PDA

View Full Version : So does this weekend pretty much determine player of the year?


MakarovaFan
Sep 5th, 2012, 08:58 PM
Assuming Serena gets through, we will have Vika/Maria/Serena remaining to play for the title(ok and Errani,but like really :rolleyes:). Does the winner pretty much seal the deal of player of the year??

Vika: 2 GS titles + SF in Wimby & OG+ IW+ Dubai+ 26-0 start......Vika nabbing 2 GSs and having that great streak
Maria: 2 GS titles+ 2 major Finals(AO & OG)+ Rome+ undefeated on Red Clay (16-0).....Maria making 3/4 GS Finals
Serena: 2 GS titles + Gold Medalist+ undefeated on grass(13-0)......Serena doing the Wimby-OG-USO triple

Yes i know the SEC/YEC remains but even if the winner here doesn't nab the SEC(Petra probably will anyways) it's hard to see anyone else having had a better year.......any other possible, justifible scenarios?

supergrunt
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:02 PM
Yes, and it will be Serena--by a landslide. :bounce:

miffedmax
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:08 PM
Nonsense. The Legion of Blondes is invincible. Invincible I say!*


(*And don't bring up Ekat and Andy, because by now you should know I live in an alternative universe).

ShiftyFella
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:09 PM
if GS and Olympics counts more than the rest of the tour then there no doubt Vuvu wins it even if she don't takes the USO title

tennisbum79
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:11 PM
In addition to POY, were Serena to win this, she will get a solid foot in the conversation as the best ever.

I recognized many posters here do not agree with it, but tennis commentator have started to increasingly mention her name.
Some argue that it is not only the number of GS won, but also the stiffness of the competition in over the years since 1997 when she won her first GS.
Yes Martina Nav and Eteffi Graf have more GS, but did they face an ever rejunvenating competition throughout their career when ethy won GS?

Gangstress
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:12 PM
Yes and it will be Maria

tennisbum79
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:12 PM
if GS and Olympics counts more than the rest of the tour then there no doubt Vuvu wins it even if she don't takes the USO title
what?:confused:

Petronius
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:12 PM
An interesting scenario: Azarenka/Sharapova wins US Open and Serena wins YEC

Result:

Azarenka/Sharapova has two slams
Serena has one slam, Olympic Gold and YEC

Who should be chosen as POY?

Jimmie48
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:13 PM
Vika has simply been more impressive overall, no R1/early round slam loss either.

Excelscior
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:16 PM
An interesting scenario: Azarenka/Sharapova wins US Open and Serena wins YEC

Result:

Azarenka/Sharapova has two slams
Serena has one slam, Olympic Gold and YEC

Who should be chosen as POY?

Your scenario would really be vice versa (if it was going to happen in any semblence).

Serena would more likely win the US Open, with one of the other two winning the YEC (if they could).

If it was going to happen, that would be the more likely sequence.

And of course, they would give POY to Serena. She would of won the two biggest majors, plus more tournaments, and been more dominant than the other two.

And of course (they feel), a dominant or winning Serena is good for the sport.

MakarovaFan
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:19 PM
An interesting scenario: Azarenka/Sharapova wins US Open and Serena wins YEC

Result:

Azarenka/Sharapova has two slams
Serena has one slam, Olympic Gold and YEC

Who should be chosen as POY?
Well Maria would have 2 GS plus played 3/4 GS Finals in a calendar year PLUS OG Silver/RU...that beats Serena
Vika otoh, 2 GSs and that great streak of 26-0 but other than that it would come down to overall title count.....

But i thought of another Scenario............Vika/Maria lose the Final to Serena, but nab YEC:
Serena: 2 GS titles+OG VS Maria: 1 GS+ 3GS Finals+OG RU+YEC VS Azarenka: 1 GS title+ 2GS Finals+ YEC+26-0 start

ShiftyFella
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:32 PM
what?:confused:
Serena didn't have that good year actually. If we count only slams Vuvu advanced deeper at all of them, Rena only at Wimbi, then we add Olympics they both have 2 medals, then we add the rest of the tour and overall dominance in rankings Vuvu again comes on top, if in USO F Vika looses to Serena and they both have terrible results at YEC i don't see how Rena could edge over Vuvu

babsi
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:37 PM
Vika has simply been more impressive overall, no R1/early round slam loss either.

Maria Final Winner R4 Semi-Final (pending)
Vika Winner R4 Semi-Final Semi Final (pending)

How is Vika more impressive?:help:

ATM, Maria just edges it with the AO final, it can all change on Friday.

LoveFifteen
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:40 PM
Whichever of the three wins the US Open will be the player of the year.

NashaMasha
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:42 PM
In addition to POY, were Serena to win this, she will get a solid foot in the conversation as the best ever.

