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View Full Version : justine, serena, kim, jennifer, etc have all said " i was tired" after losses...


treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:36 PM
So what is the big deal??? "i was tired" is not the same as "she sucks, I can't believe she won, i gave her the match, yadda, yadda, yadda"


last week people (the usual juju haters) came out to bash justine cuz she was tired and yet still gave kim all the credit in the world. now they will jump all over kim.

well guess what players are tired. oh, btw, does this mean Kim was not "JUICED UP" today? some posters are trying to imply justine lost because she was not using performance enhancement drugs. now kim loses after winning the first set and her level dropped off. guess we are supposed to attack these fine players like kim, justine, serena, etc constantly. :fiery:

give it a rest people


RANT OVER (for now :p )

bandabou
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:38 PM
Serena said it once....all hell broke loose. Kimīs blamed it twice already for her losses!

Crazy Canuck
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:38 PM
treufreund... stop being such a party pooper. Some people are uncreative and not very intelligent.. what else do you expect them to talk about? :)

Crazy Canuck
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:39 PM
Serena said it once....all hell broke loose. Kimīs blamed it twice already for her losses!
Exhibit A.

JennyS
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:41 PM
Of course players are tired. The season is almost 10 months old. Even though they take a few 3-4 week breaks throughout the year, they are training for their tournaments during their breaks. There is no recovery time. So of course, the players are going to be tired, mentally and physically by mid-late October.

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:43 PM
the only time st. Kim was out of line was after the Acura final. she said Justine had taken injury breaks almost ever time she played her. that was just flat out not true and very BIZARRE I think she was not thinking clearly then :haha:

other than that Kim has been awesome. :hearts:

Jericho
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:44 PM
So what is the big deal??? "i was tired" is not the same as "she sucks, I can't believe she won, i gave her the match, yadda, yadda, yadda"


last week people (the usual juju haters) came out to bash justine cuz she was tired and yet still gave kim all the credit in the world. now they will jump all over kim.

well guess what players are tired. oh, btw, does this mean Kim was not "JUICED UP" today? some posters are trying to imply justine lost because she was not using performance enhancement drugs. now kim loses after winning the first set and her level dropped off. guess we are supposed to attack these fine players like kim, justine, serena, etc constantly. :fiery:

give it a rest people


RANT OVER (for now :p )

Amen! :worship:

lizchris
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:45 PM
Venus has always said being tired is noo excuse not to win a match or a tournamnet. She said if you can't, then don't play the tournament at all.

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:47 PM
Venus has always said being tired is noo excuse not to win a match or a tournamnet. She said if you can't, then don't play the tournament at all.


well that is great from VENUS :D but she also has admitted to being out of shape in the past when she was drubbed in AO 2001 6-1 6-1 in the semis by Hingis and was tired. I don't recall whether she said "tired" but she said she was not ready and not in shape so same difference.

anyways back then what Venus said was FINE and UNDERSTANDABLE. no harm in admitting you were tired or not prepared.

GEEZ!

lizchris
Oct 18th, 2003, 07:54 PM
well that is great from VENUS :D but she also has admitted to being out of shape in the past when she was drubbed in AO 2001 6-1 6-1 in the semis by Hingis and was tired. I don't recall whether she said "tired" but she said she was not ready and not in shape so same difference.

anyways back then what Venus said was FINE and UNDERSTANDABLE. no harm in admitting you were tired or not prepared.

GEEZ!

Anyone with any common sense knows that being out of shape and being tired are two different things.

BTW, if memory serves me correctly, Venus only said after that loss that she was out of shape.

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:00 PM
Anyone with any common sense knows that being out of shape and being tired are two different things.

