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oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:06 PM
wouldn't Chris Evert be one as well?

I mean pretty sure her style was basically just pushing until someone makes an error and good anticipation, i.e. Wozniacki. Yeah she had great passing shots too but she needed to have them because she played in an era of netrushers. Woz lives in an era of baseline bashers so you don't see those passing shots. In fact when you look at her matches against good netplayers, she's pretty good at making them play tough low volley.

Obviously, she don't have 18 slams :lol: but just talking about the style, apparently, it IS possible to be a legend while pushing. Chris Evert proved it.

joão.
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:07 PM
:facepalm:

Uranium
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:07 PM
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:09 PM
:lol: NID

égalité
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:10 PM
omg :sobbing:

Curcubeu
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:11 PM
You made my day! :sobbing:

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:11 PM
ugh :facepalm:

In before, LOL YOU COMPARED WOZNIACKI TO AN ALL TIME GREAT

No I didn't you cretins. But when I see people saying how pushing doesn't win slams, I have to think of a certain someone.

doomsday
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:11 PM
:facepalm:

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

égalité
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:12 PM
Not hitting the ball hard ≠ not playing aggresively

Sammo
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:12 PM
THE HELL WITH WOZNIACKI!!! I'M MORE THAN TIRED OF STUPID THREADS ABOUT HER!!!!! :mad:




Seriously it gets annoying

GoofyDuck
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:13 PM
:facepalm: such great smiley :yeah: :facepalm:

melodynelson
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:13 PM
Evert is one of the top three or four most talented women to ever play tennis, this is just too much. :lol:

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:13 PM
wouldn't Chris Evert be one as well?

I mean pretty sure her style was basically just pushing until someone makes an error and good anticipation, i.e. Wozniacki. Yeah she had great passing shots too but she needed to have them because she played in an era of netrushers. Woz lives in an era of baseline bashers so you don't see those passing shots. In fact when you look at her matches against good netplayers, she's pretty good at making them play tough low volley.

Obviously, she don't have 18 slams :lol: but just talking about the style, apparently, it IS possible to be a legend while pushing. Chris Evert proved it.
There is no such thing as "pushing" at a professional level. It's just a silly word used to have a go at players one doesn't like.

backhandsmash
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:15 PM
Another day, another 3 Woz threads...

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:16 PM
Not hitting the ball hard ≠ not playing aggresively

Evert didn't really play aggressively.

uyKajiYe7H8

XRXDvqW7Exg

Evert is one of the top three or four most talented women to ever play tennis, this is just too much. :lol:

1. I don't think so. Greatness=/=talent.

2. Your point being?

Daruma.
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:18 PM
Yeah, comparing the era of Evert, Graf and all the other players to now... But on the top of that, comparing Evert to Wozniacki is just ridiculous.

melodynelson
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:21 PM
Evert was a tennis natural. She made zero errors but she wouldn't just put everything mid pace up the middle of the court, and for the flack she would sometimes get for her forehand, it was a much smoother and well managed shot than Wozniacki's. She was amazing to watch, she created incredible rivalries by being this way, similar to Nadal.

Wozniacki has zero interesting rivalries and does not add to the quality of the tennis matches she plays, almost all the quality comes from her opponent, whether it's top 10, 20, 50, or 100. She is more like Simon as opposed to someone with real talent.

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:22 PM
Yeah, comparing the era of Evert, Graf and all the other players to now... But on the top of that, comparing Evert to Wozniacki is just ridiculous.

I'm not comparing Evert to Wozniacki you goddamn...:facepalm:

I am stating the fact that she was basically what we would call a pusher these days AND she is one of the GOAT. Basically dismantling the argument "DURR HURR, pushing doesn't win you slams"

You think CHrissie won hers by blasting winners or suffocating her opponents at the net? She did it like Wozniacki is trying to but actually succeeding with it.

In The Zone
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:22 PM
Evert was a tennis natural. She made zero errors but she wouldn't just put everything mid pace up the middle of the court, and for the flack she would sometimes get for her forehand, it was a much smoother and well managed shot than Wozniacki's. She was amazing to watch, she created incredible rivalries by being this way, similar to Nadal.

Wozniacki has zero interesting rivalries and does not add to the quality of the tennis matches she plays, almost all the quality comes from her opponent, whether it's top 10, 20, 50, or 100. She is more like Simon as opposed to someone with real talent.

To be fair to Wozniacki, I have seen a quality match from her but it was only one: Dementieva New Haven 2010 SF.

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:24 PM
Evert was a tennis natural. She made zero errors but she wouldn't just put everything mid pace up the middle of the court, and for the flack she would sometimes get for her forehand, it was a much smoother and well managed shot than Wozniacki's. She was amazing to watch, she created incredible rivalries by being this way, similar to Nadal.

