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alfajeffster Feb 11th, 2004 04:06 PM

Words of Wisdom from Margaret Court
 
No, not religious pontification, just tennis:

“There’s very little subtlety or variety,” she says of today’s tennis. “The beauty and grace has gone out of the game. (And) when you take both depth and variety out of the game, you take the excitement out.”

taken from the chrisevert.net web site, of all places.

louloubelle Feb 13th, 2004 06:28 AM

Thanx Alf and with this Im sure Rev Mags also means that the individulaity of players has reduced too! The styles of everyone are very similar theses days.

Santorofan Feb 13th, 2004 07:33 AM

Nice quote, thanks for sharing....Wonder how much that has to do with everyone clubbing two-fisted backhands (and sometimes forehands) as well as advanced racket technology? Justine, Amelie, Loit and a handful of others use significant variety in their tactics, but with the advent of Graf, Seles and the Williams sisters especially, the emphasis seems to've steered towards over-powering your opponent to a much greater degree. So just as with Roddick and some of the other current male players, it does become treadmill to watch after awhile...except of course, with Fabrice Santoro ;)

alfajeffster Feb 13th, 2004 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Santorofan
Nice quote, thanks for sharing....Wonder how much that has to do with everyone clubbing two-fisted backhands (and sometimes forehands) as well as advanced racket technology? Justine, Amelie, Loit and a handful of others use significant variety in their tactics, but with the advent of Graf, Seles and the Williams sisters especially, the emphasis seems to've steered towards over-powering your opponent to a much greater degree. So just as with Roddick and some of the other current male players, it does become treadmill to watch after awhile...except of course, with Fabrice Santoro ;)

I have to admit, I can't stand Fabrice Santoro's style of play (human backboard- anathema to a serve-and-volleyer's mindset), but those buns of his are a work of art!:lol:

daze11 Feb 13th, 2004 02:04 PM

I can't believe you just said that! This isn't the homo-thread. But...right?! Roddick, who may be the most mentally-challenged man to ever reach the top 20, has quite an insider's rep for having a super-big game, everywhere, if you know what I mean. Mary Carillo & Mac were talking, saying, "Yep, its ALL big with roddick" - Mac laughs self-consciously like they've been talking about the locker-room chat, and says, "The biggest" and Mary grimaces, but tries to hide it also.

I dont think Court had great buns. But anyway, her quote is "spot-on" as they say in Australia. And its not just the one-speed/one-style issue (which is being forced into play by the sheer force the game has taken on), but I think--oddly, this was in the context of containing "racquet size" (kudos to mr. rod-dick!) and having the ITP limit size and weight of racquets so that the racquets dont do all the work for the players.

It's important for the aesthetics and mental challenges of tennis, but its important for the players health and body. The game used to be GOOD for everybody's body: fluid, yoga-like motions, extending both arms and controlled breathing. Now everyone has injuries, which hurts the players, obviously, but hurts the rivalries, hurts the mood of the sport. Even boxing doesn't have these kind of injuries. How will we have great champions if they can only play every other year?

Everyone hates wood, so i won't prattle, but the resistence is stupid. EVERY shot FEELS good when you hit with wood, because you dont WHIP forehands with your body or the ball goes out. You step back, opening your arms, lean in, and follow through...which sounds the same, but its not because there is a pacing differnece and you hit the ball very squarely. Even your approach shot changes with wood; you have to keep yourself lower and stay on top of the balls (ops!) for a longer (more enjoyable) focused period, even if the difference in reality is only a few extra seconds.

So Maggie doesn't have the buns but she had the brains. God giveth & taketh away. haha...

alfajeffster Feb 13th, 2004 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daze11
I can't believe you just said that! This isn't the homo-thread. But...right?! Roddick, who may be the most mentally-challenged man to ever reach the top 20, has quite an insider's rep for having a super-big game, everywhere, if you know what I mean. Mary Carillo & Mac were talking, saying, "Yep, its ALL big with roddick" - Mac laughs self-consciously like they've been talking about the locker-room chat, and says, "The biggest" and Mary grimaces, but tries to hide it also.

I dont think Court had great buns. But anyway, her quote is "spot-on" as they say in Australia. And its not just the one-speed/one-style issue (which is being forced into play by the sheer force the game has taken on), but I think--oddly, this was in the context of containing "racquet size" (kudos to mr. rod-dick!) and having the ITP limit size and weight of racquets so that the racquets dont do all the work for the players.

It's important for the aesthetics and mental challenges of tennis, but its important for the players health and body. The game used to be GOOD for everybody's body: fluid, yoga-like motions, extending both arms and controlled breathing. Now everyone has injuries, which hurts the players, obviously, but hurts the rivalries, hurts the mood of the sport. Even boxing doesn't have these kind of injuries. How will we have great champions if they only can play every other year?

Everyone hates wood, so i won't prattle, but its tupid. EVERY shot FEELS good when you hit with wood, because you dont WHIP forehands with your body or the ball goes out. You step back, opening your arms, lean in, and follow through...which sounds the same, but its not because there is a pacing differnece and you hit the ball very squarely. Even your approach shot changes with wood; you have to keep yourself lower and stay on top of the balls (ops!) for a longer (more enjoyable) focused period, even if the difference in reality is only a few extra seconds.

So Maggie doesn't have the buns but she had the brains. God giveth & taketh away. haha...

