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  Topic Review (Newest First)
Jun 10th, 2013 05:00 AM
VeeJJ
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSerenaWilliams View Post
Serena beat the #2 player in the world in BOTH of her FO finals, when will Justine/Roger?

Soderling, (Mentally Fragile) Clijsters, (Old) Pierce, Kuznetsova, and Ivanovic
Sis, you know you sure as shit did not want Serena to meet Sexlana in this FO final, stop playing.
Jun 10th, 2013 04:18 AM
promethus287
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

That said the answer to this thread at this point in time is clearly Roger and Nadal is the bigger gap. Anyone who says otherwise is an idiot. Serena is a long way from surpassing Henin on clay but the gap between the two is only 30% of what the chasm from Nadal to Federer is.
Jun 10th, 2013 04:15 AM
promethus287
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSerenaWilliams View Post
Serena beat the #2 player in the world in BOTH of her FO finals, when will Justine/Roger?

Soderling, (Mentally Fragile) Clijsters, (Old) Pierce, Kuznetsova, and Ivanovic
Lets be real. Justine would have had no problem beating the #2 player in the World in the finals (or anyone in the draw for that matter) any of the years she won:

2003- #2 in the World was Venus, an injured Venus no less.
2005- #2 in the World was I think was Sharapova who Justine beat easily in the quarters and would have done likewise in the finals. #1 was Davenport. Justine would have had a field day with her if she by some miracle got that far.
2006- #2 in the World was Justine. #1 Mauresmo might be the only one we will get to who had a chance, as she beat Justine in 2 slam finals that year. Still on clay weeks before the French she got only 3 games, and that was without the home pressure. Probably no chance, and might have helped Justine win Wimbledon too as it would have given her a mental edge.
2007- #2 was Sharapova. She would have been road kill for Justine on clay this year, and would have been very lucky to even match the 3 games she got off Ivanovic, or Ivanovic then got off Henin.

As for Federer he proved he beats everyone but Nadal on clay consistently for years. He cant beat #1 or #2 since he is always one, and Nadal the clay GOAT who he cant beat is the other. I am no Roger fan but this is unfair to him too. The only other one who might have beaten him is Djokovic had he made it that far, but Djokovic has still never beaten Roger at RG all these years later.
Jun 10th, 2013 04:05 AM
eck
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSerenaWilliams View Post
Serena beat the #2 player in the world in BOTH of her FO finals, when will Justine/Roger?

Soderling, (Mentally Fragile) Clijsters, (Old) Pierce, Kuznetsova, and Ivanovic
Clijsters was a two time FO Finalist, Pierce a former winner, Kuznetsova and Ivanovic eventual RG champs.

What does the seeding in RG mean anyways? It's pretty clear that clay is not the best surface for most of the women.

Bar Clijsters in 2003, none of them were seeded #2 in the tournament. But let's have a look at who were seeds 1-3

2005:
1. Davenport
2. Sharapova
3. Mauresmo

2006:
1. Mauresmo
2. Clijsters
3. Petrova

2007:
1. JuJu
2. Sharapova
3. Kuznetsova

In 05 Davenport and Sharapova on clay was just laughable, Mauresmo and France is like oil and water. Petrova was in lala land. 07 Sharapova was beaten by Ana, who then lost to Justine. Kuznetsova was in her own world too somewhere in Timbuktu.

Fact of the matter is, Justine didn't have the opportunity to beat them because they didn't even make the finals.
That said, Justine beat Sharapova in 05, Clijsters in 06 on her path to the trophy.

I'm not discrediting Serena here, what she did this year was phenomenal, taking out the defending champ, but you shouldn't discredit Justine either.

__

As for the actual OP question, Nadal-Federer on clay is night and day. I still remember that day Nadal humiliated Federer at the finals.
Jun 10th, 2013 03:10 AM
Grigorpova
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

After seeing some of the performances from Serena this RG the gap has significantly closed

If she happens to win the RG title next year convincingly the gap would be minuscule
Jun 10th, 2013 01:53 AM
MrSerenaWilliams
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Serena beat the #2 player in the world in BOTH of her FO finals, when will Justine/Roger?

