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View Full Version : Who wins this: Peak Petrova or Peak Stosur?


eDonkey
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:13 AM
So, who wins this?
I believe it's much closer than one would think. Both of them are notorious for being huge underachievers, but both of them are able to dismantle almost anyone's game when at their peak. Especially on clay, though their biggest success came on hard.

H2H is 6-3 in favour of Nadia, though it is 1-0 for Stosur on clay (in 2012 - several years after the monstrous 2006 Nadia's clay season), 1-1 on grass and 5-1 on hard, though two of these matches finished with a tiebreak in the 3rd set and three of Nadia's wins came long before Sam developed her games for singles matches.

Sam's forehand to Nadia's backhand, serve to serve and error to error when it gets tough - who wins this?

Johnbert
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:18 AM
petrova all surfaces

Yoncé
Nov 22nd, 2012, 08:13 AM
Petrova in straight sets on everything but clay where Samantha could win a set.

evana
Nov 22nd, 2012, 08:59 AM
LOL Stosur underachiever?! if anything a big overachiever, cannot even win a MM title. Petrova in straights everywhere.

FORZA SARITA
Nov 22nd, 2012, 09:19 AM
LOL Stosur underachiever?! if anything a big overachiever, cannot even win a MM title. Petrova in straights everywhere.

so right :hysteric:

eDonkey
Nov 22nd, 2012, 10:05 AM
LOL Stosur underachiever?! if anything a big overachiever, cannot even win a MM title. Petrova in straights everywhere.

How can you call someone, who has lost 12 out of 15 finals, an overachiever?:confused:

lenas warriors
Nov 22nd, 2012, 10:19 AM
when she wins a slam yet cant seem to win a MM when she doesnt have to even face a seeded player/anyone in the top 60?!

Mightymirza
Nov 22nd, 2012, 12:04 PM
Sam has a better 2nd serve and a much better FH.. EVerything else Nadia is better or at least equal.. Its tough to say really :shrug:

Z1988
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:12 PM
Petrova, period.

Okay, maybe Sam may trouble Petrova more on clay, but PEAK Petrova still can beat her.

Sammo
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:14 PM
I've seen peak Petrova and she was amazing, but she wasn't near as ferocious as peak Sam on the Charleston final :shrug: Anyway, I think Sam would win in 3 on clay, Nadia would win in 3 on hardcourts and in 2 on grass.

Sammo
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:16 PM
LOL Stosur underachiever?! if anything a big overachiever, cannot even win a MM title. Petrova in straights everywhere.

so right :hysteric:

Ivanovic and Errani fans giving more importance to MM titles than to Grand Slams, Premier titles, and ranking, how surprising.

$uricate
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:30 PM
Doesn't normal Petrova stomp all over Stosur anyway?

Grigorpova
Nov 22nd, 2012, 07:32 PM
Why are people bringing up her underachievement, this is meant to be Peak Stosur it does not bring it 'bad mentality' or has anything to do with her titles, it is to do with her performance.

Anyway Stosur on clay, Petrova on hard and grass.

joeh37
Nov 23rd, 2012, 12:58 AM
Arguably Sam is at her peak now. And still struggles to beat older Nadia.
On grass there is no question it's Petrova on hard Nadia should take it. Clay is a slight leveller but Peak Nadia beat Henin on clay. Peak Stosur doesn't do that. Petrova all the way.

dencod16
Nov 23rd, 2012, 01:39 AM
Basically serve Petrova>>Stosur, backhand Petrova>>>>>>Stosur, forehand Stosur>>>>Petrova, volley Petrova>>>>>>>>>>>Stosur, footwork Petrova>>>>>Stosur, mentality Stosur>>Petrova, so basically Petrova all over.

danieln1
Nov 23rd, 2012, 02:00 AM
SvjNfNafGbA

Definelety not peak Petrova and I don´t think it´s peak Stosur either :shrug:

AcesHigh
Nov 23rd, 2012, 02:29 AM
Peak Petrova on every surface. We talked about her years ago as if she could be the best Russian of the bunch. That's obviously ridiculous now but she has/had the talent.

Helen Lawson
Nov 23rd, 2012, 02:55 AM
Ok, now this one is just plain dumb.

JCTennisFan
Nov 23rd, 2012, 03:16 AM
Lets break their games down first.

Forehand goes to Stosur... even when Petrova's forehand worked it was a bit too "windshield wiper" in its production. Stosur on the other hand has one mean forehand when on.

Backhand goes to Petrova but not by alot. Stosur's backhand is generally a craptastic shot but at the 2011 US open she proved that it can be a nice stroke when she is in form. If Stosur's backhand had let her down during that slam she would not have won it.

Serve is very close.... they both have wonderful serves at peak. Stosur's kick serve probably gives her the edge due to the rarity of it in the women's game. Its pretty much Serena and Stosur and thats it when it comes to a powerful female kick serve right now.

Movement is also close but I would say the edge is to Stosur. Petrova was never the strongest mover ever (Think Sharapova... good but not great) but Stosur can generally cover the court a little better at peak.

Finally mindset has to go to Stosur. When you beat Serena in a slam Final in the manner which Stosur did.... you have the ability to (at peak) stay focused. Petrova on the other hand is let down most by her poor mentality, seeing as how it is really the only blatant weakness she has.

So overall I would have to say Stosur though Petrova does come close. The main difference would be the fact that Stosur has proven to have better nerves under pressure and thus would more than likely win more often than lose this matchup in my opinion.

Smitten
Nov 23rd, 2012, 03:20 AM
Petrova everywhere.

eDonkey
Nov 23rd, 2012, 08:57 AM
So overall I would have to say Stosur though Petrova does come close. The main difference would be the fact that Stosur has proven to have better nerves under pressure and thus would more than likely win more often than lose this matchup in my opinion.

I don't think so. Actually Stosur has much worse nerves, you just can't judge it by one single match that happened to be a slam final.:lol:
But I believe it is Petrova becoming more mature than actually becoming more psychologically stable (not that both things are much far away from each other). At her peak Petrova won 3 consecutive titles and 6 consecutive finals while I doubt Sam has ever won a match in the next tournament after a breakthrough. You can even count that Petrova has beaten Wozniacki in a final in a 6-2 6-1 manner, this is quite hard to happen at any level.:lol:

Backhand goes to Petrova by a large margin. I mean - everyone has a good shot at their peak. You can even look at Pironkova, who has an abysmal forehand for a top 50 player, but still I remember her stringing 3 or 4 consecutive winners from her forehand in her match against Zvonareva last Wimbledon.

I suppose Petrova can eat Sam's serve as it is great by speed, but still somehow one-dimensional. In addition, Petrova is nearly 1.80m, so it won't get that much of a damage for her.

And last, I believe the margin between their stamina is much bigger. Petrova gets much more easier tired if a match comes to a 3rd set, but a usual Sam is more likely to choke it than to lose it because of fatigue.

jasonbloom
Nov 23rd, 2012, 11:21 AM
Lets break their games down first.

Forehand goes to Stosur... even when Petrova's forehand worked it was a bit too "windshield wiper" in its production. Stosur on the other hand has one mean forehand when on.

Backhand goes to Petrova but not by alot. Stosur's backhand is generally a craptastic shot but at the 2011 US open she proved that it can be a nice stroke when she is in form. If Stosur's backhand had let her down during that slam she would not have won it.

Serve is very close.... they both have wonderful serves at peak. Stosur's kick serve probably gives her the edge due to the rarity of it in the women's game. Its pretty much Serena and Stosur and thats it when it comes to a powerful female kick serve right now.

Movement is also close but I would say the edge is to Stosur. Petrova was never the strongest mover ever (Think Sharapova... good but not great) but Stosur can generally cover the court a little better at peak.

Finally mindset has to go to Stosur. When you beat Serena in a slam Final in the manner which Stosur did.... you have the ability to (at peak) stay focused. Petrova on the other hand is let down most by her poor mentality, seeing as how it is really the only blatant weakness she has.

So overall I would have to say Stosur though Petrova does come close. The main difference would be the fact that Stosur has proven to have better nerves under pressure and thus would more than likely win more often than lose this matchup in my opinion.

1. Kick serve never works to Nadia
2. Nadia's backhand is much more better even at Sam's peak
3. Nadia's return is better than Sam
4. Although Sam's forehand can produce many winners, Nadia's forehand is also very effective in hitting the ball with more top spin

Beat
Nov 23rd, 2012, 01:38 PM
peak stosur has her nerves under check, peak petrova is still a headcase.

Doesn't normal Petrova stomp all over Stosur anyway?

but that's not what this thread is about.

Cajka
Nov 23rd, 2012, 03:45 PM
but that's not what this thread is about.

How not?

JCTennisFan
Nov 23rd, 2012, 10:31 PM
How not?

Because it was debating PEAK performance. Stosur's backhand. for instance, is typically a craptastic shot (she does not produce proper stroke production alot of the time... producing a shot similar to Roddick's horrible backhand) but at peak it is substantially better.

Look at Stosur during the 2011 US open and you will see what I mean.... that backhand was hard hit and deep with good trajectory on it.

2011 US open Stosur is a beast. The biggest problem with Sam in my belief is of course her mentality is still frail and that she has alot of components to her game that have to all be working in order for her to be playing at peak level. But when she does.... look out.

Petrova was good but never a show stopper. She moved slow, didnt possess a huge ground game (though it was still formidable), had a weak forehand, and a chronically poor mental state.

Sam, on the other hand, was a doubles specialist for 75% of her career and eventually calmed her nerves enough and improved her back court game enough to win a Singles slam.

JCTennisFan
Nov 23rd, 2012, 10:36 PM
1. Kick serve never works to Nadia
2. Nadia's backhand is much more better even at Sam's peak
3. Nadia's return is better than Sam
4. Although Sam's forehand can produce many winners, Nadia's forehand is also very effective in hitting the ball with more top spin

1. Your right about Petrova not being as affected by a kick serve. But my belief is that Sam's serve is more effective on a wider range of surfaces and against a wider range of players than Petrova's.

2. Petrova does win the Backhand department but not by alot. Typically Petrova's backhand is a good deal better than Sam's but at the 2011 US open (not just the final mind you but throughout the tournie... as well as during the summer HC swing that year) Sam proved how effective her Backhand can be when she is firing on all cylinders.

3. Agreed though Sam can still crack some pretty big returns when she wants.

4. Nadia's forehand has poor stroke production. She does not hit into the ball but rather swipes at the ball, which can produce a short sitting shot that is easy to pounce on. Sam's forehand is prone to error production due its' high risk/low percentage nature... the actual mechanics of it are quite sound. Think Kimmie's forehand.... prone to errors but a very formidable weapon when in the zone.

JCTennisFan
Nov 23rd, 2012, 10:43 PM
I don't think so. Actually Stosur has much worse nerves, you just can't judge it by one single match that happened to be a slam final.:lol:


A slam final against one of the toughest fighters/competitors of this generation (Serena). Is not the point of strong nerves to be able to win the important matches? Was this not an important match? I think that says it all.....

Cajka
Nov 23rd, 2012, 11:44 PM
Because it was debating PEAK performance. Stosur's backhand. for instance, is typically a craptastic shot (she does not produce proper stroke production alot of the time... producing a shot similar to Roddick's horrible backhand) but at peak it is substantially better.

This is a "who would win, Peak Petrova or Peak Stosur" thread? How can you say their h2h is irrelevant? It's still the best clue that we have, the rest is imagination. They played in USO last year (when Sam won the whole thing, while Petrova was #30) and the match was very close. Far from peak Petrova is still a bad match-up to close to peak Sam. It doesn't mean that Petrova is over all a much superior player, although I do believe that her best tennis was better than Sam's.

JCTennisFan
Nov 24th, 2012, 01:33 AM
This is a "who would win, Peak Petrova or Peak Stosur" thread? How can you say their h2h is irrelevant? It's still the best clue that we have, the rest is imagination. They played in USO last year (when Sam won the whole thing, while Petrova was #30) and the match was very close. Far from peak Petrova is still a bad match-up to close to peak Sam. It doesn't mean that Petrova is over all a much superior player, although I do believe that her best tennis was better than Sam's.

well said.