I recognized many posters here do not agree with it, but tennis commentator have started to increasingly mention her name.
Some argue that it is not only the number of GS won, but also the stiffness of the competition in over the years since 1997 when she won her first GS.
Yes Martina Nav and Eteffi Graf have more GS, but did they face an ever rejunvenating competition throughout their career when ethy won GS?

I will admit that Rena is a GOAT if
1) she wins 18 GS
2) she wins her second RG
3) one or two more tour Championships are also necessary

the second point is the most complicated to accomplish for Serena , to my mind

tennisbum79
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:43 PM
Serena didn't have that good year actually. If we count only slams Vuvu advanced deeper at all of them, Rena only at Wimbi, then we add Olympics they both have 2 medals, then we add the rest of the tour and overall dominance in rankings Vuvu again comes on top, if in USO F Vika looses to Serena and they both have terrible results at YEC i don't see how Rena could edge over Vuvu
Let get me this straight.
Serena wins Wimbledon, Olympics Wimbledon, USO and along the way, beats Maria, Azarenka, Kvitova and Radwanska convincingly.

And you are still picking Azarenka with on one single GS?

Excelscior
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:45 PM
PS: I forgot (how could I). :eek:

Serena also won the Olympics this year.

If she wins the US Open, and/or the YEC (if she went), its' a wrap for her with POY.

edificio
Sep 5th, 2012, 09:53 PM
Vika has simply been more impressive overall, no R1/early round slam loss either.

Win loss record for 2012

Serena 50-4 slam, gold
Vika 52-7 slam, bronze
Maria 48-7 slam, silver
(Correct if wrong, someone.)

How is Vika more impressive overall again? :weirdo:

The weekend will decide, since they rarely seem to consider YEC.

justineheninfan
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:02 PM
Assuming Serena gets through, we will have Vika/Maria/Serena remaining to play for the title(ok and Errani,but like really :rolleyes:)

You might as well do the same eyeroll for Vika and Maria since their odds of winning the title while Serena is still around are about on par with Errani's.

MakarovaFan
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:14 PM
You might as well do the same eyeroll for Vika and Maria since their odds of winning the title while Serena is still around are about on par with Errani's.

:confused:So Sara Errani has as much chance to beat Serena-Maria/Vika back-to-back in a GS SF-F on harcourts as Maria or Vika do to beat Serena??? Please......the last 2 times Vika and Serena met in a Slam(2 in last 5) Vika has been 2 points away from taking a set, and despite the horrible match up Maria HAS beaten Serena before in big matches(not likely to happen now until Maria sees a doctor,but still faaaaaar higher a chance than Errani). It's okay to state the obvious but please don't be ludicrous with the hate.

ShiftyFella
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:20 PM
Let get me this straight.
Serena wins Wimbledon, Olympics Wimbledon, USO and along the way, beats Maria, Azarenka, Kvitova and Radwanska convincingly.

And you are still picking Azarenka with on one single GS?
yes, 2GS proves she is champion but not the POY, for me overall performance on tour is what important when choosing POY, personally i don't like when people(players\fans\journalists\etc..) put GS above the rest of the tour, GS should be pinnacle of the tour but not the only tournament on the tour that matters

MakarovaFan
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:23 PM
In addition to POY, were Serena to win this, she will get a solid foot in the conversation as the best ever.

I recognized many posters here do not agree with it, but tennis commentator have started to increasingly mention her name.
Some argue that it is not only the number of GS won, but also the stiffness of the competition in over the years since 1997 when she won her first GS.
Yes Martina Nav and Eteffi Graf have more GS, but did they face an ever rejunvenating competition throughout their career when ethy won GS?

I can't with the double standards....this really belongs in a different thread but oh well: since 2008 Serena has won almost half her GS titles-(6) yet since 2008 the tour has LARGELY been considered a joke with the likes of Jankovic,Safina and Woz being number 1 and many considering the level of play the worst ever in tour history with 'generation' suck emerging. Her 6 slam wins coming over none other than: Jankovic,Safina,Venus,post retirementHenin,Zvonareva and Radwanska, and in a few of those slams she didn't face a top 10 player.

Now check my history cuz i've never been one the make these claims towards the tour(and i feel 2011-2012 has significantly increased the tour's level) but i find statements like these to be bewildering.

NashaMasha
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:25 PM
Serena with 2 Slams and OG will be much >>>>>>>>>> than anyone with 1 Slam and without OG , especially Vika with her not much better RG accomplishment

someone will try to remember Vika's IW and Dubais , but this streak was not more than 1/4 of the season and only on HC, whereas Rena has wins on fast clay courts and grass in her pocket

manu32
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:31 PM
no match for Serena,obv

manu32
Sep 5th, 2012, 10:33 PM
and her "scores" against Sharpie or Azarenka are ...lol

Roookie
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:23 PM
Let get me this straight.
Serena wins Wimbledon, Olympics Wimbledon, USO and along the way, beats Maria, Azarenka, Kvitova and Radwanska convincingly.

