PDA

View Full Version : Is Tamarine Tanasugarn simple/naive?


baleineau
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:47 PM
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bashing thread.

But has anyone else thought the same thing after seeing Tamarine play, either on the telly or live? To me, she has a lovely smile and an infectious manner, but there's something that suggests she's a little simple and naive as well.

It's hard to explain I guess. She's not quite in Justine's category of looking a bit childlike, but it seems there's something going on there with Tamarine.

Any thoughts, from anyone who knows more about her? Or perhaps it's just a trick of the light, or my imagination.

Glenn
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:49 PM
And I guess Conchita, Magui or Rita look normal to you?

V.Melb
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:50 PM
She has a bloody LAW DEGREE!

Based on that fact alone, She's more intellegent then 90 percent of the other players!

Thats what u get for having a bubbly personality these days :rolleyes: :(

baleineau
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:51 PM
wow, i didn't know she had a degree in law. that's impressive. must have been hard to balance being a pro and studying.

clearly she isn't simple then. :o

CC
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:53 PM
It's hard to explain I guess. She's not quite in Justine's category of looking a bit handicapped/crippled, but it seems there's something going on there with Tamarine.



Don't kill me please. :D
This is probably a compliment, but for who I can't really tell.

Brαm
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:56 PM
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bashing thread.

But has anyone else thought the same thing after seeing Tamarine play, either on the telly or live? To me, she has a lovely smile and an infectious manner, but there's something that suggests she's a little simple as well.

It's hard to explain I guess. She's not quite in Justine's category of looking a bit handicapped/crippled, but it seems there's something going on there with Tamarine.

Any thoughts, from anyone who knows more about her? Or perhaps it's just a trick of the light, or my imagination.
I don't think Tammy's sister will appreciate a thread like this one, if she reads it.. :(
You do know that Tammy's sister often posts on this board right?
Please get it deleted :(

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:57 PM
Tammy is one my favourites and not only don't I take offense by your comments, I know exactly what you mean. I've seen her play live 3 times and Tammy's very sweet but there's a real innocence or wholesome quality about her that makes her appear to be "naive". Sometimes I think of her as a "woman-child". I see her as being very idealistic and being upset if she heard you speak unkindly of others. I admire that about Tammy. :)

baleineau
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:59 PM
I don't think Tammy's sister will appreciate a thread like this one, if she reads it.. :(
You do know that Tammy's sister often posts on this board right?
Please get it deleted :(


I think we've just clarified that she's obviously not simple if she has a law degree.

and what do you have against being simple anyways??

If tammy's sister is as smart as Tammy, she'll see that no harm was intended with this thread. I like Tammy. I met her at Birmingham. She was very friendly, very giggly. Compared with the other players, she was a breath of fresh air. But I also thought she might be simple. And there's no crime in that.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 02:59 PM
yeah, what a woman child. how many women childs have law degrees?

she's a smart woman. respect her, please.

baleineau
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:01 PM
thanks Curtis. This is what I meant to say, but didn;t choose the right words.

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:07 PM
yeah, what a woman child. how many women childs have law degrees?

she's a smart woman. respect her, please.

I have loads of respect for Tammy! As I said, she's one of my favourites but I don't treat my favourites like idols where I can't say anything remotely critical about their game or personality. I admire her more than most tennis fans, many of whom only see her as "that girl who gets the 4th round of Wimbledon every year" and not much else. When you see her play in person, you can see the little girl in her when she dumps forehands into the net or argue line calls. It's very sweet to see but there's a part of me that wants to go out on the court and hold her hand during changeovers to get her through the match. :o

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:11 PM
you can't base intelligence on looks:(
lucky the person in this case has a law degree wich says enough:)

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:12 PM
I have loads of respect for Tammy! As I said, she's one of my favourites but I don't treat my favourites like idols where I can't say anything remotely critical about their game or personality. I admire her more than most tennis fans, many of whom only see her as "that girl who gets the 4th round of Wimbledon every year" and not much else. When you see her play in person, you can see the little girl in her when she dumps forehands into the net or argue line calls. It's very sweet to see but there's a part of me that wants to go out on the court and hold her hand during changeovers to get her through the match. :o

well, i know you don't mean any disrespect, but do you think tammy would like to be called a "woman child"?