BTW, if memory serves me correctly, Venus only said after that loss that she was out of shape.

no you missed the point entirely. If venus thinks that you should not step onto the court when you are tired (not ready) then certainly you should not step onto the court out of shape (not ready). anyways who cares??? i have no problem with what venus has said nor any player just saying they were tired.

lizchris, you think kim or other players like rena or juju were not tired??? get real, this sport is demanding and when you win a lot sometimes you are tired. what is wrong with saying that???

i just don't understand the problem at all. :confused:

TeeRexx
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:06 PM
From the words of truefiend:
============================
"oh, btw, does this mean Kim was not "JUICED UP" today? some posters are trying to imply justine lost because she was not using performance enhancement drugs. now kim loses after winning the first set and her level dropped off."
============================

So now Kim is on the juice as well? :eek:
Many thought just Juju was juiced up and now truefiend reveals that Kim is on the sauce as well. :)

Well, seriously, maybe Kim was tired because she may have gotten out of shape and has lost some of her stamina.
So, maybe there was some truth in her words and not just an empty excuse afterall.

alexusjonesfan
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:10 PM
Wow, do we need to turn everything into an 'us' (insert fans of your fave) vs. 'them' (everyone else) bitchfest?. Treufreund made a point about players saying they were tired after a match...not which players deserve to be able to say that or any of the other interpretations which'll undoubtedly arise :p

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:11 PM
no you missed the point entirely. If venus thinks that you should not step onto the court when you are tired (not ready) then certainly you should not step onto the court out of shape (not ready). anyways who cares??? i have no problem with what venus has said nor any player just saying they were tired.

lizchris, you think kim or other players like rena or juju were not tired??? get real, this sport is demanding and when you win a lot sometimes you are tired. what is wrong with saying that???

i just don't understand the problem at all. :confused:

I didn't realize tired and out of shape both meant not ready. :o

Grasping at straws are we??

alexusjonesfan
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:11 PM
Well, seriously, maybe Kim was tired because she may have gotten out of shape and has lost some of her stamina.
So, maybe there was some truth in her words and not just an empty excuse afterall.

or maybe one can get tired after playing 90 some odd matches in the year :shrug:

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:12 PM
Wow, do we need to turn everything into an 'us' (insert fans of your fave) vs. 'them' (everyone else) bitchfest?. Treufreund made a point about players saying they were tired after a match...not which players deserve to be able to say that or any of the other interpretations which'll undoubtedly arise :p


EXACTLY!!!! Caelestia = HEAVENLY :angel:

dang, you must be related to Saint Kim?? :D

KIM= :angel:

JUSTINE = :worship: / :hearts:

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:14 PM
I didn't realize tired and out of shape both meant not ready. :o

Grasping at straws are we??

not grasping at straws cuz this TANGENT has nothing to do with the thread!!!

why are you just TRYING to find something to be persnickety about? :p

but, anyhoo, yep tired/out of shape are both "not ready" IMHO. You are free to feel that being tired or out of shape means that one is ready tho. :)

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:15 PM
I think many are missing the point.

No one is saying Kim wasn't tired. I bet she is after playing so many damn matches.

The point being made by bandabou, was that her excuse for losing a match to tiredness was accepted, while with other players, it is rejected. Why is that??

Besides, if Kim is so tired, like she claims to be, shouldn't she be withdrawing from tournaments, instead of adding tournaments and playing doubles in them as well?? Like Kim needs a Tier III title.

I'm all for supporting a tournament, but, come on. Go to the tournament, give autograph sessions, etc., just don't play. It's as simple as that.

lizchris
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:17 PM
no you missed the point entirely. If venus thinks that you should not step onto the court when you are tired (not ready) then certainly you should not step onto the court out of shape (not ready). anyways who cares??? i have no problem with what venus has said nor any player just saying they were tired.

lizchris, you think kim or other players like rena or juju were not tired??? get real, this sport is demanding and when you win a lot sometimes you are tired. what is wrong with saying that???

i just don't understand the problem at all. :confused:

The problem is that when Serena said she was tired, she was critcize and mocked for doing so. When others like Kim and Justine say the same thing, it is no big deal. Some believe that Serena should not be able to get tired because she doesn't play as many tournaments as the rest of the tour (Venus plays even less). But I will tell you this; expect to see Serena aound a lot longer (unless injuries stop her) on the tour than Kim because she is burning herself out playing so many tournamens.

BTW, if you want to talk about out of shape, let's talk about Mary Peirce. She is the most out of shape player I have seen in a while, until recently.