Wozniacki has zero interesting rivalries and does not add to the quality of the tennis matches she plays, almost all the quality comes from her opponent, whether it's top 10, 20, 50, or 100. She is more like Simon as opposed to someone with real talent.

That's an insult to Simon IMO. He is capable of hitting winner out of fricking nowhere when his opponent falls asleep.

And it doesn't matter. I am comparing their defensive, beat your opponents by never missing playing style. The point of this thread is to shut up people talking about how pushing doesn't win you slams. It does. If you're good enough.

shovi
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:26 PM
Wozniacki entrevista a Djokovic

http://www.wta10is.com/2011/06/wozniacki-entrevista-djokovic-entre.html

madmax
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:28 PM
That's an insult to Simon IMO. He is capable of hitting winner out of fricking nowhere when his opponent falls asleep.

And it doesn't matter. I am comparing their defensive, beat your opponents by never missing playing style. The point of this thread is to shut up people talking about how pushing doesn't win you slams. It does. If you're good enough.

Evert is one of the all time great players, who had amazing backhand and pure ballstriking abilities. Wozniacki on the other hand is a workhorse, who always tries to drag her opponents into endless baseline grindfests in hopes of them eventually cracking and committing an error. There is nothing similar in their games - one plays classical easy on the eye game, the other is a product of todays racquet technology and fitness regimes.

Maza1987
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:29 PM
My eyes are hurting after havin' to read the op.

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:29 PM
If you guys were smarter, you'd tell me that this comparison is invalid since the racket technology back then didn't allow for aggressive baseline tennis.

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:30 PM
Evert is one of the all time great players, who had amazing backhand and pure ballstriking abilities. Wozniacki on the other hand is a workhorse, who always tries to drag her opponents into endless baseline grindfests in hopes of them eventually cracking and committing an error. There is nothing similar in their games - one plays classical easy on the eye game, the other is a product of todays racquet technology and fitness regimes.

Which is exactly what Evert's style was. :facepalm:

quote unquote
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:31 PM
the thread originator could be correct

all the TV commentators(many EX players) and magazine writers have said that todays tennis is more superior that say 20-30 years ago and that the bars been raised,its more competitive and so forth

Effy
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:31 PM
:haha: :facepalm:

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:33 PM
the thread originator could be correct

all the TV commentators(many EX players) and magazine writers have said that todays tennis is more superior that say 20-30 years ago and that the bars been raised,its more competitive and so forth

Whoa whoa whoa, thats not what I said at all.

vexxx
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:33 PM
comparing Evert to Wozniacki :facepalm:

There is no such thing as "pushing" at a professional level. It's just a silly word used to have a go at players one doesn't like.

Then why nobody calls Sharapova, Azarenka, Kvitova pushers? Nobody hates them?

Daruma.
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:34 PM
I'm not comparing Evert to Wozniacki you goddamn...:facepalm:

I am stating the fact that she was basically what we would call a pusher these days AND she is one of the GOAT. Basically dismantling the argument "DURR HURR, pushing doesn't win you slams"

You think CHrissie won hers by blasting winners or suffocating her opponents at the net? She did it like Wozniacki is trying to but actually succeeding with it.

Firstly, chill out.

Can you please tell me, if you are not comparing Evert to Woz, then what are you basing your argument on? You say that Evert's game is what we would call pushing in today's game, if this is not comparing Evert to Woz, then what is it? You are basing your argument on the scale of Wozniacki's game. :help:

Plus, it doesn't make any sense to compare two different eras as there is no way you can come to any sort of relevant conclusion, as these players play in a complete different group of players with complete different materials and training styles. Wozniacki, given how much the tennis racquet technology has improved, still plays as if she's using a wooden racquet. Whatever, the whole argument is just plain stupid and you've already made enough fool of yourself already with your constant insulting of other posters and your being extremely arrogant.

Admins, close this thread already. :facepalm:

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:35 PM
And it doesn't matter. I am comparing their defensive, beat your opponents by never missing playing style. The point of this thread is to shut up people talking about how pushing doesn't win you slams. It does. If you're good enough.
Evert moved her opponents around the court. In baseline rallies SHE was the dominant player. SHE dictated play in baseline rallies. Others reacted to what SHE did whereas Wozniacki often allows her opponents to dictate play and reacts to what THEY do. Wozniacki is the queen of frustrating her opponents into making unforced errors because she's such a great retreiver and always gets back that extra ball while Evert FORCED her opponents into making errors.

quote unquote
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:38 PM
as the thread originator hinted @

its the era of WTA tennis were you are more famous for being #1 and slamless than in Everts era

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:39 PM
Firstly, chill out.

