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simonsaystennis
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:08 PM
First let me clarify, by youngster, I mean 18 and under, so born in 1994 or later. I thought this might be a fun thread, since not everyone keeps track of junior tennis or the ITF pro circuit regularly, so we can share our different insights.

Here are my 5 to watch (in no particular order):

1. Eugenie Bouchard (CAN) http://storage.canoe.ca/v1/dynamic_resize/sws_path/suns-prod-images/1297283115183_ORIGINAL.jpg?quality=80&size=650x&stmp=1341688758594

Birthdate: February 25, 1994 (18 years old)

Reasons to watch: Current Junior Number 2, Junior Highlights include Wimbledon Singles and Doubles Champion; Improved senior ranking from 305 to 148; Senior highlights include a 50k and 25k title, a 50k runner up, QFs at WTA Citi Open, and R32 appearance at WTA Rogers Cup.

2. Madison Keys (USA) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/Madison_Keys.jpg/557px-Madison_Keys.jpg

Birthdate: February 17, 1995 (17 years old)

Reasons to watch: At 14, she became the 7th youngest player to win a WTA tour level match; Improved her senior ranking from 273 to 138; Highlights include: a 50k and 75k title, two 50k semifinals, a R32 appearance as a qualifier at the WTA Sony Ericsson Open.

3. Donna Vekic (CRO) http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Donna+Vekic+2012+French+Open+Day+Ten+823OwfVZxWrl. jpg

Birthdate: June 28, 1996 (16 years old)

Reasons to watch: Improved her senior ranking from 395 to 109. Youngest player to reach a WTA Final since Tamira Paszek in 2006. Junior highlights include Wimbledon QFs. Senior Highlights include: Runner up at WTA Tashkent Open, two 25k titles, three 25k runner ups, and a 100k semifinal.

4. Carina Witthoeft (GER)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6004/5965900771_3cb070f959.jpg

Birthdate: February 16, 1995 (17 years old)

Reasons to watch: Improved her senior ranking from 413 to 222. No points to defend until April. Highlights include win over Tsvetana Pironkova in qualifying of the WTA Porsche Tennis Grand Prix, two 25k titles, one 25k runner up, and a 75k+H SF.

5. Ashleigh Barty (AUS)

http://images.smh.com.au/2011/07/04/2469702/art-svBARTY-420x0.jpg

Birthdate: April 24, 1996 (16 years old)

Reasons to watch: Improved her senior ranking from 679 to 183. Former junior World number 2 and Wimbledon Champion. Highlights include: a 50k win, three 25k wins, two 25k runner ups.

Honorable mentions: Laura Robson (18, WTA #53); (I didn't include her because she's been on everyone's radar since 2008 and everyone knows to keep an eye out for her in 2013 due to her strong finish in 2012); Annika Beck (18, WTA #77); Yulia Putintseva (17, WTA #125); Irina Khromacheva (17, WTA #189); Taylor Townsend (16, WTA #501, ITF Junior #1); Francoise Abanda (15, WTA #611, ITF Junior #8).

With the exception of Barty (who I haven't seen play since early 2012, so this may have changed) I picked girls with fairly big, powerful games who I think will see a lot of success with their style of play. Have fun with this thread... I'm interested to see who everyone has their eye on for the 2013 season! :)

cowsonice
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:13 PM
I'd include Annika Beck, too. :)

Barktra
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:15 PM
No Crawford? I think I would include her? A big and powerful game with a win over Danilldou

Wert.
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:19 PM
All of these you mentioned in first post + Sharipova.

Barktra
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:23 PM
Mine would be

1. Beck
2. Vekic
3. Keys
4. Crawford
5. Bocuhard

T_P
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:25 PM
So many actually: Robson, Beck, Vekic, Barty, Min, Bouchard, Keys, Svitolina, Khromacheva, ...

Trey
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:28 PM
My Top Youngster Girls

1. Madison Keys

2. Donna Vekic

3. Eugenie Bouchard

4. Laura Robson

5. Taylor Townsend

6. Francoise Abanda

7. Sachia Vickery

8. Irina Khromacheva

9. Daria Gavrilova

10. Indy de Vroome

duhcity
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:35 PM
I would be shocked if Keys isn't HUGE in the future

simonsaystennis
Nov 12th, 2012, 09:35 PM
No Crawford? I think I would include her? A big and powerful game with a win over Danilldou

I could pick loads of USA girls to be on that list (since those are the juniors I am most familiar with), but I didn't want to seem like I was favoring one country over another. Definitely think Sam will have a good 2013. :)

Viktymise
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:04 PM
At 14, she became the 7th youngest player to win a WTA tour level match

Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 10 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months

Othe players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

Bismarck.
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:11 PM
Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 11 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months

Othe players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

Where was Vaidisova's first career win?

Viktymise
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:16 PM
Where was Vaidisova's first career win?

Listed as deafeating Kurhajcova at Acapulco in March 2004 on the WTA site.

Just realised I left out Graf who was also 13 years and 11 months when she won her first WTA match at RG 83.

simonsaystennis
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:18 PM
Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 11 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months



I would love to find this official data as well. The only reason why I knew the Keys stat was I remembered reading an old article from right after she won her tour level match that threw the stat around, so I did some research and found the article again. However it didn't say who was ahead of her. :worship: to Vaidisova if she tops that list. A real shame to see where her career headed though. :sad:

The Dawntreader
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:26 PM
Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 10 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months

Othe players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

Didn't Venus win her first professional match at 14 too?

Edit: Venus won her first match in Oakland in 1994, aged 14 and 4 months.

Viktymise
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:28 PM
I would love to find this official data as well. The only reason why I knew the Keys stat was I remembered reading an old article from right after she won her tour level match that threw the stat around, so I did some research and found the article again. However it didn't say who was ahead of her. :worship: to Vaidisova if she tops that list. A real shame to see where her career headed though. :sad:

Vaidisova was 53 days away from her 14th birthday at the beginning of Acapulco 2004, so if the stats are right I think she beats both Graf and Capriati in the age stakes.

Although, Capriati's run as a 13 year old in Boca Raton looks truly unbelievable looking back at it today, with a final and wins over two top 10 players.

sweetadri06
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:33 PM
1) Laura Robson
Ranking: 53 Previously ranked 131
Win-Loss record: 34 - 25
2012 Highlights: US Open 4th round, Guangzhou F, Palermo SF, Osaka QF, Eastbourne rd16

2) Donna Vekic
Ranking: 108 Previously ranked 392
Win-Loss record:43-12
2012 Highlights: Tashkent F, Pune QF
ITF titles: Bangalore, Fergana

3) Eugene Bouchard
Ranking: 148 Previously ranked 302
Win-Loss record: 46-16
2012 Highlights: Washington DC QF, Montreal rd32, Dallas rd16, Quebec City rd16
ITF titles: Sweden Bastad, Bastad 2, Granby

4) Annika Beck
Ranking: 78 Previously ranked 234
Win-Loss record: 62-16
2012 Highlights: Luxemborg rd16, Quebec City rd16
ITF titles: Moscow,Versmold, Koksijde, Shresbury,Ismaning, Barnstaple

5) Allison Van Uytvanck
Ranking: 218 previously ranked 297
Win-Loss record: 28-18
2012 Highlights: Brussels QF
ITF titles: Glasgow; Kaarst F, Glasgow2 F;

Viktymise
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:34 PM
Didn't Venus win her first professional match at 14 too?

Another one that I missed. 14 years and 4 months, I think.

To actually say something on-topic, I think that both Keys and Witthoeft will be very good in a few years time. Both have the biggest games of all of the prospects I've seen, and their results this year have shown promise

Bouchard, despite being an obvious crowd favourite, didn't impress me much when I seen her seen her this summer. Glitchy FH technique, and not too much in the way of weapons.

Vekic is impressively solid for her age. A nice mix of defense and offence, with a surprisingly hefty and solid serve. Unconvinced that she's the biggest talent amongst all of these, despite her success at such a young age.

killerqueen
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:39 PM
All the obvious ones - Robson, Beck, Svitolina, Vekic, Barty, Keys, Bouchard, Putintseva. Maybe Margarita Gasparyan to make a splash as an outside bet?