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:17 PM
not grasping at straws cuz this TANGENT has nothing to do with the thread!!!

why are you just TRYING to find something to be persnickety about? :p

but, anyhoo, yep tired/out of shape are both "not ready" IMHO. You are free to feel that being tired or out of shape means that one is ready tho. :)

I guess we can blame every loss of Monica's in the past 8 years to her not being ready.

-Sonic-
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:18 PM
Well in all honesty I would think that most players have some sort of little worry or niggling injury that they just play through with a bit of strapping or a massage on it beforehand... they go on the court "feeling tired" and "not in top shape" all the time. Mentioning this in an interview after a loss when they're psychologically low isn't that bad is it?

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:19 PM
venus i say whatcha mean. but i think you are being defensive.

but i agree in general JUSTINE or the WILLIAMS get crucified for all kinds of little petty things whereas KIM can make statements about justine taking tons of injury timeouts or imply that venus was not injured at wimbledon and basically not get called on by Pam shriver, mary jo fernandez and mary carillo.

same thing with capriati. damn cappy can cuss up a storm and act horrible and nobody bats an eye. it sucks, but that is how it is.

but then again maybe we "williams haters" and "justine haters" are partly responsible for this too???

maybe we should look at ourselves too. :)

bandabou
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:19 PM
I think many are missing the point.

No one is saying Kim wasn't tired. I bet she is after playing so many damn matches.

The point being made by bandabou, was that her excuse for losing a match to tiredness was accepted, while with other players, it is rejected. Why is that??

Besides, if Kim is so tired, like she claims to be, shouldn't she be withdrawing from tournaments, instead of adding tournaments and playing doubles in them as well?? Like Kim needs a Tier III title.

I'm all for supporting a tournament, but, come on. Go to the tournament, give autograph sessions, etc., just don't play. It's as simple as that.

Exactly.....when Kim says it, itīs aight. When Serena said it, it was excuses....whatīs the difference?!

lizchris
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:21 PM
I think many are missing the point.

No one is saying Kim wasn't tired. I bet she is after playing so many damn matches.

The point being made by bandabou, was that her excuse for losing a match to tiredness was accepted, while with other players, it is rejected. Why is that??

Besides, if Kim is so tired, like she claims to be, shouldn't she be withdrawing from tournaments, instead of adding tournaments and playing doubles in them as well?? Like Kim needs a Tier III title.

I'm all for supporting a tournament, but, come on. Go to the tournament, give autograph sessions, etc., just don't play. It's as simple as that.

I was wondering the same thing; if she is tired, then like Justine, she should have pulled out of her next tournament. She has a lot more to defend at the YEC than she does at Luxenbourg.

treufreund
Oct 18th, 2003, 08:21 PM
hmm, i just got it....

this thread is not about KIM CLIJSTERS

it's another "poor serena/venus" thread. :rolleyes:

not gonna go over well with most people tho. even tho I see where you all coming from but you have more credibility if you would point some cases where JUSTINE or HINGIS or players you may not like have also been victims of the double standard.

Like I did in my posts where I at least acknowledge that you are right to a point and I acknowledge some harsh judgments towards the Williams when compared to kim, k?

alexusjonesfan
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:03 PM
I don't understand this crusade. Nobody in this thread has stated that Serena didn't deserve to say she was tired while Kim did. So who exactly are you guys arguing with? Trying to make Treufreund accountable for things other people said about Serena (even though his point is that no player should be crucified for the 'tired' excuse)? Now where's that double standard...

faste5683
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:09 PM
[QUOTE=treufreund]So what is the big deal??? "i was tired" is not the same as "she sucks, I can't believe she won, i gave her the match, yadda, yadda, yadda"


last week people (the usual juju haters) came out to bash justine cuz she was tired and yet still gave kim all the credit in the world. now they will jump all over kim.

well guess what players are tired. oh, btw, does this mean Kim was not "JUICED UP" today?

I'm getting tired responding to this post: where in the hell did I put
the juice?http://www.wtaworld.com/ubb/eek.gif

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:23 PM
The point being made by bandabou, was that her excuse for losing a match to tiredness was accepted, while with other players, it is rejected. Why is that??

