there are 5 disciplines, especially war and sequence are very nice.

IMO the game makes only sense with OOP of at least 5-7 matches,
so the ITF last week was not good to play this game and small tournament aren't in general.
Because there are not so many players, I think it's enough to play the biggest tournaments. Grand Slams, Premier 5 and Premier mandatory. A few premier as well. And YEC and Sofia. It's enough.

IMO no team league or something, only singles.
The ranking then are interesting.
It does not make sense to play a team competition when everybody just picks his own picks.
 
#31 ·
Up, sorry I didn't respond earlier.

I still think the Fed Cup format is the most fun team format, you get to play head-to-head with someone, and the current team league is pretty much decided by Wednesday/Thursday.

I'm still a bit confused about how the league would work? Would it be head-to-head over several weeks, or would it be one in one tournament? The first might be hard to recruit people to (3-4 months until they could even play in division I).

Personally, I think it's best to have one individual winner and one team winner each tournament. Easiest and simplest to work out. So if that's the goal, what would be the best way of getting there? (Not quite sure myself)
 
#32 ·
The way I see it now is the following:
-There will be one individual winner each tournament. So it is not going to change.
-Team competion will be FEDCUP like, but still one winner per week. Depending the number of teams the format will either be daily elimination or daily round robin.
-I would like to change the number of team members to 4. So teams might change a bit :D
-In addition (if there is a need) I set up (an) individual league(s) 8 players each (1st 2nd 3rd division later). It is a 10 week excercise, where you can skip a week or two, with weekly face to face matches.

I open Brisbane soon and ask for the new teams and whether you want to take part of the league.
 
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