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View Full Version : Which singers have most run out of puff over the years?


Lord Choc Ice
Apr 8th, 2012, 12:49 PM
As much as I'm a huge fan I think Elton John. He still sounds fine when he writes songs to accomodate his now-limited voice but when he sings his old stuff? Forget it :tape:. Age is a possible factor obviously but he also abused his voice heavily during the 80s (drugs, bulimia). I'm quite confident he would still sound good singing his old songs if he took more care of himself.

"I'm Still Standing" original studio version (1983): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bz7ifClpT4g
And live in 2011: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umHZtVX70e4.

Example of sounding good in his 'new voice':
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmCS_qs1Fpw

So Disrespectful
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:03 PM
Argh. I have to do this. :tape:

EYJOq6VnV2U
Ymm5vDHAQIc

But like Elton, songs that suit her new range properly still come across well.

sP7jAnLtaQI

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:06 PM
^ Funny that a Marlboro username is the first reply in a thread about singers losing puff! :lol:.

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:08 PM
Mariah.:shrug:

So Disrespectful
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:12 PM
Mariah.:shrug:

But what other divas can maintain their voice like she has? Christina is 10 years younger and is already losing hers badly. Whitney's voice died before she did, and Celine was never relevant. :oh:

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:32 PM
But what other divas can maintain their voice like she has? Christina is 10 years younger and is already losing hers badly. Whitney's voice died before she did, and Celine was never relevant. :oh:

aviEAI_NgYc
Based on this, I believe she can still sing circles, just not as good as before (as in she'll overuse her runs more than usual).:shrug: She's like Nadal, people keep saying she'll lose her voice yet her vocal is still very strong, slaying each performance but maybe some inevitable hiccups here and there.:oh:

Whitney voice was never the same since the 2000s. Celine still has the same tone in her voice but also deteriorate like Mariah. Luckily she's a better 'actor' in terms of singing than Mariah.:lol: It's easier to spot Mariah when she's lip-synching.:oh:

Julian.
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:39 PM
Britney Spears :lol:

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:39 PM
Another one I love dearly, Paul Stanley. He's a rock singer I suppose, it's inevitable :oh:.

"Detroit Rock City" studio (1976): iZq3i94mSsQ
Live 1992: cKloAC1PBQY
Live 2003: JZ4lVI-QnXc
Live 2012: lV00gJv10DA

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:51 PM
Britney Spears :lol:

Well, with her limited voice, I'm actually surprised she's also going through this phase.:oh:

Julian.
Apr 8th, 2012, 01:58 PM
Well, with her limited voice, I'm actually surprised she's also going through this phase.:oh:

She used to be good when she was a kid :lol:

Julian.
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:01 PM
Oh and Kelly Clarkson

Back in 2002 during American Idol:
1vZ00h_crSw

2009:
WmZJqqVJXzU

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:03 PM
aviEAI_NgYc
Based on this, I believe she can still sing circles, just not as good as before (as in she'll overuse her runs more than usual).:shrug: She's like Nadal, people keep saying she'll lose her voice yet her vocal is still very strong, slaying each performance but maybe some inevitable hiccups here and there.:oh:


Christina is fine besides a bit of wear and tear which she'll probably learn to compensate for. Example, half a year ago she sang like this!
jq6nA7DayDI

Besides funeral performances aren't very fair to judge on. Example, Mariah never sang "I'll Be There" as badly as she did at MJ funeral :p.

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:40 PM
Oh and Kelly Clarkson

Back in 2002 during American Idol:
1vZ00h_crSw

2009:
WmZJqqVJXzU
Kelly actually can still hit them notes if she wants to do it. Just that her voice has become raspier than before and with the amount of touring she's been doing, no doubt her voice is going to be affected as much.:shrug: She also needs a lot of rest to get her voice going.

BTW, is Natural Woman the only time she hits that whistle register?:lol:

Julian.
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:43 PM
BTW, is Natural Woman the only time she hits that whistle register?:lol:

No idea :lol: I started watching idol back in Season 3. :p

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:45 PM
Christina is fine besides a bit of wear and tear which she'll probably learn to compensate for. Example, half a year ago she sang like this!
jq6nA7DayDI

Besides funeral performances aren't very fair to judge on. Example, Mariah never sang "I'll Be There" as badly as she did at MJ funeral :p.

