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View Full Version : Bielik and Baltacha and others; bradhsaw, lucic etc.?


Gowza
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:11 PM
they both reached the 3rd round of their home grand slam last year, each as a wildcard. they showed some promising signs that they may compete with the top 15. where are they now? as much as i hate to say it they are both struggling at the challenger level. i want them to be top 15 players but i'm starting to lose hope. i know it is early in their careers but if you see someone performing at the level of the 3rd round in a grand slam, the round of 32, you expect that they can at least win challenger tournaments that are against players ranked in the 200's to 500's. even if they weren't playing well, if you have seen the player compete at the top 32 level you would thik they would at least be able to win a round in a wta event let alone in a challenger event. but this isn't happening and then i think back to bradshaw, 3rd round us open, the tops players said "with her serve she will be top 10 by next year" and she is ranked in the 300's and is still dropping. i guess the same sort of thing happened to lucic.

this thread is to cheer for the players that have once looked to be so promising but are now struggling.

i wish you all the best and hope to see you on t.v. once more.

rated_next
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:13 PM
Bea just competed in her first tournament this year - give her some time.

Elena has been struggling this year though.

Gowza
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:37 PM
bea actually played really well in that tournament. the two matches she won were 6-1 6-2 and 6-1 6-1 i think. but then she lost a three set match.

but i expect them to be playing at at least a top 150 or top 200 standard and they clearly are not.

BK4ever
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:41 PM
Hopefully Bea wil make a move this year. I think she just needs to play a few more matches to get her confidence up.

Sometimes doing well in a slam too early hurts a player. They start to put too much pressure on themselves.

england_rules
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:51 PM
Bally has liver damage and is obviously feeling the effects of it! Give her time and she will give us her Wimbledon showing again!

*JR*
Feb 12th, 2003, 11:56 PM
Bally is just playing back into shape after an autoimmune condition that left her easily fatigued and really challenged some of the best doctors in Britain. BTW, surprise, surprise: I called her @ her hotel in NYC with good wishes during the Bronx Challenge last year (post 9/11 NYC, now) and she DID NOT FREAK OR CALL THE COPS, wonder of wonders... (similar to this Jan. when I spoke to "the nice Nathalie" after her injury @ Canberra). I wasn't going to let you-know-who "intimidate me", PLUS these 2 deserved it, esp. Bally who was really sick for awhile. Bea won the 2002 NCAA championship (playing for North Carolina's Wake Forest University) as the 2nd ranked player, blowing away the smaller and lighter Jessica Lehnhoff from Univ. of Florida (#1 going in) in the final. (Lisa Raymond won that title @ Florida in '93, BTW). Bea was like a collegiate equivilant of Linzi with her 6' 1" frame and booming serve, surprised she's had so little consistency as a pro so far.

sartrista7
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:37 AM
Originally posted by Gowza
they both reached the 3rd round of their home grand slam last year, each as a wildcard. they showed some promising signs that they may compete with the top 15. where are they now? as much as i hate to say it they are both struggling at the challenger level. i want them to be top 15 players but i'm starting to lose hope.

Top 15? Are you quite sane? Bea and Bally are damn good players and they should be proud of their Slam performances, but top 15... at no point did they show anything like that much potential. If you could restrain yourself from labelling every power player with a decent serve who has one good result as a future top player, you'd be able to see that neither have been all that disappointing. Bally's won a couple of $25ks - despite her health problems - and Bea's only played a handful of tournaments anyway.

ColinB
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:41 AM
why would you phone a player at her private hotel? Are u mad or something? God, give them some peace and space.. If you want to speak to them, approach them at the tennis centre.. the word stalker springs to mind.....

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:42 AM
they both made good appearances and they both showed they had great potential. at the time the players ranked from #10-15 weren't as consistent as they are now and i said COMPETE that doesn't necessarily mean i think they will be ranked up there just that they will be able to trouble them. they can improve on the way they played in those tournaments and they hae great potential.

sartrista7
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:46 AM
Originally posted by Gowza
they both made good appearances and they both showed they had great potential.