Also, though they are a bit older than the thread specifies, I hope and thik 2013 could be a breakthrough year for Mladenovic and Burdette. I'd also really like to think that the likes of Caroline Garcia, Daria Gavrilova and Irina Khromacheva improve on mediocre years though they aren't exactly filling me with confidence. (Though saying that, Khromacheva is still only 17 I think so time is still on her side)

Barktra
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:44 PM
Eventhough she is older than 18 I am interested if Garcia can have a big year next year make some noise :shrug:

killerqueen
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:48 PM
Oh also. What do people think of An-Sophie Mestach's chances? She was away injured for a long time, but returned recently with some decent results. I never really paid much attention to her before. what do people expect for her? is she potentially the real deal, a top 100 tour player, or just another top junior who doesn't make it.

Pump-it-UP
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:54 PM
Keys and Vekic should both establish themselves in the top 60 provided that they stay healthy. Probably top 80/90 for Bouchard. :shrug:

Crawford and Townsend will be massive in a few years, but I think they're still too raw (especially Crawford) to make an impact in 2013.

The Dawntreader
Nov 12th, 2012, 10:55 PM
I think Keys is probably the best ball-striker out of that list. Bouchard just doesn't fetch me. Her game is very rudimentary, with no real smoothness or refinement in her strokes. No real innate firepower either, to compensate for glitchy technique.

Putintseva will be too inhibited by her lack of height/reach in the modern game.

BlueTrees
Nov 12th, 2012, 11:05 PM
I think Svitolina has more potential than Bouchard :shrug: Otherwise a great list :yeah:

Barktra
Nov 12th, 2012, 11:07 PM
I think khromacheva's ball striking is a bit underrated :shrug:

austennisfan
Nov 13th, 2012, 12:41 AM
Besides putting Barty down as an America, its a great list. It is interesting that most of the youngsters on that list are from traditional tennis powerhouses.

iPatty
Nov 13th, 2012, 12:48 AM
I think Keys has the biggest upside out of all of these girls. I would be surprised if she made the jump all the way into the top 50 this year but I think top 70 or 80 is definitely attainable. As for girls like Bouchard, Vekic, and Barty I think it is pretty clear that they will successfully transition from juniors to pros.

As for the other Americans, Min and Pegula both seem to be stalling a little bit...Min moreso than Pegula. We could see some solid results from girls like Duval and Vickery if they work hard and keep improving. The jury is still out on Townsend. She definitely has a lot of racquet skills and flair (reminds me of Schnyder in that regard) but I'm skeptical if she will be able to put it together against the pros on a consistent basis. I really want her to succeed but I'm not sold. Same goes for Crawford. The girl can definitely whack the ball but does she really have what it takes to make it on the tour? I doubt it TBH. :shrug:

Putintseva, Khromacheva, Gavrilova, Kontaveit, and other hyped girls...:yawn: Haven't really seen too much from any of them to suggest that they will become elite players.

As for the 1997 crowd it's still way too early to make any kind of concrete predictions. Abanda and Bencic are clearly leading the charge into the pros and I think we will see some success from both of them in 25 and 50Ks next year. Ana Konjuh has a big game for a girl so young and I would like to see Jelena Ostapenko break into the top 400 at least. I'm sure there will be some girls that come out of nowhere from this crop as well.

All in all it seems like younger players are starting to find more success in ITFs than they have in recent years so I'll be interested to see if that trend continues in 2013.

binky-GOAT
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:15 AM
Nice thread.

I think we need to keep an eye on most youngsters in 2013. I think all will improve in the next year, but obviously some more than others.

Potential wise I think Vekic and Barty are far ahead of the others though, they are just 16 and have been so good in their early pro career:
Vekic: 53-15 in ITF
Barty: 39-8 in ITF

That is scary good. Other girls have worse records and are older. Also having seen both play they really do look like baby champions.

I also liked Khromacheva's game, but she hasn't transitioned into pro's that well, I think she hasn't improved as much in the last year, maybe due to lack of commitment.

tenisamulo
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:36 AM
5. Ashleigh Barty (USA)

USA? Huh?

simonsaystennis
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:40 AM
Besides putting Barty down as an America, its a great list. It is interesting that most of the youngsters on that list are from traditional tennis powerhouses.

Woops, sorry about that :lol: Thanks for catching that, I'll edit now. However if she wanted to play for us I certainly wouldn't complain. :p :lol:

simonsaystennis
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:43 AM
I think khromacheva's ball striking is a bit underrated :shrug:

Agreed. I watched her play a couple weeks ago on a stream and was pretty impressed. I think she has some nice talent and will do well in a few years. To the people who are suggesting Gavrilova, I don't see anything in her game that makes me think she will make a big move in 2013. I could be wrong, since it's been a while since I've seen her play, but that's my opinion.

Barktra
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:59 AM
And to add Irnia has beaten Bouchard the last 5 times they played both pros and juniors. :shrug: and their pro match at Burnie Khromacheva was really whipping Bouchard around the court from what I saw in the stream. 6-1 6-3 Irnia. I feel Khromacheva and Putintseva will be good IMO it is just taking them longer.

I hope Gabby Andrews plays some more itf's next year :cheer: and I feel like it wont be long until Abanda gets the #1 junior spot

simonsaystennis
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:16 AM
I hope Gabby Andrews plays some more itf's next year :cheer: and I feel like it wont be long until Abanda gets the #1 junior spot

A year ago I'd have placed Gabby Andrews on the list of honorable mentions, but this year she is not even close. She's had a reaaaally poor season this year compared to last year, in my opinion. Her only positive results came in doubles. Singles was really lackluster. She's only 15 (will be 16 in December) so there's lots of time to get back on track, but only time will tell.

I also agree that Abanda is just going to explode on the junior circuit this year. :)

Barktra
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:22 AM
You are right. I feel like she should have done better and her doubles results could be do to the sole fact of how incredible a doubles player Townsend is. Hope Gabby can do well at Eddie Herr and the Orange Bowl to get her confidence back because I think she is very talented. She might go to college and be a very good prospect if she does.

Trey
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:31 AM
I think Margarita Gasparyan, Daria Gavrilova & Irina Khromacheva are going be real big in the future, I also agree with simonsaystennis Gabby Andrews result haven't been so good this year, hopefully next year she can do better.

simonsaystennis
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:42 AM
I think Margarita Gasparyan, Daria Gavrilova & Irina Khromacheva are going be real big in the future, I also agree with simonsaystennis Gabby Andrews result haven't been so good this year, hopefully next year she can do better.

One of the reasons I started this thread was to alert myself to any names that I may not be familiar with. I don't think I've ever heard of Gasparyan, but you're the second or third person to mention her. Care to give some details about her game/career thus far??

Trey
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:51 AM
One of the reasons I started this thread was to alert myself to any names that I may not be familiar with. I don't think I've ever heard of Gasparyan, but you're the second or third person to mention her. Care to give some details about her game/career thus far??

ATM she rank 234, She won a couple ITF Events, If I right she is 18yr old & she has a Big Serve from what I saw in Moscow, she plays with an One-handed backhands and is currently being coach by Vera old coach Sergei Demekhine :)

BlueTrees
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:51 AM
One of the reasons I started this thread was to alert myself to any names that I may not be familiar with. I don't think I've ever heard of Gasparyan, but you're the second or third person to mention her. Care to give some details about her game/career thus far??
She rose from #648 to #231 this year, won four $25Ks...she plays with a single handed backhand which is very unusual for a girl so young.