And you are still picking Azarenka with on one single GS?

So now Olympics count as a Grand Slam..now that Serena won it :lol:...when for years her stans claimed it was just a glorified exhibition event. :weirdo:

Serena is out of the question for Player of the Year...1R at Roland Garros 4rd Australian Open. The winner of Azarenka/Sharapova should get POY.

Excelscior
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:26 PM
So now Olympics count as a Grand Slam..now that Serena won it :lol:...when for years her stans claimed it was just a glorified exhibition event. :weirdo:

Serena is out of the question for Player of the Year...1R at Roland Garros 4rd Australian Open. The winner of Azarenka/Sharapova should get POY.

Are you serious? :eek:

Even if Serena wins the US Open (and Wimby and the Olympics), with the best winning percentage; albeit as a almost part time player, she shouldn't win player of the year, cause she lost 1st round at the French? :tape:

This sounds like a Wozniaki fans argument for consistency now.

Stonerpova
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:30 PM
It's crazy that Maria could win the French Open, get to 2 other slam finals and medal at the Olympics and still not be player of the year :lol:

The point is that we have had 3 players each having incredible seasons, and it's so nice that the POY race is this close.

Roookie
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:36 PM
Are you serious? :eek:

Even if Serena wins the US Open (and Wimby and the Olympics), with the best winning percentage; albeit as a almost part time player, she shouldn't win player of the year, cause she lost 1st round at the French? :tape:


You said it. And again since when Olympics is more important than tournaments like Indian Wells/Rome :confused:

dybbuk
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:45 PM
yes, 2GS proves she is champion but not the POY, for me overall performance on tour is what important when choosing POY, personally i don't like when people(players\fans\journalists\etc..) put GS above the rest of the tour, GS should be pinnacle of the tour but not the only tournament on the tour that matters

So if Serena wins the USO she would have two more titles this year than Vika, one more Premier event title than Vika, one more Slam than Vika, a Gold medal to Vika's bronze medal, more finals than Vika, a 3-0 head to head with Vika, and a better win-loss record than Vika. Yet Vika would still have had the better year. Oh, ok.

Excelscior
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:53 PM
You said it. And again since when Olympics is more important than tournaments like Indian Wells/Rome :confused:

Just so you know, I've never been one of those people that say the Olympics is not important.

Ask Andy Murray how important it was to him?

Of course it's important, cause the top/best players made it important (and rearranged their entire schedules and played -HUSH-Fed Cup for it).

Yes being an almost part time player may not be the fairest thing (cause it keeps Rena fresh/fresher against her peers).

However, if she wins the US Open, it's pretty much a wrap on the year, even if one of the others wins the YEC (cause Wimby, Olympic Gold and US Open trumps, their one slam, the YEC, and anything else they won). Sorry.

And if someones fave won the Olympic this year, they would call it the "5th major", touting how important it was, regardless of what they may of said in the past.

TheLegendof
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:56 PM
Yes, and it will be Serena--by a landslide. :bounce:

Oh, I hope so!

tennisbum79
Sep 5th, 2012, 11:57 PM
yes, 2GS proves she is champion but not the POY, for me overall performance on tour is what important when choosing POY, personally i don't like when people(players\fans\journalists\etc..) put GS above the rest of the tour, GS should be pinnacle of the tour but not the only tournament on the tour that matters

Let me try this
How many times has Serena beaten these players in 2012?
Maria, vika, Aga, Petra . Top 5 except Petra

Dave.
Sep 6th, 2012, 12:03 AM
Probably. And this conversation includes Errani too. Were she to win this on top of her RG final she'd have a very good case.

Never mind that she's already doubles team of the year and favourite to take 2/4 slams.

TheLegendof
Sep 6th, 2012, 12:04 AM
I will admit that Rena is a GOAT if
1) she wins 18 GS
2) she wins her second RG
3) one or two more tour Championships are also necessary

the second point is the most complicated to accomplish for Serena , to my mind

I see that as hard but fair. Winning another French seems an almost impossibility for Serena now, but you never know, she may surprise us -- I personally think she needs 18 and RG, but don't really care about YEC.

faboozadoo15
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:11 AM
If Serena wins, she has POY on lockdown. It'll be interesting if Maria or Vika win USO but Serena manages to win YEC.

sweetadri06
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:30 AM
Can we have this conversation after the USopen? It's pointless to talk about hypothetical.

blackandblue
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:31 AM
The gap in accomplishment between finalist and winner is greater than that between a 1st round loser and a finalist.