Can you please tell me, if you are not comparing Evert to Woz, then what are you basing your argument on? You say that Evert's game is what we would call pushing in today's game, if this is not comparing Evert to Woz, then what is it? You are basing your argument on the scale of Wozniacki's game. :help:

Plus, it doesn't make any sense to compare two different eras as there is no way you can come to any sort of relevant conclusion, as these players play in a complete different group of players with complete different materials and training styles. Wozniacki, given how much the tennis racquet technology has improved, still plays as if she's using a wooden racquet. Whatever, the whole argument is just plain stupid and you've already made enough fool of yourself already with your constant insulting of other posters and your being extremely arrogant.

Admins, close this thread already. :facepalm:

I'm not insulting anybody bro, you are acting like a passive aggressive baby.

And I know that they had wooden rackets which is why I said that would be a good argument.

fact remains though, she won by consistency, not by hitting winners. Which, according to the great experts on TF is impossible.

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:39 PM
Then why nobody calls Sharapova, Azarenka, Kvitova pushers? Nobody hates them?
They have invented another nonsense term to insult those players: "Brainless Ball bashers."

Olórin
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:39 PM
wouldn't Chris Evert be one as well?

I mean pretty sure her style was basically just pushing until someone makes an error and good anticipation, i.e. Wozniacki. Yeah she had great passing shots too but she needed to have them because she played in an era of netrushers. Woz lives in an era of baseline bashers so you don't see those passing shots. In fact when you look at her matches against good netplayers, she's pretty good at making them play tough low volley.

Obviously, she don't have 18 slams :lol: but just talking about the style, apparently, it IS possible to be a legend while pushing. Chris Evert proved it.


While Chris wasn't a hard-hitter by today's standards she wasn't just a wall/retriever. On faster surfaces she was the aggressor when necessary. She was a master-point-constructor who showed an amazing control of the ball/racquet, of the length and pace of rallies; and she showed an awareness of the court which Wozniacki, and most players in history can only dream of. She hit some jaw-dropping winners in her time if you actually watch her matches. It's just they weren't coming off rapid cross-court exchanges but lengthy rallies. And with graphite racquets in the 80's she even beefed up her serve a bit, and from the matches I've seen of her hit at least as many aces as Woz does.

Woz isn't a bad player, but it's certainly incorrect to compare her to Evert. The first sentence proves how clueless you are about her game.
So shut up and stop defending your entirely moronic thread.

oomph
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:42 PM
While Chris wasn't a hard-hitter by today's standards she wasn't just a wall/retriever. On faster surfaces she was the aggressor when necessary. She was a master-point-constructor who showed an amazing control of the ball/racquet and of the length and pace of rallies and awareness of the court which Wozniacki, and most players in history can only dream of. With graphite racquets in the 80's she even beefed up her serve a bit and from the matches I've seen of her, hit more aces than Woz does.

So shut up and stop defending your entirely moronic thread.

:kiss:

Guess who's gunna get reported.

madmax
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:42 PM
They have invented another nonsense term to insult those players: "Brainless Ball bashers."

Sharapova and Azarenka are far from what you call "Brainless Ballbashers"...You could make a case for Kvitova, who can still go off the boil in any of her matches though:lol: Maria and Vika both can create amazing angles with their backhands and they both play with controlled aggression most of the time anyway

Daruma.
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:45 PM
I'm not insulting anybody bro, you are acting like a passive aggressive baby.

And I know that they had wooden rackets which is why I said that would be a good argument.

fact remains though, she won by consistency, not by hitting winners. Which, according to the great experts on TF is impossible.

Please, don't talk about things you know nothing about. :facepalm: Be open to different ideas.

Hurley
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:45 PM
WozniackiWorld :inlove:

matty
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:46 PM
There is no such thing as "pushing" at a professional level. It's just a silly word used to have a go at players one doesn't like.

Yes, there is such thing at a professional level. It's real and commentators and other players will say these players are great defensive players to be polite.

Olórin
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:47 PM
:kiss:

Guess who's gunna get reported.

Report as much as you want, doesn't make you any less of an idiot. :kiss:

matty
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:48 PM
They have invented another nonsense term to insult those players: "Brainless Ball bashers."

pushers rarely hit winners and the above mentioned players do hit winners or at least try to hit winners (on off days they have a lot of errors instead)because they are going for it.

égalité
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:49 PM
Evert didn't really play aggressively.

:lol: She came to net often (by todays standards at least). She hit winners. She hit ridiculous passings shots routinely. She strove to take control of points.

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:52 PM
Sharapova and Azarenka are far from what you call "Brainless Ballbashers"...
I don't call them brainless ball bashers. I instead said that to call them brainless ball bashers is just as silly as to call Wozniacki or Radwanska pushers.

Njalle
Jun 19th, 2011, 07:55 PM
>Evert is a tennis player
>Wozniacki is a tennis player

>OMG U COMPARED WOZNIACKI TO EVERT!!! GO DIE IN A FIRE!!


You guys!

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:01 PM
Yes, there is such thing at a professional level. It's real and commentators and other players will say these players are great defensive players to be polite.
Yes, how dare they be polite? But maybe they just call them great defensive players because they are great defensive players. But ok, no problem. I'm sure that you guys know best. :)

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:05 PM
pushers rarely hit winners and the above mentioned players do hit winners or at least try to hit winners (on off days they have a lot of errors instead)because they are going for it.
"Even I" am aware of the fact that defensive players tend to make fewer winners and fewer UE than agressive players. And I even know that those who are "going for it" make on average both more winners and UE because they play a high risk game. ;)

Potato
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:15 PM
Evert's game was not based entirely around defense, you must have not watched many of her matches. :facepalm: She had fantastic court sense and knew how to move the opponent around and she frequently came in to finish off the points. The only similar thing between these two players are their rock solid groundstrokes but then again Graf also had rock solid groundstrokes :facepalm:

Wozniacki is a backboard, Evert is ANYTHING but that. I don't hate Wozniacki, but I wonder why all these Woz fans don't understand why so many people hate this fanbase :facepalm:

another :facepalm: thread

Ferg
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:31 PM
Quality thread from a quality troll :hysteric::hysteric:

I applaud you sir :bowdown:

Chrissie-fan
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:33 PM
I'm not insulting anybody bro, you are acting like a passive aggressive baby.

And I know that they had wooden rackets which is why I said that would be a good argument.

fact remains though, she won by consistency, not by hitting winners. Which, according to the great experts on TF is impossible.
It's not impossible, but probably a lot harder now because those modern racquets reward the type of play that wouldn't have been nearly as effective against someone like Evert with the technology of her time. Evert would have been only too happy if her opponents went for broke on each shot in baseline rallies with a wooden racquet. It would no doubt only have resulted in very easy wins for her. The modern racquets can generate so much pace that you can as it were hit through your opponents - much less so with those old woodies. In short, technology has indeed changed the game and has made what was effective then less effective now and vice versa. It also explains why for example we see virtually no serve and volleyers anymore.

WozTakesAll
Jun 19th, 2011, 08:59 PM
And I know that they had wooden rackets which is why I said that would be a good argument.

fact remains though, she won by consistency, not by hitting winners. Which, according to the great experts on TF is impossible.

I actually think you have some good valid points. But its hard to compare tennis or tennis style from back then to now. Interesting thread.

jefrilibra
Jun 19th, 2011, 09:02 PM
http://i55.tinypic.com/14t4pw5.gif

Ryusuke Tenma
Jun 19th, 2011, 09:03 PM
Haters crying, as usual. Wozniacki a pusher?? Haha, no.

Ferg
Jun 19th, 2011, 09:16 PM
Wordy Life didnt proclaim her better than Graf :eek: I am shocked and amazed :bowdown:

Pops Maellard
Jun 19th, 2011, 09:51 PM
She is more like Simon as opposed to someone with real talent.

There's actually a lot more to Simon's game than people think. ;)

Pops Maellard
Jun 19th, 2011, 09:52 PM
Anyway it's silly to compare the power level of a player with today's racket technology etc. with a player whose prime was in the 70s :help:.

Potato
Jun 19th, 2011, 10:08 PM
Anyway it's silly to compare the power level of a player with today's racket technology etc. with a player whose prime was in the 70s :help:.

Even so, it's ridiculous to call someone like Evert the pusher of the 70's... she was anything BUT a pusher...

MdGYUZM_e2s

Evert was the aggressor in her matches, she was never afraid to come in, she used angles, point construction, and power shots.. the match was always on her racket almost all the time. (not like Wozniacki, who is seldom always in control of her matches) The fact that the OP is claiming that Evert's consistency was the reason for her success is absolutely ridiculous when it was brilliant court sense and an iron head mentality.

To call Evert a pusher, frankly, shows how little the OP knows.

Smitten
Jun 20th, 2011, 12:20 AM
How did I miss this thread. What a complete insult. Karolina should NEVER be compared to Evert.

Evert is a legend. She was hardly a pusher. She was consistent, but she was not a pusher. Her groundstrokes extrapolated to this generation would be dominant.

Drake1980
Jun 20th, 2011, 12:41 AM
:oh:

VeeJJ
Jun 20th, 2011, 12:49 AM
Chis Evert is gonna sue you and when you get a husband, have an affair with him, just because of this thread.

DefyingGravity
Jun 20th, 2011, 01:36 AM
Chris and Martina Hingis are closer in comparison. The only thing that I can see with Wozniacki and Evert is that their backhands are their weapons. Evert certainly was more aggressive in the use of geometry on the court.

Graftard
Jun 20th, 2011, 01:45 AM
wouldn't Chris Evert be one as well?

I mean pretty sure her style was basically just pushing until someone makes an error and good anticipation, i.e. Wozniacki. Yeah she had great passing shots too but she needed to have them because she played in an era of netrushers. Woz lives in an era of baseline bashers so you don't see those passing shots. In fact when you look at her matches against good netplayers, she's pretty good at making them play tough low volley.

Obviously, she don't have 18 slams :lol: but just talking about the style, apparently, it IS possible to be a legend while pushing. Chris Evert proved it.

Chris Evert was a pusher. She just played in super weak era. Evert today = not even top 20 player. Stamina and more stamina don't win you slams these days.

DefyingGravity
Jun 20th, 2011, 01:46 AM
Also, it needs to be said that GRINDING someone down and hitting the ball back into the court with no pace are two different things altogether (which is what I consider a truer pushing game). There is an aggressive grinder, who uses baseline tactics and their fitness and mental toughness combined with aggressive shots to win. Dementieva and Evert go into this category because of how well they struck the ball and how much they could put the players on the defensive by moviing the ball around and either take it early or hit it hard on their own. Woz is a defensive grinder, which means that she's doing the same thing but applying it in a more goading errors manner. All three would use their fitness and mental toughness to make it known that you were going to have to beat them, but they play so differently.

young_gunner913
Jun 20th, 2011, 02:00 AM
Christine Marie had more talent in the pinky nail that she just clipped off than Wozniacki has in her blubber filled body.

SV_Fan
Jun 20th, 2011, 02:02 AM
Even so, it's ridiculous to call someone like Evert the pusher of the 70's... she was anything BUT a pusher...

MdGYUZM_e2s

Evert was the aggressor in her matches, she was never afraid to come in, she used angles, point construction, and power shots.. the match was always on her racket almost all the time. (not like Wozniacki, who is seldom always in control of her matches) The fact that the OP is claiming that Evert's consistency was the reason for her success is absolutely ridiculous when it was brilliant court sense and an iron head mentality.

To call Evert a pusher, frankly, shows how little the OP knows.

Why are they hitting the ball so weird like..?

JN
Jun 20th, 2011, 02:28 AM
THE HELL WITH WOZNIACKI!!! I'M MORE THAN TIRED OF STUPID THREADS ABOUT HER!!!!! :mad:




Seriously it gets annoying

http://l.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/41.gif *WILD APPLAUSE* http://l.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/41.gif

And notice how there's never anyone in them saying, "Player Forum." :rolleyes:

__

:kiss:

Guess who's gunna get reported.

:baby:

Svetlana)))
Jun 20th, 2011, 03:39 AM
:facepalm::weirdo:

Paldias
Jun 20th, 2011, 03:45 AM
LOL omg... watching that video... tennis used to be so bad....

kiwifan
Jun 20th, 2011, 03:56 AM
Evert moved her opponents around the court. In baseline rallies SHE was the dominant player. SHE dictated play in baseline rallies. Others reacted to what SHE did whereas Wozniacki often allows her opponents to dictate play and reacts to what THEY do. Wozniacki is the queen of frustrating her opponents into making unforced errors because she's such a great retreiver and always gets back that extra ball while Evert FORCED her opponents into making errors.

Chris Evert dominated the competition.

There is no comparison.

She ran the rest of the women (not named Martina) off the court. :cool:

JCTennisFan
Jun 20th, 2011, 04:17 AM
Evert was no pusher, her backhand could do a large amount of damage, from the extra pace she got and the better angle she could produce with the left hand. She did this in an era when she was odd to do so, kind of reverse how henin was in the modern game in that respect. Her forehand was a glitchy looking stroke but she could produce alot more power off it than you would expect. It was not enough of a weakness to throw the rest of her game off, unlike Wozniacki.

Evert was much much smarter tactically as proof of her clay record. She just knew when to expose someone, she had that killer instinct.The difference was she just finished points off at the baseline instead of at the net, an arguably harder thing to do in an era were pace was much slower than today, making outright winners much harder to perform. She kept pace with a near superhuman (athletically) and younger martina in the 80s, and before martina got insanely fit Evert really wiped the floor with her (honestly the MAIN reason Navratilova got so fit was to be able to bring herself to a level above Chris, which she managed. But if Chris had done as much work in the gym id say they would of atleast been even if not back to evert in the early-mid 80s).
Lets see Woz knock the socks off Serena (a reasonable modern game equiv to Nav) constantly. I dont think its even in the same realm of ability, when comparing Woz to Evert.

Roookie
Jun 20th, 2011, 04:48 AM
Chris really dominated. Push is 0-9 vs this era big four. :help:

bandabou
Jun 20th, 2011, 04:53 AM
Evert actually WON wimbledon and reached multiple finals there. :facepalm: Caro's only hope for a wimbledon title is perhaps in the mixed doubles events. :lol:

JCTennisFan
Jun 20th, 2011, 05:28 AM
Oh and she has the highest win percentage of any of the big slam winners ever. Its like almost 91% win ratio

Records that Evert still holds... :

-Most GS F apperances (34).
-Most US Open titles (6)
-Most French Open titles (7)
-Most F apperances at US Open (9)
-125 match win streak, Man or woman, on any specific surface.
-Win percentage overal on Clay 94.05%.

Lets see Woz do that, hah.

Alejandrawrrr
Jun 20th, 2011, 05:29 AM
I agree with the general consensus here. No Woz bashing here, that's not my game, but this thread is silly and a little disrespectful to Chrissy. If you're judging by TODAY's standards, then of course her strokes weren't exactly damaging(inferior racquet technology anyone?) but at the time her backhand was one of the best weapons on the women's tour. Also, she wasn't an epic basher, but that doesn't mean she was a pusher. She was usually always trying to work the point so that she could set up for the winner. Really one of the dumbest threads I've seen in a while.

And anyway, enough with the Woz threads. I'm still not a fan, but enough is enough. It also must be tough being a genuine fan, as there are not only detractors starting GM flame wars about her, but those shady "fans" like OP, Kman etc.

salvy41
Jun 20th, 2011, 06:27 AM
LOL omg... watching that video... tennis used to be so bad....

Bad? Because the racquet technology didn't permit the powerfest we have today? I found it quite refreshing watching two players using touch and netplay to construct and win points creatively.

Alejandrawrrr
Jun 20th, 2011, 08:18 AM
Even so, it's ridiculous to call someone like Evert the pusher of the 70's... she was anything BUT a pusher...

MdGYUZM_e2s

Evert was the aggressor in her matches, she was never afraid to come in, she used angles, point construction, and power shots.. the match was always on her racket almost all the time. (not like Wozniacki, who is seldom always in control of her matches) The fact that the OP is claiming that Evert's consistency was the reason for her success is absolutely ridiculous when it was brilliant court sense and an iron head mentality.

To call Evert a pusher, frankly, shows how little the OP knows.

On an unrelated note... Is that Mary Carillo's voice I hear? Holy fuck, has she just ALWAYS been around? :lol:

melodynelson
Jun 20th, 2011, 10:03 AM
I received a bad rep for my post earlier AND a PM questioning my opinions? Is this common on this messageboard?

It wasn't as if I was disrespectful to Evert, Wozniacki or even Simon--sure Simon can do more than just push, but I do find him in general to be a very boring defensive player and not the most talented player out there. But of course everyone has their moments.

I feel like I'm fair and objective about what I say. Costumavam gostar do que disse antes...

oomph
Jun 20th, 2011, 10:53 AM
Chis Evert is gonna sue you and when you get a husband, have an affair with him, just because of this thread.

:lol:

Do you assume I'm a chick or a homo?

Chrissie. :hearts:
















Also:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-zSFMapHML0g/TYgH8GrOA3I/AAAAAAAAC8k/roRfUZhfxKE/s320/you_mad_camron.jpg

Coconut91
Jun 20th, 2011, 10:53 AM
I received a bad rep for my post earlier AND a PM questioning my opinions? Is this common on this messageboard?

It wasn't as if I was disrespectful to Evert, Wozniacki or even Simon--perhaps Simon can do more than just push, but I do find him in general to be a very boring defensive player and not the most talented player out there. But of course everyone has their moments. But according to what I see, Wozniacki is not a player who does much on court to add to the quality of matches, nor Simon (at least most times I have seen him, which has been plenty of times, including live at Estoril), and that Evert was an incredible player who could do so much with the ball. That's it.

I feel like I'm fair and objective about what I say, god knows I appreciate reading that as opposed to hate-filled tripe. Let me guess, they get all the good reps. :rolleyes:

The problem is some people get so defensive about their favorite players that they lose all sense of objectiveness. They'll never admit what you say is true if that doesn't put their favorite's game in a good light. If you're lucky, they'll just bring out their achievements as a way to avoid the subjet instead of attacking or bad repping you :lol: Doesn't matter how objective, polite or unhateful you are on your posts. They will take it as a personal attack everytime.

I wish we could discuss freely but don't worry, objectiveness is very well appreciated by sensible people :p

JN
Jun 20th, 2011, 12:09 PM
I received a bad rep for my post earlier AND a PM questioning my opinions? Is this common on this messageboard?

It wasn't as if I was disrespectful to Evert, Wozniacki or even Simon--sure Simon can do more than just push, but I do find him in general to be a very boring defensive player and not the most talented player out there. But of course everyone has their moments.

I feel like I'm fair and objective about what I say. Costumavam gostar do que disse antes...

Take your bad reps as a sign you're doing something right, cuz 9 times out of 10, that's why you get one. ;)

bandabou
Jun 20th, 2011, 02:22 PM
Goolagong's backhand was easily overpowered in this match..but men, these girls sure knew how to play! :worship:

Chrissie-fan
Jun 20th, 2011, 03:47 PM
I agree with the general consensus here. No Woz bashing here, that's not my game, but this thread is silly and a little disrespectful to Chrissy.
I agree. I don't think the original poster wanted to suggest that Wozniacki is as great as Evert, but some will unintentionally OR intentionally (because it provides them with yet another opportunity to ridicule Caro) interpret it like that. As far as I'm concerned she doesn't have to play like Evert (or like anyone else) and it would be foolish to expect her ever to achieve what Chris did. Caroline Wozniacki has to try to be as good as Caroline Wozniacki possibly can be and nothing more. However far that will take her in terms of career achievements (no slams, one slam, multiple slams, etc) is ok by me. Nobody can ask for anything more than that she does the best she can.

I'm still not a fan, but enough is enough. It also must be tough being a genuine fan.....
It is. As a Wozniacki fan I definitely don't feel very welcome on GM, that's for sure.

bandabou
Jun 20th, 2011, 04:46 PM
But really Chrissie-fan, making this thread was simply just asking for trouble..no?! It's not the 'haters' who made the comparison between Caro and Chris...so it's kinda sad for the fans to cry: oh the haters, oh the haters. It's kinda weak.

Chrissie-fan
Jun 20th, 2011, 04:53 PM
But really Chrissie-fan, making this thread was simply just asking for trouble..no?!
Absolutely. Posting threads like these do Wozniacki no favors.

serenaforever
Jun 20th, 2011, 05:25 PM
:tape::help:

spencercarlos
Jun 20th, 2011, 08:22 PM
On an unrelated note... Is that Mary Carillo's voice I hear? Holy fuck, has she just ALWAYS been around? :lol:
That is Mary C.. yeah..

OMG this thread. I can see where the OP comes from, but sorry Evert was simply WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY too skilled around the court, very complete as a player, unlike Wozniacki who looks amateurish when playing slices, drop shots or volleys.

justineheninfan
Jun 21st, 2011, 03:51 AM
Chris Evert and Hingis were genuises on court. Even if they couldnt blow you off the court with power they could hit the ball with pinpoint accuracy, had beautiful feel, could hit amazing drop shots, lobs, slices, down the line shots, knew exactly what shot to hit at all times, atleast in Hingis case volleyed very well. Wozniacki just pushes average shots to the middle of the court and waits for an error. Her biggest strength is she has the patience to play that way for hours if needed and not fall asleep. I used to think she was very quick and good on defense but watching her more lately I am not sure if she is even that. Really she is a nice girl but her game is almost based on nothing the more I watch her. You cant compare her to genuises like Evert and Hingis just because they didnt hit the ball with massive power like Wozniacki also doesnt.

If the womens field gets it act together and Wozniacki does not improve she will be out of the top 10 in a few years time.

justineheninfan
Jun 21st, 2011, 03:54 AM
Evert actually hit the ball very hard for 70s and even 80s standards btw. If she were around today with todays equipment she would probably be considered one of the biggest hitters. Not as big as Venus, Serena, Kvitova, or Na but up with anyone else in power I imagine. And she would blow Wozniacki off the court with superior power, placement, angles, tactics, precision, variety, all court play, anticipation, basically everything, lol! Evert is the last person Wozniacki would want to play as with her playing style she could literally do nothing against someone like Chris.

Bonfire
Jun 21st, 2011, 04:31 AM
Chris Evert and Hingis were genuises on court. Even if they couldnt blow you off the court with power they could hit the ball with pinpoint accuracy, had beautiful feel, could hit amazing drop shots, lobs, slices, down the line shots, knew exactly what shot to hit at all times, atleast in Hingis case volleyed very well. Wozniacki just pushes average shots to the middle of the court and waits for an error. Her biggest strength is she has the patience to play that way for hours if needed and not fall asleep. I used to think she was very quick and good on defense but watching her more lately I am not sure if she is even that. Really she is a nice girl but her game is almost based on nothing the more I watch her. You cant compare her to genuises like Evert and Hingis just because they didnt hit the ball with massive power like Wozniacki also doesnt.

If the womens field gets it act together and Wozniacki does not improve she will be out of the top 10 in a few years time.

I don't think this is what Wozniacki does. Most of the matches I have watched of hers shows Caro hitting the ball almost as hard as most of her opponents. And she doesn't just hit the ball to the middle of the court. It's true that she doesn't usually try to paint lines which means her opponents usually make the errors before she does. But it seems your underestimating her. My liking towards her could very well be leading me to overestimation but let's meet somewhere in the middle...;)

While I admit that the slice, dropshot and lob aren't her best friends...her volleys have improved and her ability to recognize the chance to come in and finish volleys (especially swinging) in the air is more to say than quite a few other well known players. Her movement and anticipation (while not Evert level) is quite nice I would say too. Hell, I would put her serve up against Evert's as well honestly. No she is not the tennis genius that other past champions like Hinigs were, pulling out every trick at will, but I will never accept that she is simply winning her matches by hitting passively down the middle until an opponent makes an error. That's not enough to win 5 titles in this season already alone.