You can see her match in Moscow against Safarova here (she won a set): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaQixv5TFgA

Barktra
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:54 AM
^^Thanks for the video :)

Singleniacki
Nov 13th, 2012, 03:17 AM
My top 4:

1. Elina Svitolina
2. Ashleigh Barty
3. Ons Jabeur
4. Margarita Gasparyan

Aryman3
Nov 13th, 2012, 05:38 AM
Bouchard
Robson
Vekic
M.Keys
Sharipova

Meelis
Nov 13th, 2012, 06:46 AM
Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 10 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months

Othe players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

1. Fernandez, Mary Joe (13 years & 6 months - 1985 Miami)
2. Capriati, Jennifer (13 years & 11 months - 1990 Boca Raton)
3. Graf, Steffi (13 years, 11 months & 10 days - 1983 Roland Garros)
4. Hingis, Martina (14 years & 1 week - 1994 Zürich)
5. Rinaldi, Kathy (14 years & 3 weeks - 1981 Amelia Island)
6. Austin, Tracy (14 years & 1 month - 1977 Portland)
7. Keys, Madison (14 years & 48 days - 2009 Ponte Vedra Beach)
8. Larcher de Brito, Michelle (14 years & 52 days - 2007 Miami)
9. Rehe, Stephanie (14 years & 2 months - 1984 Hershey)
10. Sabatini, Gabriela (14 years, 2 months & 2 weeks - 1984 Indianapolis)

TBA2
Nov 13th, 2012, 07:13 AM
I think:

Laura Robson
Donna Vekic

Kəv.
Nov 13th, 2012, 08:39 AM
Beck
Vekic
Svitolina
Barty

Sharpiiii
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:03 AM
For me : Vekic Sharipova Danilina Kan and Maciejewska

chingching
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:25 AM
I think that all of the Junior Grand Slams winners/runner ups will be good.
I mean Townsend, Putintseva, Beck, Scmiedlova Bouchard, Svitolina, Crawford and Kontaveit would have to be a lot of people' best bets. Except for Vekic, Barty and Khromacheva I don't think there are any stars powering through except them. As for Sharipova, she has good game, but she has weak points, no head and bad movement :shrug: I still like her though :)

As for the Bouchard vs Svitolina thing, I think that Eugenie has more game but I think Elina will achieve more as she can play on all surfaces well as shown this year, whereas Bouchard is strictly Grass and Hard, not recording any amazing clay results :shrug:

GoofyDuck
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:36 AM
These are 5 young players I like and I'll be watching in 2013:

Zhang Yuxuan
Donna Vekic
Zheng SaiSai
Margarita Gasparyan
Annika Beck

Trickle
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:45 AM
Vaidisova was 53 days away from her 14th birthday at the beginning of Acapulco 2004, so if the stats are right I think she beats both Graf and Capriati in the age stakes.

Although, Capriati's run as a 13 year old in Boca Raton looks truly unbelievable looking back at it today, with a final and wins over two top 10 players.

Vaidisova was born in 1989 so in early 2004, she was 14 going on 15. Her listing in that ranking looks out of place because the AER changed in the 90s. She was one of the youngest to win a title though, I think.

chingching
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:48 AM
Also Yuxuan Zhang :inlove:

pregunta
Nov 13th, 2012, 10:01 AM
weird that none mention the best ranking junior player on pro from 1997 who is 592 already... podoroska from argentina

Meelis
Nov 13th, 2012, 10:02 AM
Vaidisova was 53 days away from her 14th birthday at the beginning of Acapulco 2004, so if the stats are right I think she beats both Graf and Capriati in the age stakes.

She was almost 15.

Age eligibility rules were in place back then, meaning that younger than 14 years olds were already banned from playing any pro events.

nevetssllim
Nov 13th, 2012, 12:12 PM
Other players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

Kleybanova was 14y and 8m when she won a main-draw match in Indian Wells in 2004 (d. Tosic 26 60 75).

tennismaster8820
Nov 13th, 2012, 01:42 PM
I was impressed by Madison when I saw her on stream at US Open qualies.
I think she should do well next season.
I expect Donna to enter top 100 at the start of year and then it will be interesting if she can consolidate on her ranking.

All these girls are very young still and things can go very wrong for either of them so any kind of predictions can turn out to be wrong.
It's nice to see so many young players do well and I wish they all could have success in 2013 to spice up the tour!

Kerbicz
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:14 PM
Laura Robson, by far.

Jane Lane
Nov 13th, 2012, 02:42 PM
Vekic, Bouchard and Beck are my top 3.

Petronius
Nov 13th, 2012, 05:00 PM
The 12-year-old Destanee Aiava of Australia :rocker2:

http://images.watoday.com.au/2012/05/16/3301093/ipad-art-wide-destanee-420x0.jpg

She may lack experience, but she's brimming with self-confidence: :yippee:

''I want to become No. 1 in the world and be the best player. I think I have a good chance of achieving that,'' she says. ''I'm a pretty aggressive player, I have good footwork, I have a lot of strengths. I like to come up to the net sometimes and mix up the play.'' :worship:

I stumbled upon her, because she is coached by former Czech Wimbledon junior champ Andrea Strnadová, who married Jason Stoltenberg.

King Halep
Nov 13th, 2012, 05:55 PM
I think Svitolina has more potential than Bouchard :shrug: Otherwise a great list :yeah:

obviously OP does not rate her at all, some of the players he included instead of her are just a joke

Viktymise
Nov 13th, 2012, 05:56 PM
She was almost 15.

Age eligibility rules were in place back then, meaning that younger than 14 years olds were already banned from playing any pro events.

Sorry, my poor maths there.

Funny seeing MLDB's name amongst all of the players...

Trey
Nov 13th, 2012, 06:44 PM
Katerina SINIAKOVA Is another player I watch out for she doing good on Juniors, Belinda BENCIC is another player I like too see more of in the future.

Petkorazzi
Nov 13th, 2012, 06:45 PM
Haven't seen Sara Sorribes Tormo's name thrown out there. 16 year old Spaniard who could Rise up the ranks with a smart schedule.

Petronius
Nov 13th, 2012, 07:18 PM
Katerina SINIAKOVA Is another player I watch out for

I agree. But I wouldn't complain if her Slovak doubles partner Petra Uberalova broke through as well. She has certain assets...

http://www.tkspartapraha.cz/res/pic/clanky/original/siniakova_budapest.jpg

jj74
Nov 13th, 2012, 07:25 PM
Haven't seen Sara Sorribes Tormo's name thrown out there. 16 year old Spaniard who could Rise up the ranks with a smart schedule.

On clay she is a top junior player for sure (she lost in three against Towsend, and defeated Lottner) and she is the european champion u16 too, but i don't know if she can pull the same kind of results out of clay.
We'll see soon, because i think she will play Australian Open jr next year, she has enought wta ranking to play qualification

DevilishAttitude
Nov 13th, 2012, 08:03 PM
Here's my similar thread which focuses on teens inside Top 250. :)

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=462947&highlight=

Here are some stats about the players born 1994 and after:

Top 5 in rankings:
#53 Laura Robson
#78 Annika Beck
#109 Donna Vekic
#114 Elina Svitolina
#124 Yulia Putintseva

Best WTA results in 2012:
Laura Robson - F of Guangzhou
Donna Vekic - F of Tashkent
Alison van Uytvanck - QF of Brussels
Eugenie Bouchard - QF of Washington

Best wins on tour in 2012:
Laura Robson - #8 Li Na
Ons Jabeur - #33 Zheng Jie
Daria Gavrilova - #35 Yanina Wickmayer
Alison van Uytvanck - #39 Ksenia Pervak
Carina Witthoeft - #42 Tsvetana Pironkova

Junior winners:
Laura Robson
Elina Svitolina
Daria Gavrilova
An-Sophie Mestach
Ons Jabeur
Ashleigh Barty
Grace Min
Taylor Townsend
Annika Beck
Eugenie Bouchard
Samantha Crawford

Robson leads every category from this generation currently. Highest ranked, best slam result, best victory, most tour wins, first and youngest junior winner etc.

JustPetko
Nov 13th, 2012, 08:05 PM
1. Keys
2. Vekic
3. Witthoeft
4. Barty
5. Danilina :oh:

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 13th, 2012, 08:40 PM
Okay, firstly Robson and Beck I don't include. As far as I'm concerned both are now comfortably in the top 100 and have convinced me that at the very least they will be fixtures on the WTA tour for quite a few years to come. Quite simply, these two have already graduated.

Vekic and Barty obviously both merit special attention as they are by far the youngest players in the top 200. Personally I think both most likely have very good futures. But I don't think either of them is ready for a big breakthrough yet. Vekic is very close to the top 100 and she will probably get there next year, but I think she will likely find herself a little bit out of her depths at this stage. Likewise, I don't see Barty as being able to compete at WTA level next year. But give these girls another year and both should be ready to make some noise in 2014.

Of those that are 18 and under and in the top 250, there are several I really need to see more of before having any sort of opinion of them. But there are a few I do have significant reservations about. Irina Khromacheva seems to lose almost all her matches by very uncompetitive scorelines. That is not what you want to see in a young player and it suggests to me a lack of heart and motivation. Yulia Putintseva is a small girl and she does seem to have attitude problems. Having seen her play I don't think she is terrible but there wasn't much about her game that impressed me either. I am certainly not convinced she is a future star. Saisai Zheng, I watched a little at Roehampton last year and while she is solid she has a long way to go before being competitive against top 100 opposition. She has obviously benefited from playing a lot of relatively easy ITF events. There is still time for further improvement and she may yet turn out to be a solid top 100 player in the future but next year? I don't think so.