MrSerenaWilliams
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:32 AM
Vika has simply been more impressive overall, no R1/early round slam loss either.

She also hasn't been in a final in almost 6 months and hasn't won a title in almost 8. :shrug:

Stonerpova
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:35 AM
She also hasn't been in a final in almost 6 months and hasn't won a title in almost 8. :shrug:

Yep. Vika's been consistent, but her results since Indian Wells don't scream "PLAYER OF THE YEAR!!!111"

Even if Serena doesn't win this tournament (she will, but still) she's still the only one of the big three who has won titles on all surfaces. Azarenka has won, what, 4 titles this year and all came in the first three months of the year on hard courts and Maria's three titles all came on clay.

MrSerenaWilliams
Sep 6th, 2012, 01:38 AM
Yep. Vika's been consistent, but her results since Indian Wells don't scream "PLAYER OF THE YEAR!!!111"

Even if Serena doesn't win this tournament (she will, but still) she's still the only one of the big three who has won titles on all surfaces. Azarenka has won, what, 4 titles this year and all came in the first three months of the year on hard courts and Maria's three titles all came on clay.

I don't know if it's her cooling off or everyone else picking up, but I think it's interesting that after starting the year at 26-0, she hasn't been to a final since Madrid.

I would even argue that Maria's having a better year even with 1 less title :shrug:

acetoace
Sep 6th, 2012, 02:42 AM
So now Olympics count as a Grand Slam..now that Serena won it :lol:...when for years her stans claimed it was just a glorified exhibition event. :weirdo:

Serena is out of the question for Player of the Year...1R at Roland Garros 4rd Australian Open. The winner of Azarenka/Sharapova should get POY.

Just because u said so don't make it so particularly if they fail to win 2 slams. POY is in the bag for Serena should she lift the 2012 USO trophy. What more, tennis pundist and those that count in tennis world will state exactly just that. They never fail. IT'S HOW THE GAME ROLLS. WATCH AND LEARN.

Lastly, can u show us the thread/post, article, blog or whatever where a Serena fan claimed the Olympics is just a glorified exhibition?

NashaMasha
Sep 6th, 2012, 02:55 AM
Let me try this
How many times has Serena beaten these players in 2012?
Maria, vika, Aga, Petra . Top 5 except Petra

she beat Maria and Vika on fast slippery surfaces(grass , blueclay) and not even managed to reach them on all others


And when speaking about accomplishment H2H is irrelevant. Serena lost in the 1st round of FO and 4th round of AO and can't compensate it with her H2H vs top players.

If Serena wins US Open , her 2012 achievements will be greater than anyone's in the tour this year..

Vikapower
Sep 6th, 2012, 03:59 AM
She also hasn't been in a final in almost 6 months and hasn't won a title in almost 8.

Are you a kid ? Victoria was on rate that she obviously was never going to keep for whole of the season -- you sound ridiculous especially that all the SF Victoria lost this year were against the winner and relative top heavy favorite for the title.

Victoria's last F was in Madrid, on grass she's far from being the top favorite and lost both times to Serena -- since then, she's played one joke match against Paszek and she's yet in another SF in the US Open -- so what exactly is your point, we have no idea.

Papi
Sep 6th, 2012, 04:08 AM
This year's USO will bring quite the excitement the WTA needs with three of the top stars of the game literally competing for POY - and I think the winner deserves to have that year-end title...

tennisbum79
Sep 6th, 2012, 05:42 AM
she beat Maria and Vika on fast slippery surfaces(grass , blueclay) and not even managed to reach them on all others


And when speaking about accomplishment H2H is irrelevant. Serena lost in the 1st round of FO and 4th round of AO and can't compensate it with her H2H vs top players.

If Serena wins US Open , her 2012 achievements will be greater than anyone's in the tour this year..
Wimbledon used to be the most prestigious tournament, now it is just a fast and slippery surface. You have a future in politic as spin-master.

LoveFifteen
Sep 6th, 2012, 03:25 PM
Serena will be snatching a blonde wig on Saturday, and then she will be the indisputable player of the year.

Doully
Sep 6th, 2012, 03:39 PM
Are you serious? :eek:

Even if Serena wins the US Open (and Wimby and the Olympics), with the best winning percentage; albeit as a almost part time player, she shouldn't win player of the year, cause she lost 1st round at the French? :tape:

This sounds like a Wozniaki fans argument for consistency now.

What in the blue hell is part-time about a 51-4 W/L this year to date?

MakarovaFan
Sep 6th, 2012, 05:49 PM
Can we have this conversation after the USopen? It's pointless to talk about hypothetical.
That's the whole point of this thread.....smh :rolleyes: