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kyiki2000
Sep 7th, 2003, 01:26 AM
you know I'm finding increasingly disturbing the commets I am hearing from this chat forum. I was just looking at some comments commenting that the juniors have it tough. Hilarious the juniors have everything, they don't have any outlay of money whatsoever, and if they do, there parents, sponsors, or tennis Australia foot the bill. I also noticed a comment that suggested it would be more benifical to put the money into juniors rather than average senior players. You do realise I hope that most of thse fantastic junior players will never even make it into the professional ranks, and even if they do there will only be a handful of them ranked in the top 1000. Not to mention all the professionals we have now in the top 1000 were all extremely successful juniors. Alot of the players ranked outside the top 500 have jobs when they are in their home country just to be able to afford to tavel to the next tournament. I have moved here from Canada 2 years ago to pursue tennis and train with one of sydneys top coaches and I can tell you from experience and spening time with alot of Australian professionals, juniors is not where the money should be pumped. The standard of junior is my no means exceptional and is certaintly no better than the likes of Evie, Alica, Bree etc when they were juniors. We all love to bag them but let me ask all you guys what your atp or wta ranking is? We spend all our time having a go at people who we know, but funny enough most of them will never even know our name's!!!!

Vicky88
Sep 7th, 2003, 02:26 AM
I'm not sure exactly what your point is. I think if you have a good look you will find most of us support each and every Australian player.

However, I do question the funding for any of the players. I don't think anyone should be given unlimited public funds to pursue this type of career with no expected payback to the system. There is no such thing as a free lunch, no matter what your profession is. However, like any career, unless one puts 100+% effort in they will never achieve their goals.

broncosven
Sep 7th, 2003, 03:13 AM
i also think that is unfair

some people in hear have opinions but so does everyone

We support Aussies and most arent welll know and copmared to other countries exposed and finacially supported

Id love for a junior to come through to seniors and take #1 . . . . im sure everyone here would

AUSBOY
Sep 7th, 2003, 03:41 AM
thanks Kyiki2000!

I agree totally with you, have been trying to say the same on here. The juniors get it too easy, its crazy the money wasted on them.

I used to be involved with the Nationals, which was the top 8 in every age group in both boys and girls juniors and Tennis Australia would put up all these players in 5 star hotels, even the players that lived locally!

I think half the juniors just continue as they like 'the attention, high-life' and not because they ever think they are seriously good enough to make a career out of it. Only about 1% of top juniors end up going on to make a top 700 ranking.

Its such a waste, they would be better to spend this money helping juniors make the transition to senior ranks, so many of these so called top juniors play the senior circuit for 1 year then quit cos they cant afford it.

Players like Kellie Browne, Bree Calderwood, Amy Jensen, Maija Avotins, Donna Mcintyre, Holly McKee, Rebecca Pike, Jordanna Seymour, Kim Coventry, Lisa Mackey, Donna Calvert, Karen Butler, Jade Ooi (used to beat Szili), Laura Harkness, Hadas Zabusky, Kimberley Risson, Michelle Grobby, Jodi Richardson, I could name heaps more but you would say "Who are they" and these would be players like Sharni Rothacker who was number 1 nationally at one stage and went on to play Aust Open juniors etc before deciding not to go pro!.

kyiki2000
Sep 7th, 2003, 05:25 AM
my point is forget the juniors, forget talking about the juniors coming through and being numba 1, and focus on the touring professioanls who are actually out there at the moment playing professional tournaments and giving it their hundred percent. You know even the pro's who are up there took years to get to those top 100 spots, Peter L completed college before turning Pro and is only blossoming now. I know alot of you support the Aussie players and this tread wasn't directed at you guys but more at the people who arn't offering support for these players. Like recently I noticed aussie player Rebecca Turner getting completely slammed when it wasn't at all justified. Just to give you some background info on this player. She quit tennis in 1999 and hadn't picked up a raquet for three years til she returned to tennis basically this year. It's been a very difficult year for her as ahe funds her tennis completely on her own, she is in her final year of a psychology degree, is a volunteer surflifsaver, has beaten players such as Jelena D in juniors, and is extremely talented. In a recent interview she stated that returing to tennis is one of the hardest things she's eva done. She may be struggling a little this year but I quarentee she will find her form and start kicking some serious butt. I'm not sure if most of you guys have seen her, but she is an absolute stunner, blonde hair, blue eye's, Aussie's own Anna K. Plus she always takes time out to talk to anyone who approaches her, and most other players think she's one of the nicest players on the tour. I have her bio at home I might post it, along with other Aussie players bio's, maybe we could all start and dedicate a thread to the less loved Aussie Battlers.

