View Full Version : Why are Raymond/Stubbs Splitting Up?

Nov 3rd, 2002, 03:31 AM
I read that the year ending championships will be the end of the Raymond/Stubbs doubles team. Does anyone have the inside info on why? I know Stubbs didn't play that well the second part of the year, but this seems like a rash decision. Is she going to team up with someone else?

Nov 3rd, 2002, 03:39 AM
I think Renee is retiring.

I'm not 100% sure on that. Considering she is 31, or close to that age, I wouldn't be surprised to find out she is retiring.

Nov 3rd, 2002, 05:36 AM
I've read quotes where Stubbs said she planned on playing a few more years. Certainly physically you can do that in doubles, look at Navratilova, and Stubbs is in great shape.

I think there is more to this story, something involving their dynamics as a team. Someone reported seeing them walking in opposite directions at the end of a match recently.

Nov 3rd, 2002, 03:28 PM
They are so nasty and agressive against their opponents...although I like Lisa I can't stand Rennae

Nov 3rd, 2002, 03:43 PM
nasty?!aggressive?! what do u mean?
btw next year Lisa will play double with Lindsay! :D

Nov 3rd, 2002, 04:24 PM
pfff and why Lindsay don't play with Corina? :fiery:

Nov 3rd, 2002, 04:31 PM
I really like Lisa but do not like Rennae either.

I dunno. I saw them play a few matches in the second half of the year and to be honest they didn't actually seem to be getting on very well on the court. At San Diego where they lost they left the court from different sides and at Wimbledon Lisa seemed embarrassed by Rennae's attitude when trying to get off for bad light against Matinez / Pierce. Lisa was willing to play and chatting and smiling with Conchita and Mary while Rennae was basically having a hissy fit.

Nov 3rd, 2002, 05:31 PM
I mean nasty & agressive... I think it's very clear

Nov 3rd, 2002, 08:55 PM
Gossip or not, my tip is that they split as a couple and that is the reaction ON COURT.

By the way, didnīt Lindsay plan to SKIP doubles ?!

Nov 3rd, 2002, 09:07 PM
:sad: I want my fave team back :(

Nov 3rd, 2002, 09:19 PM
oo la la, a split from them is certain? sorry if it was posted, but is there proof? Too bad but not overly surprising given their staleness recently... wish I could see their last match or matches (I HOPE multiple) together. :confused:

Nov 3rd, 2002, 09:32 PM
Yeah, I agree, I think that Lindsay should be playing with Corina.

Mary Kate

Nov 3rd, 2002, 09:55 PM
I wonder with Corina is to play if Kim Po teams with Zvereva. Or is Zvereva with Rubin !?!

Nov 3rd, 2002, 10:06 PM
Last news are that Lisa will play with Lindsay at least the Australian Open and Indian Wells 2003 and that Rennae will play in 2003 and is already arranging something with a new partner :) - I guess they just figured they've won as much as they were going to, a change will probably be good for both of them.

Nov 3rd, 2002, 10:34 PM
May be Stubbs thinks if she plays double with s.o. else she can be no.1 :)

Nov 3rd, 2002, 11:51 PM
I hope Ren won't retire. Wimbledon wouldn't be the same without her. That conchi/Mary match this yr was amazing - I'd miss that

Nov 4th, 2002, 01:25 AM
maybe stubbs should team up with Zvereva then?

Nov 4th, 2002, 01:32 AM
Grafiati ,

Here is an article:

Raymond and Stubbs to split

By Matthew Cronin

Defending WTA Championship doubles victors Lisa Raymond and Rennae Stubbs have decided to end their seven-year partnership after the season-ending event, ******************** has learned.


Rennae is very vocal on court; very emotional. I lot like Serena is. Lisa is more reserved. Perhaps that is the reason.

Nov 4th, 2002, 02:18 AM
I think too taht their relationship was over and that they couldn't play together again on the same court...They split in two ways...

Nov 4th, 2002, 04:05 AM
If Rennae is still playing on tour, can you imagine when they have to play each other in tournaments. That will be interesting. Imagine a Morariu/Stubbs v. Davenport/Raymond match!!!

Nov 4th, 2002, 04:22 AM
If Lindsay is really finding a new doubles partner, I am a little disappointed in her.

Nov 4th, 2002, 08:13 AM
why is Lindsay obligated to play with Morariu? because she was sick? I can imagine that one thing Morariu doesn't want, is that people pitty here and for sure not her friends. and who says it was Lindsay's choice anyway?

Nov 4th, 2002, 08:39 AM
I think things wonīt work out for Lisa if playing with several partners. Weīve seen that Ai didnīt manage to go to LA last year and it could have been this year too if not finding Fujiwara.

If playing with 2-3 partners a year things get more difficult. I wonder if Lindsay agreed on playing the first GS and tierI and then a couple of more 2-week-events like Miami and Indian Wells to have a realistic chance to qualify the way Hingis/Kournikova did over the years. Brilliance at the big events and not playing doubles at some minor events. That would work out.

With whom could Stubbs play ? Pratt ? Sheīs the only one among the top players in doubles without a partner in 2002.

Nov 4th, 2002, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by ChrisGermany
Gossip or not, my tip is that they split as a couple and that is the reaction ON COURT.

that's what I heard, don't know if it's true.

Nov 4th, 2002, 11:47 AM
First of all Rennae is definitely NOT retiring. She is finalising her new partnership this week in LA. When things are in place I won't have a problem giving you the details and I promise you quotes from Rennae to clarify the situation.

Double partnerships end all the time. Rennae and Lisa have played together since 1996. It’s a professional decision based on the fact that both feel they have achieved all that they can with each other. I think after the French Open final both lost a little heart, it was the one they wanted the most. The year started with them basically winning everything in sight, but unfortunately most people judge performances on Grand Slam titles and so all in all it’s been disappointing for both of them. They are no longer defending champions in any of the Slams, so they felt this was the best time for them to part company. Both feel it’s time for a fresh start and to set new goals with new partners.

Nov 4th, 2002, 03:02 PM
I'm sad to see this duo part, as I really liked the two of them as a team.

However, what stubbsy said is perfectly logical. They've played together for a long time and perhaps what each needs is a fresh partnership.

I am thrilled to hear Rennae is not retiring. I like the emotional part of her personality and think she has some great tennis left to share with us.

I wish the best for both and hope to see new and exciting partnerships and tennis.

Nov 4th, 2002, 03:36 PM
HORRAYYYY RENNAE won't stop playing, GREAT NEWS!

Nov 4th, 2002, 05:15 PM
Why irma? Because they were partners and close friends, because Lindsay was Corina's maid of honor, because Corina got sick, and because when Lindsay returned from injury her excuse for not playing with Corina anymore was that she was not going to play doubles at all.

Unless of course Corina decided to end the partnership. That would be fine.

Nov 4th, 2002, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by disposablehero
If Lindsay is really finding a new doubles partner, I am a little disappointed in her.


and that brings us to the 3-month old discussion, when I thought Lindsay could have done more to support Corina in her return... She had previously called herself a close friend of Corina, right?

lucky people (never got badly sick), who say that Corina doesn't need people feeling pitty, etc. Have they thought that Lindsay not playing with Corina could also be percieved by Corina that she is not good enough for Lindsay any more???

Nov 4th, 2002, 05:44 PM
People always jump to conclusions when things like this happen. Perhaps they have decided to end there professional relationship to preserve there personal one. Can you imagine working with your partner?

Helen Lawson
Nov 4th, 2002, 05:50 PM
Maybe she is not good enough for Lindsay anymore. Do you really think Lindsay plays doubles to be nice to other women on the tour or to help out her friends, like Corina? No! She plays to win, as do almost all players out there.

Nov 4th, 2002, 05:56 PM
Stubbsy, I'm glad Ren isn't retiring....coz you won't come to Wimbledon otherwise, and court 13 wouldn't be the same without you ;)

Nov 4th, 2002, 08:08 PM
Were they more than a doubles team? I don't know the inside scoop on this but I suspect they were. Why? Because I've seen them play in person a couple of times, and one thing really stood out. Rennae was bitchy. And she directed a lot of her venom at Lisa when things weren't going right. I commented about this to people that I was watching with and we were all a bit confounded. We speculated "Why would Lisa put up with such crappy treatment by her doubles partner?" The only thing we came up with is that people put up with a lot of shit from their significant others. You know, love is blind and deaf sometimes. ;) So, to follow this reasoning, perhaps Lisa finally got fed up with the treatment and waved buh-bye.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but it seems like it fits to me.

Nov 4th, 2002, 09:44 PM
Rennae making her new partnership in LA means her new partner IS in L.A. with someone else right now.

So letīs tip who it is then. A singles player or a doubles player ? My tip would Ai maybe, even Husarova is possible when Elena concentrates on singles again ...

Nov 4th, 2002, 09:45 PM
Hi everyone,
Well, as for the Lindsay/Corina partnership, I have a lot to say. No, Lindsay is not obligated to play with Corina, and the same goes the either way. Corina started her comeback playing doubles, and Lindsay was not playing doubles then. Maybe Corina established a partnership with someone else while Lindsay wasn't playing, and Lisa suggested that they play together. Corina has been playing with Kim Po in pretty much everything, and they are also really good friends. The only reason that I know of that Po teamed up with Zvereva was because Corina is out for the rest of the year with tendinitis in her shoulder. She'll be back in the beginning of 2003, but since Lindsay is teaming up with Lisa, they obviously can't be partners in the beginning of the season anyway.

