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Thread: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :) Reply to Thread
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  Topic Review (Newest First)
Apr 23rd, 2013 07:36 PM
égalité
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pov View Post
That is irrelevant to legal rights. There is nothing in marriage laws that codify attraction. Heteros can and do marry people they aren't attracted to. In fact, state sponsored marriage has historically been based on considerations that have nothing to do with attraction. You married who it was proper to marry.

BTW There are a still a few place where heteros cannot marry anyone they want to. If that person is of a different ethnicity or creed - forget about it.

Anyway - NZ has expanded marriage to include same-sex marriages - a right open to all no matter what their sexuality is. Fairly soon - if it hasn't happened yet - you'll find heteros who make use of the access to same-sex marriage.
There most certainly is. The (legal) declaration that marriage is between a man and a woman isn't arbitrary. It wasn't decided on a coin flip whether the legal definition of marriage would be same-sex or opposite-sex.

Besides marriage, attraction is codified all the time. Homosexual acts have frequently been illegal in the past (in the US), up through the 1990s in some states (maybe even later, I can't remember). I don't think you can separate the attraction from the sexual acts. They're not separate entities. Not that this is the case anymore, but the situation for gay people was basically, "if you want to avoid doing something illegal, either be celibate or have sex exclusively with the gender you're not attracted to. Oh and P.S. the same laws apply to everyone so it's fair."

That's the situation with marriage right now in both states. Gay and straight people have equal access to marriage kind of in the same way that birds and fish both have equal access to water.
Apr 23rd, 2013 06:12 PM
Nicolás89
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pov View Post
That is irrelevant to legal rights. There is nothing in marriage laws that codify attraction. Heteros can and do marry people they aren't attracted to. In fact, state sponsored marriage has historically been based on considerations that have nothing to do with attraction. You married who it was proper to marry.

BTW There are a still a few place where heteros cannot marry anyone they want to. If that person is of a different ethnicity or creed - forget about it.

Anyway - NZ has expanded marriage to include same-sex marriages - a right open to all no matter what their sexuality is. Fairly soon - if it hasn't happened yet - you'll find heteros who make use of the access to same-sex marriage.
Yes there is, the act consummation is crucial to the legal recognition of marriage in most constitutions.
Apr 23rd, 2013 05:02 PM
Novichok
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pov View Post
That is irrelevant to legal rights. There is nothing in marriage laws that codify attraction. Heteros can and do marry people they aren't attracted to. In fact, state sponsored marriage has historically been based on considerations that have nothing to do with attraction. You married who it was proper to marry. You will also fairly soon - if it hasn't happened yet - find heteros who make use of the access to same-sex marriage.

BTW There are a still a few place where heteros cannot marry anyone they want to. If that person is of a different ethnicity or creed - forget about it.

Anyway - NZ has expanded marriage to include same-sex marriages - a right open to all no matter what their sexuality is..
The structure of the laws codifies attraction. I know that some heteros can and do marry people they aren't attracted to. But they also have the right to marry those who they are attracted to. Gays do not.
Apr 23rd, 2013 04:59 PM
pov
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Novichok View Post

Does a straight man have the right to marry a member of the sex he's attracted to? Does a gay man?
That is irrelevant to legal rights. There is nothing in marriage laws that codify attraction. Heteros can and do marry people they aren't attracted to. In fact, state sponsored marriage has historically been based on considerations that have nothing to do with attraction. You married who it was proper to marry.

BTW There are a still a few place where heteros cannot marry anyone they want to. If that person is of a different ethnicity or creed - forget about it.

Anyway - NZ has expanded marriage to include same-sex marriages - a right open to all no matter what their sexuality is. Fairly soon - if it hasn't happened yet - you'll find heteros who make use of the access to same-sex marriage.
Apr 23rd, 2013 04:33 PM
TIEFSEE
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Done
Apr 23rd, 2013 04:18 PM
silverwhite
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

I think this deserves its own thread, BTW
Apr 23rd, 2013 04:15 PM
Novichok
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pov View Post
There has always been marriage equality. A gay man always had the same legal marriage rights as a straight man.