:lol: Her voice was in rather poor condition during her E=MC^2 and Memoirs Era. But her Xmas performances.:drool:

XHVXHTsQOis

silverwhite
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:46 PM
Christina is fine besides a bit of wear and tear which she'll probably learn to compensate for. Example, half a year ago she sang like this!

Besides funeral performances aren't very fair to judge on. Example, Mariah never sang "I'll Be There" as badly as she did at MJ funeral :p.

+1. It was a very emotional moment for her, which had an impact on the performance :awww:

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:46 PM
No idea :lol: I started watching idol back in Season 3. :p

I was actually asking if she has hit any outside Idol?:oh: I remember she only hit that once ever in her career, during that song but somehow she may realize she doesn't hit them the right way and hence never use it anymore.:oh:

Julian.
Apr 8th, 2012, 02:48 PM
I was actually asking if she has hit any outside Idol?:oh: I remember she only hit that once ever in her career, during that song but somehow she may realize she doesn't hit them the right way and hence never use it anymore.:oh:

Also no idea :rolls:

delicatecutter
Apr 8th, 2012, 03:06 PM
She only hit that note the one time. Every other time she sang Natural Woman she didn't go for that note.

fJ5RwQiB1YA

Natural Woman is one of my least favorite of her Idol performances. I wish she had sung something else. "Shouting with tone" :hysteric:

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 9th, 2012, 02:37 AM
80wCzdGi1l8
CbAi6anK0jw

Mikey.
Apr 9th, 2012, 04:22 AM
But what other divas can maintain their voice like she has? Christina is 10 years younger and is already losing hers badly. Whitney's voice died before she did, and Celine was never relevant. :oh:

Regardless of relevance, I don't think Celine has "run out of puff" at all. :P

Mikey.
Apr 9th, 2012, 04:29 AM
She only hit that note the one time. Every other time she sang Natural Woman she didn't go for that note.

fJ5RwQiB1YA

Natural Woman is one of my least favorite of her Idol performances. I wish she had sung something else. "Shouting with tone" :hysteric:

I loved this performance, with the choked up, raspy high note and all! :hysteric: I wanted to cut that judge so badly! I also wanted to cut the Australian judge for cracking that hobbit joke and making that gap-toothed Norwegian win.

ranfurly
Apr 9th, 2012, 06:38 AM
n-KPGh3wysw
Streisand 1975

xtu9RXeYSLU
1993/1994

hQj8ujqTmCY
2006

VZdPZnai_go
2010

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 9th, 2012, 12:24 PM
^ Babs is pretty good for a dinosaur :oh:.

So Disrespectful
Apr 9th, 2012, 01:03 PM
On the other end of the scale.

uVk5hJ30WOc

:inlove:

Charlatan
Apr 9th, 2012, 06:28 PM
Regardless of relevance, I don't think Celine has "run out of puff" at all. :P

that's because she has been lip synching the hell outta her career for, uhm, like 20 years :rolleyes:

Roookie
Apr 9th, 2012, 06:43 PM
Bjork...one of the purest voices and at the Debut-Post era was even better live. But from the Volta album you could hear her voice becoming raspy. Understandable though, she does lots of high notes in most of her songs.

The Dawntreader
Apr 9th, 2012, 06:56 PM
Mariah of course. But that's understandable, that ridiculous range and extension she had isn't sustainable, and she utilised it to the max in her glory years.

But she still can sing. Well, she can mime what she sings at least.

Charlatan
Apr 9th, 2012, 07:00 PM
Mariah of course. But that's understandable, that ridiculous range and extension she had isn't sustainable, and she utilised it to the max in her glory years.

But she still can sing. Well, she can mime what she sings at least.

+1

Opnxxakxv2w

this is a collection of her last performances in 2012...she was belting some upper belts with ease and fluidity. (live)

it's just a matter of vocal rest when it comes to her

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 12th, 2012, 08:26 AM
Paul Stanley again :bigcry:.

1983 studio:
0KsemfKS2og

1998 live:
IhnLF4DdPIY

2012 live:
TTR0RC8azX0

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 14th, 2012, 11:54 AM
that's because she has been lip synching the hell outta her career for, uhm, like 20 years :rolleyes:
You're so correct :sobbing:. She sings most songs live to be fair, but "Power of Love" she's mimed for like almost 20 years :sobbing:.