The biggest issue with their matchup result is that until around 2010 or so Stosur was not quite the same player in singles. Petrova's peak was probably 06 while Stosurs was last year (up until this point). Neither was in their respective "peaks" when they have faced one another.

It is my belief, however, that in 2011 Stosur brought her game up a level beyond what Petrova has ever managed. Stosur of the 2011 US open is arguably in contention with any other current HC player (obviously I can no longer include kim :sad: ) bar possibly Serena.

And though Serena is no doubt a superior HC player at peak Stosur (luckily for sam) has a gametype that really bothers Serena.... similar to how Capriati did.

Cajka
Nov 24th, 2012, 01:57 AM
well said.

The biggest issue with their matchup result is that until around 2010 or so Stosur was not quite the same player in singles. Petrova's peak was probably 06 while Stosurs was last year (up until this point). Neither was in their respective "peaks" when they have faced one another.

It is my belief, however, that in 2011 Stosur brought her game up a level beyond what Petrova has ever managed. Stosur of the 2011 US open is arguably in contention with any other current HC player (obviously I can no longer include kim :sad: ) bar possibly Serena.

And though Serena is no doubt a superior HC player at peak Stosur (luckily for sam) has a gametype that really bothers Serena.... similar to how Capriati did.

I see Sam and Capriati as completely different players, but the one thing that can be said for both of them is that they can be a really tough match up for Serena, they are tougher opponents for her than many other significant tennis players from this century, especially Capriati, who is a nightmare match up for Serena, although we all know that Serena is a much superior player.

I also think that peak Sam would be a very tough opponent for Kim. Although none of them played their best tennis in that match in USO 2010, it's clear that the surface is very good for Sam's game. It's a shame she couldn't beat Vika this year. She has the game to beat her, but I'm not sure that she truly believes in that. She's capable of hitting outside Vika's hitting zone, but she can't do it consistently... Or she doesn't believe that she can, the outcome is the same, however.

JCTennisFan
Nov 24th, 2012, 08:00 AM
I see Sam and Capriati as completely different players, but the one thing that can be said for both of them is that they can be a really tough match up for Serena, they are tougher opponents for her than many other significant tennis players from this century, especially Capriati, who is a nightmare match up for Serena, although we all know that Serena is a much superior player.

I also think that peak Sam would be a very tough opponent for Kim. Although none of them played their best tennis in that match in USO 2010, it's clear that the surface is very good for Sam's game. It's a shame she couldn't beat Vika this year. She has the game to beat her, but I'm not sure that she truly believes in that. She's capable of hitting outside Vika's hitting zone, but she can't do it consistently... Or she doesn't believe that she can, the outcome is the same, however.

Capriati was superior to Serena on Clay but otherwise I agree with all you said.

And yes, I do agree that Sam and Capriati have much different gamestyles. The similarity though is that they (for different reasons) are not good matchups for Serena.

And on the Vika match this year at the US open.... I really believe that proved how much heart and determination Stosur has. She was insanely close to beating Azarenka that day.... it really just came down to poor luck on Sam's part.

And on the respect of not being able to outhit Azarenka consistently.... I think that is simply mental... certaintly it is not because of her groundies. When Stosur is in the zone I would argue she hits a harder (though not as precise or consistent) ball off both wings than Azarenka does.

However when Sam is not hitting effectively (most importantly that BH wing) Victoria can pick on the BH and break Sam's game apart that way.

As good as Vika is her game is effectively a glorified pusher. I think of her as a more competent version of Radwanska, Woz, etc.

She certaintly does not hit the ball as hard as Serena, Kvitova, Sam, Li, etc.

FerrerFan123
Nov 24th, 2012, 09:03 AM
Peak Samantha is unbeatable for most players on high-mid bouncing surfaces IMO. :shrug: No one can deal with the spin on her serve and forehand.

Peak Petrova would beat her on grass and other low bouncing surfaces.