As for the Lindsay/Corina friendship, they are really good friends. Lindsay did nothing but support Corina when she was sick, and in her comeback. Corina did the same for Lindsay when she came back from her knee surgery. They talked about their comeback a lot together, in fact, Lindsay stayed in the hospital with Corina for a few days when she was really sick. She was maid of honor in her wedding, and they are still really close friends. Still, that does not obligate them to still play together.

Corina is an awesome doubles player, and I really doubt that Lindsay would say that Corina isn't good enough to play with her anymore. Yes, Corina has fallen in the rankings, but so has Lindsay, and both for reasons in which they couldn't control. If they could win the 1999 Ladies Wimbledon Doubles Championship together, they sure must have been great together. I think that for now, they will for their seperate ways, but eventually will end up playing together again. Maybe Linday wants to focus a little more on doubles since her singles isn't at it's best. I know that Lisa was also in Corina's wedding, so they obviously have to be close too. So, I don't think there will be any hard feelings there.

As for the fact of Corina wanting pity, I totally don't agree with that. I met Corina this summer, and she just isn't a person whi would walk around looking for sympathy. She is totally happy with everything in her life, and I have never seen anyone with more of a positive outlook on life. She takes what is handed her, and tries to make the best of it. I am sure that she it totally happy for Lindsay in whatever success comes her way, and no matter who her doubles partner is. Corina is just that type of person.

But, whatever the reason, I hope they both have a lot of success in 2003! Partners or not!

Mary Kate

Nov 4th, 2002, 09:54 PM
I will let you know her new partner soon........ I will have more answers after the tournament is finished. She's hoping to finalise things in LA. That's all I can say for now.

Nov 5th, 2002, 06:25 AM
Anyone know who Rennae's new doubles partner is?

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:06 AM
Stubbsy knows for sure ;)

It shouldnīt be one of the singles players, definetly not. It should be one of the doubles players - as we have :


Well, itīs pretty obvious where there are chances for a change and where they are not :

I think that Stubbs is keen on playing with someone keen playing doubles and winning events. I think that the obvious choice would be ending the Likhovtseva/Black partnership. They had their time and now that Black struggles to close it out in singles same as Elena, I think both of them donīt play doubles as successfully as they did in the past. Rennae teaming with Elena could be a great combination but with Cara as a younger player as well. Personally I doubt Rennae teaming with a singles profile player like Sanchez or Sugiyama.

Nov 5th, 2002, 11:42 AM
Personally I hope that Corina finds a partner a little more powerful than Kim Po. I'm glad she won't be playing with Lindsay because Lindsay always treated doubles as an afterthought.

Nov 5th, 2002, 12:07 PM
Well, one factor for Raymond/Stubbs might be that they can't play Fed Cup or the Olympics together, since they are from different countries.

Nov 5th, 2002, 12:23 PM
Itīs the couple-story, Denise, definetly.

I doubt it has to do with FedCup. Lisa played lots of FedCups with players she hasnīt played with before, I think it doesnīt bother her at all. Same with Rennae who as far as I know hasnīt the best thoughts about her Federation by the way.

Nov 5th, 2002, 05:35 PM
Husarova is the most obvious choice. She's a VERY accomplished doubles player...I've seen her in action paired with Conchita Martinez playing another US team. Husarova was the class of the court during that match. Hantuchova is great too, but I don't think she would play with anyone who's main goal in life is to win doubles titles. Hantuchova would rather concentrate on her singles. Husarova seems to be a budding great singles player, but right now, she seems to be better as a doubles.

Nov 5th, 2002, 08:59 PM
Interesting photo's from LA - Stubbs is sitting with Nicole Arendt and Lisa with Kim Po- maybe new teams?

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:14 PM
I was thinking the same thing when I saw the pics, ColinB. It could be.

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:28 PM
Where are those pics ?

Arendt might be switching from Huber ( who could reunite with Montalvo then )

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:39 PM
They are on the Sanexwta.com website.




Nov 5th, 2002, 09:39 PM
Hey you guys are making me laugh...... why the guessing games ;) Which table is Rennae sat at, who is 2 her left hand side?

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:40 PM
If you told us we wouldn't have to guess! ;) :p

Maybe Rennae'll be playing with you stubbsy? :D

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:44 PM
Well you know the situation with Lisa and Kim's husband Gallofa, so I doubt the Kim and Lisa partnership is likely.