I agree with you whole-heartedly, only I'm not so much a stickler for returning to wood racquets- simply limiting the size and weight of the racquet, as you say, to standard proportions. I don't really care if it's made of carbon or whatever. So how did we go from Margaret Court's quote to all this fixation on wood? Okay, I'll admit it- put a bag over Andy's head, and I'm on it!:lol:

daze11 Feb 13th, 2004 02:59 PM

his head is only bad because there's so much dumb in his eyes, but i'd have to be dead to not admit those lips are...damn, i really dont want to give him ANY credit. ok, the whole mouth of his COMMANDS me to accept he's got 'somethin' goin' on' so...i wouldn't put that bag over the whole head, so to speak.

ANYWAY...as i said, NO ONE believes in going back to wood (except borg and mcenroe...and ME) and chrissie, MARTINA (!), and court ALL agree the technology has made the game too easy and too one-dimensional, and believe racquets should be limited in some way by the ITF. The idea is for locals to play with whatever they want, but if you're a top 100 player on this planet, you sure better be able to handle wood, so to speak, and not need training wheels to make great shots and feel good about your play. Whether its wood or a limited graphite etc., whatever keeps the game 'honest' is good. I dont think Court was at all concerned with amateurs...but she has a good nose for 'greatness' and champions, and thinks they should rise to the test. I really agree with her.

We dont have a Mac/Borg-like rivalry...because we would need TWO Federer's to get one! But i went to the us open this year and i can promise you, being a new yorker, everyone who talked about the open on the streets, in the subways, in offices...they remarked about the 91 jimmy connors/krickstein match that was shown during a rain delay, and how exciting it was...that they'd "NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT!" It was the MOST DISCUSSED match of the tournament, and it was 15 years old. So? It was a very good match, but it was an old Connors and silly aaron Krickstein. There are much better match-ups than that, but what they saw was at least closer to the way tennis used to be played, and its a lot more exciting than the "wam-bam-thank-you-ma'am" style of today.

Andy T Feb 13th, 2004 04:18 PM

I'll sign up to your campaign to establish once and for all some ground rules and regulations about racquets and balls, gentlemen. It's time tennis ensured that it is not in the process of destroying itself as a spectator sport and ruining the health of its stars by making them go all out for power and play far too much on hard courts.

As for Roddick, he's too much of a boy and not enough of a man for me ( then again , I haven't seen all). You guys can have Roddick if I get Moya, Safin, Kiefer and Blake (all to myself and at once).

alfajeffster Feb 13th, 2004 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy T
I'll sign up to your campaign to establish once and for all some ground rules and regulations about racquets and balls, gentlemen. It's time tennis ensured that it is not in the process of destroying itself as a spectator sport and ruining the health of its stars by making them go all out for power and play far too much on hard courts.

As for Roddick, he's too much of a boy and not enough of a man for me ( then again , I haven't seen all). You guys can have Roddick if I get Moya, Safin, Kiefer and Blake (all to myself and at once).

Hey, I'd take sloppy seconds on that group, Andy! Here's wishing you a large lunch today, my friend!

daze11 Feb 13th, 2004 04:31 PM

whoa! well, together i'm sure those 4 gents can match the size of roddick. haha...no, you're right, he's a big bore...but also a BIG BOAR. love him, hate him, love him, hate him...

uh...what about GUGA circa 1997 etc?? Is that just not the hottest?? he just needs a stylist. i could make his life... a LOT better. There are a number of hotties on the men's circuit (*by the way, this is so much better than the homo-thread, because we're ACTUALLY discussing real homosexuality! hahahaha) all of a sudden. get agassi OUT of the game and its gonna be an ORGIE! i mean...whoa. we've had some real dogs on the boys circuit for a long time. IVAN LENDL? Remember that Frankenstein of a man? EEK. Skin crawl.

But is everyone aware that the ITF was PETITIONED at last year's wimbledon by 100 past champions to limit the racquiet size & materials??!! pat cash, martina, mac...a lot of people. This was chris' first year NOT physically going to wimbledon, so...she was not part of it, but they know. She refuses to even teach the power tennis thing at her academy! She has them paying as much attention to court-demeanour and attitude (bless her heart) than hitting 143 MPH serves.

Andy T Feb 13th, 2004 04:34 PM

Call me a submissive pervert if you want, but Lendl actually did turn me on sometimes....

daze11 Feb 13th, 2004 04:40 PM

well, i found that GODZILLA turned me on at times...this odd reptilian kind-of RADIOACTIVE HOTTNESS. But he was like chris evert, too...FIRE ALL YOUR MISSILES! You're still goin' down in flames, and he'll be back for another round later! haha...She'd really appreciate being compared to godzilla.

and uh...now that you've all lost your erections...

what were we saying about racquet size? :lol:

alfajeffster Feb 13th, 2004 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daze11
well, i found that GODZILLA turned me on at times...this odd reptilian kind-of RADIOACTIVE HOTTNESS. But he was like chris evert, too...FIRE ALL YOUR MISSILES! You're still goin' down in flames, and he'll be back for another round later! haha...She'd really appreciate being compared to godzilla.

and uh...now that you've all lost your erections...

what were we saying about racquet size? :lol:

We were just about to get into limiting the head.:lol:

daze11 Feb 13th, 2004 05:51 PM

As long as the handle doesn't have to get thinner, too. And that is my final post in the perverse little thread. :help:

Santorofan Feb 13th, 2004 08:43 PM

Alfajeffster - with all due respect, I can't see where you'd call Santoro a human backboard. His game is chock full of surprises and he mixes things up wonderfully. He serves and volleys on second serves and cuts the giants of the game (like Safin for one) down to size with a tremendous array of tactical brilliance (spin variety, drop shots, angled lob and mixed up pace). A human backboard spits back the ball the same way every time..far from Santoro's style.

Regarding his "butt"..I ain't one to censor anyone but maybe you should save that one for the general thread??? :rolleyes: Just MHO.


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