EOoQ40T9aL0

I even traced what I think is the source of the vocal she lips to (first chorus onwards). This is from a live (at least on paper) album from 1994.

9gl9XZJ8IvQ

I really like this song honestly but whenever I hear it I feel like I'm being cheated :o:lol:.

delicatecutter
Apr 14th, 2012, 01:07 PM
The Power of Love is crazy hard to sing, apparently even for Celine. :hysteric:

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 14th, 2012, 01:17 PM
The Power of Love is crazy hard to sing, apparently even for Celine. :hysteric:
It's in a lowered key too. Imagine the original key :hysteric:. Maybe I'm being too hard on poor CiCi.

So Disrespectful
Apr 14th, 2012, 01:34 PM
Gwen's voice changed a lot in 2000, but then turned to complete shit somewhere after 2004 and it ain't budging.

irv_rbMonZE
-pjXK8wDS0M

TIQQculD-Vk
w-ZKF4_RJnw

ifkcmgb5tHw
bJzFfn7O6U0

Just a girl is almost unlistenable now.

Charlatan
Apr 14th, 2012, 06:44 PM
The Power of Love is crazy hard to sing, apparently even for Celine. :hysteric:

it wasn't even that hard vocally, apart from the sustained D5 in the end...she barely bothers to do that note in the original key, anyway :lol:

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 21st, 2012, 04:09 PM
What a mess! Footage taken by concert-goer shows her lip-synching to the same track she always does (and it sounds so weird, like a different woman after the first verse)

ecjTvDeQar8

On official CD/DVD product of the same night, vocals are re-recorded in the studio, probably so she can have a million tries of that last note till she gets it right.

Tqpm_mbfXLo

I don't get it though...is she scared that her fans will judge her or something? :weirdo: She doesn't give them enough credit methinks.

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 21st, 2012, 04:17 PM
Anyway I'll post a reverse example. Klaus Meine of Scorpions :bowdown:.

1991 - p-4fTp_nZDE

2001 - 6ILqVXnvF6w

2011 - Z5urTKWAAIE

In fact his voice sounds more powerful in 2011 at 63 than in 1991 :). Some people are just blessed I suppose.

$uricate
Apr 21st, 2012, 05:58 PM
n-KPGh3wysw
Streisand 1975

xtu9RXeYSLU
1993/1994

hQj8ujqTmCY
2006

VZdPZnai_go
2010

How dare you :o

I knew somebody would say Babs in this thread even though she's still got it. The woman is almost 70 and has been singing her whole life, of course there is going to be a slight deterioration, but she has kept her voice in very good shape.

Here's a Past Her Peak Barbra Streisand taking Celine Dion apart in their 1997 duet "Tell Him"

wB_vjpRhLxM

pov
Apr 21st, 2012, 06:29 PM
Does Age Effect Your Voice?
By Jeannie Deva

From my research and nearly five decades of experience, I would not say that age alone is the reason for the decline of the singing voice.

Getting Personal
First let me give you my personal experience. You may have difficulty believing what I am about to tell you because it is not what you generally observe as singers age. Through my more than forty years as a performing singer, my voice has actually continued to improve. Within the first year of completing my basic research on the voice (1977) and applying to myself the fundamentals of my evolving voice training method, my range expanded to over four strong continuous octaves. (And yes, this includes the disappearance of any register break or weak upper register.)

Since that time my voice has remained full, flexible, powerful and versatile. I am able to sing for hours with no fatigue or blow-out. In fact the more I sing the better my voice becomes. I am still surprised at the development of new colors and variations within it. With each passing year it is more expressive than it ever was.

The Ideal
Treated correctly and exercised properly, the voice remains a living, growing instrument. Obviously and unfortunately, this is not the experience of most singers. To keep your instrument performing at its best, year after year, you need to know what effects it negatively and positively. This is why it is so vital to become educated about your voice and what influences it. Knowledge is power. Only with true data can you make correct decisions and take actions that will foster continued vocal growth.

(http://www.jeanniedeva.com)

Mynarco
Apr 21st, 2012, 06:39 PM
Poor Celine :sobbing:

ranfurly
Apr 22nd, 2012, 12:25 AM
How dare you :o

I knew somebody would say Babs in this thread even though she's still got it. The woman is almost 70 and has been singing her whole life, of course there is going to be a slight deterioration, but she has kept her voice in very good shape.

Here's a Past Her Peak Barbra Streisand taking Celine Dion apart in their 1997 duet "Tell Him"

wB_vjpRhLxM

Im like Streisand's biggest fan!

There is deterioration, but how many singers sound this good at 70? Her last album was beautiful, slow, standards of a time gone by, she is timeless.

During her peak, she was arguably one of the greatest (if not the greatest) singers the world has ever produced, and perhaps one of the greatest talents.

Not many celebrities can boast kudos of the highest praise across various mediums of the entertainment industry.

Sam L
Apr 22nd, 2012, 02:05 AM
Here's a Past Her Peak Barbra Streisand taking Celine Dion apart in their 1997 duet "Tell Him"

OMG that's like past her peak Steffi Graf taking Martina Hingis apart - by a nose.

moby
Apr 22nd, 2012, 07:56 AM
Joni Mitchell is someone who "lost" her voice and simply got a another one is neither better nor worse, just different.

the jamierbelyea
Apr 22nd, 2012, 08:26 AM
I wasn't sure what the answer would be, but I thought to check out how Donna Summer has grown over the years, when I read the thread title. I think you gotta give mad props to Donna, who I think has kept her voice going strong over the years.

I really read the title and thought I wonder how Donna Summer sings MacArthur Park these days, as it's such a ridiculous song for sure haha

1978
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1kPkCOXE2c
p1kPkCOXE2c

unsure, but I'm guessing late 80s?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsiJJQAvUTY
jsiJJQAvUTY

2004 (best verision?)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcC3VT67HfI
gcC3VT67HfI

2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrHSEYHf6jc
PrHSEYHf6jc

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 22nd, 2012, 08:29 AM
You're a Donna fan as well?:eek: :cheer:
Yeah, she's actually the few singers who actually sing the same, if not better than their peak years.:oh: :worship:

the jamierbelyea
Apr 22nd, 2012, 08:38 AM
She's a powerhouse, and if anything she has a fuller sound now then she did 40 years ago. What a gift she is.

ranfurly
Apr 22nd, 2012, 09:18 AM
I'll add Kim Carnes to the list
EPOIS5taqA8

and from 2008
0uQtrov990U

ranfurly
Apr 22nd, 2012, 09:20 AM
Bonnie Tyler - Somewhere in the 80's
h8VGQTtENSs

And 2008
oQVWbpcKMWQ
phwoar, Bonnie, lay of then Benson and Hedges love.

and in 2010
6JNZ_3Mjx6c

ranfurly
Apr 22nd, 2012, 09:25 AM
One Singer who has wonderfully preserved her voice is US Legend, Judy Collins

1967 z8jGFu7ys64

1987 TbfbVMpzgx4

2010 cj5sDxHI0Mc < Starting to get the old lady wobble in there

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 22nd, 2012, 12:49 PM
Bonnie Tyler



Good God. You know what that reminds me of?

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photopost/data/825/1pattySelma.jpg

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 22nd, 2012, 01:16 PM
Poor Celine :sobbing:

OTOH, not sure what's worse...Celine's dishonesty or this hot buttered mess by the original artist of this song, Jennifer Rush.

NfJCC_2jr40

I guess that was just a bad day or she was drunk :lol:.

Aw570Lm2mFs

Here's a better performance. Still not very good though :tears:.

Charlatan
Apr 22nd, 2012, 05:51 PM
omg those jennifer rush performances :hysteric:

AdeyC
Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:01 AM
She's a powerhouse, and if anything she has a fuller sound now then she did 40 years ago. What a gift she is.

Saw her in concert here in the UK about 7 years ago, she's great.

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 23rd, 2012, 02:11 AM
Saw her in concert here in the UK about 7 years ago, she's great.
Donna Summer is good. She's underrated though because she came from the disco era :lol:.

CrossCourt~Rally
Apr 23rd, 2012, 02:27 AM
Good God. You know what that reminds me of?

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photopost/data/825/1pattySelma.jpg

^^ :lol:

Bonnie actually got her "raspy voice" from throat nodules back in the mid 70's . Although, it has gotten "raspier" over the years... WOW :eek: :lol:

Lord Choc Ice
Apr 24th, 2012, 03:46 PM
Klaus Meine again. Studio comparison.

1990 - HNrGuQpblkw

2011- gUlbgLpzIF4

So Disrespectful
Apr 24th, 2012, 04:09 PM
Chaka Khan is sounding incredible these days.

Qf4hANQUylg

delicatecutter
Apr 24th, 2012, 04:16 PM
God my ex was obsessed with that song. :hysteric:

She does sound good though.

ElusiveChanteuse
Apr 24th, 2012, 04:18 PM
wow I thought Chaka's voice was shot but apparently not.:oh:

$uricate
Apr 24th, 2012, 09:50 PM
God my ex was obsessed with that song. :hysteric:

She does sound good though.

I'm obsessed with that song :unsure:

Nicolás89
Apr 24th, 2012, 09:52 PM
Adele is losing her voice incredibly quickly. :oh:

the jamierbelyea
Apr 24th, 2012, 11:52 PM
Speaking of incredible, how bout that Dame Shirley Bassey, one of the purest most incredible voices ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEGLevoUVTU
lEGLevoUVTU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XW6ZUfbqZtU
XW6ZUfbqZtU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-orFtcORyuM
-orFtcORyuM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHTfM8Knd3c
CHTfM8Knd3c

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuKSR9EBsk4
uuKSR9EBsk4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oLBvHwwnkw
2oLBvHwwnkw

Lord Choc Ice
May 3rd, 2012, 05:36 AM
Elton John again...

Rocket Man

1972: 76itSz-QEcE

1985: lmVlcCPX9YE

2011: bEFmqUcIpu8

ranfurly
May 3rd, 2012, 06:55 AM
Elton John again...

Rocket Man

1972: 76itSz-QEcE

1985: lmVlcCPX9YE

2011: bEFmqUcIpu8

When I saw him in Dunedin, he's lost his Falsetto.

He's also a very short dumpy little man. Made me lol.

ranfurly
May 3rd, 2012, 07:00 AM
btw: Great vids of Shirley Bassey.

She's in her 70's and she can still belt out great tune, one of the most well known singers in her age group where there is hardly any signs that her voice is starting to waiver or get that old woman wobble in it.

I think this can be contributed to her heavy contro-alto style aswell.

I'll tell you what's sad, Dionne Warwick. Love her, but she really needs to give up the Mic. She sounds like an old folk at a rest home talent contest.

5tIAOu8alaw

ranfurly
May 3rd, 2012, 07:01 AM
Oh and Nana Mouskouri, Im glad she retired as well, loved her, but she started to tour and her voice just wasnt what it was

ZgJyDYIYWOs

ranfurly
May 3rd, 2012, 07:06 AM
Mireille Mathieu, one of the greatest french singers, still looks the same as she did in the 70's. She must be 65/66 now.

Voice is starting to get a little thin, but still holds it well
ECKH8QfyoGw

1993
IrznmH3XZQ8

1966 - sounds a little like Piaf here
_46_O7c_PWc

Lord Choc Ice
May 3rd, 2012, 07:29 AM
When I saw him in Dunedin, he's lost his Falsetto.

He's also a very short dumpy little man. Made me lol.
What I don't understand is, he sings "All The Girls Love Alice" quite a lot these days and he does the falsetto notes in the second half of the chorus:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YIIoTBu5vuc#t=104s

So why does he only do it on that song? :o

Melly Flew Us
May 13th, 2012, 02:23 AM
it must be heartbreaking for a really talented singer to lose their some range; just devastating.

Lord Choc Ice
May 18th, 2012, 10:24 AM
Phil Collins' voice held up quite well till his retirement in 2011 :sad:.

1983 - upnrXooMh4s
2010(?) - NbRKTBmRbO4

Lord Choc Ice
May 25th, 2012, 01:26 AM
George Michael's a lucky SOB really, he's very cruel to himself (smokes pot like a chimney) but he's still got it.

1984 - xQ9KuQQDEow

2008 - xAxKlPIwp-A

2008 is lowered key but it doesn't really sound like he needs it :confused:.

Lord Choc Ice
May 25th, 2012, 02:31 PM
Even better :bowdown:

0K7TaQdK6UU

HippityHop
May 25th, 2012, 02:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFrUsa5SUv0

When any of those mugs are singing as well as Tony Bennett at age 85, get back to me.

But isn't it interesting that the young pop stars (as opposed to singers) are the ones who are losing their voices at a relatively young age while the Tony Bennett's of the world who have real technique still can sing very well into their 80s?

Shvedbarilescu
May 25th, 2012, 07:22 PM
I love music. Over the years I have accumulated a collection of 3000+ CDs along with many 7in singles and LPs as well. As far as vocals go I do value vocals that have an individuality and fragileness and vunerability about them far more than I do singers who have big strong well trained technically correct vocals. Honestly those type of singers do nothing for me and I will always value a singer who injects real humanity into their singing over one who simple hits all the proper notes. The kind of singers that touch me are people like Lou Reed, Neil Young, Daniel Johnston, Nick Drake, Johnny Thunders, you get the drift.

But my alltime favourite singer and songwriter has to be Ray Davies. No one elses vocals has ever connected to me more and I am very very happy to say even as he approaches his 68th birthday he's still got it.

Raymond Douglas Davies. Simply the greatest.

JtBZotHxaTc

Sam L
May 26th, 2012, 02:26 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFrUsa5SUv0

When any of those mugs are singing as well as Tony Bennett at age 85, get back to me.

But isn't it interesting that the young pop stars (as opposed to singers) are the ones who are losing their voices at a relatively young age while the Tony Bennett's of the world who have real technique still can sing very well into their 80s?

I think that's too simplistic. It has to do a lot with vocal style and how demanding your style is. I mean opera vocalists have real technique and a lot of them decline as they grow older.

Lord Choc Ice
May 26th, 2012, 11:55 AM
OMG retirement calls Meat Loaf :sobbing:. This is perhaps the worst performance by a once-good singer I've ever heard.

NRTW6sN30Q0

ranfurly
May 26th, 2012, 12:49 PM
I think that's too simplistic. It has to do a lot with vocal style and how demanding your style is. I mean opera vocalists have real technique and a lot of them decline as they grow older.

Defintly,

Tony Bennett is an old crooner, much like Frank Sinatra, He could sing well into his 90's and pull it off, because of the type of song he sings, how he sings and what he sings.

What he sings doesn't allow for exceptional vocal tapestry,

there isn't a doubt in his younger years he had a rich vocal tapestry, but given what he sings now, he's polished.

To watch someone like Dame Joan Sutherland perform something in her 90's (if she was still alive) would be vocal suicide for her.

HippityHop
May 26th, 2012, 04:00 PM
I think that's too simplistic. It has to do a lot with vocal style and how demanding your style is. I mean opera vocalists have real technique and a lot of them decline as they grow older.

The point is not that the voice declines as they grow older (most do) but rather that very few opera/classical singers go into vocal decline in their 30s and 40s at the rate that pop singers do.

Defintly,

Tony Bennett is an old crooner, much like Frank Sinatra, He could sing well into his 90's and pull it off, because of the type of song he sings, how he sings and what he sings.

What he sings doesn't allow for exceptional vocal tapestry,

there isn't a doubt in his younger years he had a rich vocal tapestry, but given what he sings now, he's polished.

To watch someone like Dame Joan Sutherland perform something in her 90's (if she was still alive) would be vocal suicide for her.

You're correct in that the great singers make intelligent choices about what they sing. As for vocal tapestry I don't know what you mean. Please elaborate. :confused: Tony Bennett did not sing anything in his younger years (style wise) that he's not singing now. So I'm not sure what that means.

And as much as I love Tony he never was able to pull off the art of scat singing like Mel Torme, Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan and the other great jazz singers.

Of course Sutherland wouldn't sound as well at 90 as she did at 50 but that's just the point. Classical singers are very often hitting their stride in their 40s and 50s and not going into vocal decline.

Of course there are exceptions. But those exceptions most often occur by making bad choices. For example a young soprano in her 20s has no business trying to tackle Aida or Turandot not matter how wonderful her voice is. By the same token a young (20 something) tenor has no business trying to sing Tristan or Siegfried. Several promising careers have been cut short by making those kinds of decisions.

EDIT: Of course getting into the high weeds of classical vs. popular singing is too much inside baseball. They are completely different animals. (how's that for mixing metaphors? Classical singers would be pretty much laughed off the stage if they used microphones (the Three Tenors notwithstanding).

HippityHop
May 26th, 2012, 04:07 PM
btw: Great vids of Shirley Bassey.

She's in her 70's and she can still belt out great tune, one of the most well known singers in her age group where there is hardly any signs that her voice is starting to waiver or get that old woman wobble in it.

I think this can be contributed to her heavy contro-alto style aswell.

I'll tell you what's sad, Dionne Warwick. Love her, but she really needs to give up the Mic. She sounds like an old folk at a rest home talent contest.

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Nancy Wilson is another singer who can still bring it in her 70s.

Dionne Warwick's voice has been in decline for a long time. And her intonation has never been dead center when you hear her live.

The Dawntreader
May 26th, 2012, 05:52 PM
People really need to consider how old some of these singers are. Singing like any physical exertion takes it's toll as you get older. The vocal chords become less flexible, and the breath support etc needed loses its facility.

Singing is like being an athlete. You either preserve it and maintain it for as long as you physically are able, or you can neglect it and not caretake the voice carefully.

Christina Aguilera is a good example now. All her tacky embellishments, ridiculous attempts to sing out of her fach, her less than stellar technique have all contributed to a vocal decline.

young_gunner913
May 26th, 2012, 06:05 PM
Joni Mitchell and Tori Amos. They need to give it up. They never should've started but really need to give it up. :oh:

Wannabeknowitall
May 26th, 2012, 08:12 PM
Tori Amos. They need to give it up. They never should've started but really need to give it up. :oh:

I just saw her perform about 6 months ago. Her vocals and her tone are still impeccable.
Joni on the other hand did actually retire from singing for a few years.
People like Herbie Hancock brought her back though and considering his collabo with her work and his unique spin on it won a Grammy (Joni did a few vocals on that album by the way) just a few years ago, perhaps you've picked two of the worse examples of deteriorating vocals. :wavey:

The Dawntreader
May 26th, 2012, 08:59 PM
Joni's vocal changes have been well documented, but it's merely the evolution of an artist. She started singing in high soprano at the beginning of her career because she felt it suited the vocal stylings of that time and she was heavily influenced by Judy Collins and Joan Baez, who sang in a similar fashion.

As early as Clouds, you can see that Joni's natural vocal placement was a contralto, able to hit very deep, resonant low notes, but in her youth she had a very high, flexible range and was able to sing in a very high soprano tessiutura. As her career developed, she started to develop problems hitting high notes as she started moving into jazz and rock genres, and eventually has to concede her higher register for an exclusively contralto fach. She was still hitting high notes as late as 1988, but her voice had lost all it's flexbility by the early 90's. There were other problems too, such as her profuse smoking habit, the lingering effects of polio, compressed larynx, and simply age. It's very hard for a woman to maintain her range once she approaches late middle age. But importantly her voice had to change with her music, regardless of any vocal issues.

I love Joni's maturing vocal style though. Everyone must remember that Joni isn't primarily a singer, but a musician and song-writer, and the vocal dynamics are secondary to that. There's no way she could've sang her later work in soprano voice. Her work had matured and so had her voice. It's inevitable really.


She talks about her voice in an interview from a few years ago:

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From around 3:40.

ranfurly
May 27th, 2012, 01:38 AM
You're correct in that the great singers make intelligent choices about what they sing. As for vocal tapestry I don't know what you mean. Please elaborate. :confused:

Dawntreader's post above actually explains what I was conveying, What I am suggesting is that in his prime, his voice allowed him to be more flexible with what he was singing, and that is notaceble on his older recordings, That's a no brainer, but his longevity in entertainment is reserved for the style that he sings, it's the same as Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra, Bacharach, even as old as they were/are, and past their use by date technically, they are/could still able to fill an ampitheatre and pull of a polished performance.


Tony Bennett did not sing anything in his younger years (style wise) that he's not singing now. So I'm not sure what that means.[/qupte]

Yeah, I know that. Maybe I didn't elaborate well enough.

I was merely suggesting that, that's why he can still sell records/sing now, because of what he sings, across the board, his music didn't have a huge toll on his voice to start with, he's an old crooner

[quote]Of course Sutherland wouldn't sound as well at 90 as she did at 50 but that's just the point. Classical singers are very often hitting their stride in their 40s and 50s and not going into vocal decline.

yeah mate, that was just a far fetched example I used.

HippityHop
May 27th, 2012, 02:07 AM
Dawntreader's post above actually explains what I was conveying, What I am suggesting is that in his prime, his voice allowed him to be more flexible with what he was singing, and that is notaceble on his older recordings, That's a no brainer, but his longevity in entertainment is reserved for the style that he sings, it's the same as Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra, Bacharach, even as old as they were/are, and past their use by date technically, they are/could still able to fill an ampitheatre and pull of a polished performance.


[quote]Tony Bennett did not sing anything in his younger years (style wise) that he's not singing now. So I'm not sure what that means.[/qupte]

Yeah, I know that. Maybe I didn't elaborate well enough.

I was merely suggesting that, that's why he can still sell records/sing now, because of what he sings, across the board, his music didn't have a huge toll on his voice to start with, he's an old crooner



yeah mate, that was just a far fetched example I used.

Of course the term crooner has a lot of connotations. Some have used the term to apply to any male singer who sang from the Great American Songbook and used microphones For me it's a specific overly covered vocal sound made. Bing Crosby made that sound in some of his recordings. But Bennett has always had a very bright forward ringing sound. One of the most interesting things that Bennett did during his "comeback" when he was in his late 70s and early 80s was to sing a song without the use of the microphone and still be able to fill the hall.

I wonder how many of today's pop singers can do that. Not many, I'll bet.

On a side note Burt Bacharach never had a voice. He's one of the best songwriters around though. He's kind of like Bob Dylan in that respect though one could argue that Bacharach had much more voice than Bob Dylan ever had. I'm one of those who never got the point of Dylan but then to each his own.

But on the point of singers losing their voices early, Jerry Butler is a 70 something year old pop/soul singer who can still bring it with the best of them.

Dominic
May 27th, 2012, 02:51 AM
But what other divas can maintain their voice like she has? Christina is 10 years younger and is already losing hers badly. Whitney's voice died before she did, and Celine was never relevant. :oh:

Celine's voice nowadays is one hell of a lot better than Mariah's in every way.

jetglo
May 27th, 2012, 03:25 PM
OMG retirement calls Meat Loaf :sobbing:. This is perhaps the worst performance by a once-good singer I've ever heard.

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Meatloaf got the gig as the "entertainment" directly before the start of the Australian Football Leagues Grand Final last year. He apparently got about $600,000 for a hits medley of 15 to 20 minutes, and his performance was so bad it was the talk of the day, overshadowing even the biggest football game of the year. Absolutely hopeless, yet his backup singers, Patti Russo and others, were fine. It sounded like he was drunk and if he hit a right note occasionally, it was just luck. :(

jetglo
May 27th, 2012, 03:35 PM
Argh. I have to do this. :tape:

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But like Elton, songs that suit her new range properly still come across well.

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Siouxsies had too many Marlboros ;) I'm a fan too, but calling it "her new range" is being very kind. It's actually a limited version of the range she once had.

The Dawntreader
May 27th, 2012, 03:41 PM
OMG retirement calls Meat Loaf :sobbing:. This is perhaps the worst performance by a once-good singer I've ever heard.

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Jesus, has he had a stroke?

lee station
May 27th, 2012, 03:55 PM
the music that's my background is 80's-90's. as all this stuff is in my memory now, i prefer to remember all that postmodernist music the way it was. it doesn't matter to me if now they don't sing like they used to. to me, my memories stand the way they were :)

Lord Choc Ice
Jun 14th, 2012, 12:36 PM
Ann Wilson of Heart :bowdown:.

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Hitting those notes so well at 61 :yeah:.

Fête_des_fleurs
Jun 14th, 2012, 01:23 PM
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Duh!

Albireo
Jun 14th, 2012, 06:45 PM
Steve Walsh is one who seems to have had some actual damage done to his vocal cords.

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(On the other hand, Robbie Steinhardt could be my twin brother.)

Albireo
Jun 14th, 2012, 06:55 PM
Guy who's had every right to lose his voice over the decades, but hasn't:

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Not the greatest recording, but it's amazing that he can still sing at all.

Lord Choc Ice
Jun 15th, 2012, 02:29 AM
Steve Walsh is one who seems to have had some actual damage done to his vocal cords.

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(On the other hand, Robbie Steinhardt could be my twin brother.)
The start was rough but he was good once he warmed up I thought :yeah:.

Lord Choc Ice
Sep 2nd, 2012, 02:51 PM
Doesn't sound bad, but sounds like a different person! :lol:.

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