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:46 PM
I don't suppose you could share with the rest of us stubbsy71 (the Lisa/Kim's husband situation)?

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:48 PM
I see you are not denying the Arendt + Stubbs one! :D could we have a winner? ;) lol - I am just happy that Stubbs will be playing and bored (hence the guessing games ;))

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:48 PM
He was Lisa's coach for a short time, turned out ot a be a right ****, so she sacked him.

Nov 5th, 2002, 09:51 PM
Ok, then it won't be Kim Po; thanks for the info! lol @ Gallofa!

Nov 5th, 2002, 11:39 PM
This thread is getting interesting now... I think Lisa can do better than Kim Po though - No offence to Kim - but Lisa is a Grade A doubles player along with Rennae, Paulo, Virginia, Annak, Martina, Lindsay, Ai... I think Kim is the next level down.

I didnt realise how old Arendt was - I noticed yesterday that she had matchpoints to reach the last 16 of the US Open singles as far back as 1986.

I think Rennae and Arendt could be a team - very possible...

Lisa may be better with Lindsay if she commits more, or Morariu... i hope Zvereva commits to a full doubles schedule next year too and gets a regular partner and herself into shape...

Pamela Shriver
Nov 5th, 2002, 11:55 PM
Stubbsy, I'm always available if Ren needs a partner...

Nov 6th, 2002, 05:39 AM
Would love Stubbs Pratt- Nicole has really moved up in doubles
Lisa- maybe Linday Chanda Corina Nicole A or even Meaghan S?

Nov 6th, 2002, 09:38 AM
Pratt is not in LA so I doubt that one regarding Stubbs.

Arendt is a German-speaking American left-hander. It would surprise me if Stubbs chooses her because I think that Rennae would choose someone with knowledge of the game but not with the aggressiveness anymore - someone retired from singles long ago and just playing doubles - as McNeil, Bollegraf or even Navratilova. On the other hand, lefties are great because they are so rare on the tour. Could surprise some girls.

I think we had that Lisa-Lindsay topic, so why not guessing Po is with Morariu and Zvereva with Rubin then ;) ?

Nov 6th, 2002, 03:04 PM
I read that Po was planning to retire.

Nov 6th, 2002, 06:03 PM
Another one is who will Conchita play with in 2003? she's been playing a bit with Tarabini, but I think they are working together (coach/player) again and probably don't want to mess that up (like the first time ;)) - so I think Conchita is pretty much up for grabs too... she's a Grade B dubs player I would say, a good partner for a good player who is not too serious about their dubs.

I really don't see Lisa teaming up with Po. Both because of personal history and Lisa's dubs expertise, she'd be looking for a partner like Lindsay or maybe Zvereva? could that work?

Stubbs + Arendt somehow doesn't sound right to me, I would think Stubbs will be looking for someone more consistant that Arendt? can't see Stubbs + Arendt at the same level as Stubbs + Raymond were. Ai wouldn't be too bad... and Stubbs wouldn't have a problem with playing all those Japanese events, or maybe she would? :D

That leaves Morariu and Rubin... they could team up together :D - only pair I am sure about at this point is Poli/Vivi :p - Petrova/Dokic seems to work too.

Nov 6th, 2002, 06:10 PM
I'm still laughing :)

How about Mel and Rennae ?

Nov 6th, 2002, 07:22 PM
Karen is really getting a kick out of all those speculations, isn't she? ;)

Nov 6th, 2002, 07:25 PM
If Raymond is playing with Lindsay, maybe this means Raymond intends to play less doubles.

Nov 6th, 2002, 07:41 PM
That's a good point, disposablehero, I was saying the same thing the other day (... yeah, of course that's why I think it's a good point! :D :p). I was thinking that for Raymond, probably now that she doesn't have to play all the big tier I and II events if she's not playing with someone that only plays dubs and naturally wants to play the big events... she might be willing to focus more on her singles, play some more smaller tier III and IV events to pick up her ranking (like say, Smashnova02 or Schnyder98). This could be a good year for her to prove whether she can move into the top20 if she mixes up some smaller tier tourneys with the big events.

Nov 6th, 2002, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by monster
Lisa- maybe Lindsay - Chanda - Corina - Nicole A or even Meaghan S?

It would be *very* interesting to me if Lisa was paired with Nicki -- the two ole Gator Gals together again -- but I really doubt that will happen.

If Lindsay will commit, I think she is the best choice for Lisa.

I could *definitely* see Nicki playing with Stubbsie. But I agree they would probably not have the success of the Raymond/Stubbs team. I think they could be Top 8 though anf I think both of them would be happy with that.