AUSBOY
Sep 7th, 2003, 07:03 AM
Kyiki2000, you bring up an interesting point about players coming back from a long layout whether it be injury or study.

There have been several players that have attempted comebacks but then quit quite soon after as it became just too hard financially as i does take a long while to get the confidence up and to start getting wins on the board.

Examples are Emily Hewson, Melanie Clayton, Nadia Johnston etc.

A good example of how quickly a player can lose form is Annabel Ellwood. She took a 14 month break from tennis before playing State Pennant, and she is losing to girls that lose 1st round qualies at the $25K Challengers. Now you would think Annabel was in a way much higher league than the Laura Harkness's of this world but the difference really is a little bit more consistency and confidence, and these things aren't gained overnight!

People think just because a player continually loses 1st or 2nd round of Qualies often that they are a crap player. Karen Butler for instance struggled to get 0.75 points and secure a 1100's ranking yet she had wins over top 150 players in local non-ITF event tournaments.

I'm sure people there are many people on here that think Rebecca Turner has very little ability because she's had a lot of bagels, but until she's had a couple of years playing full time again I dont think we can scoff or say she has no ability as it can take that long to regain confidence!

In much higher ranks it took players like Chanda Rubin, Janette Husarova, Julie Halard-Decugis etc a good 18 months + to return to top level after injury.

broncosven
Sep 7th, 2003, 07:10 AM
I know alot of you support the Aussie players and this tread wasn't directed at you guys but more at the people who arn't offering support for these players. Like recently I noticed aussie player Rebecca Turner getting completely slammed when it wasn't at all justified.


Only one person spoke against Rebeca Turner and he got punished for it

We love all our players and yes that is true that bec is an ' aussie battler'

SM
Sep 7th, 2003, 09:37 AM
if TA had provided better support for juniors, then people like Bec Turner and other talented juniors wont face the tough decision to leave tennis early, or have to try and make a come back years later...

Ofcourse all our players (seniors inclusive) need support and i agree that hardly any of our top juniors will make even the top 500, but i would like to see them atleast be given the chance to try and get there...

SM
Sep 7th, 2003, 09:49 AM
i think its also important for juniors to be given the opportunity to go out there and give it a go backed by the support of ta, cos that is the time where lots of juniors decide whether to pursue a career or quit, and we dont wanna lose alot of players early on...

rebecca have u been to wollongong ...i think i mightve spoken to u b4, or i might be wrong and its some1 else im thinking of.

kyiki2000
Sep 7th, 2003, 10:47 AM
I completely agree that confidence is the key issue, I think it is a little extreme for us to even assume that any of these players have little ability, I mean they may lose and lose badly but they are the professionals, and the calibre of players isn't exactly afternoon comp standard. Rebecca would I'm sure be the first to agree that being baguled isn't something she is proud of, but even the players playing in the u.s open get baguled. Not to mention somethimes the score doesn't reflect the match. I agree juniors should be given the chance but why should juniors be given a free ride when seniors are supporting themselves, I mean there is the same percentage that one of australia's juniors will go all the way as one of our seniors. Age is a state of mind, just look at Agassi.

kyiki2000
Sep 7th, 2003, 10:49 AM
p.s emily has been out with knee injury, but after surgury she is back training full time, and will compete is Aus challengers.

Vicky88
Sep 7th, 2003, 07:45 PM
Interesting to hear about trying to make it from the other side. I know it is easy for us to sit on our computers and make judgements but we do try and support Aussie players even if they are ranked 1000. The one person who was bitch about Rebecca got pulled into line quickly.

Maybe what they should do is make funding available thru a sponsoring system where they get paid so much per year to compete, as in a salary, and a certain percentage of their winnings is paid back to TA. As they get more successful they can pay back more of the loan. That would allow the players a chance to plan an entire years schedule without having to worry about being able to afford a plane ticket to the next tournament.

AUSBOY
Sep 8th, 2003, 01:45 AM
What is the point of investing millions on our juniors, and then hardly anything on seniors? The funding needs to be evenly distributed

Its currently very skewed!

I mean they really offer nothing to senior players except the following

The last few years we have seen a training camp started in December, whilst this gives helps the seniors a little, its has been prodominently done to help with Junior Development.