...perhaps because Kim plays twice as many tournaments as Serena...and so has a better reason to be tired... :)

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:23 PM
I don't understand this crusade. Nobody in this thread has stated that Serena didn't deserve to say she was tired while Kim did. So who exactly are you guys arguing with? Trying to make Treufreund accountable for things other people said about Serena (even though his point is that no player should be crucified for the 'tired' excuse)? Now where's that double standard...

Considering you weren't a member of the board when it happened, I'll excuse you.

Back at the season ending champs, with Serena vs. Kim, Serena cited fatigue as to the reason why she didn't win. Meaning, Kim won only because Serena was tired. Most Kim fans jumped on Serena saying she was just a sore-loser and that being tired was not a valid excuse.

Now that Kim lost a match, and cited fatigue, it's an acceptable excuse. Their reason is because she plays more events.

But, correct me if I'm wrong, isn't being tired, being tired?? It doesn't matter if one plays 100 events or just 5 events. If you're tired, you're tired.

Just a double standard to accept one's excuse for fatigue, and not another's.

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:24 PM
...perhaps because Kim plays twice as many tournaments as Serena...and so has a better reason to be tired... :)

Tired is tired, is it not??

What does it matter if it's 100 tournaments or 5 tournaments?? Tired is tired, simple as that.

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:26 PM
...tired from what ffs...???!!!

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:27 PM
...tired from what ffs...???!!!

What does it matter, she was tired, just like Kim.

Serena was tired from the day before's match.

Kim was tired from all of her previous tournaments and bad scheduling.

There's no difference, the fact is, they were both still tired.

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:30 PM
...Kim played a match the day before too... :)

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:33 PM
...Kim played a match the day before too... :)

Was it a grueling two hour match, or did it take 45 minutes??

Still have nothing to combat anything I've said. Being tired is being tired, no matter what it's from.

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:38 PM
Was it a grueling two hour match, or did it take 45 minutes??

Still have nothing to combat anything I've said. Being tired is being tired, no matter what it's from.

...well if it took Serena longer to win her match that's her problem...if someone says they're tired after playing 100 tournaments a year I think 'yes, she is probably tired'...if someone says they're tired after playing five tournaments a year I think she's either very unfit...or just making excuses...okay...? :)

alexusjonesfan
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:42 PM
Considering you weren't a member of the board when it happened, I'll excuse you.

Back at the season ending champs, with Serena vs. Kim, Serena cited fatigue as to the reason why she didn't win. Meaning, Kim won only because Serena was tired. Most Kim fans jumped on Serena saying she was just a sore-loser and that being tired was not a valid excuse.

Now that Kim lost a match, and cited fatigue, it's an acceptable excuse. Their reason is because she plays more events.

But, correct me if I'm wrong, isn't being tired, being tired?? It doesn't matter if one plays 100 events or just 5 events. If you're tired, you're tired.

Just a double standard to accept one's excuse for fatigue, and not another's.

I think I know what you mean but what can you do about the fact that some people will hate your fave unconditionally? I get your point that it's hippocritical for people to slag Serena and then accept Kim's similar reasoning as legitimate, but I'm not sure what good that'll do in this thread whose point is that 'tiredness' is a legitimate excuse. Serena's haters will always believe that she's a sore loser even if she kisses her opponents feet, Lindsay's haters will always believe that she's unmotivated and lazy even if she spends her life training, Justine's haters will always believe that she's a cheat even if she calls a trainer on court for a visibly sprained ankle....there's no convincin em. :confused:

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:43 PM
...well if it took Serena longer to win her match that's her problem...if someone says they're tired after playing 100 tournaments a year I think 'yes, she is probably tired'...if someone says they're tired after playing five tournaments a year I think she's either very unfit...or just making excuses...okay...? :)

Just like it's Serena's fault it took her longer to win her match, it's Kim's fault for playing too much. Understand my point??

BTW, I totally agree with you, but my point is, tired is still tired.