I've seen her hit down the line ros winners. Aces in different parts of the service box. Her backhand has been hit so well and so often in odd positions that most players would not be able to come up with the winner on...but she does it. I've seen her extend points with her movement and anticipation that any player would be impressed with. Overall her game may not be incredibly inspiring but it is quite well trained and controlled (deep return, safe cc groundies until she has worked out an angle that is safe to attempt winner into, occasional chances taken on strong backhand, swinging volley on the short floating balls) It's not magic out there but it works and I would hardly call it "based on nothing."

She is not Evert. She is not Hingis. Definitely not Serena. She is Caroline Wozniacki. She is a great player in her own way and I think she will keep improving too.

justineheninfan
Jun 21st, 2011, 04:49 AM
The only times she does interesting things are when she plays people who cant hurt her like Radwanksa or Pennetta. When she plays people who have more power than her she just completely goes into her shell and pushes, tries to make no errors, and hopes for the best. The way she played against Hantuchova at the French was pathetic and inexcusable for a World #1. It was not like she was playing some enormous power player, clay court master, mental demon, or super mover. Daniela is a very talented player with quite a bit of power and shotmaking ability, and really played her best that day, but there was no excuse to look that helpless.

Contrast that to how Hingis boldly took on bigger hitters like Pierce and Seles and owned them, and even the biggest ones like Davenport, Venus, and Serena who she held her own against by always sticking to her own guns and her own unique and special game, despite the onslaugh of superior power on the other side. Or Evert who did likewise when faced with the more physically imposing Court, Navratilova, or Graf.

AnomyBC
Jun 21st, 2011, 05:05 AM
Better question: If Chris Evert is a commentator...

...Does that mean Wozniacki might become one too!?! (Just think, Caro's voice telling you what's happening during all the big matches! :eek:)

Bonfire
Jun 21st, 2011, 05:07 AM
The only times she does interesting things are when she plays people who cant hurt her like Radwanksa or Pennetta. When she plays people who have more power than her she just completely goes into her shell and pushes, tries to make no errors, and hopes for the best. The way she played against Hantuchova at the French was pathetic and inexcusable for a World #1.

Contrast that to how Hingis boldly took on bigger hitters like Pierce and Seles and owned them, and even the biggest ones like Davenport, Venus, and Serena who she held her own against by always sticking to her own guns and her own unique and special game, despite the onslaugh of superior power on the other side. Or Evert who did likewise when faced with the more physically imposing Court, Navratilova, or Graf.

I pretty much agree with your post. The bolded part sticks out to me the most. I felt so gutted when Caro came out and played like that. I hope to never see that again. I try to be optimistic. When she was not #1 and didn't have the extra pressure...I felt like she was getting very close to bringing that level she has brought against Pennetta, etc. to the bigger names and harder hitting players. Beating Sharapova at U.S. Open was a great sign. The semi vs. Vera was the first time I really got to see her going into the shell.

One thing to remember is that since becoming #1 she literally has not had enough chances to meet the best players due to their lack of play (Kim) and injuries(WS), retirements (Justine), etc. But she has beaten pretty much all of the fully active players on tour at least once. I am confident that if she possesses the ability to beat Maria twice (even though Maria was not in-form) take Kim to three sets (YEC final) and get the attention of the other top players by at least making their encounters competitive and add to that the fact that all the rest seem to really struggle beating her that their is great possibility for her to sharpen her claws in the future and bring her best when playing inspired players in slams.

It's all there. She just needs to bring it when it counts most. If I was saying this about a 30 year old, it would be more hopeless but she is quite young and seems extremely determined to make her mark in tennis. I think she can continue improving and really take it to another level. Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe it's too early to, for instance, judge her whole game and worth on that horrible FO performance.

bandabou
Jun 21st, 2011, 07:56 AM
Caro's biggest flaw: she just doesn't have the imagination/ flair to do things outside of her comfort zone. She comes into a match with a settled and tried mindset..and if it works? Nice! But when it doesn't work, she lacks the imagination to try different things.

shoparound
Jun 21st, 2011, 08:01 AM
Another thread to invite people to insult the world #1...

Chrissie had the same concept of being a wall against her opponents but she also outsmarted them.
There's a reason why she had a 125 match win streak on clay....

BUT to be fair, Chrissie did mention, I think, at one point that people probably thought she had the most boring matches in the world! I wish I could find that video somewhere, it was a while back

shoparound
Jun 21st, 2011, 08:04 AM
:lol:

Do you assume I'm a chick or a homo?

Chrissie. :hearts:



99.9% of the posters here are either or ^^