So who are the players I do think can make some noise next year?
The five I'm going with are Elina Svitolina, Eugenie Bouchard, Madison Keys, Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova. These are the five players 18 and younger, ranked in the top 250 but outside the top 100, who I have the most confidence in and I think all these players will make a significant impression on the tour next year.

A few other slightly older players I'd keep an eye on are Monica Puig, Maryna Zanevska and Paula Ormaechea.

erschloy214
Nov 13th, 2012, 09:11 PM
Really great thread! I am not as knowledgeable with non-USA juniors; however, I do believe Vekic and Bouchard are two of the top prospects that will make a splash next season.

I really feel the US has MAJOR potential in the next few years. It is great to see some talent coming through. My top US girls to make breakthroughs would be (one could name many more as well):

Keys
Crawford
Townsend
Pegula
Duval
Vickery
Jeukeng
Min

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:46 AM
Okay, firstly Robson and Beck I don't include. As far as I'm concerned both are now comfortably in the top 100 and have convinced me that at the very least they will be fixtures on the WTA tour for quite a few years to come. Quite simply, these two have already graduated.

Vekic and Barty obviously both merit special attention as they are by far the youngest players in the top 200. Personally I think both most likely have very good futures. But I don't think either of them is ready for a big breakthrough yet. Vekic is very close to the top 100 and she will probably get there next year, but I think she will likely find herself a little bit out of her depths at this stage. Likewise, I don't see Barty as being able to compete at WTA level next year. But give these girls another year and both should be ready to make some noise in 2014.

Of those that are 18 and under and in the top 250, there are several I really need to see more of before having any sort of opinion of them. But there are a few I do have significant reservations about. Irina Khromacheva seems to lose almost all her matches by very uncompetitive scorelines. That is not what you want to see in a young player and it suggests to me a lack of heart and motivation. Yulia Putintseva is a small girl and she does seem to have attitude problems. Having seen her play I don't think she is terrible but there wasn't much about her game that impressed me either. I am certainly not convinced she is a future star. Saisai Zheng, I watched a little at Roehampton last year and while she is solid she has a long way to go before being competitive against top 100 opposition. She has obviously benefited from playing a lot of relatively easy ITF events. There is still time for further improvement and she may yet turn out to be a solid top 100 player in the future but next year? I don't think so.

So who are the players I do think can make some noise next year?
The five I'm going with are Elina Svitolina, Eugenie Bouchard, Madison Keys, Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova. These are the five players 18 and younger, ranked in the top 250 but outside the top 100, who I have the most confidence in and I think all these players will make a significant impression on the tour next year.

A few other slightly older players I'd keep an eye on are Monica Puig, Maryna Zanevska and Paula Ormaechea.

Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova :confused: :lol:

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...

jj74
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:59 AM
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova :confused: :lol:

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...

Well, the thread is the youngsters to watch next year, not who is going to have a better future in tennis.

I really like Barty, but i don't think next year will be her year. She is small, and she probably will need some time to cause trouble to top players.

We have examples, and Michelle is very obvious, that having good results very soon, doesn't mean anything at all. Michelle has impressive results at a very young age and right now a lot of players her age are doing better.

I'm pretty sure that there are a good bunch of players flying under the radar who will make an impact. In fact we can see that with Kontaveitt or Vekic. They were good but they were not the top players of their age when they were 14.

And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
This is a tennis forum so it's normal that a young girl with impressive results on juniors or itfs will be mentioned. It's not the same that a 6 year old being hyped on the press

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 11:11 AM
Well, the thread is the youngsters to watch next year, not who is going to have a better future in tennis.

I really like Barty, but i don't think next year will be her year. She is small, and she probably will need some time to cause trouble to top players.

We have examples, and Michelle is very obvious, that having good results very soon, doesn't mean anything at all. Michelle has impressive results at a very young age and right now a lot of players her age are doing better.

I'm pretty sure that there are a good bunch of players flying under the radar who will make an impact. In fact we can see that with Kontaveitt or Vekic. They were good but they were not the top players of their age when they were 14.

And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
This is a tennis forum so it's normal that a young girl with impressive results on juniors or itfs will be mentioned. It's not the same that a 6 year old being hyped on the press

I know that, so like I said those predictions were based on age alone. Otherwise there is no way you can predict those 2 players will perform better next year, I mean they are better now. So random.


You are half right with Barty, she was not ready this year to win at WTA level. But at ITF level this year she has won pretty much everything she has played, played only seniors and has had the taste of every GS. There is nothing left to prove or learn. If she isn't ready now then she never will be ready.

Kontaveit was well known when she was young (hello chingching :oh:), but she has stalled in 2012.

Yes Vekic has had poor results in juniors and come out of nowhere in late-2011/2012. But she isn't a player like Bouchard who is much older and started being good at only 18, Vekic is still 16 so this is not the same case as you are saying. These girls like Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova aren't suddenly gonna become world beaters :lol:

Michelle is a worst case scenario, it doesn't mean Vekic will take the same route as her.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 12:50 PM
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova :confused: :lol:

Are you just saying that because they are 18? And you don't trust Vekic and Barty because they are 16? Even though they are much better players, if they met they would thrash those 2 for sure...

Please...you obviously don't have a clue. At the very least try to comprehend what I am saying, and criticise me for that, not for the delusional stuff you have convinced yourself that I said which I have not.

Barty has yet to beat a top 100 player. And in the few instances she has played one she has been outclassed. Mostly very outclassed. Van Uytvanck has played several top 100 players, beaten a number of them and proven she can be competitive at that level already. Barty is yet to do so. Her successful ITF results are almost entirely based on Australian 25ks. Additionally I do not say I don't believe she will be successful. Quite the reverse. I believe she will have a fine career. What I do say is that she is not yet ready to compete at top 100 level right now. And I stand by that.

Take a look at the results of Van Uytvanck and Barty. Maybe it will give you a degree of clarity you are obviously missing right now. If Alison played Ashleigh tomorrow she would kick her ass. That has nothing to do with who will be the better player in the future. That is something that has yet to be decided and neither of us know how either of their careers will pan out. But right now Alison is far more ready to compete at WTA level than is Ashleigh.

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:07 PM
And by the way, i don't think the term hype is really useful to any of the players we are talking about. All this players are hyped because they have good results, one can think that some of them don't have enough game to break into the top 100, but they are not Alexus Jones or even worse Jan Kristian Silva, who were hyped based on nothing.
Silva was the future of american male tennis, and with 11 years he is completely miss on action, and he is not the only case.
I remember hearing about that guy when he was like 4/5 years old :eek: So did nothing really happen to him? :tape: He was coached by Patrick Mouratoglou so I wonder if he's still there. Here's his video from many years ago

LnoBxuW2TYc

I completely forgot about him but as soon as you mentioned his name I knew exactly who you were talking about. It seems he's the male case of Monique Viele...You can't help but feel sorry for these kids :o

eIqHb58Iq-A

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:10 PM
Please...you obviously don't have a clue. At the very least try to comprehend what I am saying, and criticise me for that, not for the delusional stuff you have convinced yourself that I said which I have not.

Barty has yet to beat a top 100 player. And in the few instances she has played one she has been outclassed. Mostly very outclassed. Van Uytvanck has played several top 100 players, beaten a number of them and proven she can be competitive at that level already. Barty is yet to do so. Her successful ITF results are almost entire based on Australian 25ks. Additionally I do not say I don't believe she will be successful. Quite the reverse. I believe she will have a fine career. What I do say is that she is not yet ready to compete at top 100 level. And I stand by that.

Take a look at the results of Van Uytvanck and Barty. Maybe it will give you a degree of clarity you are obviously missing right now. If Alison played Ashleigh tomorrow she would kick her ass. That has nothing to do with who will be the better player in the future. That is something that has yet to be decided and neither of us know how either of their careers will pan out.

I was never talking about potential, I am saying now and 2013.

I think you might need to take a closer look at results. Beating top 100 players doesn't mean much if you're losing at challengers and futures. For example Van Uytvanck lost to Alize Lim 1 & 1. There are plenty more where that came from but I won't bother.

Beating top 100 players is also about opportunity, so it is a bit of a lottery who has more success with the limited opportunity. ITF results are conclusive though.

Specifically on Barty, she lost because she played bad and was very nervous. I think every match with 30 unforced errors, double faults and tactical mistakes. But if she played an opponent like Van Uytvanck, she would win in 2 easy sets. Same goes for Vekic. It is a no brainer.