Their are ranking rewards, these are once off cash payments for breaking rankings of 400, 300, 250, 200, 150, 100 and 50. Ironically the cash awards get bigger the lower the ranking breakthrough, I thinks its something like $20,000 for breaking into the top 50 compared to $1000 for breaking into the top 400! I dont think a cash reward should be offered for the top 50 IMO as Alicia and Nicole are very financially secure, I think a trophy or certificate is all thats required.

The only other support Senior players get is free usage of facilities at the tennis ranches in Germany, Hong Kong and some other country.

There is also the Optus Squad which is 4 players ranked between 1-300 and basically a coach is provided for the year.

So in all very little support. The wildcards are the only other thing they get, and IMO these should be reserved only for senior players or juniors that have already proven themselves in Junior Grand Slams/Orange Bowl because if they can't succeed in those pressured events they have no hope in Seniors! The idea of wildcards is to give a borderline ranked player the breakthrough chance they need and some help financially, not to line the pockets of a 14yo so she can buy some CD's and clothes, especially when there is no guarantee that this junior will even keep playing or attempt getting a senior rank!

The juniors on the other hand get all their travel expenses paid when representing Australia or their State, and there are a lot of these team events! They also have a lot of training camps for juniors for which everything is provided except transport there. Plus all the very top Juniors are flown abroad initially to compete in Junior events to get their junior rankings up. Basically all the accomodation overseas that is provided is 4 or 5 star as well. Do I need to use Jelena Dokic as an example? Over a $1 million dollars was invested in her! Can I ask how much money was invested in Nicole Pratt? She's done is all herself, as has Molik Ironically! Both werent really discovered until 15-16 and have had limited help from the AIS to get to where they are now.

Perhaps if more money had been invested in Nicole as a 18-20yo she would have got her rank up before the age of 26! Same deal with Guse. Who knows maybe is someone like McShea or Dittmann had more assistance it wouldnt have taken 10years+ to crack the top 200!

louloubelle
Sep 9th, 2003, 06:34 AM
Sorry Im another that thinks that the comments on here are constructive and realistic, not full of bagging and disrespect.

Totally agree the funding is skewed. I have no interest in juniors getting substantial assistance if they have no talent, but just capable of smacking girls in their age group. Alternatively why would you spend money on someone floundering in the 300's only because their lazy and diet consists of pasta and chocolate. It's an individual thing, just like coaching, and should be treated as such.

Just getting to Nicole Pratt – she is a victim of the Australian junior, AIS system. Nicole was supported as a junior along with Godridge & Sharpe. She played all the junior slams, received some ‘upcoming talent’ senior Aus wildcards. However she floundered for years after that with her junior ride not helping one bit in the senior ranks.

A change of attitude, a move to the US in which was a huge risk financially, a more dedicated training regime, hiring of a coach and acceptance of advice from Lesley Bowrey was the instigator of her rise up the ranks. So she’s not really a hard luck story, the battler given nothing and then makes it good.

She’s a classic case of being sheltered and loved as a junior by Tennis Aus and then floundering afterwards. Only a change of attitude has gotten her where she is. Hopefully the likes of Evie D may see this.

TS
Sep 9th, 2003, 07:58 AM
my point is forget the juniors, forget talking about the juniors coming through and being numba 1, and focus on the touring professioanls who are actually out there at the moment playing professional tournaments and giving it their hundred percent.

That's what we DO :) In case you haven't noticed most of us here support ALL of the girls.

Juniors, seniors, higher ranked players, lower ranked players...hell we've got em covered.

No-ones talking about any of the junior kids making no.1 (LOL), hell, I think most of them will struggle to make the top 300. But if I and others wish to discuss their fortunes, then so be it! It's a tennis forum afterall...

I'm not going to add to the discussion of funding, talent etc cos I've said it all before...and it's all been said here :)

AUSBOY
Sep 10th, 2003, 01:53 AM
That's what we DO :) In case you haven't noticed most of us here support ALL of the girls.

Juniors, seniors, higher ranked players, lower ranked players...hell we've got em covered.

No-ones talking about any of the junior kids making no.1 (LOL), hell, I think most of them will struggle to make the top 300. But if I and others wish to discuss their fortunes, then so be it! It's a tennis forum afterall...

I'm not going to add to the discussion of funding, talent etc cos I've said it all before...and it's all been said here :)


Your just too lazy and cant be bothered retyping your opinions! Lets be honest now hehe

TS
Sep 10th, 2003, 07:37 AM
Ah bite me :p

Exactly. I can't be arsed!