Does a straight man have the right to marry a member of the sex he's attracted to? Does a gay man?
Apr 23rd, 2013 03:58 PM
pov
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

There has always been marriage equality. A gay man always had the same legal marriage rights as a straight man.
Apr 23rd, 2013 03:33 PM
Soliloque
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

France becomes the most populated country in the world and the biggest great power country to legalize gay marriage. Hopefully that will influence some other big countries and help even more that great cause.
Apr 23rd, 2013 03:09 PM
Soliloque
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

331-225

France joins the party
Apr 18th, 2013 10:45 PM
Dani12
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
NSW Premier O'Farrell backs same-sex marriage

New South Wales Premier Barry O'Farrell has come out in support of same-sex marriage.

Fairfax newspapers are reporting the Premier has also challenged Opposition Leader Tony Abbott to allow a conscience vote on the issue.

It follows a vote to make gay marriage legal in New Zealand.

Mr O'Farrell says same-sex marriage is "about family".

He also told the newspaper that if a parliamentary inquiry in New South Wales found the state could act alone, he would vote for legislation that might be introduced.

''My view - a view that I've come to in recent years - is that as a Liberal who believes that commitment and family units are one of the best ways in which society is organised, I support the concept of same-sex marriage,'' he told Fairfax.

''We should, as governments, be encouraging commitment.

"As societies we should be encouraging commitment.

"Because, ultimately, people caring for each other works side by side with governments to create better communities.''

Mr O'Farrell described claims that same-sex marriage would damage the institution of marriage as "utterly ridiculous".

He told the newspaper he was ''not going to campaign on the issue'', but felt the NZ vote presented a ''suitable opportunity'' to express his view.

New Zealand's legislation, which was passed 77 votes to 44, defines marriage as a union between two people.

It means gay couples can be legally wed there as early as August.

New South Wales Greens MP Cate Faehrmann says Mr O'Farrell's support will make an impact.

"People who have been campaigning for marriage equality for many years now will be very heartened by Barry O'Farrell's leadership in coming out in support of same sex marriage," she said.

"I do think we will see this have a big impact on the campaign potentially in terms of New South Wales marriage equality laws; hopefully even in terms of federal equality laws."

She says the decision in New Zealand has given the campaign a boost.

"It's about time we saw it in Australia as well," she said.

"It would be fantastic if New South Wales was the first parliament to recognise marriage equality.

"But even more significant, would be if we got marriage equality laws through at the federal level.

"Barry O'Farrell coming out in support of same sex marriage really kicks the campaign along in a big way."

The state's Opposition Leader, John Robertson, says it is a good move.

"I've had a position for some time of support for this," he said.

"It's pleasing Barry O'Farrell has come to the same conclusion."
It's a start anyway
Apr 18th, 2013 10:39 PM
Lord Choc Ice
Re: Do you support Gay Marriage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam L View Post
Well to be fair, I don't want to live anywhere but France. So it's nothing personal against NZ.
Don't worry, I understand. New Zealand really is a secluded place too. It's not like in Europe where you can go to a different country on a bus or train ride or something .

Bottom right-hand corner. That's us .
Apr 18th, 2013 10:38 PM
Soliloque
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

It's nice to see the number of countries legalizing gay marriage growing fast the last few months. France will join tuesday with the final vote on the law.
Apr 18th, 2013 10:01 PM
Sam L
Re: Do you support Gay Marriage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pops Maellard View Post
Why?
Well to be fair, I don't want to live anywhere but France. So it's nothing personal against NZ.
Apr 18th, 2013 04:09 PM
Mikey.
Re: 77-44, the law passes - marriage equality in New Zealand :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gc-spurs View Post


You need to watch this speech by one of the National MPs, it's hilariously well done.
I loved this so much.
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