If it took Serena longer to finish her match against Capriati than for Kim to finish against Venus, it's just bad luck. But, nonetheless, she's still tired from it.

If it's Kim's poor decision to play so many tournaments, and to play so many in a row, it's her own fault, just like it was Serena's own fault that she didn't win quicker.

It still comes down to them both being tired, but for two different reasons. How come one "I'm tired" statement is more acceptable than another?? What it still boils down to is that they are still both tired. Why accept one over the other?? It's just back to the original question.

Smart
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:44 PM
All girls aren't brave enough to say that "Juju was better". All are complaining about their tiredness.

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 10:52 PM
BTW, I accept tired as a valid excuse. If you're not physically 100%, it's obviously going to affect the outcome of the match.

Another point that could be made about this whole situation about why one is accepted and not the other, is this. Kim's fatigue is controllable. She can control the number of tournaments she plays, as where, Serena could not control how well Capriati was going to play against her. If anything, it's more Kim's fault that she is tired, more than it's Serena's fault that she is tired.

It still comes back to, why is one accepted over the other??

alexusjonesfan
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:04 PM
It still comes back to, why is one accepted over the other??

I don't think this'll make a difference, but atleast some people here accept both ;)

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:14 PM
...I don't deny it's Kims fault if she's played too much...I'm just saying she has more reason to be tired than Serena had...and therefore when she says 'I was tired' it's more likely to be an honest statement of fact...whether that makes it a valid excuse is another matter...but...if it's an honest statement there's no reason why she shouldn't say it, is there...?

...and...better players play shorter matches and use less energy...that's all part of the game...luck has nothing to do with it... :)

bandabou
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:24 PM
...I don't deny it's Kims fault if she's played too much...I'm just saying she has more reason to be tired than Serena had...and therefore when she says 'I was tired' it's more likely to be an honest statement of fact...whether that makes it a valid excuse is another matter...but...if it's an honest statement there's no reason why she shouldn't say it, is there...?

...and...better players play shorter matches and use less energy...that's all part of the game...luck has nothing to do with it... :)

blah blah......either they both were right or they both are wrong.

Venus Forever
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:30 PM
...I don't deny it's Kims fault if she's played too much...I'm just saying she has more reason to be tired than Serena had...and therefore when she says 'I was tired' it's more likely to be an honest statement of fact...whether that makes it a valid excuse is another matter...but...if it's an honest statement there's no reason why she shouldn't say it, is there...?

...and...better players play shorter matches and use less energy...that's all part of the game...luck has nothing to do with it... :)

More reason to be tired?? Kim brought about her fatigue on herself by playing too much. Serena, on the otherhand, was going shot for shot with Capriati which made it a very long match. If anything, Serena has more reason to be tired. Kim can control her fatigue, Serena couldn't. Kim brought upon herself, Serena didn't. If anything, Serena's weariness is more valid than Kim's.

Serena, the #1 player, played a match against the #3 player in the world, and it went to three sets. Serena was the better player that day, but she played a GREAT player in Capriati. They were both hitting winners left and right, and there were many long rallies.

Kim's fatigue is all within her own control.

Serena's wasn't.

Therefore, Serena's claim of being fatigued can be justified more than Kim's.

Martian Willow
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:30 PM
...I don't think so... :)

Cybelle Darkholme
Oct 18th, 2003, 11:39 PM
Look the point people are making is that when players say they were tired they are saying they were not at their best which basicaly is the same as saying you played below your level, get it?

Every player does this...

There are no excuses when you lose. Kim lost because jelena was better. period.

j_dementieva27
Oct 19th, 2003, 02:43 AM
i hate when players say that... just give credit to the winner... or even say "i didnt play well today, and she did simple as that"... but to cite fatiuge ... maybe all of these "tired" players should stop playing WEEK IN WEEK OUT!!!

look at elena dementieva... she has played more tourneys this year then most players have, and she wins... and she never claimed tiredness except after bali-shanghai-moscow SEMI, and she should have, shes not a top player

these girls are numbers one and two in the world, and they are just because they lose to a much lower rankde player, dont blame exhaustion