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:15 PM
you can't base intelligence on looks:(
lucky the person in this case has a law degree wich says enough:)

I know that irma but we're all humans, and as humans we make observations about people based on their looks, among other things. None of us really know the players so our perceptions of them are based on what we read and what we see. I realise I may be wrong but naivete is one of the things that Tammy projects when I've seen her in person (3 times).

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:17 PM
lucky the person in this case has a law degree wich says enough:)

Irma that's naive, sorry. Just because a person goes to uni and gets a degree of any sort does NOT make them intelligent. All it says is that they were disciplined enough to graduate.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:19 PM
I doubt she is naive with a law degree. if she wants to be lawyer you can't trust everybody;)

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:21 PM
well, i know you don't mean any disrespect, but do you think tammy would like to be called a "woman child"?

She may take offense but I didn't intend for it to be an offensive comment. I hope it doesn't come across as sexist because I know some men who could be called a "man child". My dad is one.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:23 PM
so people who are going to special schools or have problems with learning are not disciplined enough?

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:24 PM
I doubt she is naive with a law degree. if she wants to be lawyer you can't trust everybody;)

I disagree. You can have a multitude of degrees and still be naive. You're presuming she's not just because Tammy graduated from Law School. It's not a guarantee.

QUESTION: have any of you ever seen her play LIVE? And I mean sat/stood there and watched an entire match or set played by Tammy?

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:25 PM
Irma that's naive, sorry. Just because a person goes to uni and gets a degree of any sort does NOT make them intelligent. All it says is that they were disciplined enough to graduate.

that's not true. it makes them intelligent enough to perform well in advanced schooling, which truly stupid people cannot do. it doesn't make her a genius, but it means she's not stupid at the very least.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:26 PM
She may take offense but I didn't intend for it to be an offensive comment. I hope it doesn't come across as sexist because I know some men who could be called a "man child". My dad is one.

it doesn't matter what you intended, that was an offensive comment. nobody wants to be called a woman child or a man child.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:27 PM
my point was about the word simply not naive

for me that are two totally different things.

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:29 PM
so people who are going to special schools or have problems with learning are not disciplined enough?

They are disciplined enough. My point is irma is that just because you go to uni and graduate does NOT guarantee that you're intelligent nor does it guarantee that you can't be naive. You were just able to discipline yourself enough for 3, 4 or 5 years to finish your studies. There are loads of intelligent, well-rounded people who didn't even finish high school. But I'm sure you know that, irma.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:30 PM
They are disciplined enough. My point is irma is that just because you go to uni and graduate does NOT guarantee that you're intelligent nor does it guarantee that you can't be naive. You were just able to discipline yourself enough for 3, 4 or 5 years to finish your studies. There are loads of intelligent, well-rounded people who didn't even finish high school. But I'm sure you know that, irma.

curtis, intelligent people don't always go to post-secondary schooling. but stupid people never do.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:33 PM
yes I know that. I can't finish a stupid degree and my learning abilities have nothing to do with it :o

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:35 PM
that's not true. it makes them intelligent enough to perform well in advanced schooling, which truly stupid people cannot do. it doesn't make her a genius, but it means she's not stupid at the very least.

They were intelligent enough to read what they needed to read, pass exams, etc. That's all. Anyone with the right amount of discipline can do it whether it be advanced schooling or undergrad. Yes, some people have their limitations but with proper tutoringand motivation, it is quite possible they can pass the advanced exams. I just graduated from uni and while it was gratifying to learn, the uni experience of finding myself and planning my future was the richer experience. Most of the courses I took I will have no real use for down the line.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:38 PM
They were intelligent enough to read what they needed to read, pass exams, etc. That's all. Anyone with the right amount of discipline can do it whether it be advanced schooling or undergrad. Yes, some people have their limitations but with proper tutoringand motivation, it is quite possible they can pass the advanced exams. I just graduated from uni and while it was gratifying to learn, the uni experience of finding myself and planning my future was the richer experience. Most of the courses I took I will have no real use for down the line.

that she did it precludes her from being stupid. i don't see why you cannot admit this.

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:39 PM
curtis, intelligent people don't always go to post-secondary schooling. but stupid people never do.

Not true. I went to a state school, considered the 2nd best in my state and there were loads of stupid people there, just drifting (and hoping to prolong the secondary school experience). They did well enough to get into the uni but once they got there they went to pot.

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:43 PM
yes I know that. I can't finish a stupid degree and my learning abilities have nothing to do with it :o

Irma, you know yourself better than anyone else so only you can tell me if it's really a learning disability or a lack of motivation or a lack of self-confidence or...

There's no reason why you can't finish your degree...but then again you may have personal reasons that would be inappropriate to share on the board. I apologise if I'm going where I shouldn't.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:43 PM
Not true. I went to a state school, considered the 2nd best in my state and there were loads of stupid people there, just drifting (and hoping to prolong the secondary school experience). They did well enough to get into the uni but once they got there they went to pot.

you've never seen true stupidity then.

Hulet
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:43 PM
Irma that's naive, sorry. Just because a person goes to uni and gets a degree of any sort does NOT make them intelligent. All it says is that they were disciplined enough to graduate.
I kind of agree. I see a lot of people who honestly shouldn't graduate from university do so b/c they are good at cheating. There is too many of them too. F-ing cheaters. :(
Note: I am not implying Tammy did so. :)

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:46 PM
that she did it precludes her from being stupid. i don't see why you cannot admit this.

King Lindsay, I never said Tammy was stupid. I said she was naive. The reason I went into the uni explanation is because irma mentioned Tammy's Law Degree as if it was the utlimate solution to this discussion about Tammy's "simplicity". Tammy's intelligence has never been in question here.

King Lindsay
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:47 PM
King Lindsay, I never sais Tammy was stupid. I said she was naive. The reason I went into the uni explanation is because irma mentioned Tammy's Law Degree as if it was the utlimate solution to this discussion about Tammy's "simplicity". Tammy's intelligence has never been in question here.

it was by balineau. and if you were debating her "simplicity", you were debating her intelligence, not her naivete. as that is what that term refers to.

if what you were saying is that she is naive, that's fine. maybe she is. we don't really have any way of knowing.

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:50 PM
you've never seen true stupidity then.

Oh I have. I went to secondary school with them, worked part time with them, went to uni with them, currently interning with them. Remember: you don't need high marks to graduate.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:53 PM
Irma, you know yourself better than anyone else so only you can tell me if it's really a learning disability or a lack of motivation or a lack of self-confidence or...

There's no reason why you can't finish your degree...but then again you may have personal reasons that would be inappropriate to share on the board. I apologise if I'm going where I shouldn't.

no my case has nothing to do with learning problems, not even my not excisting confidence since I mostly get a c and pass even at a bad day. it has other more complicated reasons and I don't want to accept that so I keep whining about it. while I first should move on and do other things;)

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:55 PM
it was by balineau. and if you were debating her "simplicity", you were debating her intelligence, not her naivete. as that is what that term refers to.

if what you were saying is that she is naive, that's fine. maybe she is. we don't really have any way of knowing.

I made reference to her naivete (her on court demeanor) but you didn't comment on it. You didn't answer if you've seen her play live which is where I got the impression that Tammy was naive.

We'll never know if Tammy's naive but will we ever really know anything about our players' personalities that we know 100% to be true? So much of our opinions of the players are based one-way observations. One of mine is that I think one of my favourites is naive.

TS
Jun 24th, 2003, 03:59 PM
I'm trying to get my head around this thread...but can't.

I guess I'm just simple :D

Hurley
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:03 PM
I think it's quite evident who is actually simple after reading this thread, Terr. ;)

TS
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:04 PM
It's Tammy right? ;)

*OK, off to bed*

Greenout
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:05 PM
I can answer this one. It's a cultural thing.
I guess if you never been to Thailand, Nepal or
even Bali and are a cynical Westerner they might
look naive or child-like. These cultures/people
are just so much more open, and laid back. It has
nothing to do with so called "simpleness".