Not really. They both showed that they had good serves and good mentality. Neither displayed much court sense or consistency. Really... they are good, I'll grant you that. Maybe even top 100 good. But beating Vento-Kabchi and a slumping Coetzer, or Voracova and an ill Tanasugarn, does not make you anything special. Personally, I'll be ecstatic if Bally makes the top 100 at all.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:50 AM
bally did all that with huge liver damage so she should improve just from that reason. bielik played quite well against henin one a few points but she hadn't played enough on the tour to keep with her.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:50 AM
and you're saying third round in a grand slam isn't a good appearance?

sartrista7
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:55 AM
Third round in a slam is very good for both players, a really good result. I'm not saying they're bad players... most people in the top 200 are good. But there's a difference - a HUGE one - between a player who is good, who possesses weapons, and who can win a couple of Tour-level matches once in a while, and a player who can actually compete with the top 20 in the world.

If you hadn't noticed... Justine H-H is not very good on US hardcourts, and certainly not one of the ten best in the world.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:58 AM
how can you say henin is not one of the best 10 in the world? i respect your opinion and if you don't think she is then fine but i have my own opinion and i think she is one of the best 10 in the world.

sartrista7
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:02 AM
Read my post. ON US HARDCOURTS Justine is not one of the top ten. On clay and grass and Rebound Ace, she's... well, she's amazing. Top five if not top three. Go and look up her results on US hardcourts, and you'll find nothing to compare to what she's achieved elsewhere. It's quite logical, when you consider how she plays.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:13 AM
henin still got to the fourth rounr there which is top 16 and she may not be amazing like she is on other surfaces but she is still up there with the best.

i'm not saying they performed like a top 15 player, i'm saying they have the potential like a lot of other women do.

BK4ever
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:14 AM
Whether Bea will become top ten or not remains to be seen. The fact is, she has the potential. She needs to work on her backhand and learn to stay in rallies longer. She HAS variety, a huge serve and a HUGE forehand. If she works hard and learns to put them all together she will have a good chance to make top ten.

But thats why tennis is so great...U NEVER KNOW!

Venus Forever
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:24 AM
Bea definitely has top 10 potential. That first set with Henin-Hardenne, I think, is really what she is capable of doing. She was going toe-to-toe with Justine, until the UFE's creeped in.

Baltacha?? Haven't really seen her play, but she lost to Alexandra, who seems to be losing to everyone else, so... :rolleyes:

*JR*
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:24 AM
Originally posted by ColinB
why would you phone a player at her private hotel? Are u mad or something? God, give them some peace and space.. If you want to speak to them, approach them at the tennis centre.. the word stalker springs to mind..... At a tennis centre you get an autograph or something. And I know a doctor with a treatment I wanted Bally to ask her's about, but she declined and I just wished her well and we said goodbye. Same re. Nathalie (killing time in Canberra then anyway) and her injury the week B4 the AO (different treatment, don't know the Dr. who does it in Oz, but a Dr. I know knows one there who does it). She also declined, I said basically "Well, congratulations on winning last week", she thanked me, and we said goodbye. (I read a lot of medical literature for an old family friend who's a Dr. overwhelmed by the volume of it because he's always looking for innovative treatments for his multi-specialty practice). Neither freaked out @ all. I guess they didn't think I was "mad or something". Now Colin: do we have a caste system or the like? :confused:

sartrista7
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:30 AM
OK, Bea is a talented girl, but isn't top 10 slightly over-estimating her? I mean... Zuzana Ondraskova was going toe-to-toe with Justine today. I was pleasantly surprised by Ondraskova, and she should make the top 100, but top 10's a stretch.