This is why I am puzzled with your choice, of course players like Keys, Bouchard and maybe Svitolina make sense, but not the other two because even now there are far more likelier players who will do better.

jj74
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:13 PM
I know that, so like I said those predictions were based on age alone. Otherwise there is no way you can predict those 2 players will perform better next year, I mean they are better now. So random.


You are half right with Barty, she was not ready this year to win at WTA level. But at ITF level this year she has won pretty much everything she has played, played only seniors and has had the taste of every GS. There is nothing left to prove or learn. If she isn't ready now then she never will be ready.

Kontaveit was well known when she was young (hello chingching :oh:), but she has stalled in 2012.

Yes Vekic has had poor results in juniors and come out of nowhere in late-2011/2012. But she isn't a player like Bouchard who is much older and started being good at only 18, Vekic is still 16 so this is not the same case as you are saying. These girls like Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova aren't suddenly gonna become world beaters :lol:

Michelle is a worst case scenario, it doesn't mean Vekic will take the same route as her.

I wasn't talking about that. Kontaveitt is doing well for a couple of years, but no so much time ago she was very far from Putintseva, Uberalova, Rohanova, Vickery or Khromacheva. And the same for Vekic, she was always good, but she wasn't at the level of De Vroome, Tsuji, Dean or Korasvilli.
Improvement is what's matter, and it's very easy to see with spanish girls, Torro or Muguruza weren't (by far) one of the top players of their age, and now they are ahead of player who dominated not so much time ago.

And of course Michelle is a worst case sceneario, but we have Vaidisova too. And on the other side of spectrum we have Kvitova who never was a top junior (she played very few tournaments), or even in u14 or u16 and now she is doing better than people her age who seemed more promising when they were younger.

Vekic results are quite weird, she has great results on itfs and very poor results on juniors (very poor for someone who is near top 100). Of course at her age irregularity is pretty normal (well some top players don't know what regularity means either).

When you bet on people to do well next season, the probabilities are in favour of someone who is 18, specially because lately the people rising in wta rankings are not (generally) teenagers.

But of course, people like Vekic or Barty can continue improving and breaking big next year. In fact, it would be fantastic for wta to have a couple of new teenage queens

Losing Streak
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:16 PM
Vekic
Sasnovich
Min
Keys
Beck

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:37 PM
I was never talking about potential, I am saying now and 2013.

I think you might need to take a closer look at results. Beating top 100 players doesn't mean much if you're losing at challengers and futures. For example Van Uytvanck lost to Alize Lim 1 & 1. There are plenty more where that came from but I won't bother.

Beating top 100 players is also about opportunity, so it is a bit of a lottery who has more success with the limited opportunity. ITF results are conclusive though.

Specifically on Barty, she lost because she played bad and was very nervous. I think every match with 30 unforced errors, double faults and tactical mistakes. But if she played an opponent like Van Uytvanck, she would win in 2 easy sets. Same goes for Vekic. It is a no brainer.


This is why I am puzzled with your choice, of course players like Keys, Bouchard and maybe Svitolina make sense, but not the other two because even now there are far more likelier players who will do better.

This summer Alison was focused on completing high school, not on her tennis. It was inevitable her results would suffer. I am much more interested in how she has done throughout career when she has had a big opportunity. These have been the times she has played her best. For the record Alison's results against top 100 IS RELEVENT and can not be swept under the carpet. In her short, parttime career, which she has hardly devoted herself fully too most of the time, until the Autumn when she completed her education, she has played 9 top 100 players. She has won 5 of those matches. Go on, aside from Laura Robson, find me another 18 year old or younger player who has had results like that against top 100 players.

If you really think beating a bunch of players ranked in the 200s means more than beating 5 out of 9 top 100 players then I have nothing further to say to you.

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:39 PM
Here's my similar thread which focuses on teens inside Top 250. :)

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=462947&highlight=

Here are some stats about the players born 1994 and after:

Top 5 in rankings:
#53 Laura Robson
#78 Annika Beck
#109 Donna Vekic
#114 Elina Svitolina
#124 Yulia Putintseva

Best WTA results in 2012:
Laura Robson - F of Guangzhou
Donna Vekic - F of Tashkent
Alison van Uytvanck - QF of Brussels
Eugenie Bouchard - QF of Washington

Best wins on tour in 2012:
Laura Robson - #8 Li Na
Ons Jabeur - #33 Zheng Jie
Daria Gavrilova - #35 Yanina Wickmayer
Alison van Uytvanck - #39 Ksenia Pervak
Carina Witthoeft - #42 Tsvetana Pironkova

Junior winners:
Laura Robson
Elina Svitolina
Daria Gavrilova
An-Sophie Mestach
Ons Jabeur
Ashleigh Barty
Grace Min
Taylor Townsend
Annika Beck
Eugenie Bouchard
Samantha Crawford

Robson leads every category from this generation currently. Highest ranked, best slam result, best victory, most tour wins, first and youngest junior winner etc.
Um, it kind of helps that she's also older than all the girls you mentioned, some of them by several years, given she's born in January 1994. Not trying to take away what she's achieved but you need to put it in perspective. Several of the girls are just as good if not better than her, just younger. Vekic reached a WTA final before Robson despite being two and a half years younger. Not to mention several of those girls have won pretty big events, like Svitolina in Pune last week as well as Beck winning some high level ITFs. Robson broke Top 100 when she was 18y4m, Vekic is 95% certain to break Top 100 by around 16y9m, if not earlier, given she has no points to defend until April 2013 and at #109 is around 50 points outside Top 100. Barty is also ranked way higher than Robson was at the same age. :shrug:

One record that Robson definitely holds over the other girls you listed is the most wildcards received, although I think everybody knows that one :lol:

Halepsova
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:52 PM
Off-topic, but this got me thinking - has anybody got the full list of the youngest players to win a WTA tour level match? I did some quick research and made a stab at the top 5 myself but it's probably wrong...

1) Vaidisova - 13 years, 10 months
2) Capriati - 13 years, 11 months
3) MJ Fernandez - 14 years, 8 days
4) Hingis - 14 years, 1 month
5) Larcher de Brito - 14 years, 2 months

Othe players that I know won matches at 14 as well as Keys:

Seles
Kournikova
Karatantcheva
Kutuzova

Nicole :hearts: What a great achievement. Why couldn't you just keep winning? :sobbing:

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 01:58 PM
Nicole :hearts: What a great achievement. Why couldn't you just keep winning? :sobbing:

:facepalm: Except that she didn't do it. :shrug:

Perhaps you need to read this thread more thoroughly. :wavey:

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:05 PM
Im not sweeping it under the rug, just saying there are limited opportunities against top 100 players, so you can't use that argument to bring down other players chances if they were given another shot.

Thanks for that information about Alison. :) Although most teenagers are completing their education so not really relevant. Now taking into consideration Alison's limited schedule, she has played 19 tournaments (which WTA site not yet updated). Ash has played 13 tournaments. Alison made WTA QF, Ash has made no points from WTA. But Ash is in top 200, while Alison isn't.

I think we disagree completely so no more point talking about this.


BlueTrees you always look to have a say about Robson :lol: But you gotta admit she has broken through to the Top 100 and even though she's not the youngest, she has already achieved what none of these players have yet.


Also I forgot about Beck, but her results this year in ITF have been great. Another girl to look out for in 2013. But she has already made Top 100 :lol:

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:15 PM
BlueTrees you always look to have a say about Robson :lol: But you gotta admit she has broken through to the Top 100 and even though she's not the youngest, she has already achieved what none of these players have yet.
How does that even make sense though, to compare a girl born in January 1994 to girls born in mid-1996 and act like she's going to be way better than them? :confused: Vekic and Barty have had considerable more success than Laura at the same age, it's just the truth :lol:

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:26 PM
How does that even make sense though, to compare a girl born in January 1994 to girls born in mid-1996 and act like she's going to be way better than them? :confused: Vekic and Barty have had considerable more success than Laura at the same age, it's just the truth :lol:

Well... to her credit she is there. But OP didn't include her in this discussion anyway. Just hope posters like LethalLaura stick around when things go south :oh:

LegionArgentina
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:32 PM
So many OFF TOPIC posts about youngest players to win a WTA tour level match that Its hard to read about what OP want it.
So only girls from 1995/1996/1997?

KeysisGOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:38 PM
Yeah, if I were to make a list I'd make a point of excluding Laura. She counts as a youngster (she's younger than Bouchard, for example) but let's be honest, Laura doesn't need to be pointed out.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:43 PM
How does that even make sense though, to compare a girl born in January 1994 to girls born in mid-1996 and act like she's going to be way better than them? :confused: Vekic and Barty have had considerable more success than Laura at the same age, it's just the truth :lol:

Actually Robson was getting competitive results against top 100 players at a younger age than Barty is now. At Barty's current age, Robson had won sets against Benesova & Hantuchova and she had actually scored a win against Goerges. Her overall results against tour players was substantially better than what we have seen so far from Barty, who is 0-10 in sets won against against top 100 players.

Vekic is a bit different. She has had one outstanding tournament in Tashkent. It is possible that could be indicative of how she plays throughout next year. However looking at her remaining results I am not so sure. I think it is a sign of how good she is going to be but I have to say Donna's Tashkent results don't reflect the level she was playing at before that event or after it.

Anyway, surely you must know not to get trapped into "the youngest to do xxx will end up the with the best career" kind of thinking. It doesn't really matter a great deal if player A won more 25ks at 16 than player B once both players are in the top 100 and competing on the WTA tour. It is only then that we find out who is best. And frankly the amount of 25ks or whatever that a player wins as a teen I don't think has a lot of bearing on that.

When looking at teens I look for 2 things above all else. 1) How well they play against established pros and 2) A sudden shift in the level of results a player produces. If a player from out of nowhere suddenly puts together say 3 or 4 events that are substantially better than what they had been doing previously then it is a good indication they are ready for the next level. For example what impresses me about AKS is her steady improvement throughout the year. At the start of the year AKS had only one 10k to her credit. By the end of the year she was winning 25ks and taking sets off established tour veterans. She is making fast progress. But even those things only matter in the short term. What matters in the long term is how committed a player is and how hard they are prepared to push themselves. And when we look at players of 16 to 18 years old, those are things that we won't end up finding out about them until they are into their early 20s, and sometimes even later than that.

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:44 PM
Yeah, if I were to make a list I'd make a point of excluding Laura. She counts as a youngster (she's younger than Bouchard, for example) but let's be honest, Laura doesn't need to be pointed out.
Um...she's actually not. Robson is January 1994, Bouchard is Febuary 1994. But I get what you're saying.

And for the record I never said Robson wasn't talented or anything, but FFS, we don't need to hear about how great she is in every damn thread, especially in one which specifically asked to not include her. :help:

KeysisGOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 02:47 PM
Um...she's actually not. Robson is January 1994, Bouchard is Febuary 1994. But I get what you're saying.

And for the record I never said Robson wasn't talented or anything, but FFS, we don't need to hear about how great she is in every damn thread, especially in one which specifically asked to not include her. :help:

Yeah, that was a cockup. Not quite sure how I convinced myself that February comes before January but what difference does a month here or there make anyway?

And I know you haven't, Blue and I agree with you about Laura not needing to be pointed out. Actually, I agree with you on most things. You're annoyingly right a lot of the time. I also missed the part of the OP where he/she explained why Robson was omitted (I looked at the list then scrolled down). Apparently I fail at reading as well as months. I should probably go back to pre-school and iron that out.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 03:03 PM
Um...she's actually not. Robson is January 1994, Bouchard is Febuary 1994. But I get what you're saying.

And for the record I never said Robson wasn't talented or anything, but FFS, we don't need to hear about how great she is in every damn thread, especially in one which specifically asked to not include her. :help:

I'm with you on that. Robson has established herself on the tour, as it was always pretty obvious she would. But now that she is on the tour she is just another WTA player working to improve like everyone else ranked at that level. I think sometimes it is clear a player has what it takes to make it onto the WTA tour, and Robson was just such a player. But one NEVER knows what a player will do once they are on the tour. She might have a big star studded career or she might struggle to get into the top 30. She might have a good year and then falter and fall back as a lot of players do or she might improve year on year. But nothing she has or hasn't done in the past is going to help or hinder her now. Players don't get brownie points for getting to the top 100 early.

King Halep
Nov 14th, 2012, 03:13 PM
At the start of the season a lot of people would still have predicted that she was overrated, had never played at a good level and was too slow to ever be a top player. It was only when she took on the new coach that her game clicked and suddenly everyone is raving. Its the same for the other juniors, they will only make the top 50 if they get the right setup which can get the most out of their game.

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 03:21 PM
Actually Robson was getting competitive results against top 100 players at a younger age than Barty is now. At Barty's current age, Robson had won sets against Benesova & Hantuchova and she had actually scored a win against Goerges. Her overall results against tour players was substantially better than what we have seen so far from Barty, who is 0-10 in sets won against against top 100 players.

Vekic is a bit different. She has had one outstanding tournament in Tashkent. It is possible that could be indicative of how she plays throughout next year. However looking at her remaining results I am not so sure. I think it is a sign of how good she is going to be but I have to say Donna's Tashkent results don't reflect the level she was playing at before that event or after it.

Anyway, surely you must know not to get trapped into "the youngest to do xxx will end up the with the best career" kind of thinking. It doesn't really matter a great deal if player A won more 25ks at 16 than player B once both players are in the top 100 and competing on the WTA tour. It is only then that we find out who is best. And frankly the amount of 25ks or whatever that a player wins as a teen I don't think has a lot of bearing on that.

When looking at teens I look for 2 things above all else. 1) How well they play against established pros and 2) A sudden shift in the level of results a player produces. If a player from out of nowhere suddenly puts together say 3 or 4 events that are substantially better than what they had been doing previously then it is a good indication they are ready for the next level. But even those things only matter in the short term. What matters in the long term is how committed a player is and how hard they are prepared to push themselves. And when we look at players of 16 to 18 years old, those are things that we won't end up finding out about them until they are into their early 20s, and sometimes even later than that.

I agree that Barty's results against Top 100 players aren't good, but the rankings don't lie :shrug: Barty's winning streak in ITFs is too much to ignore for a 16 year old. She's improved a lot over the course of the year. The only Top 100 players Barty has played since the beginning of the year (when she was just 15 years old!) are Kvitova and Vinci, and you're delusional if you think Robson would've taken sets off them. :o I'm not saying that Barty would necessarily be better than Robson, but it's not out of the question.

It's just really not right to compare a girl born in January 1994 to girls born in April/June 1996, because she won a few sets over some decent players, yet ultimately didn't win the match anyway. That's like comparing these girls to the likes of Azarenka, Radwanska and Wozniacki, going through the statistics and what they achieved at the same age. It's really barely relevant when the age gap is that wide.

Vekic's results since Tashkent have been fine? :confused: She reached the SF of $100K Suzhou where she lost to Hsieh, and QF of $125K Pune (where she was injured and lost to Tanasugarn). She had a bad loss in the QF of $25K Seoul but Yuxuan Zhang is another good player who nobody's talked about yet in this thread. Donna easily reached the final qualifying round of the US Open (dropping just five games) so the signs were there that she was ready for a big break through. I didn't expect it so soon, but it was always going to happen.

Larcher de Brito is a player who as a 15/16 year old had several Top 100 wins (including Aga Radwanska), took sets off the likes of Serena and Kuznetsova. On the other her results on ITF level were pretty awful in comparison, she never won her first ITF until she was 18, and it was just a $25K. So I'm guessing you thought Larcher de Brito was going to be a really great player and are shocked at how bad she's doing now? :confused:

*hingis_forever*
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:02 PM
I agree that Barty's results against Top 100 players aren't good, but the rankings don't lie :shrug: Barty's winning streak in ITFs is too much to ignore for a 16 year old. She's improved a lot over the course of the year. The only Top 100 players Barty has played since the beginning of the year (when she was just 15 years old!) are Kvitova and Vinci, and you're delusional if you think Robson would've taken sets off them. :o I'm not saying that Barty would necessarily be better than Robson, but it's not out of the question.:

Well, seeing as Laura beat Vinci in straight sets on clay this year, I don't consider it very delusional to think she'd beat her on grass at Wimbledon.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:11 PM
I agree that Barty's results against Top 100 players aren't good, but the rankings don't lie :shrug: Barty's winning streak in ITFs is too much to ignore for a 16 year old. She's improved a lot over the course of the year. The only Top 100 players Barty has played since the beginning of the year (when she was just 15 years old!) are Kvitova and Vinci, and you're delusional if you think Robson would've taken sets off them. :o I'm not saying that Barty would necessarily be better than Robson, but it's not out of the question.

It's just really not right to compare a girl born in January 1994 to girls born in April/June 1996, because she won a few sets over some decent players, yet ultimately didn't win the match anyway. That's like comparing these girls to the likes of Azarenka, Radwanska and Wozniacki, going through the statistics and what they achieved at the same age. It's really barely relevant when the age gap is that wide.

Vekic's results since Tashkent have been fine? :confused: She reached the SF of $100K Suzhou where she lost to Hsieh, and QF of $125K Pune (where she was injured and lost to Tanasugarn). She had a bad loss in the QF of $25K Seoul but Yuxuan Zhang is another good player who nobody's talked about yet in this thread. Donna easily reached the final qualifying round of the US Open (dropping just five games) so the signs were there that she was ready for a big break through. I didn't expect it so soon, but it was always going to happen.

Larcher de Brito is a player who as a 15/16 year old had several Top 100 wins (including Aga Radwanska), took sets off the likes of Serena and Kuznetsova. On the other her results on ITF level were pretty awful in comparison, she never won her first ITF until she was 18, and it was just a $25K. So I'm guessing you thought Larcher de Brito was going to be a really great player and are shocked at how bad she's doing now? :confused:

Nope. I actually didn't see MLDB being that successful but I kept an open mind because the results were good. When your head is telling you one thing and the results are saying something else an open mind is always the best policy.

Additionally, what I have been saying is that top 100 wins are a better indication that a player is heading for the top 100 than success at 25k level. In the case of MLDB, that proved true as she reached the top 100 at a very young age. But the other thing I have said is that it doesn't matter when you get to the top 100, it is certainly not a race, what matters is what you do once you are there. And MLDB rather supported that view too.

One thing that actually always left me doubtful about MLDB was her emotional state. When you see players having tantrums it usually doesn't bode well for the future. There are exceptions but a lack of emotional maturity can often be a hindrance. It certainly has been for her. That, and her size always meant that she was going to have to work that much harder than the players around her, a problem that Putintseva and to a lesser exent Barty also face. I don't say short players can't succeed in tennis, but the odds aren't stacked in their favour and they have to work twice as hard. What Errani has done this year, doesn't come easily.

I have to say, your Robson/Barty comparisons are silly too. Robson had 9 top 50 victories last year, one of them was against Roberta Vinci as a matter of fact. Suggesting Barty who is playing a diet of some of the easiest 25ks on the planet in Australia is at this level is risible. Let me be clear. Ashleigh is 16, she is doing very well for someone who is sixteen winning loads of Aussie 25ks. But there is a vast difference between between beating the Tammi Patterson's and Sally Peers's of this world and beating top 100, let alone top 50 players. And Barty has shown no sign of being close to beating established WTA tour pros. That's not a big problem right now. She is 16. She has time. Another year on the tour and I expect she will be that much stronger.

I must add though, I don't believe Barty is even at the level of play Robson was on at that age but if you have read everything I've written I don't think that matters much anyway. Barty will in all likelihood establish herself on the main tour. I don't believe it will be next year though. She has a lot of improving to do. Once there we will see how she performs. Given her physical size, I would say the odds of her being more successful than Robson are small, not miniscule small but in the 10-20% range.

Donna Vekic? She is another matter, and it is true I might be being too cautious on her. She has a much better shot at breaking through next year than does Barty. Her results in Tashkent were amazing. But I want to see her get a few more decent wins before I'm really sold that she is going to be comfortable playing next year on the main tour which given her current ranking is what we can expect to attempt. I suspect she needs a little more time to come good and she might fight it pretty tough on the main tour to begin with. We will see. That said, she obviously has as good potential as any player in the game right now and in the long run I expect her to do just fine.

Halepsova
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:12 PM
Alexus Jones :cheer:

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:17 PM
Well, seeing as Laura beat Vinci in straight sets on clay this year, I don't consider it very delusional to think she'd beat her on grass at Wimbledon.
We were making the comparisons of Barty/Robson at the same age, i.e. Robson as a 16 year old (around 2010 Wimbledon). At this time Robson was ranked outside Top 200 and lost in straight sets to Cibulkova, Wickmayer and Jankovic in the grass season. I don't think any of that suggests that she would take a set off of Vinci of 2012 on grass, moreso actually beat her. :confused: Of course now Robson would have a fair chance of beating her, but it's not like that would be a given.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:24 PM
We were making the comparisons of Barty/Robson at the same age, i.e. Robson as a 16 year old (around 2010 Wimbledon). At this time Robson was ranked outside Top 200 and lost in straight sets to Cibulkova, Wickmayer and Jankovic in the grass season. I don't think any of that suggests that she would take a set off of Vinci of 2012 on grass. :confused: Of course now Robson would have a fair chance of beating her, but it's not like that would be a given.

Okay, but Robson was playing competitive matches against top 100 players regularly. She had sets against Hantuchova and Benesova. She had a win against Goerges. She was winning 9 games against Jankovic and Wickmayer, both top 20 players. Problem with Barty is that not only has she not won 1 set out of 10 against top 100 players, only 2 of those ten sets were even competitive and one of those was against Tatishvili. That's 8 sets out of 10 sets with 2 or less games won. :tape: Before I believe a player is ready to compete against top 100 opposition I need some sort of sign. I have not yet gotten it from Barty.

Losing Streak
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:40 PM
Oh, I forgot to mention Anna-Lena Friedsam. But really, watch Sasnovich, she's very talented and crafty. I think she can be big.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:40 PM
Re: Alison van Uytvanck there are other things that also make me very optimistic about her future that have nothing to do with her results. When I first saw her in a junior 1st round match at Wimbledon I saw a rough diamond right then and there. Even though she lost that match, I left that day remembering this talented redhead who had more skills that all the other juniors I saw combined. Sure not everything was coming off and a lot of the time she was careless but I saw the talent even then and when she started winning loads of matches on the ITF tour the at the start of 2011 I knew I was on to something.

Seriously, she does have an uncommon level of talent. Her serve is unusually big for an 18 year old and can only improve. She is strong and can use her forehand to hit powerful winners and she has great volleying skills for someone so young as well as tremendous touch which is always something that catches my eye. As with all players success will come down to how hard she works and how motivated she is. But if we are talking about raw talent, AVU has more of it than any 18 year old on the tour as far as I'm concerned. Next year we will start seeing what she does with it.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:41 PM
Oh, I forgot to mention Anna-Lena Friedsam. But really, watch Sasnovich, she's very talented and crafty. I think she can be big.

Yeah, she is one I didn't mention either but definately a girl with big potential. :yeah:

BlueTrees
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:42 PM
Okay, but Robson was playing competitive matches against top 100 players regularly. She had sets against Hantuchova and Benesova. She had a win against Goerges. She was winning 9 games against Jankovic and Wickmayer, both top 20 players. Problem with Barty is that not only has she not won 1 set out of 10 against top 100 players, only 2 of those ten sets were even competitive and one of those was against Tatishvili.

I'm sorry, but just because you took "a set" off of some top players (and Goerges wasn't even a top player then, and was Benesova ever a "top player"? :lol:) is not indicative that she would be able to always repeat that level, at that stage of her career. 90%+ chance is that Vinci would've won in straight sets. Especially seeing as Robson was straight setted by Wickmayer and Cibulkova the weeks leading up.

As for your other post, once again I don't even think it's right to compare girls who are two and a half years apart, picking how many Top 100 wins they had at "Age X". If we played that game then I guess all of these girls would look at Sharapova's career at the age they are now and find another job :lol:

I know you're going to reply to this post because you always want to have the last say, so have at it. Once again Robson should never have been brought into the discussion.

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 04:56 PM
I'm sorry, but just because you took "a set" off of some top players (and Goerges wasn't even a top player then, and was Benesova ever a "top player"? :lol:) is not indicative that she would be able to always repeat that level, at that stage of her career. 90%+ chance is that Vinci would've won in straight sets. Especially seeing as Robson was straight setted by Wickmayer and Cibulkova the weeks leading up.

As for your other post, once again I don't even think it's right to compare girls who are two and a half years apart, picking how many Top 100 wins they had at "Age X". If we played that game then I guess all of these girls would look at Sharapova's career at the age they are now and find another job :lol:

I know you're going to reply to this post because you always want to have the last say, so have at it. Once again Robson should never have been brought into the discussion.

No. I have no need for a last word. But I would consider it rude not to reply. :)

I think I've said everything that I want to say.

I actually think we are mostly in agreement then that comparisons between how two successful two players are at 16 is fairly useless and doesn't have a great bearing on how they will do as their careers progress. And yeah, I agree I don't think there is a lot of point in comparing Barty to Robson, but then I wasn't the one that initiated that comparison. ;)

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:06 PM
Shvedbarilescu your argument is flawed because you are only looking at one side of the story.


1. How is a player supposed to be ready for WTA if they are losing easily in $25k and $10k level? Even if they are having a bad day they should still pull out the win.


2. You don't trust Donna's WTA run, but isn't that completely against your point? (ie some few big results are all that matter, ignore the more conclusive ITF results)


3. A point I keep mentioning but you ignoring, a young player has limited opportunities at WTAs. Not fair to compare a player who has a win over a top 100 player that played like shit on the day to a player that played against an opponent playing well. It is more like a lottery on which player gets the better hand. A young players WTA record should only come into question once they have started to play regularly on tour like Robson.


4. Even some of the best players in the past struggled to win games early. Transitioning can take a year. But usually once they get their first win, many more quickly come.

fouc
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:09 PM
Alison van Uytvanck and Anna Karolina Schmiedlova :confused: :lol:


oh gurl, you are in for a rude awakening

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:23 PM
Shvedbarilescu your argument is flawed because you are only looking at one side of the story.


1. How is a player supposed to be ready for WTA if they are losing easily in $25k and $10k level? Even if they are having a bad day they should still pull out the win.


2. You don't trust Donna's WTA run, but isn't that completely against your point? (ie some few big results are all that matter, ignore the more conclusive ITF results)


3. A point I keep mentioning but you ignoring, a young player has limited opportunities at WTAs. Not fair to compare a player who has a win over a top 100 player that played like shit on the day to a player that played against an opponent playing well. It is more like a lottery on which player gets the better hand. A young players WTA record should only come into question once they have started to play regularly on tour like Robson.


4. Even some of the best players in the past struggled to win games early. Transitioning can take a year. But usually once they get their first win, many more quickly come.

1. The last time I checked, AVU had won her last 6 matches and 10 of the last 12. It was obvious throughout this summer that Alison wasn't focused on her 25k matches. It was never a concern to me. She had already proven she was capable of playing at a higher level than that.

2, Donna's run, is one tournament that is out of context with the rest of her year. But please don't twist my words. I state very clearly that I believe Donna has a much potential as anyone on the tour right now and I acknowledge I might be a bit cautious suggesting she isn't quite ready yet. I wish her well and we will see how next year pans out. On balence I still don't think she is quite ready to compete week in, week out at WTA level yet, but we will see.

3. Alison has played 9 top 100 players. She won 5 of those matches. So are you saying that she got lucky 5 times? Contrast Barty has played ten sets against top 100 players, lost them all and won more than 2 games in a set just twice. If you want to ignore these results, be my guest, I don't care.

4. Again, same thing. Can you distinguish between "not ready yet" and "never going to be ready"? If you actually read what I have said about Barty you would know I think on balance she probably has a good future. But her results do scream "I'm not ready yet". And if you think winning a bunch of matches against players ranked outside the top 200 says otherwise again, that's fine. I don't care. We will see next year.

Viktymise
Nov 14th, 2012, 10:43 PM
Van Uytvanck didn't impress me much. Like Hercog with a bit of a BH.

binky-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2012, 11:09 PM
1. The last time I checked, AVU had won her last 6 matches and 10 of the last 12. It was obvious throughout this summer that Alison wasn't focused on her 25k matches. It was never a concern to me. She had already proven she was capable of playing at a higher level than that.

2, Donna's run, is one tournament that is out of context with the rest of her year. But please don't twist my words. I state very clearly that I believe Donna has a much potential as anyone on the tour right now and I acknowledge I might be a bit cautious suggesting she isn't quite ready yet. I wish her well and we will see how next year pans out. On balence I still don't think she is quite ready to compete week in, week out at WTA level yet, but we will see.

3. Alison has played 9 top 100 players. She won 5 of those matches. So are you saying that she got lucky 5 times? Contrast Barty has played ten sets against top 100 players, lost them all and won more than 2 games in a set just twice. If you want to ignore these results, be my guest, I don't care.

4. Again, same thing. Can you distinguish between "not ready yet" and "never going to be ready"? If you actually read what I have said about Barty you would know I think on balance she probably has a good future. But her results do scream "I'm not ready yet". And if you think winning a bunch of matches against players ranked outside the top 200 says otherwise again, that's fine. I don't care. We will see next year.

1. If you find losing at low levels nothing to be concerned about... :help:

2. I think Donna has already shown enough, don't understand why you can't see it. Maybe like for most youngsters you haven't been watching their matches.

3. I wasn't saying ignore good results, but you should ignore bad results when we are talking about young players with limited opportunities.

4. So what does someone like Barty need to do to convince you she's ready?
- Win even more at ITF (which you seem to disregard, even when she wins a $50k in your country)
- Win at WTA (but then she can never be ready, unless she wins a match when she wasn't ready, see the paradox?)
- Become 18 years of age

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 14th, 2012, 11:23 PM
1. If you find losing at low levels nothing to be concerned about... :help:

2. I think Donna has already shown enough, don't understand why you can't see it. Maybe like for most youngsters you haven't been watching their matches.

3. I wasn't saying ignore good results, but you should ignore bad results when we are talking about young players with limited opportunities.

4. So what does someone like Barty need to do to convince you she's ready?
- Win even more at ITF (which you seem to disregard, even when she wins a $50k in your country)
- Win at WTA (but then she can never be ready, unless she wins a match when she wasn't ready, see the paradox?)
- Become 18 years of age

Err...I see...get back to me in a year's time. I'm busy now. :o

King Halep
Nov 15th, 2012, 12:29 AM
I dont think Barty will be ready for a year. Too bad she prefers to play at home and theres no 50k events there. Maybe she should go to Asia and play some there. I have seen some matches and it does not look like she is dominant enough. She should get stronger and refine her technique.

Carsten
Nov 15th, 2012, 02:27 PM
From those I've seen enough, Keys and Witthoeft do have the most promising games to me.




You can see her match in Moscow against Safarova here (she won a set): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaQixv5TFgA

Wow her backhand looks really awkward :lol: Is that one-handed or two-handed? :help:

améliemomo
Nov 15th, 2012, 02:41 PM
I really believe in Barty cause she has a smart game and amazing technique for such a young player. Perhaps not next year but at 18 she will make serious serious damages for sure.

FiBeR
Nov 17th, 2012, 02:01 AM
Podoroska

jaredlikesbieber
Nov 17th, 2012, 03:07 AM
laura robson. i also see big things for pavlyuchenkova, i have been waiting for her to make a breakthrough and we may see it in 2013

espana
Nov 17th, 2012, 10:52 AM
not sure how old is Monica Puig, but I expect a lot of her next year

*Jool*
Nov 17th, 2012, 11:40 AM
Puig, but maybe she's a bt older than those mentionned in the first page (havent read all thread)

deliverance.
Nov 17th, 2012, 11:45 AM
There are a lot of young girls, which we should keep an eye. Robson, Bouchard, Beck, Vekic, Barty, Khromacheva, Putintseva, Schmiedlova, Keys, Crawford, Townsend, Belgians and Germans are my favorites for rise their ranking the most.

smarties
Nov 17th, 2012, 12:44 PM
In no particular order:

1- Vekic
2- Khromacheva/Beck
3- Keys
4- Putinseva
5- Gasparyan
(6- Pfizenmaier)

Petkorazzi
Nov 17th, 2012, 12:53 PM
Pfizenmaier is 21 in less than 2 months, hardly a youngster :p

Juju Nostalgique
Nov 17th, 2012, 05:08 PM
Sam Crawford :hearts:

Eugenie Bouchard :hearts:

Françoise Abanda :hearts:

Carina Witthöft :hearts:

Antonia Lottner :hearts:

F4CU
Nov 18th, 2012, 05:49 AM
Nadia Podoroska!!!

F4CU
Nov 18th, 2012, 05:56 AM
Nadia Podoroska!!!

Ana'sProcess
Nov 18th, 2012, 11:38 PM
1. Sloane Stephens
2. Laura Robson
3. Donna Vekic
4. Samantha Crawford
5. Aleksandra Krunic