It actually has to do with a higher awareness of
yourself. It's not about being a jerk, aggro or
arrogant.

Thai's a mellow, ok. End of story.

Greenout
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:06 PM
I can answer this one. It's a cultural thing.
I guess if you never been to Thailand, Nepal or
even Bali and are a cynical Westerner they might
look naive or child-like. These cultures/people
are just so much more open, and laid back. It has
nothing to do with so called "simpleness".

It actually has to do with a higher awareness of
yourself. It's not about being a jerk, aggro or
arrogant. It's about one's own way into the world
with dignity.

Thai's are mellow, ok. End of story. It has to do alot with
religion. It's just not a cultural thing in Thailand to be judgemental
or confrontational.

Messenger
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:10 PM
On a side note, does anyone remember a poster here saying that Paradorn was ogling their sister? lol

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:13 PM
I can answer this one. It's a cultural thing.
I guess if you never been to Thailand, Nepal or
even Bali and are a cynical Westerner they might
look naive or child-like. These cultures/people
are just so much more open, and laid back. It has
nothing to do with so called "simpleness".

It actually has to do with a higher awareness of
yourself. It's not about being a jerk, aggro or
arrogant.

Thai's a mellow, ok. End of story.

Greenout, I understand completely about cultural differences but that's how I see Tammy. For example, in her walk, there's something "simple" about it. It doesn't have any authority (she slouches a bit). My 8 year old niece walks exactly like her. Tammy's facial expressions during matches illustrate that naivete as well. Again, it's just my perception. I apologise to those of you that are offended.

Greenout
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:14 PM
Well...all I can say is head to Chiang Mai in
Thailand and you'll see everyone walking around
like that!!!

Greenout
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:17 PM
Go to Indonesia, Thailand or Nepal and
walk around really quickly, and act like
you usually do back in the states when you
think your late for work or an appointment,
and watch people stare at you for being
what they consider an intense weirdo. :)

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:17 PM
Well...all I can say is head to Chiang Mai in
Thailand and you'll see everyone walking around
like that!!!

Perhaps I'm looking at it through Westernised eyes but as a fan of Tammy's, I wanted to answer balineau's question truthfully.

irma
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:19 PM
Go to Indonesia, Thailand or Nepal and
walk around really quickly, and act like
you usually do back in the states when you
think your late for work or an appointment,
and watch people stare at you for being
what they consider an intense weirdo. :)

really? I would not fit there then at all I hate it to be late for anything :angel:

Curtis F
Jun 24th, 2003, 04:20 PM
Go to Indonesia, Thailand or Nepal and
walk around really quickly, and act like
you usually do back in the states when you
think your late for work or an appointment,
and watch people stare are you for being
what they consider an intense weirdo. :)

Greenout, I didn't say I thought Tammy was a "weirdo" and it's not just her walk but her on-court demeanor where I see naivete.

Benny
Jun 25th, 2003, 09:05 AM
I have seen Tammy play matches live on TV and in person.
I must say that when I see her play the four times I have, she has won 3 of them, (lost to Hantuchova 6-7 1-6).
I don't know what you are really talking about when you say she is simple and naive. Tammy is always fighting hard looking confident.
I remember when she was playing Sfar and Tammy had set point went for a winner, made it, Sfar caused a racket that the ball was out, Tammy just walked over to her chair and sat down, keeping her composure.
Tammy has a bright bubbly personality and is obviously very smart. This makes her the oppisite of naive.
If her loss to Morigami has strangthen these thoughts of you on her then I think you should think back two weeks ago when she gave Lisa Raymond a belting 6-2 6-2 and loosing 7-6 in the 3rd to Daniliidou.
I don't really know what your talking about but she wins more matches than she looses therefore it works out in a positive for her.
Admire Tammy for her personality and talent, don't look at her if she is simple or naive. I know she is one of the most popular players on the tour and she deserves the respects she gets.
:)

GO TAMMY FOREVER:worship:

Diya
Jun 25th, 2003, 09:40 AM
All i know is thet Tammy is a real sweetheart :hearts: :drool:

Curtis F
Jun 25th, 2003, 12:27 PM
I have seen Tammy play matches live on TV and in person.
I must say that when I see her play the four times I have, she has won 3 of them, (lost to Hantuchova 6-7 1-6).
I don't know what you are really talking about when you say she is simple and naive. Tammy is always fighting hard looking confident.
I remember when she was playing Sfar and Tammy had set point went for a winner, made it, Sfar caused a racket that the ball was out, Tammy just walked over to her chair and sat down, keeping her composure.
Tammy has a bright bubbly personality and is obviously very smart. This makes her the oppisite of naive.
If her loss to Morigami has strangthen these thoughts of you on her then I think you should think back two weeks ago when she gave Lisa Raymond a belting 6-2 6-2 and loosing 7-6 in the 3rd to Daniliidou.
I don't really know what your talking about but she wins more matches than she looses therefore it works out in a positive for her.
Admire Tammy for her personality and talent, don't look at her if she is simple or naive. I know she is one of the most popular players on the tour and she deserves the respects she gets.
:)

GO TAMMY FOREVER:worship:

Benny, it has nothing to do with Tammy's tennis abilities nor does it have anything to do with her intellect. All I'm saying is that based on 3 in-person appearances, I came away with varied impressions of Tammy. The first being that she is a sweet, genuine person. The second being that she gives 100% on the court, even when she's losing. Other feelings include her valiant attempts to remain positive during matches. Then there is the naivete issue. I realise it's judgmental of me to say that but don't we analyse all facets of players' personalities?

I'm disappointed that some of you think I don't respect Tammy because nothing could be further form the truth. In my mind, you can completely respect someone and at the same time be critical of them. Just because I find Tammy naive doesn't mean that I think any less of her. For me (and my family) it's encouraging to see Tammy, Ai, Angie and the other Asian players excelling on the tour. We're very proud of them!

Experimentee
Jun 25th, 2003, 02:23 PM
I think some of you are confusing intelligence with naivety. They are both completely different things. Just because you think Tammy is naive (which i dont think so btw) does not mean she is simple.
Likewise, friendliness does not mean naivety. They are not at all related. Its incerdibly stupid to make assumptions about someones character or abilities just by looking at them. No one likes to be judged just by their looks alone.

Tammy is not unintelligent at all. You need to have a certain standard of intelligence to even get into a law degree, let alone complete one. I am currently doing a law degree and the competition to even get in is so tough, and its the same everywhere in the world. There is no way anyone studying law is stupid. There are some who dont make effort, smoke pot etc like Curtis F referred to, but that doesnt mean they are unintelligent.

Jakeev
Jun 25th, 2003, 05:46 PM
To change the subject a little I really wish Tammy would devote herself more to the game. I really think she could be a top 15 player but she does not seem motivated enough to beyond that.

She is a great girl and probably one of THE nicest players on tour. But like Amy Frazier, it drives me nuts that she is just content to be a average tennis player.

Randy H
Jun 25th, 2003, 05:58 PM
To me, when I see Tammy I think that the feeling I get from her is not that she has a lack of desire to win or be a great player, but I think she is almost too nice - She lacks a bit of a killer instinct. Occasionally I see her talking to herself or let out a bit of frustration, but overall I would like to see a bit more of a fierce attitude out there to show she's pumped up to win. She just seems like such a nice player, it's hard for me to think that she is highly intimidating to the other players because of that!

King Lindsay
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:03 PM
To change the subject a little I really wish Tammy would devote herself more to the game. I really think she could be a top 15 player but she does not seem motivated enough to beyond that.

She is a great girl and probably one of THE nicest players on tour. But like Amy Frazier, it drives me nuts that she is just content to be a average tennis player.