Dokicfan17
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:34 AM
Bea is definitley a soon to be top twenty player, she played damn well at the OPen, winning good matches,shoing off a NICE serve and powerful weapons

what impressed me the most is even though she played very well against her loss to justine, she still felt like she should have won and still felt like she could have done better, so its nice to see she's determined

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:39 AM
i haven't seen ondraskova play she may have more potential, she may not. as i said a lot of ladies have the potential to play top 15 but they don't all make it. there are players where you can see the potential and the talent and you know they are not fulfilling it just yet. whether they do or not is up to them and what they do but you can't just deny that they have a talent.

Serendy Willick
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:41 AM
Originally posted by sartrista7
Read my post. ON US HARDCOURTS Justine is not one of the top ten. On clay and grass and Rebound Ace, she's... well, she's amazing. Top five if not top three. Go and look up her results on US hardcourts, and you'll find nothing to compare to what she's achieved elsewhere. It's quite logical, when you consider how she plays.

Now I dont think thats very fair, even though I do understand what you are saying. I think when she tries hard an puts her effort into it then she is capable of getting good results on the US hardcourts. In 2001, she was the only person besides Meghann Shaugnessey to even take a set off Venus on the American Hardcourts, and in the US Open that year she had to face Serena in the fourth round, (who is Monstorus on US hardcourts), I think she had a bit of an injury last year (didnt she fall on her finger or something? and sprained it?) Of course these results arent as good as her clay, rebound ace, and grass, but I do think with hard work she can get some decent results there.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:48 AM
she broke her finger when she fell on it.

Leena
Feb 13th, 2003, 03:12 AM
Well, Bea just played pretty well in Midland... so she's showing promise. I think it's way too early to say she's Top 20 material though. Yeah, she has a powerful serve, decent groundies for her size... but she really didn't show much more.

paul_masterton
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:46 PM
Elena has 0 court craft. She makes Pierce look like an olympic sprinter.

When she leanr to use her head and THINK on the court, and work on her movement then we'll see huge gains.

But she can't really do this until she's feeling 100% again.

TS
Feb 13th, 2003, 12:51 PM
I didnt see top 100 potential in Elena when I saw her play Alex in AO (admittedly I only saw the first set and she was clearly nervous)...but its obvious she can play, duds dont reach the 3rd round of slams.

But I think she can be really happy if she gets as high as 100. Top 30, let alone Top 50 is ridiculous to suggest at this point in time.

Experimentee
Feb 13th, 2003, 01:11 PM
Most low ranked players have a match a or two where they play like top 20 players, but that doesnt mean they'll keep it up, or that they'll ever be ranked that high.

Monica_Rules
Feb 13th, 2003, 05:45 PM
Paul how can you say Elena has 0 court craft.

Ok her main game play is hit the ball hard and go for winners.But in case you didn't watch most of her wimbledon matchs for the past 2 years she has some court craft she has a great slice which she used effectavely and a good drop shot which she used at the right time!

spiceboy
Feb 13th, 2003, 05:51 PM
Originally posted by Gowza
they both reached the 3rd round of their home grand slam last year, each as a wildcard. they showed some promising signs that they may compete with the top 15.

Thanx for the laughs, Gowza...beating Coetzer on grass or Bea's "excellent" run in NYC means NOTHING about being top 15..

Do you really know what it takes to get a top 15 ranking? :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Gallofa
Feb 13th, 2003, 06:32 PM
Much as I love this Bea girl :D I think she needs to work a lot on her game if she wants to do well on the WTA tour. This is not the NCAA, personally, I think she should had gone back to Wake Forest for her final year to finish her degree and get a bit more training, right after winning the NCAA last year she said she was committed to playing one more year and finishing her degree, but her "success" at the US Open might have made her change her mind. She's got a killer serve and a good forehand, there's about a 100 girls on the WTA tour that can do what she can do equally well, and they are more mentally tough and in better shape.