Soderling, (Mentally Fragile) Clijsters, (Old) Pierce, Kuznetsova, and Ivanovic
Jun 10th, 2013 01:22 AM
bandabou
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Jun 10th, 2013 12:20 AM
Sam L
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by homogenius View Post
A mess So Serena was in a slump from 2003 to 2008 ? Good to know At least you got something right : clay is indeed Serena's worst surface.
You can keep changing the target of the debate each time you have no answer, it won't change the fact that on the big scale of things, Serena is a non-entity on clay (even Ivanovic reached more FO's finals than her ), furthermore when compared to Henin.Fed (as much as I dislike him)is the 2nd best player of this decade on clay, behind who ? : the best player of all time on the surface.Enough said.
Jun 10th, 2013 12:10 AM
Sam L
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by nealcaffrey View Post
lol i did not admit i was wrong

-based on skill and accomplishment on clay,gap between federer and nadal much smaller than that of henin and serena
-all time greats list, gap between federer and nadal much smaller than that of henin and serena
-serena also never beat henin in french open like federer never beat nadal in french open
-federer at his peak able to bagel nadal on clay

still you have not provided me a statistic that proves your point except your own hypothesis that serena can somehow win against peak henin on clay when you have no statistic whatsoever that proves your point
Hello? Where are you now? I see, haven't posted since last year ...

Stay away until Serena retires.
Jun 10th, 2013 12:02 AM
Sam L
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Epic bump. No comparison. Boy those who said Serena/Henin are eating crow now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDVTennis View Post
Roger has made more RG finals than Serena, many more. Roger has more titles at tour events on red clay than Serena, many more. Roger knows how to move and play on clay; Serena doesn't.

The gap between Henin and Serena is much greater.
You must be seething right now. Serena's coming after your Steffi.
Jun 9th, 2013 05:38 PM
Calypso
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Not a good comparison at all.

Justine, as great as she was on clay, did not have the HUGE intimidation factor about her on clay as Nadal does. He simply sweeps everyone away at Roland Garros.

Only ONE loss in NINE years of playing RG is just insane, of course the gap between Rafa and all his rivals on clay and at RG will be >>>>> the gap between Henin and Serena/her WTA rivals.
Jun 8th, 2013 08:00 PM
Olórin
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesborah View Post
Serena - peak Henin obv.

peak Nadal on clay is scary.
Peak Serena on clay vs Peak Justine on clay would definitely be close. I'd give it 55-45 to Justine with the 5% being because of her superior movement, which should be recognised and applauded.

I think Justine is the best mover of all time on clay, even better than Evert and Graf.
Jun 8th, 2013 07:54 PM
marpilto
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesborah View Post
He would be top 5 at least if Nadal never played professional tennis
Irrelevant. Fact is Nadal exists and Fed's achievements are what they are. One could turn around and say he is super lucky he is plays in such an incredible weak era with no competition other than Nadal and Djokovic. Nadal likewise is lucky to play in such a weak clay era but is so dominant and puts up such untouchable numbers it doesnt matter.
Jun 8th, 2013 07:04 PM
MrSerenaWilliams
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDVTennis View Post
Roger has made more RG finals than Serena, many more. Roger has more titles at tour events on red clay than Serena, many more. Roger knows how to move and play on clay; Serena doesn't.

The gap between Henin and Serena is much greater.




2 French Opens to Justine's 4.


Whereas Roger has 1 to Rafa's 7 (could be 8 tomorrow).


You were saying?
Jun 8th, 2013 06:56 PM
debby
Re: Bigger gap on clay- Serena vs Henin or Federer vs Nadal

Serena - peak Henin obv.

peak Nadal on clay is scary.
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