I'm sorry, jakeev, but what gives you the impression she's not motivated enough or just content to stay where she is? Personally I feel she's only as good as a stable top 30 player, where she has closed the last three seasons.

apoet29
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:14 PM
Definitions for simple from Dictionary.com

simĚple ( P ) Pronunciation Key (smpl)
adj. simĚpler, simĚplest
Having or composed of only one thing, element, or part. See Synonyms at pure.
Not involved or complicated; easy: a simple task. See Synonyms at easy.
Being without additions or modifications; mere: a simple “yes” or “no.”
Having little or no ornamentation; not embellished or adorned: a simple dress.
Not elaborate, elegant, or luxurious. See Synonyms at plain.
Unassuming or unpretentious; not affected.

Having or manifesting little sense or intelligence.
Uneducated; ignorant.
Unworldly or unsophisticated. See Synonyms at naive.
Not guileful or deceitful; sincere.
Humble or lowly in condition or rank: a simple woodcutter.
Ordinary or common: a simple head cold.

Being a fundamental or rudimentary element; basic.
Not important or significant; trivial.
Biology. Having no divisions or branches; not compound: a simple leaf; a simple eye or lens.
Music. Being without figuration or elaboration: a simple tone.

n.
A single component of a complex, especially one that is unanalyzable.
A fool; a simpleton.
A person of humble birth or condition.
A medicinal plant or the medicine obtained from it.

apoet29
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:16 PM
Considering the context of the word in its description of Tammy, I don't view it as an insult. Yet, I hardly think that it completely describes her as a person. Like anyone else, Tammy is more complex than any of us know, even those of us who have met her. I do not believe that it is fair to characterize someone as being "simple," "arrogant," etc without having really known them.

Curtis F
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:19 PM
No one likes to be judged just by their looks alone.

I wasn't referring to physical looks (Tammy's complexion, eye color, hair texture, etc). I was referring to her facial expressions and body language. Everyone does that. Look at the reports that posters file after attending tournaments. "She looked really sweet", "He looked arrogant and unfriendly", etc.

Randy H, I agree. Tammy should have a more fierce attitude and because she doesn't, players aren't necessarily intimidated by her.

Curtis F
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:21 PM
Considering the context of the word in its description of Tammy, I don't view it as an insult. Yet, I hardly think that it completely describes her as a person. Like anyone else, Tammy is more complex than any of us know, even those of us who have met her. I do not believe that it is fair to characterize someone as being "simple," "arrogant," etc without having really known them.

No offense apoet29 but if that's the case than none of the posters here should make assertions about any of the players because we don't know them. I'm not angry (sorry if it sounds that way) but that's the only reply I have to your most recent post.

apoet29
Jun 25th, 2003, 06:50 PM
No offense apoet29 but if that's the case than none of the posters here should make assertions about any of the players because we don't know them. I'm not angry (sorry if it sounds that way) but that's the only reply I have to your most recent post.

No insults here. Just say what you really feel! ;)

I was talking about the originial thread starter who seemed to feel that Tammy was just a simple person. Perhaps it was the language used to describe Tammy that I and others seemed to have a problem with. The other posts seemed to come from people who have met her and know a little bit about her.

I agree that no one should make assertions about players without knowing them, but often times that happens because we are trying to figure them out.

Kirt12255
Jun 25th, 2003, 07:15 PM
:wavey: Tammi got her law degree...while most of her opponents were living their fathers dreams.

Tammi has something if she decides to leave tennis.

They are few and far between....however. Look at a big point....brain over-rides a formed power mind.

Tami isn't stupid....she hasn't the power...placement...and mind to match the best....she does have....to make more than we will in a lifetime every year....she will retire within 3 years...my thought. :wavey:

kyk710
Jun 25th, 2003, 09:49 PM
I am really confused. How can you tell that someone is simple/naive just from watching them play? I would think that those are things that you can only find out about a person by talking to them.... Maybe you are confused about what naivete really is??? Or maybe I am.... Someone help me!

Jakeev
Jun 25th, 2003, 10:40 PM
I'm sorry, jakeev, but what gives you the impression she's not motivated enough or just content to stay where she is? Personally I feel she's only as good as a stable top 30 player, where she has closed the last three seasons.

Her highest ranking I think at one time was 19. And then she went backward instead of forward. If she is content being a stable top 30 player so be it, but I still feel she is not realizing her real potential.