I do wish Bea the best, and I hope she keeps working on her game and slowly builds up a good ranking. But top15 right now is very far away.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 09:36 PM
i never said they would be top 15 just that they had the potential to get their

geewhiz
Feb 13th, 2003, 10:10 PM
I think it depends who else emerges. It seems very simple, if there are 15 people around who are better than them, then they won't be in the top 15, if there are less than 15 people better then them, then they will be in the top 15. We are not talking about a static target that they have to reach. Sometimes there is more competition and sometimes there is less, there are weak years and strong years.
There are also other variables, like whether or not they get injured, whether or not they are able to improve the current weakness in their game, etc.

Looking at what they have achieved so far, does it look likely that they would make the top 15 in an average year? I would say they have a chance, as do many other people. Plenty of people get to the 3rd round of a grand slam, particularly of their home slam, and remember they didn't actually qualify to take part in the slam, they weren't actually playing consistently at 3rd-round-in-a-slam level, instead on a one of occassion, which they have never matched before or since, they played as though they were amongst the 32 best in the world - it's been done before. As for Bea being the NCAA champion, well every year there is an NCAA champion, and where are they now? Not in the top 15, that's for sure. As far as I am aware, Lisa Raymond is the most successful former winner of the NCAA and she won it twice. Is she in the top 15? Nope.

So, if there is a weak year, then maybe they might, but looking at what they have achieved so far I would say there is no cause to champion their prospects over anyone elses.

But good luck to them. I hope they reach their potential :angel:

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 10:41 PM
people are forgetting that this isn't just about bielik and baltacha it's about players like stevenson, lucic and bradshaw that have LOOKED PROMISING but are NOW finding it hard to get back to that level.

Gowza
Feb 13th, 2003, 10:42 PM
oh, and this wasn't meant to be much of a debate, it was meant to be more of a cheering thread to give those players inspiration.

spiceboy
Feb 14th, 2003, 12:57 PM
Originally posted by Gowza
people are forgetting that this isn't just about bielik and baltacha it's about players like stevenson, lucic and bradshaw that have LOOKED PROMISING but are NOW finding it hard to get back to that level.

You're talking about 2 different things...the difference between Stevencow & Lucic and Bradshaw, Bielik & Baltacha is HUGE...as big as a place in a GS semis and a third round :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Gowza
Feb 14th, 2003, 01:01 PM
spiceboy, just cheer for someone or get out

i didn't say it had to be one of those players it could be anyone who has showed promise

spiceboy
Feb 14th, 2003, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by Gowza
spiceboy, just cheer for someone or get out



Gowza, I don't need your advice...I'll do whatever I want :kiss:

Go and get a life ;)

Gowza
Feb 14th, 2003, 01:05 PM
i started this thread and if you aren't going to speak on the topic then don't come in her.

spiceboy
Feb 14th, 2003, 01:08 PM
Relax Gowza :wavey: :kiss: :kiss: :kiss:

Jakeev
Feb 14th, 2003, 01:11 PM
Well at least in Bea's case, she definitely just needs more match play. The more she competes weekend and out, if she has the means to travel, I think you will see more consistency out of her.

paul_masterton
Feb 14th, 2003, 05:25 PM
I disagree Monica_Rules.

She doesn't mix it up well at all. She has a slice and can hit good dropshots, but seh just htis them whenever - she puts little thought into where she is going to place the ball.

I agree that alot of teh time it is affective, so it appears she is thiking ,when in actual fact she is just hitting the ball.

He talent is raw, and as a result is a bit scrappy. She neds more experience, remember she has only been on tour fro 3 years. She needs to learn how to put a point together, not just smack teh ball as hard as she can and then hit a slice randomly.

That's one of teh main things both Jo and Alan haev admitted she needs to work on, along wiht her movement.

But she's gonan be Britain's biggest thing if she can keep it up. If seh doens't she will be out of the top 250 come August when Wimbledon, Fleixstowe and Pamplona drop off.

Gowza
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:43 PM
sadly to say at the moment she doesn't look like will stay ranked where she is for to long, she looks like she will drop in the renkings even further.