Another poster said she does not have the power of mind to be a better player. I totally disagree with that. If she has the mind to have gotten a law degree, than she certainly had the power and mind to be a more successful tennis player.

TammysBigSis
Jun 26th, 2003, 05:31 AM
Hello there, Tammy Fans.

I was alerted to this "controversial" thread. I'm not upset, but I am confused. Perhaps some people have a different definition of "naive" than I do.

If you believe Tammy is naive, then I must be more so. In terms of her judgment off the court, I think Tammy shows better intuition in terms of character judgment than I do. I make friends easily, but as a result, I sometimes get burned by my caution being not what it should. She is constantly reminding me to be more careful.

By "simple," do you mean that she is easy going? That she is. But I agree with Greenout's cultural interpretation of Asian nationalities. Thai people are easy going and fun-loving.

I also agree with most of you out there who says Tammy does not have enough of a killer instinct. I mutter that all the time when I am courtside and I don't see her smashing overheads with real authority. I really think she could have beaten Capriati at the JP Morgan Chase Open last summer, or Momo this spring at Indian Wells, but she always left the door open.

Her body language on the court is not good, but she is not the only player that has that problem (Davenport is another player who doesn't hide how she feels about a bad shot). My sister and I are a lot alike in that we lack self-confidence (perhaps another Asian upbringing by-product? too much humbleness?), we get down on ourselves, and our negative feelings always last much longer than our positive feelings. Sometimes we don't realize what we have accomplished, or don't believe we deserve all the praise we are getting. That's why I really wish she would find a sports psychologist or a new coach to help her tap into the positives.

I would not view Tammy's slide in rank from 19 to 30-something as an indication that she is slumping. Ask any player on the tour...it is much easier to get higher in the ranks than to stay there, because unless you are consistant, it is hard to duplicate your successes in tournaments year after year.

I think it is quite remarkable that she reached the last 16 at Wimbledon for five years running. I am extremely proud of my sister. Hats off to Morigami for doing her homework and having a better match than Tammy yesterday. I know Tammy is capable of doing more than her rank shows, but she has to decide to make the changes in her training, coaching, etc. to get her back to the Top 20.

The bottom line is this: she *is* like Amy Frazier in that they are both players who are in the sport for the love of tennis, not for the love of the media attention or prize money. Tammy has often complained of being tired of the players who are on the tour for the wrong reasons, and I think she is often more mentally challenged than physically challenged by the rigors of the week-in week-out travel of the WTA Tour.

She will keep playing as long as it is fun for her and as long as she is healthy.

Any comments or questions are welcome.

disposablehero
Jun 26th, 2003, 05:38 AM
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bashing thread.

But has anyone else thought the same thing after seeing Tamarine play, either on the telly or live? To me, she has a lovely smile and an infectious manner, but there's something that suggests she's a little simple and naive as well.

It's hard to explain I guess. She's not quite in Justine's category of looking a bit childlike, but it seems there's something going on there with Tamarine.

Any thoughts, from anyone who knows more about her? Or perhaps it's just a trick of the light, or my imagination.

She must be naive and simple, she's not from the same culture as you.

Cam'ron Giles
Jun 26th, 2003, 05:39 AM
WOW, YOU MUST BE SO PROUD...HATS OFF TO YOU FOR STICKING UP FOR YOUR LITTLE SISTER...:worship:

TammysBigSis
Jun 26th, 2003, 05:55 AM
Just curious...do you also think Paradorn is simple/naive?

I think both Tammy and Paradorn have a lot of fans because they can still laugh and smile (usually) even when they blow the easiest shot. I've often heard the crowd laugh when Tammy lets out an "Aaaaack!" They both have really good sportsmanship. Perhaps too good.

Yes, the smiling face is hard to fear, and makes the "Taminator" vulnerable to opponents who are more determined and "serious" about their game.

Perhaps that is precisely the problem...Tammy doesn't have a "game face," or too often has one that looks like this :) .

irma
Jun 26th, 2003, 06:05 AM
Ai has it too

a lot of asian people have something soft in their face( it's very attractive) maybe that's why it doesn't look like they have a killerinstinct

but I still don't understand the comparing between simple and naive :confused: